FL - Jennifer Kesse, 24, Orlando, 24 Jan 2006 - #11

[ShaunG2]

Hi. I'm new to the site, I've tried to create a new thread but seem unable to. Any suggestions there would be appreciated.

Anyways, I'm currently producing a podcast on Jennifer's case. Is there anyone here with connections to the case that would be willing to talk?

Looking forward to joining all the discussions on the site….

 

[Valiant]

Thank you, that next leads me to ask:

If this was a random or targeted act of crime and JK is dead, would the perp had taken her car and park it where he did?

Also, what about her luggage used for her trip to St Croix?

Has that been accounted for?

My thoughts on the bolded part of you question: I think the perp needed to get back to the area because his car (or other transportation) was in the area. So he dumped the car close by and walked back to where it all started. I would not be surprised if he first thought to put the car back at her place but there was too much commotion there.

 

[JnRyan]

Hi. I'm new to the site, I've tried to create a new thread but seem unable to. Any suggestions there would be appreciated.

Anyways, I'm currently producing a podcast on Jennifer's case. Is there anyone here with connections to the case that would be willing to talk?

Looking forward to joining all the discussions on the site….

My first thought would be to contact Jennifer's family, Joyce, Drew and Logan Kesse. If they are open to the idea, their approval may open some avenues that might otherwise be difficult. I have no idea what their contact info is, but they have a website:

http://jenniferkesse.com/

 

[ShaunG2]

My first thought would be to contact Jennifer's family, Joyce, Drew and Logan Kesse. If they are open to the idea, their approval may open some avenues that might otherwise be difficult. I have no idea what their contact info is, but they have a website:

http://jenniferkesse.com/

Thank you for the response. I've done so on that page previously. Just uploaded the trailer waiting for iTunes approval. Hope that some of you may check it out.

 

[Rust Cohle]

I appreciate you taking a look and the feedback. First as Markybug mentions, the light colored clothing is an artifact of a night vision camera that does not have night capability switched off during day. Research I did back then found this was common with cheaper cameras (required some electronics to flip the filter on and off) or was not working. Now this is not conjecture. The Orlando Police found their own police uniforms light colored in the camera. "Sort of concerned us" I believe was the quote from so many years ago, and "don't worry about the clothes'.

So because of that people cite the light clothes as that of a worker who wears light clothes and I guess in a sense is not worrying about it. Forensics Orlando style you might call it.

Technically it could be light clothing, nothing was done to test what kind of clothes would hew closely to these images. No info on the camera was ever released, no independent testing done, nothing that could help sort out what this person is. Info about the camera doesn't reveal anything about the crime. No reason for the model camera and settings not to have been revealed back then when people could take a look at a similar model.

So waiting 11 years hasn't worked yet, but who knows, it happened in Tara's case, maybe it'll happen for Jennifer. Still I prefer hard work to make your own breaks over waiting for a break.

Now for the pixel stuff, a couple of things. While certainly there can be doubt about most of the various artifacts I've pointed out, I have shown the cut out of the thigh strap holster here a few times and there is nothing pixelly about it. Solid shape and straps, an extender up to the belt, even a beveled connector. This is one view of it including some gear on the backside of the POI:

The strapped holster is centered below the gate latch and between the bars. That's not a shadowy, pixelly, fuzzy, gee let's not look at it because it doesn't fit our agenda thing, that's a solid strapped thigh holster for something.

The other thing is that all the other shapes such as the equipment on the back, duty holster entending around and seen through the latch, and many, many other artifacts I've pointed out, including his face in still 3, are all law enforcement oriented. If there were a holster but other artifacts of that of a clown, then you know it wouldn't be that of an armed bike security guard or the like. I don't come up with something and try to justify it, I just find what's there and let the facts lead to the conclusion.

We don't have enough facts to conclude this is a security guard, but we also don't have a serious effort to determine the facts. I do feel fortunate that several people understand the scope of what's in these images even though it's hard to believe.

Which is the main problem. It's not too difficult to see, it's too difficult to believe.

