NY-LI-4 bodies on Beach-Possible SK-12/10-All id'd,4 more found 3/11 #3

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shadowraiths said:
I thought of this, however the sister says he later denied saying that stuff, indicating they had been in contact with him after he called them. Hopefully w/LE in tow. Also, his residence seems to be a bit of a distance (2.6 miles and midway between JB's place and the dumpsite). Though, iirc, they reported that someone pulled her into an SUV shortly after the 911 call.
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Is his clinic in the gated community? That is the only address I could find for him.
 
epiphany said:
Also..."Melissa Barthelemy was last seen in the Bronx on July 12, 2009. But a call made to her voicemail that day came from Massapequa..."

The Bronx is directly north of upper Manhattan. A hop and a skip.
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Yea, looking at the map I was amazed how everything fit together and names I recognized like the Bronx, Manhattan, Soho were right at the end of the island. I was in NYC right after that huge garbage strike. Left me with smelly memories. The city had an odor I can even smell to this day if I close my eyes and think of walking down the streets. LOL

I do appreciate everyone here giving us non-East Coasters helpful info. Thanks.
 
Secret77 said:
If the SK is grabbing the victims after work, then he must have known them as clients, otherwise how would he know where they lived, etc?
Also, grabbing the victims against their will is very risky, as they could be witnesses, the victims can scream, make noise, fight back, etc.

Persuasion and trust always works a lot better than sheer force.
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We were speculating the other day that if Shannan were a victim of the SK responsible for the deaths of the 8 bodies discovered, and neither the driver nor the John were involved, how could the SK be after her that particular early morning? How would he know where she would be working on a particular night? That led to speculation about the SK communicating with other Johns, who unwittingly and unknowingly, discuss (on the LI Call Girl Site) who they hire/who is coming over on a particular evening. He could have cyber friendships with other customers who used the girls he's interested in.

If necessary, he can even put a call into her cell from his throwaway cell as she's about to leave. That's why she may have refused to leave the John's house - He's after me, etc. That could be the first contact he had with the victim. She didn't tell her driver that she had another job.
 
scandi said:
Is his clinic in the gated community? That is the only address I could find for him.
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Yup, it's in the gated community. Probably the same addy I found. Though, it looks like a house as opposed to a clinic. Tried to check it out using google's stalker cam but you can only see the roofs from Ocean Pkwy.
 
epiphany said:
We were speculating the other day that if Shannan were a victim of the SK responsible for the deaths of the 8 bodies discovered, and neither the driver nor the John were involved, how could the SK be after her that particular early morning? How would he know where she would be working on a particular night? That led to speculation about the SK communicating with other Johns, who unwittingly and unknowingly, discuss (on the LI Call Girl Site) who they hire/who is coming over on a particular evening. He could have cyber friendships with other customers who used the girls he's interested in.

If necessary, he can even put a call into her cell from his throwaway cell as she's about to leave. That's why she may have refused to leave the John's house - He's after me, etc. That could be the first contact he had with the victim. She didn't tell her driver that she had another job.
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Also, if he lived in the gated community he might have an idea what goes on, who normally parties when and at what time of the day. Then scout it out.

I don't think that is how an organized killer would work. So many shows I've seen about SK's is they find a victim they want then create the opportunity to get them in their clutches. More like the spider and the Fly, they know just what they're gonna get and when. IMO
 
epiphany said:
We were speculating the other day that if Shannan were a victim of the SK
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interesting theory, but i doubt most johns would share that type of information publicly.. specially after finding out that some of the girls they hired disappeared.

unfortunately, there is no evidence whatsoever SH was a victim of the SK.. we don't even have evidence she was a victim at all.. she is still missing and her whereabouts are unknown.
I think LE has better chances of finding the SK though the evidence from the 4 (or 8) confirmed victims, than through speculations of what may have happened to SG.
 
Filly said:
Hmmmmmmmm. Thank you so much Epiphany. Especially NYPD moving to LI to become LI LE.
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[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suffolk_County_Police_Department_%28New_York%29"]Suffolk County Police Department (New York) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:SCPDpatch.jpg" class="image"><img alt="SCPDpatch.jpg" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/a8/SCPDpatch.jpg/119px-SCPDpatch.jpg"@@AMEPARAM@@en/thumb/a/a8/SCPDpatch.jpg/119px-SCPDpatch.jpg[/ame]


In recent years, Suffolk officers (along with the Nassau County Police Department) have become well-known in the New York area for their exceptionally high rate of pay, especially as compared with the nearby New York City Police Department. In 2010, top pay for a Suffolk patrol officer is $108,608 annually, not including overtime, night differential and benefits, compared with $76,000 in New York City.[8]

