JonBenet: A Closer Look

[LazyCat08]

I've always been in limbo over this but does the DNA evidence not essentially prove that none of the Ramsey's actually killed Jonbenet? So they are not quilty of the physical act of murdering her, right?
But they knew something and they OBVIOUSLY had a hand in covering up the crime/ evidence, etc.
The BIG questions for me is WHY would the family cover anything up if they knew who killed her or why she was murdered? - they would have HAD to have something to hide or someone to protect - end of story. There just isn't any other reason.
The body being in the basement IMO points toward an intruder or someone hiding - someone who didn't live in the house but was familiar with it OR an obvious attempt to make it look that way.
I always kind of thought that Jonbenet was murdered somewhere else in the house because the body was cleaned and re-dressed. I always thought that the body was moved - but the chocking device was made from materials in the basement - so that doesn't really fit.......

 

[Wudge]

I've always been in limbo over this but does the DNA evidence not essentially prove that none of the Ramsey's actually killed Jonbenet? So they are not quilty of the physical act of murdering her, right?
But they knew something and they OBVIOUSLY had a hand in covering up the crime/ evidence, etc.
The BIG questions for me is WHY would the family cover anything up if they knew who killed her or why she was murdered? - they would have HAD to have something to hide or someone to protect - end of story. There just isn't any other reason.
The body being in the basement IMO points toward an intruder or someone hiding - someone who didn't live in the house but was familiar with it OR an obvious attempt to make it look that way.
I always kind of thought that Jonbenet was murdered somewhere else in the house because the body was cleaned and re-dressed. I always thought that the body was moved - but the chocking device was made from materials in the basement - so that doesn't really fit.......

Unless someone thought that the BPD had the DNA profile that was twice found on Jon Benet's person, but were not capable of obtainng the families DNA for comparison purposes, then, when mixed with the other exculpatory evidence, the DNA is highly exculpatory to the point of being near perfect exoneration.

 

[lisafremont]

Did the special explain why Patsy wrote the "ransom" tome for Helgoth??

 

[Michael Cook]

I knew Mike Helgoth, it was not like we were good friends but we did know each other. I knew alot of the people he hung around with, but was not a real part of the "in" crowd. There were a few things that the show last night embellished, which leads me to believe they may have on other things. The town of Boulder is really nothing like the described we have no Ski resort, people do care about this case and we would love to see it solved. I think the BPD sucks, even though my Sister-in-law is an officer. The show was a real eye opener for me as I had no idea He (Helgoth) was a prime suspect. The show brought back alot of memories from the mid-90's. I was at Mike's funeral, and it was discussed among friends there that He had committed suicide because of a failed relationship with a girlfreind, not the one in the show. He had dated her(from the show) around a year before all this. I did not see any of the sadistic things, CTV said he did, like I said I was not part of the in crowd. Alot of the evidence talked about last night seemed to add up with some of the info I knew of personally about Helgoth. I am very curious about the other perp. I knew another person who had been friends with Helgoth since Elementary school, I knew him better. He had moved away from Boulder in the summer of 97'?

 

[Jayelles]

Welcome Michael Cook! It's always exciting when someone of interest posts on the forum

Could you be more specific when you say:-

There were a few things that the show last night embellished, which leads me to believe they may have on other things.]

and

Alot of the evidence talked about last night seemed to add up with some of the info I knew of personally about Helgoth.

Also, do you know John Kenady?

This show was shown in the UK last year. In it, they were specific about their real Prime Suspect (Helgoth was only the accomplice). It was a load of badly speculative garbage which was exposed by some of us on another forum. As a result, the documentary was somewhat edited for the US.

The US people have been badly mislead by this documentary. Some of the things where were claimed as "facts" are not facts at all. The investigators were presented as the "new" investigators on the case and they aren't. They have no access to the official file and are merely Private Investigators hired by the Ramseys.

The DanceWest assault took place months after Michael Helgoth's death and could have had nothing to do with him.

Michael Helgoth's boots were extremely unlikely to still contain mould from the Ramsey basement several moths later (that's just common sense). Besides, film footage of the yard where he worked showed that the soil on the ground was a similar colour to the debris on his boot soles - isn't it more likely it came from there?

I'd be very interested to hear more from you - if you are willing to share.

 

[CinnamonGirl]

I wonder if they will ever solve this case.

