Has anyone compared the remains location with the ping maps?

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If I remember correctly, the pings showed Casey never left the general area of the A's home until much later in the day (like 4-5pm), despite George saying they left the house at 12:50pm. I assume the wooded area would still ping off the same tower as the A's house?
 
Marsha said:
Patting myself on the back........I posted this on the Ping Map page on 10/18:

aa1212.jpg



http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2834123#post2834123
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I agree that you need a great BIG pat on the back, Marsha!

:clap:
 
TxRose said:
If I remember correctly, the pings showed Casey never left the general area of the A's home until much later in the day (like 4-5pm), despite George saying they left the house at 12:50pm. I assume the wooded area would still ping off the same tower as the A's house?
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Yes I'm sure you're right about the pings but Caylee wasn't taken to the dump spot until sometime later, after Caylee had laid in the back of her pontiac, started decomposing and leaving a lasting impression on the carpet.

The working theory is, if she left as GA claims she stayed nearby and returned soon after GA went to work. As soon as she returned she logged onto the A's desktop computer. Logged off abruptly at 3, went to TonE's house at 4:15ish.

Depending on which story you believe Caylee either died accidentally while KC was on the pc, or KC killed her between 3 and 4 (or drugged her at this time which lead to her death), or Caylee had been killed the nite before after the fight with CA.

I'm still struggling with this because for all her on line searches, Leaving a decomposing body in the back of ones car for 2 & a half days, then literally tossing it into a culvert at the end of the block, was a poor plan.

There's no doubt in my mind she did this by herself, and she was sickeningly happy to have finished her plan. Just what did she think she was going to do with the remains? Bury her unnoticed in the family back yard? Did she think the angels were going to come and whisk her away like the tooth fairy?
 
This is all really impressive work! So many of you were going in the right direction a long time ago.
 
Indigo said:
WTG, Marsha! Wow.

:clap::clap::clap::clap:
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I actually didn't want to just pat myself on the back.....I did see a few others who were just as interested in this area as I was. It was just too obvious.......a "she is close" area, very familiar to KC.

When I first posted the map on Surburban Dr., Realist, a fellow WS'r replied to my post. He, being a local searcher who initially started searching in August for Caylee and continued searching until the day she was found, had also been very interested in this area and had also been there a few times.

There are so many locals like Realist who gave countless hours of their precious time to look for this baby. And those like Realist who were sooooo close to finding her should also be congratulated and applauded for their efforts.

Thank You Realist and other Local Searchers!
 
It's Not the Nanny said:
I find it weird she didn't go all the way to the dead end and walk into the woods a bit more. She put her off the sidewalk near a school where kids would walk/play.
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She was found on the other side of the street without the sidewalk. It is pretty brushy in that area whereas I think it is a bit more open directly east and south of the school. Plus KC was guarded from visibility by the woods on the sidewalk side of the street.

I think she was in a real hurry, also. Possibly even scared to death in the near discovery by GA in the trunk incident on the 24th. So a dump date of 7/24 or 7/27 makes sense to me.
 
It's Not the Nanny said:
I find it weird she didn't go all the way to the dead end and walk into the woods a bit more. She put her off the sidewalk near a school where kids would walk/play.
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I agree, I think even if she had left the body there in a panic, she would have returned soon after to move it to a much better location far from her parents' house where it wouldn't be found. To me, the body being placed there seems to indicate a different perpetrator, one who either didn't care about the body being found or who actually wanted it to look like KC was responsible. Either that or she really suffers from serious enough mental illness that she could put the body there but not remember it. If she had killed Caylee (or even if she just wanted to conceal that there had been an accident, or to cover for a paramour or other friend) I think she would have moved the body someplace else, any more remote area, any pond or whatever.
 
