NY NY - Joseph Helt, 17, hiking Sam's Point ice caves, Ellenville, 16 Jan 1987

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I live in NY, avid hiker, Mostly Catskills.
I have not really followed this case.

A friend took me to Cragsmoor.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cragsmoor,_New_York

I got the creeps, big time. Hated it.

From what I understand there are deep caverns there and paranormal activity.

:twocents::scared::twocents:

I hated it, bad vibes. I will watch the videos and follow up.
:twocents::moo::twocents:
 
I'm surprised they didn't check that lake sooner. I've been to exactly those same parties, I've gone joy riding on exactly those same types of roads, and I've walked across a lot of frozen lakes for short cuts. Where that car was supposed to be and the way the road goes....if I'm stuck, I'm cutting across the lake to walk back. There is no way I'm walking that out and back loop if I don't have to. From the looks of it though there is an inlet/outlet (chasm) right in the area he could have walked through which means the ice would not have been as thick there. If you've ever fallen in real cold water you know that it takes your breath away so your not making a lot of noise for long.

There seems to be a lot of speculation that he may not be up there so I guess that boils down to - how much unaccounted for time did anyone have? I mean, no one had time enough to drive him to Florida so we know he isn't there. The range of possibilities is much smaller.

I think it's great so many people have kept his story going. IMHO, I wouldn't go to crazy listening to psychics though.
 
From post #21 on Page 1 of this thread:

During the evening, Joe spent time at Mt. Cathalia talking with different people and at one point he got into a fight with three particular individuals: John LaForge, 21, Wade Marks, 18, and Kelly Diaz,16. The fight got so heated that people started to move away, for fear that it was about to get physical. After the fight Joe nervously asked someone for a ride home, but this person already had a car full of people and could not take Joe. About an hour later, Joe left the party with these three individuals in LaForge's car.
Click to expand...

My perspectives of this case has not changed over the years. I am certain that the three individuals and LE know what happened to Joe. I believe that he was murdered likely over a drug deal or maybe a girl, but I lean towards a drug deal. I can't remember, but wasn't one of the fathers of the boys a judge?

If so, I share the feeling that strings were pulled by LE to protect either one or all of these three kids whom Joe was with that night. You get a ride home with three people, were you have gotten into a terrible fight that was so confrontational, others had to back away? I don't believe the "Car stuck in the snow" story at all!

I believe the boys did something to Joe, swore each other to secrecy and political or legal connections are preventing this case from being solved and stopping those involved from being brought to justice. Look at how over the years, when those who have tried to help find Joe, their efforts have been chagrined, torn down. Somebody or several somebody's with high political or legal connections does not want the truth to be known in this case.

The thing is, can enough time and positive community involvement for Joe, overcome the economic and political barriers of the past? Those helping on an international level, through the Internet and awesome sites like this, hopefully will bring some closure to this sad case. Joe really seemed like one of the coolest guys ever! His family and he need to have this case solved!

Satch
 
Satch said:
From post #21 on Page 1 of this thread:



My perspectives of this case has not changed over the years. I am certain that the three individuals and LE know what happened to Joe. I believe that he was murdered likely over a drug deal or maybe a girl, but I lean towards a drug deal. I can't remember, but wasn't one of the fathers of the boys a judge?

If so, I share the feeling that strings were pulled by LE to protect either one or all of these three kids whom Joe was with that night. You get a ride home with three people, were you have gotten into a terrible fight that was so confrontational, others had to back away? I don't believe the "Car stuck in the snow" story at all!

I believe the boys did something to Joe, swore each other to secrecy and political or legal connections are preventing this case from being solved and stopping those involved from being brought to justice. Look at how over the years, when those who have tried to help find Joe, their efforts have been chagrined, torn down. Somebody or several somebody's with high political or legal connections does not want the truth to be known in this case.

The thing is, can enough time and positive community involvement for Joe, overcome the economic and political barriers of the past? Those helping on an international level, through the Internet and awesome sites like this, hopefully will bring some closure to this sad case. Joe really seemed like one of the coolest guys ever! His family and he need to have this case solved!

Satch
Click to expand...

Bumping up for Joe.

Satch
 
There has been a discovery of unidentified skeletal remains near Post Hill Road in Mountaindale, NY back in July 2015. Post Hill Road is about 16 miles away from Sams Point Preserve. Authorities haven't released (or don't know yet) whether it is a man or woman.
 
The most likely candiate for these remains would be:

NamUs MP # 7869
Marvin Gibbs

Sullivan County, New York
19 to 20 year old black/african american male
 
What I find amazing about this case is the horrible shoddy investigation that was done. Why would 3 friends allow a friend to walk down a dark mountain 3 AM with little to no light. Why would anyone walk down a mountain in the pitch black of darkness??? They houses were 2 miles away. Why not just wait 2 more hours until sunrise to attempt to make it off the mountain???? none of this *advertiser censored* and bull story makes any sense whatsoever.

The car getting stuck in the ditch was definitely a cover. I believe Joe Helt was killed before they even made it to the point where they drove the car in a ditch. His body has not been recovered because his body is not on that mountain. Either Diaz or Laforge came up with idea to drive the car into a ditch to fool law enforcement. Helt is buried somewhere or he is in that nearby lake.
 
