MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023

New Posts

Crimencandy said:
This is crazy. I’ve never heard of a buffer zone around a courthouse before.
Karen Read murder trial to begin with 'buffer zone' around courthouse
Click to expand...

Crimencandy said:
This is crazy. I’ve never heard of a buffer zone around a courthouse before.
Karen Read murder trial to begin with 'buffer zone' around courthouse
Click to expand...
Her defenders have shown 'very strong' behavior in the past court appearances. Most are followers of TB, which has created another whole issue which I believe has been stopped, but they are called TB Riders. (if you know of him). I'd say this is why, due to out of control 'mob' behavior and harassment. I can't imagine how this whole trial will turn out due to so much .. stuff. Terrible it happened at all and all the bad things that are happening and have to just find the truth.
 
Crimencandy said:
This is crazy. I’ve never heard of a buffer zone around a courthouse before.
Karen Read murder trial to begin with 'buffer zone' around courthouse
Click to expand...
Well, let's consider the aim of the "protesters". Up until now, they'll tell you they were trying to get media attention. Well, it worked. But now that the media already has trucks lined up on the street, I'd argue their reason for wanting to protest on the courthouse steps wearing their FKR gear is less to gin up media attention and far more to try and influence the jury. They want their say in the outcome, dammit!

But that isn't how the system works. The public doesn't have a say and decisions are made inside a courtroom, not outside.

Despite what some may think, First Amendment rights are not absolute. Pursuant to that same Constitution, BOTH sides - Commonwealth and Read - are entitled to a fair trial. So essentially a clash of rights. The judge is well within her rights to order a buffer zone to prevent as much pro-Read lobbying as possible.

For the record, I think she's innocent. No way could a slow moving vehicle backing up on a curve in a residential area have caused any of those injuries. (especially the bizarre arm lacerations in conjunction with the other injuries) The ultimate - and possibly only - piece of evidence needed for her to get off is John's body itself. It can't tell us what happened to him, but it can tell us what couldn't have happened.
 
HarmonyE. said:
Well, let's consider the aim of the "protesters". Up until now, they'll tell you they were trying to get media attention. Well, it worked. But now that the media already has trucks lined up on the street, I'd argue their reason for wanting to protest on the courthouse steps wearing their FKR gear is less to gin up media attention and far more to try and influence the jury. They want their say in the outcome, dammit!

But that isn't how the system works. The public doesn't have a say and decisions are made inside a courtroom, not outside.

Despite what some may think, First Amendment rights are not absolute. Pursuant to that same Constitution, BOTH sides - Commonwealth and Read - are entitled to a fair trial. So essentially a clash of rights. The judge is well within her rights to order a buffer zone to prevent as much pro-Read lobbying as possible.

For the record, I think she's innocent. No way could a slow moving vehicle backing up on a curve in a residential area have caused any of those injuries. (especially the bizarre arm lacerations in conjunction with the other injuries) The ultimate - and possibly only - piece of evidence needed for her to get off is John's body itself. It can't tell us what happened to him, but it can tell us what couldn't have happened.
Click to expand...

Respectfully, the arm lacerations could have been from a fight the night before. I agree that the whole situation looks strange, but it makes KR neither guilty nor innocent. Deep inside, I still err towards her guilt, although it was probably unintentional, but in the context of unprofessional behavior of Canton PD, nothing is possible to prove. Someone should also trace TB’s money, or maybe it was all cryptocurrency. And - I agree with @keek. It was an unlucky day for O’Keefe when he and KR met or matched. I don’t think KR is a happy defendant. I think deep inside, there is one thing she knows, and it is that she lost O’Keefe before he died. I am very sorry for his parents, and his nephew and niece who were orphaned once again. My feeling is that it will be a mistrial.

O’Keefe himself, the man who once made such a selfless decision to raise his niece and nephew, and his parents who raised him to be this way, command respect. KR, her lawyer, TB, Canton PD, the court, the pack of journalists and TB’s fan group who has surprisingly much free time on their hands - neither of them looks like a hero here. For Massachusetts, my favorite state, it is a surprisingly ugly story.
 
RIP John O’Keefe. You made your family, especially your sister and brother in-law, very proud.