seagull65 said:
I agree, I think even if she had left the body there in a panic, she would have returned soon after to move it to a much better location far from her parents' house where it wouldn't be found. To me, the body being placed there seems to indicate a different perpetrator, one who either didn't care about the body being found or who actually wanted it to look like KC was responsible. Either that or she really suffers from serious enough mental illness that she could put the body there but not remember it. If she had killed Caylee (or even if she just wanted to conceal that there had been an accident, or to cover for a paramour or other friend) I think she would have moved the body someplace else, any more remote area, any pond or whatever.
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FWIW, IMHO, now that the body has been discovered, to believe another person served as an accessory after the fact that placed the body on Suburban (vs. a different disposal location by Casey), is to believe that Casey is willing to go down without taking that someone down with her. IF the body had been moved by someone else Casey would be spilling info to cut a deal and attempting to frame that person w/ the crime.

IMHO, the bag w/ body may have floated to a location several yards away from where Casey originally left it, hence, she didn't know EXACTLY where the bag was. IF she ever returned to the location I doubt she would've looked very long or hard and assumed if she couldn't find it, no one else could, or perhaps it had been the target of scavengers.
 
yesterday, 10:48 PM

Friday
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 468
There's a nice big retention pond in a clearing right next to the woods where Caylee's body was found. All Casey had to do was throw the garbage bag into the water and watch it sink. No need to dig with a shovel or drag a bag through snake-infested woods.

She may, or may not, have realized that torrential rainfall and tropical storm force winds could cause the contents of the pond to spill over and be carried away by the floodwater.

Perhaps her "plan" had been to dispose of Caylee exactly as she did, and she chose that nearby site because she wanted Caylee's remains to be discovered--eventually. I think that because I can't get past her remark to Robb: "They haven't even found the clothes she was wearing yet." (quote from memory)
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I thought this post by Friday was a very good explanation. That would match the pings and would also mean that the body could have still been in the same location it was found (Tim M's comment that there was an impression in the ground so the body would have been there a long time). Since the backyard was checked by LE after the body was found, there may well have been something heavy from the backyard that was found around the body (paver, sand?). Friday's comment would also explain why the bag was so close to the road.
 
JWG said:
The pings should be identical to those at the Anthony's.

In an email I had another WSer suggest that her text to Amy on June 27 that she definitely had a part of a dead squirrel on her car and got rid of it - prior to running out of gas at the AMSCOT - was when she disposed of little Caylee.

The pings support this notion.
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Are we sure that she actually ran out of gas at the amscot. The reason I ask is because GA says that he put the key in the ignition and started to start it, then said to himself, "I can't just leave like this, without knowing." So he stopped and got out and asked the towyard guy to go to the back of the car with him to find the smell. A very wise thing to do, imo. Then IIRC he went from there to get the gas cans assuming it was out of gas. I think this because whenever I ran out of gas, I had to pump and pump, and even put a lttle in the carburator, but GA says "it started right up." jmo. and I didn't go back and reread. any thoughts?
 
seagull65 said:
I agree, I think even if she had left the body there in a panic, she would have returned soon after to move it to a much better location far from her parents' house where it wouldn't be found. To me, the body being placed there seems to indicate a different perpetrator, one who either didn't care about the body being found or who actually wanted it to look like KC was responsible. Either that or she really suffers from serious enough mental illness that she could put the body there but not remember it. If she had killed Caylee (or even if she just wanted to conceal that there had been an accident, or to cover for a paramour or other friend) I think she would have moved the body someplace else, any more remote area, any pond or whatever.
Click to expand...
She knew the area very well and must have known when and how often people walk through there and entry and exit areas as well. Even though Caylee was found not far from the road, looks like little more than 10 feet, I suspect she was secure in this being a good spot. Also, she would be able to check on her easily without anyone noticing. I find it well thought out in light of some of the articles they found with her, as her book, backpack, and who know what else. Some think she used pesticide to cover the smell, but I expect it was her feeble way to protect her after finding flies on her, which I think is also the reason for the duct tape, to cover areas bugs could get in, but then I may be being generous with her maternal feelings. I do apologize. I take into account her age and remember how incredibly stupid I was and how I lacked knowing consequence for actions at that age. I do tend to swing from complete disgust to justify somewhat with her enviroment, and age though. fwiw. and jmo The body being placed there says to me she acted alone, and without help or advice from anyone else, and that she isn't a sociopath after all.
I'm going to go way out on a limb here and hopefully not regret to say that the big rocks around the small area might have been a makeshift gravesight to protect her. I really have no clue though, and so should stop. I doubt I will feel this way tomorrow. She did this to hurt her mom, as much as to be free to have a beautiful life. She wanted free from Caylee and Cindy. she should have just walked out the door and got a new number and sent her a postcard. Cindy would have been thrilled, Caylee would have been happy, and Casey probably would have been happy too, until she ended up in jail for stealing, but she was too spiteful to let it happen that way, and she now regrets it, I'm sure.
 
