GA GA - Carlene Tengelsen, 16, Macon, 21 June 1972

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Christopher Wilder would have been in his mid-20s at the time, probably we will never know how many he killed, I don't believe he suddenly started killing at middle age. Also I previously mentioned John Paul Knowles (or as he is just as often listed, Paul John Knowles) who kidnapped and murdered a teen girl in GA in 1974. He was killed in a shootout so we will never know. I just keep thinking how do you abduct a girl in broad daylight at an open air mall? Either you know her and she isn't afraid to let you in her car or you pull a weapon on her. There was a report that somebody heard screams that afternoon, but there are so so many cases out there where days or weeks later somebody reported they heard a scream around the time of an abduction, and it may not be related or even have been on the same day. My feeling has always been she was taken on her way back to her car or while she was getting into her car. She was seen at the mall arcade so we know she made it there. I would think if she screamed or made any sort of a scene, somebody would have noticed. School was out and I would imagine there would have been a fair amount of kids and housewives in the area on that afternoon. I still think he brought the car back and parked it in the general area because he had to get back to the area, either because he lived nearby or because his own vehicle was parked there. Otherwise why would you drive a vehicle you know people are out looking for?
 
Re Knowles-how the hell do you just start killing when you are almost an old man? Talk about a mid life crisis.
This case haunts me. Were there wooded areas near the mall? Were cadaver dogs used to hunt for her or did they have that then?
 
I dont think anybody starts killing when they are an older man, at least not if they are a serial killer. Most serial killers start in their 20s, 30s at the latest. I think some of these guys started killing many years before they were ever caught, and most of them bragged about how many people they had killed although they were never linked to that many.

The only info I have in regard to this case was the articles I posted the links to in regard to what Carlene's mom and one of her sisters said about the investigation, which was really no investigation. Her dad had to beg the police to fingerprint the car because the police insisted she was a runaway and would turn up. Nothing was found. Her family and friends put up fliers and stayed by the phone but later on Carlene's mom received a letter from the police asking to be notified if her daughter had returned so they could close her file! So obviously they had done nothing. I think this case could have been solved at the time, or at least they could have recovered Carlene's remains. I think it's doubtful now that we will ever know what happened or where she is, it's very likely her killer may not even be alive. Unless he is and he decides to talk, or unless someone else with info decides to talk, I feel the chances are slim to ever getting any answers.
 
Her parents should sue the police force from neglect. they should talk to macon media, try to jar memories. someone knows something.
 
tengelsen_carlene.jpg

http://www.charleyproject.org/images/t/tengelsen_carlene.jpg

I like to post the images right on our site so that any UID investigators only have to click once.


Here's her NamUS link: https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/show/10554
 
Kimster said:
I wonder if this UID could be her? They don't list any rule outs. I do hope the family has submitted a DNA sample to NamUS.

https://identifyus.org/en/cases/2189
Click to expand...

Good shout Kimster. McDonough is only an hour's drive away from Macon. There is so little info on that UID's Namus that it's quite frustrating, however the one possible thing I've seen that might rule her out is that the UIDs dental records (which says "forthcoming") has her upper 8s present, which typically don't erupt until 17 years old at the earliest and usually much later. Also, the maxillary teeth as a rule erupt after the mandibular ones which would indicate perhaps that the UID was older than 16.

That said, DNA is obviously the best indicator as there is a lot of person to person variation with regards to dentition. Mitochondrial was extracted so I sure hope a suitable relative is alive and fighting to bring Carlene home.
 
I have considered that UID at times, although I think several on WS believe she could be another lady missing in I think 1969. I am sorry I can't recall her name right now but I am thinking her last name might be Nolan? The main problem I have with this UID is that Carlene was wearing a full set of braces on her teeth when she disappeared. Namus doesn't mention the braces unless that was info LE didn't want to release, though I can't imagine why they wouldn't since that would be a huge indentifying factor.

My gut feeling is that Carlene was taken somewhere within the general area, most likely a wooded area, and probably was left unburied. If he buried her I would have expected the interior of the car to be dirty.