This case is perplexing. I think both sides have compelling arguments and evidence. IMO if KR is responsible I don’t think she did so intentionally or out of malice. I think it could be possible the alcohol unfortunately really impaired her driving and awareness that she injured someone (The voicemails seem to indicate she genuinely believed that JO made it inside the house and was going to cheat on her instead of suffering from the reality of being mortally injured, alone and facing hypothermia as he laid helplessly outside). Also if she is guilty don’t think she fled the scene as much she wasn’t aware enough that a horrific one was unfolding due to her impaired driving. As a result, I, like other mentioned, agree that this case seems to fit moreso under the umbrella of manslaughter or homicide charges, than second degree murder but JMO. I could be wrong due to my lack of legal expertise.

On the other hand, I agree with JR and her defense team that JO’s hand wounds seem more consistent with those that result from a fist fight and that something appears to have attacked/scratched or bit JO’s arms repeatedly from the right side of his body. Based on how distinguishable they are too IMO those cuts had to result from something that happened that night otherwise KR and those at the bar would have noticed them earlier. Additionally, they could have been very painful which might have been something JO could have expressed and KR could have noticed if the cuts were from an earlier time period.

As others stated, based on the skull fractures and lacerations a lot of JO’s trauma was focused around his head and upper limbs. In what position does the prosecution think JO’s body was in when he allegedly hit by the car? Is it believed that he was crouched down at the time of the accident thus enabling his skull and upper limbs to be in line with the taillight or trajectory of injury? If instead the prosecution thinks he was standing up wouldn’t we see more injury to his abdomen, torso, chest and legs like a few commentators explained earlier?

Were investigators able to swab any saliva, blood, hair or skin samples of JO’s from the back of KR’s vehicle? Did they find any fingerprints on the back bumper, door or glass indicating that JO was trying to push away from or stop the vehicle from crushing/hitting him?

It was mentioned that a tip one of the defense lawyers received mentioned JO’s assault resulting in a broken nose and mouth. KR mentions in an interview that blood was coming from JO’s nose and mouth but was that information public or well-known at the time the tip was received? If not, that may lend it more credibility.

What did cause the laceration and hemorrhaging at the back of JO’s head? Where did JO’s missing sneaker end up?
 
Injuries:

A small, very deep back-of-the-head injury that didn't bleed where he lay. (Head injuries normally bleed. A lot)
Skull fracture associated with this head injury.
Bilateral bruising on both fists.
Lacerations up and down his right arm (they look clean in the autopsy photos but the blood was washed off by the time pics were taken)
Facial scratches and bruising.
No fractured ribs, or any other fractures for that matter. No torso damage.

Regardless of all the other strangeness about the prosecution's case, I don't see how they sell these injuries, especially in conjunction with each other happening simultaneously, as being the result of a slow moving vehicle vs. pedestrian incident. (Or a fast moving vehicle for that matter, but I've been to the scene and there's no way a drunk woman in the snow could have gotten up much speed in such a short distance.) Apparently the FBI has an expert who concluded the same and I'm sure the defense will have accident reconstructionist and biomechanical experts of their own. Karen Read doesn't have to prove what actually happened. Only that her car didn't cause those injuries and something else must have happened to him.
 
https://twitter.com/x/status/1780245456880054318

A couple of interesting names on the defense witness list:
  1. Elizabeth Proctor - The wife of the lead investigator. I'm guessing she's on there because she had a "secret" meeting with Jen McCabe, one of the state's primary witnesses.
  2. Norfolk County DA, Michael Morrissey - Probably on there because of his extrajudicial statement, which the judge has already said was improper.

I don't know if they will really be called, it may just be gamesmanship by KR's attorneys. But for the spouse of the investigating officer and the county DA to be on a witness list just confirms how bizarre this trial is going to be.
 
I absolutely cannot believe I have never heard of this case. My second favorite website (lol), Law & Crime, put out this article and totally intrigued me. I'm going to read this whole thread because I don't know what to think right now!

lawandcrime.com

Karen Read trial: Peeling back the layers of a complicated case as jury selection begins

Karen Read either hit her cop boyfriend with her SUV and callously left him to die in a blizzard or is the victim of a massive conspiracy who is being framed for murder.
lawandcrime.com lawandcrime.com
 
I can't even read this article because I live in the UK and I'm too lazy to get a VPN so that I can read it all. 11 jurors in place out of (I don't know how many alternates there are going to be).