As always will be glad to discuss with anyone here as this appears to be the only lead in Jennifer's disappearance.

rd

Over time, I've look at those pics on a CRT, LCD, LED, and now oled. I'm not disputing that you're not seeing the tactical gear, I see them myself, I'm of the opinion that what we're seeing is manufactured from the awful video feed. There is a clear shot of POI wearing glasses, but those badges are too large, I think they are created by the feed. There is an illusion that POI is carrying something by a strap in the left hand, but there are perpendicular lines in the feed that can create that strap. Once I start looking at the image surrounding the POI, I start to see a familiar pattern of pixelization which disrupts the POI. The black ring on the neck I believe to be from the feed, unless the POI has a necklace/rosary tattoo there is no other explanation. It's just unfortunate LEO waited so long to release the video, or didn't attempt to recreate the POI by using the same equipment and wearing various outfits with multiple people.

 

[rd_jfc]

Over time, I've look at those pics on a CRT, LCD, LED, and now oled. I'm not disputing that you're not seeing the tactical gear, I see them myself, I'm of the opinion that what we're seeing is manufactured from the awful video feed. There is a clear shot of POI wearing glasses, but those badges are too large, I think they are created by the feed. There is an illusion that POI is carrying something by a strap in the left hand, but there are perpendicular lines in the feed that can create that strap. Once I start looking at the image surrounding the POI, I start to see a familiar pattern of pixelization which disrupts the POI. The black ring on the neck I believe to be from the feed, unless the POI has a necklace/rosary tattoo there is no other explanation. It's just unfortunate LEO waited so long to release the video, or didn't attempt to recreate the POI by using the same equipment and wearing various outfits with multiple people.

That's an excellent take on it and thanks for the feedback. Note that while there are serious vertical and horizontal streaks they do not form anything themselves. They do distract from what's in the image. Manufactured from the feed is another way of saying that interference or streaks if you will form the illusion of tactical gear. Certainly I dealt with this in a number of ways.

I looked at the same area in image 1 and 2 and looked for anything out of place in the other image. I found nothing suggestive of anything anywhere in the same spot in the other image (for example, near gate latch in image 1), or for that matter, anything suggestive if any non-law enforcement anywhere in the three images.

If these are random artifacts, note that the artifacts are that of law enforcement in expected positions on the body. Note that there are no random artifacts of anything anywhere else in the three images. At what point can one say that law enforcement artifacts at expected places in the images aren't random visual artifacts? This isn't even blurry. If anything, it is exceedingly sharp. I am amazed at the detail of the bevelled connector between holster and belt when I first looked at it on a 19" CRT monitor. I was stunned.

Now I have focused on the holster because it is so clear, with the belt webbing, thigh straps, etc. But there is some connector type equipment hanging over his back, possibly supporting the circular object behind him at same level of holster. The bike helmet has a stunning precsion in its outline, blown up on a big screen tv it is perfect.

There are many problems due to the slow lapse of the camera and a moving object, and clearly to me the image is contorted as it goes out from center (large shoes, car in background, etc.) but there is an image in the shape of law enforcement shoulder patch hovering where his shoulder is, there is a badge in image 3 in shape of police / DoD badge, there is his face in image 3 which looks like wearing strapped helmet.

The circle around his neck believe it or not is in all 3 images! It looks very much the same in images 1 and 2, and there is a distinct circle around his neck in image 3. People can say what they want about shadows and manufactured feeds, but this is a moving person that has a distinct bruisey type circle around his neck, not sharp like the thigh straps but somewhat firm in makeup. We may not know for sure what it is, but random manufactured visual artifacts do not have that firmness and consistency across multiple images.

I understand the size and position of the shoulder patch is not proportional, and I wouldn't ask anyone to believe that this POI was dressed as law enforcement on that alone, but it's a swinging arm in a time lapse lens distorted image, and not something that's static and clear. But it's yet another law enforcement artifact in images full of them. And not a non-law enforcement artifact to be found.

What is interesting is that there is no reason to think this is anything but someone dressed as law enforcement. There is no reason to believe that this is the actual murderer, this could be someone who moved the car for any number of reasons. The Orlando Police believed this to be a short gang banger type, i.e. Latino, for among other reasons believing that this person is striding in a fashion of arm held back and straight down, a distinctive minority gangster trait. Yet that straight down arm is an illusion. There is no hand at the end, it is a perfectly cylindrical object, and starts at belt level.