Unless......the deal with the car is all wrong. Maybe the perp never took her in her own family's car and the car was parked near the mall all along, although one of her sisters insists it was not. It was found with the keys inside and the windows rolled down. Carlene's family stated she would never have left the car that way. But if the info we have is accurate, and the car was not at that location earlier in the evening, it looks as if she was abducted along with the vehicle and the perp drove the vehicle back to town several hours later. I think he didn't steal the car because he didn't need it, either because he lived in the general area or because his own vehicle was parked in town. I think he had to drive it back for some reason. I think if I were him I wouldn't have come back so near the mall, but we will probably never know why.

We know Carlene disappeared somewhere between 4pm and 5pm because she didn't pick up her youngest sister at the appointed time. So where was the car and what was going on between then and when the car showed back up after 1am the next morning? I don't think the perp held Carlene that long. I could be wrong but I picture him as someone who took her for the purpose of rape, so I am thinking he either drove or made her drive to a location, and I don't feel she was with him alive very long. I don't feel he took her and kept her somewhere for hours or days, and I certainly hope not. Was part of the missing time spent driving to and from the location where Carlene's remains are? That would widen the possible area considerably. Or maybe the time was used in the concealment of the body. I still wonder why the car wasn't dirty if he buried her or covered her with leaves or brush, but its possible he took her to a location where he would have had access to soap, water, and clean clothing.

I think the reason this case sticks with me is the pure randomness of it. Who would have ever imagined Carlene would disappear the first time she drove anywhere alone, on a summer's day, in the middle of the afternoon, in a public area? It's just not something you could prepare for or try to prevent. I can't imagine not knowing all these years what happened, not having any remains or a gravesite, not having a suspect, not knowing if someone you passed regularly in the neighborhood was the person responsible.
 
Dogperson, thank you I hadn't known she wore braces on her teeth it makes UID rule outs a hell of a lot easier now. The issue of the car certainly creates a lot of headaches in this case. Having looked at Google maps I see there are two lakes and a river and some other bodies of water in surrounding Macon. Hence I'm beginning to think she may have been murdered and her remains discarded into one of those.

You're 100% right about the randomness of this case. For this to happen in the early evening in a densely populated area does beggar belief. My prayers go out to her family, the not knowing must be the worst feeling of all.
 
Sallust said:
Dogperson, thank you I hadn't known she wore braces on her teeth it makes UID rule outs a hell of a lot easier now. The issue of the car certainly creates a lot of headaches in this case. Having looked at Google maps I see there are two lakes and a river and some other bodies of water in surrounding Macon. Hence I'm beginning to think she may have been murdered and her remains discarded into one of those.

You're 100% right about the randomness of this case. For this to happen in the early evening in a densely populated area does beggar belief. My prayers go out to her family, the not knowing must be the worst feeling of all.
Click to expand...


The timing of the finding of the UID, and the location, would make for a good possible match for Carlene other than the braces. I mainly remembered the braces because her mom stated, when told by the police that Carlene probably just ran off, that you dont run away when you have braces on your teeth. The body of water theory is a good one and would be an excellent way to conceal remains without really getting yourself dirty. Such as, weighing the body down somehow and throwing it in the water where it would sink. I wonder if our kidnapper hadnt done this kind of thing before. He certainly made her vanish quickly enough and has gotten away with it for 40 years. Its hard to imagine he only did this once.

I am hoping that if remains are ever found we might be able to identify her jewelry and/or the dental work. She was wearing her boyfriend's classring, a POW bracelet, and a Mickey Mouse watch.
 
Bumping for Carlene. Nothing really new online about her in the last year.
 
Carlene Sessions Tengelsen, 16, Missing since June 21, 1972 from Macon, GA

Carlene Sessions Tengelsen
Missing since June 21, 1972 from Macon, Bibb County, Georgia
Classification: Endangered Missing

Vital Statistics

Age at Time of Disappearance: 16 years old
Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'9"; 115 lbs.
Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Curly, brown hair; hazel eyes. She ironed her hair straight. Tanned complexion. Skinny.
Marks, Scars: A mole on her left cheek. A brown fleck beneath her chin, on her neck.
Clothing: A blue dress shirt; blue jeans and a Mickey Mouse watch on her right wrist. She wore a bracelet on the other, which bore the name of a Vietnam POW. She also wore her boyfriend's class ring, white gold with his initials engraved.
Dentals: Braces. She had a chipped front tooth.