This trial is going to be about as fascinating as it gets!

 
bobbymkii said:
I can't even read this article because I live in the UK and I'm too lazy to get a VPN so that I can read it all. 11 jurors in place out of (I don't know how many alternates there are going to be).

This trial is going to be about as fascinating as it gets!

Click to expand...
From the article:

DEDHAM, Mass. — Eleven of 12 deliberating jurors are in place as the murder trial of Karen Read wrapped up its second day of the jury selection process at Norfolk Superior Court in Dedham on Wednesday. Four additional alternate jurors need to be selected.
-------
Almost there!
 
I know there's already a lot of information about this case available in the public domain, which means that a lot of people have already made up their minds about exactly what happened that evening, one way or the other.

I'm personally going to withhold judgement until all of this evidence is tested in a trial setting. I think the key will be extensive direct and cross examination of the postmortem evidence, whether JO'K was more likely to have died by being hit by a car or physically attacked by people and/or a dog.

I'm not expecting the eyewitness testimony to be particularly reliable, everyone had been drinking and some witnesses may be implicated by the defense in the "cover up."

JMO
 
First day of Jury Selection: Tuesday, April 16, 2024


Here we go. Jury selection begins today in the Commonwealth vs. Karen Read. Both sides are seated in the courtroom waiting for Judge. Defense-Karen Read-David Yannetti -Alan Jackson -Elizabeth Little Prosecution: -ADA Adam Lally-ADA Laura McLaughlin-The current plan is to choose 16 jurors. 12 will ultimately decide the case. -Most people have heard of the case so the goal is to find people who promise to be impartial. -Jury selection is expected to last until at least the end of the week. -Judge Cannone has not yet ruled on prosecution motion to block defense from using 3rd party culprit. (Pic: Media waiting for participants to enter earlier this morning)

1713543826783.png


NEW: Judge will allow defense to put forth 3rd party culprit argument during trial as long as it “developed”through witness statements and evidence. 3rd party is not allowed during initial statements.



Prospective jurors have filled every seat in the courtroom. Court Officer is explaining initial process now. Our count is roughly 90 are in the courtroom now


Judge Cannone gave a brief explanation of the case to the jury pool and explained a jury must be "free from outside interference"


Both sides just introduced themselves to the jury. Judge reading witness list to see if potential jurors recognize any of the names


Prosecution witness list (1/2)

https://twitter.com/x/status/1780239888693985753

2/2

https://twitter.com/x/status/1780240554057429125

One more...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1780241682937622544




The majority of prospective jurors raise their hands when asked if they have heard or talked about the Read case.


Roughly 20-25 ppl in the pool raise cards indicating they have already formed an opinion about the case


About 10-15 ppl in the pool claim to have already have “bias” one way or the other

Defense witness list: https://twitter.com/TedDanielnews/status/1780245456880054318


Jury pool filling out questionnaire now.


Potential jurors have submitted their questionnaires. Now individuals from the pool are being called to the bench for questioning by both sides.


They have been powering through the jury selection process without a break since about 10:30 this morning. Media seats are essentially church pews.


Jury selection done for the day. I’m told 4 seated today.


I seriously appreciate those who watch our coverage. X is a good way to share info but X doesn’t pay the bills!

Wrapping up the 1st day of jury selection and the ruling on 3rd party defense in the Karen Read case on #Boston25 at 6.

@TedDanielnews
 
Day Two of Jury Selection: Wednesday, April 17, 2024


Back in my church pew for 2 day of Jury selection in the Commonwealth vs. Karen Read.