If you want imaginary artifacts, there's one for you. But unfortunately it was the Orlando Police seeing imaginary things. And the public has been misserved in the Jennifer Kesse case.

rd

 

[scadagirl28]

What is past the key hole of the gate ? I don't think that is entirely his body .

 

[rd_jfc]

What is past the key hole of the gate ? I don't think that is entirely his body .

In looking through the latch keyhole? What is seen is consistent with a service belt as also seen between the latch and rail.

 

[scadagirl28]

In looking through the latch keyhole? What is seen is consistent with a service belt as also seen between the latch and rail.

Thank you!Past that is that something he is holding under his arm?

 

[Cblewife]

I understand about the light colored clothing being caused by a night vision camera that does not have night capability switched off during day, but why do the shoes appear black if that's the case? At least if I recall correctly they appear black. It's been quite a long time since I've seen the video.

 

[rd_jfc]

I understand about the light colored clothing being caused by a night vision camera that does not have night capability switched off during day, but why do the shoes appear black if that's the case? At least if I recall correctly they appear black. It's been quite a long time since I've seen the video.

Did you happen to catch the side by sides I posted a couple of pages back of normal and infrared mixed in with light? There's a chair or stand of some type with clothese draped over it. The hard top of the stand is black in both pictures but the clothes and what appears to be a soft arm is light colored. There are dark handles on a beige cabinet and the handles stay dark while the cabinet is a pale green.

It isn't like just washing out the image with extra light, it's very material / color dependent on the results.A very dark sweater and purplish shirt are both light colored, the sweater a gray. In the POI images for example, the metal fence remains black.

 

[rd_jfc]

Thank you!Past that is that something he is holding under his arm?

I'm looking carefully at several pictures. I'm thinking on this.

 

[grief2hope]

Do we know of any evidence that disputes that Jennifer never even made it to the work parking lot that morning?

 

[rd_jfc]

Do we know of any evidence that disputes that Jennifer never even made it to the work parking lot that morning?

I'm not sure I understand the question, but felt someone should respond.

Are you suggesting that without evidence to the contrary, Jennifer might have made it to her employment parking lot before being abducted?

I would say the whole phone call to her bf each morning, some say on her way to work, not taking place rules her out as going to work that morning.

Of course with both phones going dead at 10:40 pm that should have ruled out anything concerning morning. There just isn't very much logic that was applied by Orlando Police in anything they have said or done in this case, in particular, saying in public statements that Jennifer was probably abducted in her parking lot going to work around 8am.

I know Orlando Police have more blood spatter evidence on a given day than they can handle, but if they don't care much about this case they should have at least not said just about everything they have said about the case. Their public statements have all been misleading if not incorrect or impossible.

 

[Truth Prevails]

I'm not sure I understand the question, but felt someone should respond.

Are you suggesting that without evidence to the contrary, Jennifer might have made it to her employment parking lot before being abducted?

I would say the whole phone call to her bf each morning, some say on her way to work, not taking place rules her out as going to work that morning.

Of course with both phones going dead at 10:40 pm that should have ruled out anything concerning morning. There just isn't very much logic that was applied by Orlando Police in anything they have said or done in this case, in particular, saying in public statements that Jennifer was probably abducted in her parking lot going to work around 8am.

I know Orlando Police have more blood spatter evidence on a given day than they can handle, but if they don't care much about this case they should have at least not said just about everything they have said about the case. Their public statements have all been misleading if not incorrect or impossible.

BBM - Isn't that basically what Jennifer's parents believe? (Minus the time, I'm not sure about that.)

_______________________________________​

Mrs. Kesse @ APX 12:17 minutes in Part 2 of the "Concluded" podcast: Initially, the two detectives thought that Jennifer was taken that night. They thought that Jennifer—Jennifer. These two gumshoe detectives thought that Jennifer would have gone out after ten o’clock at night to take Logan’s friend phone to a UPS or a FedEx mail envelope—twice—at ten o’clock at night. We kept trying to tell them there is no way in hell.

_______________________________________​

And sure enough, someone posted an old link that still works with at least one "gumshoe detective" saying pretty much exactly what Mrs. Kesse said they said. So, do you mean LE changed their mind since that time and now believe in the morning parking lot of condo abduction, as do Jennifer's parents? Or maybe I'm wrong and I don't understand what Jennifer's parents believe?