Missing From: ELLENVILLE, New York
Date Missing: 01/16/1987

JOSEPH D HELT
DOB: 07/18/1969
Sex: Male
HGT: 5'09"
WGT: 150 lbs.
Hair: Blonde
Eyes: Brown
Race: White

Other Information: Joseph was last seen hiking near Sam's Point ice caves. He was last seen wearing a camouflage jacket, t-shirt, long sleeve thermal shirt, gray hooded sweatshirt and white high-top tennis shoes. The additional photo is age-progressed to age 46.

getImage


http://www.criminaljustice.ny.gov/missing/#/missing-child/60
 
On January 17, 1987, Lee Ann Helt reported her son, 17-year-old Joseph David Helt, as a missing person. Helt advised that her son did not return home after going out with friends the night of January 16. Joseph Helt was last seen with three friends after their vehicle became disabled in the snow on Sam’s Point Preserve. Helt walked off in the snow and has not been seen since. Joseph was last seen wearing a camouflage jacket, t-shirt, long sleeve thermal shirt, grey hooded sweatshirt and white high-top tennis shoes.

https://www.nyspnews.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=55649
 
Nothing new.
NCMEC

Reviving for 2 reasons - awareness for Joe's case and archiving news articles/links so they do not ever get lost unless the site and archive.li goes down.


What Happened to Joe Helt? - Shawagunk Journal - By Tod Westlake
archived link: What Happened to Joe Helt? Missing Teen Still Haunts Village After 24…
^ the only article that was already archived (7 years ago)

State Cops Still On Helt Case - Shawagunk Journal - By Tod Westlake
archived link: State Cops Still On Helt Case

"25 Years Is Too Long" - Shawagunk Journal - by Jane Anderson
archived link: "25 Years Is Too Long" Monday's Candlelight Vigil to Remember Joe Helt

Joe Helt Goes Missing "Quietly Into the Bad Night" - Donna Gore
archived link: http://archive.li/sJmty

Tensions Persist Over a Man Long Missing -By Tim Stelloh Oct 23, 2011
archived link: A Village’s Tensions Over a Man Missing for 24 Years - The New York T…

A Break in A Quarter-Century Old Upstate N.Y. Cold Case? Aug 2, 2012
archived link: http://archive.li/M7Cml

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.
.
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Sadly, here and in other threads on WS, links to many of the articles are broken. It's unfortunate to lose data available to the public when the user base at WS actively, daily, wants to help.

***If you are able, please archive anything you link in a thread (news articles, blog posts). It takes seconds, and preserves the information for future sleuths. Copy the active URL, paste at archive.li OR archive.org it will generate a new link which can be added under the original link when making a post, or added to the thread.***

Archived news links above will not play videos embedded in articles. Copyright protection on MSM videos could be problematic if published elsewhere on the net, my best advice to "archive" videos is to save them to your own device/backup using a website like y2mate.com

Please feel free to message me if you have any questions on archiving links, videos, etc.
**Facebook pages cannot be archived - take a full page screen shot**
 
Joseph “Joe” David Helt
joseph_david_helt_1.jpg
joseph_david_helt_2.jpg
joseph_david_helt_3.jpg
joseph_david_helt_4.jpg
joseph_david_helt_7.jpg

Joseph, circa 1987; Age-progression to age 43 (circa 2012)

Missing Since: 01/16/1987
Missing From: Ellenville, New York
Classification: Lost/Injured Missing
Race/Sex: White/Male
Date of Birth: 07/18/1969
Age: 17 years old
Height: 5'9”
Weight: 150 pounds
Hair: Blond
Eyes: Brown
Clothing/Jewelry Description: A camouflage-print jacket, a t-shirt, a long-sleeved thermal shirt, a gray hooded sweatshirt and white high-top sneakers.

Details of Disappearance
Joseph was last seen near Sam's Point ice caves in Ellenville, New York on January 16, 1987. He and three friends, John LaForge, Wade Marks and Kelly Diaz, were staying at the Mount Cathalia Lodge when they decided to go for a late-night drive in LaForge's Subaru.

Joseph was driving when their car got stuck in the snow at approximately 3:30 a.m. The four young men were unable to push the car out and Joseph left the car and went to get help at the village five miles downhill. Diaz and Marks also abandoned the car a short time later, then LaForge left as well, separately from the others.

The three other boys made it to safety, but Joseph has never been seen from again. The others assumed he had gone home and didn't realize he was missing until the next day, when LaForge went back to retrieve his car. An extensive search turned up no sign of Joseph. The inclement weather seriously hampered the search efforts; there was a great deal of snow and high winds, and most of the roads on the mountain were impassible.

At the time of his disappearance, Joseph worked alongside his mother at the Auction Barn in Napanoch, New York. He was interested in rock music, particularly the band KISS. Both of his parents have died in the years since his disappearance, but his aunt and his friends hope he may yet be located.
Click to expand...
 
bump
 
30 years after disappearance in Ellenville area, police still hope to solve Joseph Helt case

30 years after disappearance in Ellenville area, police still hope to solve Joseph Helt case

CRAGSMOOR, N.Y. >> It’s been 30 years since teenager Joseph David Helt disappeared, but state police haven’t given up hope of cracking the case.

The investigation is being led by state police Investigator Vincenzo Iemma. Iemma did not respond to a reporter’s request for additional information.
 
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