Circumstances of Disappearance

Carlene Tengelsen was last seen on June 21, 1972 at Westgate Shopping Center in Macon.

Carlene was supposed to tool up the family station wagon and later pick her younger sister up from day camp at Mercer University. It was her first time driving anywhere alone, and she'd had her license for two weeks.

Charlene never arrived, and the 1963 Pontiac station wagon was located in the Westgate mall parking lot at 01.45, the night she disappeared, with the windows down and its doors unlocked.

Carlene was a rising junior at Southwest High at the time of her disappearance.

Investigators
If you have any information concerning this case, please contact:

Macon Police Department
912-751-7505

Agency Case Number: 97MP123808

Source Information:
The Macon Telegraph
The Doe Network: Case File 2837DFGA

LINK:

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/2837dfga.html
 
I was searching online and found a couple of links about has some info about Westgate Mall in Macon, Georgia. The first two links had photos of the mall from the 1960's and 1970's.


http://skycity2.blogspot.com/2009/07/westgate-shopping-center-macon-ga_17.html


http://skycity2.blogspot.com/2010/09/westgate-mall-brochure-photos-macon-ga.html


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westgate_Mall_(Macon,_Georgia)


I also read the link from the newspaper article Miracle of a Loss that was posted at the beginning of this thread.

What caught my attention was that the newspaper article mentioned Carlene did sketches of horses and that the day Carlene Tengelsen disappeared on June 21, 1972, was the first day of Summer.

Carlene's disappearance may be connected to other females that disappeared on the first day or at the start of Summer during the 1970's. All had connection to horses.

Jan Andre Cotta missing: June 26, 1973 from Wall Township, New Jersey.

Margaret Ellen Fox missing: June 24, 1974 from Burlington, New Jersey.

Edna Christine Thorne missing: June 24, 1975 from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.

Sandra Kaye Butler missing: June 26, 1978 from Sparks, Nevada.
 
Y'all, my jaw dropped reading this thread. There are strong, strong similarities between this case and Mary Shotwell Little.

Mary disappeared from an Atlanta shopping center, Lennox Square, in 1965. She met a co-worker for dinner, at some point went grocery shopping, and disappeared. It was determined she never returned home. Her boss called Lennox Square and they searched the parking lot. They didn't find her car. Later her boss searched the parking lot and found it.

That's a strange, strange coincidence, the disappearing/reappearing car. Mary, like Carlene, was never found.

A few years ago I thought about writing an article on Mary and took the tack that the multiple complications in her case were red herrings and it was more likely a serial killer got his hands on her. During my search for similar cases I found Nancy Stewart Wilkes, who also disappeared from a shopping center, left groceries in her car, and was never seen again.

I found several cases of women abducted out in public, many from shopping centers, others from unknown places from towns/cities along Georgia's major transportation highways, who either were never found again or were found murdered, but no one was ever charged with the crime. All were white women in their teens and early thirties whom I would describe as pretty in a girl next door way. I'll have to look through my notes from grad school.

I don't know how I never ran across Carlene.
 
Her case always has reminded me of the Little case, with the exception of the possible sightings of Little afterwards and the comments from her co-workers that she had been frightened of someone.

I hadn't ever heard of the Wilkes case but it's similar too. I just don't believe whoever took Carlene only did this one time. Who commits their first murder by taking a girl in broad daylight in the mall parking lot? And he got away with it so cleanly that there was no reason to stop, if he chose to do it again. The only exception I can think of is if this was done by someone who was obsessed with her, like maybe a young man who had feelings for her along with some type of problems that would cause him to kill her if she rebuffed his advances.