As a result of this disparity, numerous NYPD officers have left the city force and joined the Suffolk department.[9] Typically, between one-third and one-half of the recruits in every Suffolk police academy class are former city officers.[10]
 
shadowraiths said:
Yup, it's in the gated community. Probably the same addy I found. Though, it looks like a house as opposed to a clinic. Tried to check it out using google's stalker cam but you can only see the roofs from Ocean Pkwy.
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He's not letting much info out and I would say it is bare minimum at best. I found another address but it is also in the gated community. His ratings are not very good either. ;{
 
scandi said:
Just curious, How do you get to Manhattan from LI, besides auto. Ta
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Helicopter? He'd have to have lots of $$$$ .
I am thinking LE or X-LE but they would need family $ to be able to have access to a chopper.
Hair Dresser?
Lingering shop owner?
Manicurist?
Soooo... Dr.~ what kind of Dr. could have had all of these women as patients?
Plastic Surgeon? Augmentation, Nose Jobs, Lip injections, Botox?
OB-GYN? annual checks... STD tests?
Psychiatrist? for qroup/ personal therapy?
Dentist? Veneers, bleaching, repair after injuries?
Pain Management? provided them narcotics?
ER Doc~ treated them for getting knocked around?
MAYBE NOT A Dr.!
Maybe a wife of a Dr. or a maid?
Computer Geek? maybe the girls had open WI FI? at coffee shops when they worked out when and where to meet their "John's"?

I'm babbling ... trying to link them other than by their deaths.
 
Secret77 said:
interesting theory, but i doubt most johns would share that type of information publicly.. specially after finding out that some of the girls they hired disappeared.

unfortunately, there is no evidence whatsoever SH was a victim of the SK.. we don't even have evidence she was a victim at all.. she is still missing and her whereabouts are unknown.
I think LE has better chances of finding the SK though the evidence from the 4 (or 8) confirmed victims, than through speculations of what may have happened to SG.
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Hi Secret. Welcome to WS. I think there is plenty of circumstantial evidence that SG was indeed a victim and is now deceased. Whether that was at the hands of SK or another, I don't know. It's just all so coinkydinky.
 
gngr~snap said:
Helicopter? He'd have to have lots of $$$$ .
I am thinking LE or X-LE but they would need family $ to be able to have access to a chopper.
Hair Dresser?
Lingering shop owner?
Manicurist?
Soooo... Dr.~ what kind of Dr. could have had all of these women as patients?
Plastic Surgeon? Augmentation, Nose Jobs, Lip injections, Botox?
OB-GYN? annual checks... STD tests?
Psychiatrist? for qroup/ personal therapy?
Dentist? Veneers, bleaching, repair after injuries?
Pain Management? provided them narcotics?
ER Doc~ treated them for getting knocked around?
MAYBE NOT A Dr.!
Maybe a wife of a Dr. or a maid?
Computer Geek? maybe the girls had open WI FI? at coffee shops when they worked out when and where to meet their "John's"?

I'm babbling ... trying to link them other than by their deaths.
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Bless your heart Gng~Snap, I don't think he'd want a string of women coming to his clinic, some of which would turn up dead.

In fact when he called Shannan's mom he told her about his clinic. Maybe he was trying to appear respectable to her. But I thought it a bit odd.

Actually he also is an Emergency care Dr.
 
scandi said:
In fact when he called Shannan's mom he told her about his clinic. Maybe he was trying to appear respectable to her. But I thought it a bit odd.

Actually he also is an Emergency care Dr.
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Respectfully snipped:

I am not getting this at all. A random neighbor not only knows who the girl is, he also knows how to contact her mother. How?

Was this doctor treating the girl at some point? If so, he would have her mother's contact details as next of kin, because you have to fill that stuff out on med forms in the doctors office before they'll treat you.
 
If these are not related I might be shocked.


http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2010-01-12/news/1001110122_1_serial-killings-iwana-patton-serial-killer

Sheriff's offices in Orange, Osceola, Seminole, Volusia and Polk -- ones that service the I-4 area in the region -- said they have no serial-killer cases. Police agencies in Orlando and Kissimmee said they don't either.

None could explain where the FBI got its information.

Only Daytona Beach police acknowledge they are working a serial-killer case.

"We have several people, including volunteers, looking at evidence and following up on leads," Capt. Kerry Orpinuk of the Daytona Beach Police Department said. "But there are no leads that point in any one direction."

The other Daytona Beach victims:

&#9642;A construction worker in January 2006 discovered the body of Julie Ann Green, 34, on an access road off LPGA Boulevard, a remote area near Interstate 95.

&#9642;The body of Iwana Patton, 35, was found in February 2006 in a wooded area just east of I-95. The body of the fourth victim, Stacey Gage, was found in January 2008 near an abandoned church less than a mile from I-4.

Other recent murders in Central Florida appear to fit a profile laid out by the bureau's probe:
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Wrt the scenario of the vics being grabbed after their meets and how the perp might know...

NB: following is purely speculation based upon what very little I know about this case

How about night patrol? Rent-a-cop, even. Someone who failed out of the police academy. Someone who has serious control issues and an extremely rigid belief system.

After all, LE states the perp could be a cop, or at the very least, someone with LE experience/knowledge.

Who better to fit the profile than someone who patrols a gated community. He would be trusted bc that is his job. Women (in fact, anyone) entering/exiting the place prolly would not give him a second thought (or glance, for that matter). In other words, he would not be so "off" as to be noticeable to any real degree. But he would be a very by the books type of individual. Like I said, rigid. If questioned, they prolly would not remember what he looked like. Importantly, however, he would know all about them. Their comings and goings. Their visitors. Their quirks.