 

[Michael Cook]

Alright here we go. I think the investigators focused on Mike because He committed suicide right after Hunter made his famous(FBI written) statement. The show "neglected" to say it was on Valentines day! Which blends real well with the assumption from friends, of which I have first hand info, that it was over the broken relationship with the Dancer. He wanted to settle down with her from what I knew. The way the show described him? I never saw anything like that at all, but like I said I only knew him for around 1-2 years up to his suicide. He did work in a junk yard, owned by his uncle Doug. I do not know Joe, I have seen him around town. The interviews with him and the other guy in the junk yard? The junk yard Mike's uncle owned was bought by the City of Boulder not 2 years after Mike's suicide, they have since totally cleaned the site. It has been turned into a Park and has been that way since 2000? They did not do the interviews at the said junkyard, where Mike worked. The show really tried to make it look that way,don't you think? That was one embellishment. I do not think Mike was as wierd as the show said he was. You think you hang around someone for a year or two you would see some reflections of this attitude?! He was a very gentle person, soft spoken. The boots, the infamous boots. Good grief, Boulder is a hikers haven! You could not have traced those boots to one person, I bet in the City of Boulder alone there were 1,000-2,000 people with those boots, rare my rear! Let alone the rest of this state! For the record I have a hard time thinking it was the parents. I live very close to "the house". I could drive there in 2 minutes, the dirt is likely not the same. It was much drier at the Junk yard, but mold on the boot? That was how the show described it, not from the yard would there be any mold, way to dry. And if it was him who was in the house, the dirt could have been tracked from the junk yard. This junk yard was only 15 minutes away fromt he house. You think Crime scene detectives would have taken that debris from where she was found and tried to compare it to dirt from the yard, which would have undoubtedly had grease in the dirt? Will get this posted now, did they name the prime on the show in the UK?

 

[JBR_Justice]

I wonder if they will ever solve this case.

The narrator said funding is minimal so I hope they can keep the case open somehow. The other prep(s) is (are) still at large.

 

[Michael Cook]

I do not think BPD wants it to be anyone else, and they will not spend Money to make themselves look bad. Boulder is a small town by most standards, alot more is not known about this case then what is I think.

 

[Michael Cook]

The narrator said funding is minimal so I hope they can keep the case open somehow. The other prep(s) is (are) still at large.

Scary thing for me is I live in Boulder and not far from the house. I have a 12 year old girl, I wnat then to catch whoever did it.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

I tend to agree with investigators about the pillow-angle thing and say that the idea it could have been murder can't be ruled out. Most suicides are more direct. An angled shot thru the chest just isn't suicide-like.

Besides, the show presented Holgoth as a person generally hated and feared by many, for his antics with guns, and maybe with kids (he was quoted as saying he can't be trusted with little girls).

The list of enemies he had would be long--and it would have my name on it too if he shot a gun anywhere in my direction, I'll tell you that!!

IMO, no connection to the Ramsey homicide. Every neighborhood has a characater like that one. My neighborhood had 2, and neither was a child-killer. Ramsey killer is a hardened, experienced killer who is not a local, IMO.

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Meanwhile, the 12 year old's attacker was shooed away by the mother; sounds like a pervert-creep-opportunist-burglar. Let me tell you that the Ramsey killer probably doesn't shoo.

IMO, no connection to the Ramsey homicide. Simple sex offenders, such as the one that snuck into the 12 year old's room at night, happen all too frequently, where nobody gets garroted and headbashed.

It's like saying a successful bank robber was later caught shoplifting. I don't think so.

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If you tell me that any of the Ramsey's or any of their friends suddenly and brutally murdered JonBenet Ramsey, you might as well tell me a pussycat just took the keys and drove off in the car. That's just light-years away from the reality, IMO.

 

[Michael Cook]

The pillow angle thing was quite conclusive, I tried that on myself and it does not seem I would try to commit suicide that way. He did not have alot of enemies as you say, he did deal some drugs, small stuff. And I suppose he was feared by some, like the guy they interviewed for the show. I have to say if someone did that to me friend or not I am talking to the cops before my pants dry. I am not wholly convinced he was telling the truth about the gun shot around his head. Some people would say anything to get on TV or perhaps some money, especially after that person is dead and cannot defend themselves. One thing is for sure the BPD ?#@!!% this thing up.

 

[BlueCrab]

The narrator said funding is minimal so I hope they can keep the case open somehow. The other prep(s) is (are) still at large.

JBR_Justice,

Unsolved murders are kept open forever, or until solved.

In regard to the district attorney's funding for the JonBenet case -- it is ZERO; as in "not a penny". Furthermore, there is NO investigation, and Mary Keenan hasn't applied for any money to carry out an investigation. It's nothing but talk, and not as much as a red penny put where their mouth is. The D.A.'s office scraped together a few bucks last year by not filling a position for an attorney -- but that's the only money spent recently on the case.

Keenan hasn't done ANYTHING in regard to an active investigation. The volunteers are simply brousing through the hundreds of boxes of stuff accumulated over the years. There's no new investigation. Mary Keenan, certain other Boulder officials, the courts, and the media are lying through their teeth. Why?

BlueCrab

 

[Michael Cook]

JBR_Justice,

There's no new investigation. Mary Keenan, certain other Boulder officials, the courts, and the media are lying through their teeth. Why?