I considered Debardeleben because he was called the "mall passer" for passing counterfeit currency at mall stores, but he was also a serial killer. For instance, maybe he passed some fake money at the mall, then grabbed Carlene along with her car to make his getaway in case somebody took a harder look at the money. If I recall correctly, he also used fake police badges and other gear to look official when approaching a potential victim. He could have staked out the parking lot and maybe he saw a lone female (Carlene) get out of her car and go into the mall. Then he could have approached her as she came out, flashed a badge, then said somebody struck or vandalized her car and he needed her to accompany him to it. Ted Bundy tried that particular ruse.

According to NAMUS there are no dentals, DNA, or fingerprints on file for Carlene. I have not been able to find any UIDs that would match her, particularly considering she had a full set of braces on her teeth. Her family would need to provide DNA if a potential match ever came up, but I suppose they may feel there has been no reason to do so without a potential match available. Most likely they believe she is deceased considering the time span and also she just doesn't sound like the type to run away. When you read the story about her mom and younger sister you can tell this was a close-knit family and Carlene doesn't appear to have any reason to want to run away.
 
dogperson said:
You are right: a lot of people seem to have disappeared from shopping malls. I went on Doe Network one day and just did a search for "mall" and was surprised how many there were.

Carlene's disappearance is one of my pet cases, maybe my top pet case that I would like to see solved. There is practically NO info about her online other than pretty much just the links I posted when I started the thread. I really believe if she hadn't been treated as a runaway by the police, this could have been solved at the time. Her sister said in one of the articles that their dad had to beg the police to fingerprint the car.

Carlene was apparently taken in broad daylight from the mall parking lot that afternoon, and evidently was taken away in her own car because it wasn't at the mall when her family started looking for her but turned up later that night in front of the Krispy Kreme at the mall. Somebody either carjacked her by using a weapon or some sort of force and made her drive them someplace where most likely she was assaulted and murdered, or else somebody she knew made a pretense of needing her to drop them off someplace while intending to assault and kill her. Whoever it was had the nerve to drive the car back to the mall and park it later that night, even though they had to have known her family would be looking for her by that time. He (I'm assuming it was a he) could easily have been spotted while driving or parking the car. (The details about the car remind me of Mary Shotwell Little's case, who was abducted from an Atlanta, GA mall, although I firmly believe Mary's case was a kidnapping and murder for hire.)

I would love to see a cold case unit take another look at this. Maybe, after all these years, somebody would be willing to talk. It may not be too late to prosecute whoever did this, assuming he is still alive. If this was a stranger abduction then I'm wondering how likely it is that he only did this one time. Carlene's abductor may very well be the same person who abducted other young women during the time period.
Click to expand...

I wonder if there has been any progress on this case. I am assuming the boyfriend was ruled out.
 
The boyfriend must have checked out okay; it's my understanding from the info out there that he was present at his job during the time Carlene disappeared. He worked at a grocery store in the general area of the mall because Carlene put a note on his windshield while she was at the mall. The note said she was looking forward to seeing him that night. The note makes it sound as though the relationship was going well and that they had a date planned for the evening. Normally the boyfriend or husband is the first person who needs to be checked out so I certainly hope the police verified he was on the job for his entire shift. I can't find any articles at all that state his name but I'm guessing he was underage at the time. If he was ruled out as a suspect then police and/or his family may have wanted to keep his name out of it.

Carlene did have a full set of braces when she disappeared and I haven't found any UIDs anywhere in the country whose stats match up with her. The few who are wearing braces are nowhere near as tall as Carlene, among other things that rule them out. I wish her DNA or dentals were on file with NAMUS in case remains ever turn up, but maybe the family is waiting to submit those items if and when a likely match ever does turn up.

Occasionally I check websites that sell yearbooks hoping to find a 1972 book from her high school, which would have been the spring before she disappeared. I would be interested to see what photos there might be of her and who might be in those photos with her. If by any chance a young man from her school, or even an authority figure at the school, abducted her then I am hoping something in the photos would give us a clue, although I realize how far-fetched an idea that is. I still think it was more likely a grown man who took her, and that maybe it was a crime of opportunity and she just happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time. It seems so unsolvable now, unless somebody makes a confession all these years later.
 
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