And. He would see these women as infestations to the community he is overseeing... to his mind, they would devalue the community... like a disease that must be dealt with. Exterminated. He's the mother hen. He's the protector. Unlike the sexually sadistic serial killer who gets a rush from killing which will keep him high for some time before he needs another fix... this guy would be killing out of a sense of duty. To keep the community clean. He doesn't need to kill. He has to kill. It's a dirty job but someone's gotta do it. That would be his mind set. And the kills would have an opposite effect on him. He would feel extremely dirty afterwards... gross... like if you smooshed a cockroach with a shoe... the burlap sacks are to keep them contained. from infecting the place more.

But there is an anomaly. And that anomaly is the call to the sister. What was it about Melissa that might compel him to call? After all, she was, at the very least, his second victim. And yes, it had been two years. But still... Did Melissa have a facebook account? Was her cellphone an iphone... as opposed to say, a simple phone... something that, even after death, exuded her personality? Who she was as a human being? Did she keep a list of her John's? Correspondence she may have had with them? If so, did this enrage him? So much so, he could not shake the anger. That he became almost obsessive, to the point of calling her sister once a week to rail at her?

And what about him? His personal life? Does he have a family? Kids? Daughters? Whoever or whatever he is, I think this is extremely personal for him. If he had called all of the victim's families, I would lean more toward a sexual sadist who got off by tormenting the victim's families. However, that we know, he only contacted the one family. He deviated. And deviations are as important (if not more so), than established patterns.

So... what caused him to deviate?

NB: the above is purely speculation based upon what very little I know about this case​
 
Soulmagent said:
If these are not related I might be shocked.


http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2010-01-12/news/1001110122_1_serial-killings-iwana-patton-serial-killer
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's the "Highway Serial Killings Initiative" that they started as a result of the I-40 killer. Or rather, helped them to suss out the I-40 killer.

Highway Serial Killings
New Initiative on an Emerging Trend
04/06/09

In 2004, an analyst from the Oklahoma Bureau of Investigation detected a crime pattern: the bodies of murdered women were being dumped along the Interstate 40 corridor in Oklahoma, Texas, Arkansas, and Mississippi.

The analyst and a police colleague from the Grapevine, Texas Police Department referred these cases to our Violent Criminal Apprehension Program, or ViCAP, where our analysts looked at other records in our database to see if there were similar patterns of highway killings elsewhere.

Turns out there were. So we launched an extensive effort to support our state and local partners with open investigations into highway murders.​

Full Article: click here
 
HI Everyone....I was lead to this thread after reading about Shannan in the missing not found forum and then today discovering they have found more bodies.....holy macaroni that is very scary.

I cant beleive that we have hardly heard anything about this over here and yet at the moment if Charlie Sheen lets out a rant its on every station news, newspapers, internet etc etc.

I have only read a bit of this and skimmed thru a lot of pages, so dont really understand about doctors etc, however with my fresh eyes I am finding it VERY hard to discount that the original JB is not involved.

There are way way too many coincidences for me. All prostitutes advertising on craiglist, dead, in bags in the same area and a prostitute that he has called from craiglist goes running from his house screaming that someone is trying to kill her is just so suspicous.

To me Shannan is the one that got away.....at first......I am thinking they later found her.

I also think it may be a THEY......a couple or maybe three guys getting these girls in to a sex party and then killing them.

The only other thing that would make sense to me is if maybe one of the guys at the sex party is the dedicated driver offering to drop these girls off and he is killing them without JB or/and the others knowing.

scary stuff this
 
Good morning everyone!

Here is a link to Shannan's thread here. There are good photos of the neighborhood from where Shannan was last seen.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=122841"]NJ NJ - Shannan Gilbert, 24, Jersey City, 1 May 2010 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]


Also here is a link to case archives for the LI killer and Shannan. Lots and lots of info here.

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/...&current=40711LI-AtlanticCitysimilarities.jpg

wm
 
Secret77 said:
His house was searched and his car was hauled away to be inspected.
I am sure the proper chemicals were sprayed in his house to see if blood had been cleaned up, same thing with the car.

If there had been anything suspicious, he would have been arrested by now.

The sad thing about all this, is that, even if the SK has been found, there is no proof he did anything to SG.. she is still missing and nobody knows what really happened to her.
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I sort of find it sad her case is here rather than under Missing.

She is a missing person

re JB, it may not even have been something like parts or trophies as i suggested, it could be that he tried to hurt her or he said things about dead girls from CL or she found something simple to get rid of, rope and clothes. I mean it isn't as if he didn't have time to remove something easily especially once he knew she got away
 
shadowraiths said:
Yup, it's in the gated community. Probably the same addy I found. Though, it looks like a house as opposed to a clinic. Tried to check it out using google's stalker cam but you can only see the roofs from Ocean Pkwy.
Click to expand...

stalker cam.... LMAO :floorlaugh::floorlaugh:
 
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