If LE really have evidence for one or both of those cell phones going dead during the evening of the 23rd, I would be shocked if they really changed their theory that much. I don't mean I agree with them about the reason she went out, or even if she went out at all--but it's hard to ignore the phone or phones event.

 

[marable]

BBM - Isn't that basically what Jennifer's parents believe? (Minus the time, I'm not sure about that.)

_______________________________________​

Mrs. Kesse @ APX 12:17 minutes in Part 2 of the "Concluded" podcast: Initially, the two detectives thought that Jennifer was taken that night. They thought that Jennifer—Jennifer. These two gumshoe detectives thought that Jennifer would have gone out after ten o’clock at night to take Logan’s friend phone to a UPS or a FedEx mail envelope—twice—at ten o’clock at night. We kept trying to tell them there is no way in hell.

_______________________________________​

And sure enough, someone posted an old link that still works with at least one "gumshoe detective" saying pretty much exactly what Mrs. Kesse said they said. So, do you mean LE changed their mind since that time and now believe in the morning parking lot of condo abduction, as do Jennifer's parents? Or maybe I'm wrong and I don't understand what Jennifer's parents believe?

If LE really have evidence for one or both of those cell phones going dead during the evening of the 23rd, I would be shocked if they really changed their theory that much. I don't mean I agree with them about the reason she went out, or even if she went out at all--but it's hard to ignore the phone or phones event.

If Jennifer made it to her car to go to work, why did she not call Rob as per usual?

I have heard and read several interviews where Drew stated the phones were "turned off and presumably the batteries removed at 10:40 pm".....Did he know this as a fact or was he just repeating rumor?

 

[shelly111]

The lack of evidence,no struggle inside the apt or outside,is because whatever happened happanned after Jennifer left for work.
The night before was the first night Jennifer was home after vacation . There was no food at home. In the morning on her way to work jennifer stopped somewhere ,a grocery store, a donought place... it was early so the place was not open yet and jennifer was abducted in the parking lot. Or jennifer drove her car to work and was stopped by somebody before she entered the workplace or she made it to work and parked the car and was abducted soon after.
There are several women missing in this area,some before and some after Jennifer's disappearance.

 

[marable]

The lack of evidence,no struggle inside the apt or outside,is because whatever happened happanned after Jennifer left for work.
The night before was the first night Jennifer was home after vacation . There was no food at home. In the morning on her way to work jennifer stopped somewhere ,a grocery store, a donought place... it was early so the place was not open yet and jennifer was abducted in the parking lot. Or jennifer drove her car to work and was stopped by somebody before she entered the workplace or she made it to work and parked the car and was abducted soon after.
There are several women missing in this area,some before and some after Jennifer's disappearance.

Not all crime scenes appear to be crime scenes....

How do you know there was no food at home? I have read otherwise suggesting that she stopped for groceries on her way home on Monday evening as she had a party scheduled for Tuesday evening....

If Jennifer left for work , why did she not call Rob as she usually did?

I have never seen anything in over 11 years that would suggest that she was abducted from her work place.....

 

[shelly111]

Not all crime scenes appear to be crime scenes....

How do you know there was no food at home? I have read otherwise suggesting that she stopped for groceries on her way home on Monday evening as she had a party scheduled for Tuesday evening....

If Jennifer left for work , why did she not call Rob as she usually did?

I have never seen anything in over 11 years that would suggest that she was abducted from her work place.....

That Tuesday morning was supposed to be the second day at work after vacation. Jeniffer could have left much earlier that morning,maybe she left an hour early than the usual time she left every day .
Jennifer wanted to go over work related things ,especially after missing few days, she needed to catch up on her work and be prepared before the big meeting.
Maybe she didn't call Rob because it was too early to call him so she waited to call him later,at the usual time they talked every morning, and she never the chance ...

 

[Tulessa]

That Tuesday morning was supposed to be the second day at work after vacation. Jeniffer could have left much earlier that morning,maybe she left an hour early than the usual time she left every day .
Jennifer wanted to go over work related things ,especially after missing few days, she needed to catch up on her work and be prepared before the big meeting.
Maybe she didn't call Rob because it was too early to call him so she waited to call him later,at the usual time they talked every morning, and she never the chance ...

It sounds like you have some inside info, or I have missed a lot of articles on this case?