Identified! WI - Clinton, 'River Guy' WhtMale 1207UMWI, 17-20, 'Venom' TShirt, Nov'95 - Carl Junior Isaacs

Re: http://www.rockcountycoroner.us/reports/RuledOut_Chart.php

Hi:

Here is a link (above) to Rock County Coroner's Office official "ruled out" list. This online list is generated from an online database and so is up-to-date each time the page is accessed. (Look closely and see that Brian Lee Barrett is already on the list and I just eliminated him a few minutes ago!) The listing includes 1) MPs that have been Excluded, meaning ruled out scientifically (DNA or Dental X-rays) made by NamUs scientists and dentists and are also listed on the NamUs "Exclusions" section, plus 2) other MPs that have been Eliminated, meaning ruled out based on non-scientific reasons (like too old, too tall, dental chart mismatch, etc.) made by the RCCO. The list also includes 3) MPs that have come to RCCO's attention and are being evaluated.

This list has been posted to the Public Circumstances section of the Circumstances page of JCD's NamUs case file. The teensy, tiny problem now is that section is not viewable to the public even though it has been tagged for public viewing by RCCO due to some kind of programming problem at NamUs. I'm told the IT guys are working on it, so until it gets fixed, the only way to get to the listing is through the above link.

I hope this is helpful for your searches. If you've read this entire forum or have been following along for a while, you will know that I've been working on getting a listing like this published on the Internet since last July (2013). So, just to let everyone know I HAVE been working on this and now have finally succeeded in getting to you all.

Please pass on any suggestions for improving it--I will take them ALL under VERY thoughtful consideration! Thanks.

Jack
 
Re: http://www.rockcountycoroner.us/reports/RuledOut_Chart.php

Hi:

NamUs has now fixed the problem with the visibility of the publically viewable circumstances. So, to access Rock County Coroner's Office (RCCO) official ruled-out list, in addition to the link above, you can now go to JCD's Namus case file (https://identifyus.org/en/cases/4757) and click on "Circumstances" then scroll down to "Public Circumstances" and look for the link "RCCO Excluded and Eliminated List".

Jack
 
I'm embarrassed to admit how long I've been searching for this UID's thread tonight (somehow I thought he was found in 1989 and was estimated to be older) only to find that the age is really off, but he looks like Richard Lynn Bare (IMO). I think it's interesting that he told someone that he was a fugitive (Mr. Bare is wanted by the FBI for unlawful flight to avoid prosecution for murder).
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8187

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/murders/richard-lynn-bare/view
 
I'm embarrassed to admit how long I've been searching for this UID's thread tonight (somehow I thought he was found in 1989 and was estimated to be older) only to find that the age is really off, but he looks like Richard Lynn Bare (IMO). I think it's interesting that he told someone that he was a fugitive (Mr. Bare is wanted by the FBI for unlawful flight to avoid prosecution for murder).
image_thumb
8187

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/murders/richard-lynn-bare/view

He looks like a good candidate despite the age difference. He'd have been around 30. He's considered North Carolina's most wanted fugitive.

I found a bit more about him on the Unsolved Mysteries site (http://unsolvedmysteries.wikia.com/wiki/Richard_Bare). Apparently he was last seen in 1993 in Delaware:

In 1993, Bare was almost arrested in Delaware, but just hours before FBI agents were able to get to a relative of Bare's house where he had been hiding, he escaped and has not been seen since.

Comments on some other articles indicated that some locals believe he's been seen around the area, that he has dyed his hair blonde, and that he sometimes dresses as a woman, but apparently none of that has been verified. There seems to be a kind of legend that he's living in the mountains, going from small town to small town where they don't love LE.
 
http://www.startribune.com/nation/261471361.html

The Rock County Coroner's Office is hoping a piece of a bone will reveal where an unidentified young man was from, which might lead to finding his identity.

The bones of John "Clinton" Doe were found in 1995 near Turtle Creek in a wooded area in Bradford Township. It was determined that he was between the ages of 17 and 20, but who he was remains a mystery.

Now a small piece of a leg bone is at the Smithsonian Museum Conservation Institute in Washington, D.C. Extensive research is being conducted on the bone that hopefully will lead to identifying where Doe spent most of this life, said Acting Rock County Coroner Lou Smit.

"What we eat and drink, particularly when growing up, weighs into our bones," he told the Beloit Daily News. "This process (by the Smithsonian) is able to evaluate what's in your bones and gives us a picture and should be able to tell us where he was from."

The test is expensive — close to $1 million —but the museum is doing it for free, Smit said. It was actually a "cold call" to the museum by Rock County Deputy Coroner Jack Friess that opened up the opportunity to send the bone to the nation's capital.
 