yosande said:
Are we sure that she actually ran out of gas at the amscot. The reason I ask is because GA says that he put the key in the ignition and started to start it, then said to himself, "I can't just leave like this, without knowing." So he stopped and got out and asked the towyard guy to go to the back of the car with him to find the smell. A very wise thing to do, imo. Then IIRC he went from there to get the gas cans assuming it was out of gas. I think this because whenever I ran out of gas, I had to pump and pump, and even put a lttle in the carburator, but GA says "it started right up." jmo. and I didn't go back and reread. any thoughts?
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Hi, yosande. I believe if you check the 6/27 ping thread the details are there. Believe the Pontiac was abandoned intentionally so Casey would for Tony to let her drive his Jeep GC to the airport vs. her decomp-smelling car. She intended to recover 6/30 w/ gas can assistance from Amy after she attempted to get gas cans 6/29 from G&C's which resulted in "the chase" where George spotted her and gave chase to her in Tony's Jeep (vs. Cindy's Forerunner as he thought she must be driving....see 6/29 thread).

Casey likely ran the car outta gas intentionally. I believe she told Tony it was broken and George would repair. That ensured her plan would work vs. just telling him it was outta gas...which could've easily been remedied and foiled her plan.

Hope that helps.
 
BondJamesBond said:
Hi, yosande. I believe if you check the 6/27 ping thread the details are there. Believe the Pontiac was abandoned intentionally so Casey would for Tony to let her drive his Jeep GC to the airport vs. her decomp-smelling car. She intended to recover 6/30 w/ gas can assistance from Amy after she attempted to get gas cans 6/29 from G&C's which resulted in "the chase" where George spotted her and gave chase to her in Tony's Jeep (vs. Cindy's Forerunner as he thought she must be driving....see 6/29 thread).

Casey likely ran the car outta gas intentionally. I believe she told Tony it was broken and George would repair. That ensured her plan would work vs. just telling him it was outta gas...which could've easily been remedied and foiled her plan.

Hope that helps.
Click to expand...

Hi BondJamesBond, incredible work you've done here! I was wondering if there is any concrete evidence that Casey actually tried to pick up the car at Amscot on the 30th. I looked at the ping maps (I admit I'm lost there) and read Amy's interview. It seems that even though Casey and Amy did buy gas cans that day, Casey just hung out for the rest of the day and didn't follow through. Any thoughts on this? I'm probably missing something...:crazy:
 
Indigo said:
Hi BondJamesBond, incredible work you've done here! I was wondering if there is any concrete evidence that Casey actually tried to pick up the car at Amscot on the 30th. I looked at the ping maps (I admit I'm lost there) and read Amy's interview. It seems that even though Casey and Amy did buy gas cans that day, Casey just hung out for the rest of the day and didn't follow through. Any thoughts on this? I'm probably missing something...:crazy:
Click to expand...