-We are expected to hear some motions before jury selection resumes. There are a couple outstanding items from Friday's hearing according to clerk
-4 jurors selected yesterday. 16 are needed
-3rd party culprit can only be developed through testimony and evidence. Defense can't use in their opening statements per Judge.
-People are demonstrating on both sides of the buffer zone and I've heard lot of honking as people drive by
-I actually found a power outlet near my seat to charge my laptop and phone


We are underway. Yannetti asks to speak at podium. He says there are issues including a "serious" one he needs to raise, Judge calls for recess to discuss with both sides before going on the record


We're back. Judge asking to see both sides at side bar. She says she "doesn't have any motions in front of her"It appears defense wants to raise something and that's being discussed privately now


It appears the issues Yannetti alluded to will not be discussed in open court. There was a lengthy discussion at sidebar. When that ended Judge Cannone called for the jury candidates. they are walking in now


This is a rinse repeat of yesterday. Judge explaining case and the selection process to a new group of about 100 jury candidates.


3 people have had interactions with witnesses, more than half indicate they've heard or talked about the case. That is not an immediate disqualifier b/c the case is so high profile


Roughly 25 ppl raise their hand when asked if they've formed an opinion of the case.


12 people indicate they've already formed a bias in this case.


For those wondering about the stream. Here's what I've been told: "Point 8 in the media order states that only the first day of impanelment when the case is called and jury instructed is allowed to be recorded."


Karen Read has some of the jury questionnaires in front of her and is marking them up with an orange highlighter. Her defense did not hire outside jury consultants. Defense using its combined experience to select.


Still going, about 40 jury candidates still need to be questioned from this batch. They haven’t called a break yet.


Jury Questionnaire in the Karen Read case.
https://twitter.com/x/status/1780670679613952479


Day 2 of Jury selection for the Karen Read trial is over. We’re told 7 more selected today for a total of 11. They need 16 to start.


@TedDanielnews
 
Day Three of Jury Selection: Thursday, April 18, 2024


57 jury candidates are expected to be screened today. It’s a smaller group than the last 2 days. Prosecution and defense are seated. We are waiting for court to begin.

We are underway. Good mornings all around.

Judge says she has an issue she needs to see both sides about at sidebar.


“Issue” quickly discussed at sidebar. Both sides return to their seats. The jury pool is filing in.


Judge Cannone is explaining the case and charges to the new jury candidates. Court rules prohibit the pool camera from recording/showing this.


And this is the 3rd pool so far.


57 in Karen Read jury pool
41 have heard or spoken about case
20 have formed opinions
8 have formed bias


The DNA analysis from Bode Labs in VA has been entered by the prosecution. A piece of hair found on the back of Read's Lexus SUV was sent to the lab to see if it matched John O'Keefe's DNA. The defense has been trying to get the results excluded citing a delay in testing. We haven't seen the lab report yet.


Here’s the prosecution filing on the DNA testing and some of the police reports they just entered.

1713545304971.png1713545314409.png



The clerk just indicated there are now 12 jurors seated. That would mean they’ve added 1 more so far today.

That’s it for today. Got 2 more today but the total is now 12 because one seated yesterday was excused for hardship. Off tomorrow so we resume Monday. We’ll recap everything on #Boston25

@TedDanielnews
 
Yemelyan said:
I don't know yet what happened in this case - if she got mad and hit him, if she hit him by accident, or if she didn't hit him at all and this is all a cover up - but I can say that it seems that most people in the house were so drunk that it would not surprise me if some of the witnesses gave inaccurate information about that night.
Click to expand...
Agree with most of what you stated. I am on the fence with this one. It's been too complicated of a case to follow (imo) so look forward to trial. However, to my understanding, KR also intoxicated and most likely does not even recall anything that happened that fateful night. The science will tell the story. moo
 
@KristinaRex

NEW: Karen Read’s defense team moves to physically rearrange the courtroom, claiming its current arrangement violates her constitutional right to face-to-face confrontation. In its current set up, some jurors would not be able to see witnesses’ faces as they testify.

1713546975564.png1713546984272.png

1:00 PM · Apr 19, 2024


The rest of the motion is here —

1713547074648.png

1713547088341.png
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Staff online

Members online

... and 252 more.
Total: 4,043 (members: 253, guests: 3,790)

Online statistics

Members online
253
Guests online
3,790
Total visitors
4,043
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
592,666
Messages
17,972,751
Members
228,855
Latest member
Shaunie
Back
Top