BlueCrab

Cover-up, maybe?!

 

[Voice of Reason]

Thank you, Michael Cook, for your great insight into Michael Helgoth. People here are "experts" on the Jonbenet case, but noone knows all that much about Michael Helgoth, because all we hear is from the news filter. Your information is greatly appreciated!

The town of Boulder is really nothing like the described we have no Ski resort, people do care about this case and we would love to see it solved.

I have friends in Boulder and have visited their numerous times. Your statement above is dead-on, and I thought the exact same thing when the show first started. All of the big ski resorts in Colorado are at least one hour from Boulder, if not more. Boulder is more of a college town, with a lot of people who love the outdoors. It is no surprise that half the city owns Hi-Tec boots! If you start out a 1-hour special with a completely false statement, it's hard to be believed for the next 59 minutes...

 

[Michael Cook]

Your welcome voice of reason, ya know it was about when I started to mature and really start to pay attetion to the media that I started not believing nearly everything I heard unless I had first hand info. Like I said though I only knew him in certain social situation's, but I do know alot about the involvement he had with the women, whom said she did not trust him with her daughter. I knew her enough to know she would not lie about something like that, but is that a murderer make? I do not know. Someone knows. And yes you are very right, when I heard the crap in the beginning of the show that really put my hair up on my neck. It was pretty fragmented, the show did not flow. My sister-in-law is an officer with BPD, and they all believe it was the Ramsey's, go figure.

 

[Voice of Reason]

Michael Helgoth's behavior with women or children is hardly enough to implicate him in the Ramsey murder!! Also, the video they showed of him with the young girl looked like a father playing with his daughter, and I saw nothing unusual in that footage. Finally, the show mentioned something about an order of protection that she filed against him.

I have worked in the courts assisting women filing orders of protection, and it's worth noting that there is a lot more to it than "filing an order of protection", which is all the show said. There can be numerous outcomes to that...first, a woman must file a petition with a court clerk. Then, the judge must grant the order, which is only temporary. (The man gets his day in court.) At a later date, he can either contest the order with the judge or consent to the order. If he consents, he has not admitted to any wrongdoing. So, to say that an order of protection was filed against MH means nothing. Even if an order of protection is consented to by MH, it still means nothing in terms of his guilt legally speaking, except that he must stay away from her in the future. If a TEMPORARY order of protection is granted by a judge, that means the woman's story was believed by the judge for the moment. If a FINAL order of protection was granted by a judge (at a later date), that is another story. The show was vague here, and for those of you unaware of the legal background, there you have it.

I don't mean to sound critical of women victim's of domestic violence, but it is important that people understand these terms. CourtTV throws them around so casually, and it's offensive. I am very sympathetic to these women, otherwise, I wouldn't be assisting them for free in the first place!

Don't believe everything you read/hear...

 

[Michael Cook]

Yes, I do agree on the whole protection order, another thing the show did not enlighten us to, was Mike did continue to have contact with the little girls mother long after the incident happened. Strange but true. That incident was the only one ever discussed in the group, if there were other incidents with Mike I never heard of them. The little girls mother whom I will refer to as Nancy, had another man she had a relationship as well. THis other man was a very good friend of Mike's, they knew each other for a very long time. I did mention that in another reply earlier on this thread. There is just so much that does not add up concerning Mike

 

[BlueCrab]

Cover-up, maybe?!

Michael Cook,

Exactly. There's something conspiratorial going on at the highest levels in Boulder, and that is not a hypotheses. It's a plain fact. It started with the "missing" cell phone records for December and encompasses the D.A.'s office, the courts, and certain other Boulder officials. The ludicrous "no cell phone calls made in December" crap unveils the conspiracy. The cops used John's cell phone on December 26. The cell phone records alone would have likely solved the case within the first week of the investigation.

For even the courts to be involved in such an obvious coverup conspiracy tells me one thing -- VERY YOUNG CHILDREN ARE INVOLVED! The courts wouldn't get themselves involved in a criminal conspiracy to protect an adult.

BlueCrab

 

[Wudge]

Your welcome voice of reason, ya know it was about when I started to mature and really start to pay attetion to the media that I started not believing nearly everything I heard unless I had first hand info. Like I said though I only knew him in certain social situation's, but I do know alot about the involvement he had with the women, whom said she did not trust him with her daughter. I knew her enough to know she would not lie about something like that, but is that a murderer make? I do not know. Someone knows. And yes you are very right, when I heard the crap in the beginning of the show that really put my hair up on my neck. It was pretty fragmented, the show did not flow. My sister-in-law is an officer with BPD, and they all believe it was the Ramsey's, go figure.

One thing you have not heard is anyone accusing the BPD of being maze bright. The Dark Ages were enlightened compared to the BPD.