Hi,
I agree BJB does nice work. There is nothing in the interview from Amy about ever going to the car. Her phone logs put her at Amy/Ricardo's place all afternoon but it is later in the day that her phone activity starts to get a little crazy and her pings have her moving about.
I have two schools of thought
#1. I suspect that Casey already knew by the time she went with Amy to Target to buy the gas can that the car had been towed but she needed to follow through with the request because otherwise it may have seemed odd.
Plus she was now driving Tony's jeep so even though a different vehicle there was still the same problem of no money but needs gas.
#2. Because her phone activity goes into hyper-mode after Amy leaves for work Casey has just discovered that the car is gone and is in some level of panic. That added to the fact that I believe she has also just figured out she can not get back into Tony's apartment and now does not have a place to stay the night. If she is attempting to contact people to help her figure out how to find out where the car went, what is the process when your car is towed etc. she may not have wanted to be within earshot of any of her friends


I just can’t make up my mind. LOL Both could be wrong too.

I would like to also hear what BJB has to say on this point.
I value his opinion.
 
Indigo said:
I was wondering if there is any concrete evidence that Casey actually tried to pick up the car at Amscot on the 30th. I looked at the ping maps (I admit I'm lost there) and read Amy's interview. It seems that even though Casey and Amy did buy gas cans that day, Casey just hung out for the rest of the day and didn't follow through. Any thoughts on this? I'm probably missing something...:crazy:
Click to expand...
*snipped*

Appreciate the kind words, Indigo. (and Shadow :) ) but you hafta take into account that I am simply summarizing the work of many, many others (incl. Shadow TYVM)...I don't mean to represent it as my own work...just try to summarize what I've read that IMHO makes sense and can be reasonably supported.

...the 6/30 thread is a good place to read and form your own opinion. You'll see that Pink Panther & JWG have done a nice job detailing it out. Summarizing what they posted, and with which I agree, Casey didn't learn of the Pontiac being towed until ~5PM.

IMHO...Casey didn't WANT Amy to be WITH her when she gassed up the car. Sooo...waiting for Amy to leave for work was intentional. It would have made more sense for Amy to go with her since she would need another driver to get the 2nd car driven somewhere (Pontiac and Jeep GC).
 
shadow of my mind said:
Hi,
I agree BJB does nice work. There is nothing in the interview from Amy about ever going to the car. Her phone logs put her at Amy/Ricardo's place all afternoon but it is later in the day that her phone activity starts to get a little crazy and her pings have her moving about.
I have two schools of thought
#1. I suspect that Casey already knew by the time she went with Amy to Target to buy the gas can that the car had been towed but she needed to follow through with the request because otherwise it may have seemed odd.
Plus she was now driving Tony's jeep so even though a different vehicle there was still the same problem of no money but needs gas.
#2. Because her phone activity goes into hyper-mode after Amy leaves for work Casey has just discovered that the car is gone and is in some level of panic. That added to the fact that I believe she has also just figured out she can not get back into Tony's apartment and now does not have a place to stay the night. If she is attempting to contact people to help her figure out how to find out where the car went, what is the process when your car is towed etc. she may not have wanted to be within earshot of any of her friends


I just can’t make up my mind. LOL Both could be wrong too.

I would like to also hear what BJB has to say on this point.
I value his opinion.
Click to expand...

(Bold mine)

Hi shadow,

I didn't mean to leave you out of the Greath Sleuthing equation. My apologies --and many thanks for all of your hard work! Your theory about Casey's hyper-mode is very interesting and I'll have to give it more thought.

The more I consider Casey's activity that day, the hinkier it seems. According to Casey, her car had run out of gas--yet her only concern was to purchase an empty gas can. On the surface, this would make it appear as if she intended to pick up her car. But I wonder if she ever really attempted to fill the gas can? Did she ever contact the Amscot to find out if her car had been towed. Did she ever make any attempt during that day or in the following weeks to find out what happened to her car or actually try to retrieve it.

Cindy asked Casey during a jailhouse visit why she never picked up her car. Casey seemed visibly upset by the question and refused to answer. I really think she meant to "get rid" of "the smell" when she left the car at Amscot that day. JMO.
 
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