The age and height are off considerably but the circumstances of this MP's disappearance match the UID's scenario:

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/25566
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/k/kelley_danny.html

He was upset about a divorce ("How could she do this to me?"), delusional and possibly under the influence of alcohol/drugs and ran from his family in May 1995 -- maybe he left the area for Wisconsin? There's no mention of whether he ever lived in the area the UID was found in, though.
 
Didn't the isotope test indicate the deceased had spent considerable time in the Upper Midwest?
 
Yes, and that's yet another reason this is an unlikely match. He lived in Washington before traveling to Oregon, but it would be interesting to learn whether he had lived in the Upper Midwest prior to his marriage. His DNA tests are pending, at any rate.
 
Good discussion. The SIA testing and results (that JCD probably grew up in Wisconsin, Minnesota, or Michigan) is really most helpful in conducting searches, not eliminating potential matches. As Tatertot mentions, people can move around, travel, etc. According to NamUs today, Kelley's DNA is now registered at UNT, thus eliminating him as being JCD because both profiles reside in the same database, are periodically "run" by the computer searching for associations, and if there was a DNA association between Kelley and JCD, UNT would have been confirmed it. Therefore, Kelley and JCD cannot be the same individual. Anyway, at age 35 in 1994, Kelley is way too old than JCD's 17-20.

http://www.rockcountycoroner.us/reports/MPs/DannyLeeKelley.html

Jack
 
Some thoughts about JCD

He makes me very sad! I can't pinpoint exactly what it is, but I guess he reminds me of a few people I've known. My gut tells me he was an emotional guy, and maybe a little bit immature. Needy in that sense. Impulsive, maybe? Angry, but also hurting deep down. The Bart Simpson boxers in contrast with his taste in music. There might have been some alcohol involved, but I also don't necessarily think there was. I think he did something bad, but greatly overestimated the consequences. Sort of like a child who steals a pack of crayons and thinks they're going to go to jail. I think that what he was running from (literally) was a single event. I think he got into a fight with his girlfriend and hit her. That was probably the last straw in what had been a turbulent, emotional roller coaster of a relationship, and she declared that was it. She was done, and she was calling the police. JCD stormed out, slamming the door. Maybe she called for him to come back? I think he was probably hoping she would chase him down, but when that didn't happen, he only got sucked deeper into the emotional meltdown he was having. And before he knew it, he'd wound up in the situation described in the article. He was too stubborn to ask for help when he needed it most. The quotes are quite dramatic, and almost read like lines from a movie; I'm imagining this quality might have been what both endeared this woman to JCD, but also exhausted her at the same time.

This theory would explain a number of things, including why there wasn't actually a missing fugitive.

This is obviously a very arbitrary prediction, and I've taken enormous liberties. It is entirely my own opinion, and I don't claim that any of this actually happened. That being said, from the very few puzzle pieces provided to us, he feels so familiar to me. I can so clearly picture something like this having happened to him, and it is heartbreaking. He might have been a handful, but there is someone, somewhere, who loved and misses him dearly.
 
j123:

There are a lot of people, including the RC Sheriff's Office detective working this case with me, who believe the young man witnessed running in Turtle Creek on October 16, 1994 ("River Guy") is the same person found dead wearing Bart Simpson shorts, etc. a year later (John "Clinton" Doe or JCD). But if you read carefully and think about it, there is really nothing in the record, other than hunches and suppositions from "eye witnesses", no read hard evidence, that is, that the two are the same person. One of my biggest goals with this case is to "prove" or "disprove" that River Guy and JCD are one and the same person. Without that proof of a connection, River Guy could be just another drunk young man running in the Creek and have nothing to do with the death of our young man, JCD. Sad for River Guy for sure, but not getting us any closer to finding JCD.

"Proof", I say. How? Yes, how, that is the question. One way, I'm thinking, is to pinpoint more accurately the time of death. The scientists (forensic pathologist and anthropologist) indicated in 1995 that JCD had been dead "...at least one year, giving 9-10 months (not including the winter months) for full decomposition to have taken place." That certainly fits with River Guy's run in the Creek in October a year earlier. But what if they were off? By, say, two or three months? River Guy couldn't be JCD then. So, how about if we do a more precise, more scientific, calculation of JCD's time of death. Which is just what we are doing.

Read about it here: http://rockcountycoroner.us/reports/PR_10-20-14.pdf

Later....

Jack
 
Wow; I actually had that thought as I read through the thread. By the time I got to the end, I figured I must have missed a detail confirming the connection. While it does make sense for them to be one and the same, it's great to read about the efforts being put forward to find out if that's really true.
 
Has anyone tried looking through yearbooks of high schools in the area?

Pretty tough to search without a photo of what the guy looks like.

A skeletal reconstruction is not an adequate reference for going through yearbooks.
 

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