Zimmerman's Medications

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I asked for examples of somebody sentenced with DUI for using prescription meds.

My links went to the state laws stating that DUI with alcohol is the same as DUI with chemicals (meds). The same punishments that are listed in those statutes go for both. In the state of Florida you can't operate a car under the influence of anything. Your original question was why it mattered if GZ was taking meds and I answered with a hypothetical situation. I think I backed up the hypothetical enough with the link to the statute.

As for GZ, and this case, it truly does matter if he was impaired on the night he took someone's life. IMO and MOO
 
Adderall

Dextroamphetamine and Amphetamine



What side effects can this medication cause?

Dextroamphetamine and amphetamine may cause side effects. Tell your doctor if any of these symptoms are severe or do not go away:

nervousness

restlessness

difficulty falling asleep or staying asleep

uncontrollable shaking of a part of the body

headache

changes in sex drive or ability

dry mouth

stomach pain

nausea

vomiting

diarrhea

constipation

loss of appetite

weight loss

Some side effects can be serious. If you experience any of the following symptoms, call your doctor immediately:

fast or pounding heartbeat

shortness of breath

chest pain

excessive tiredness

slow or difficult speech

dizziness or faintness

weakness or numbness of an arm or leg

seizures

motor tics or verbal tics

believing things that are not true

feeling unusually suspicious of others

hallucinating (seeing things or hearing voices that do not exist)

mania (frenzied or abnormally excited mood)

aggressive or hostile behavior

changes in vision or blurred vision

fever

blistering or peeling skin

rash

hives

itching

swelling of the eyes, face, tongue, or throat

difficulty breathing or swallowing

hoarseness


BBM: All these could apply to that night. The nervous tic I saw at his bond hearing... that weird eye-roll blinky thing he was doing. If he had that side effect, he very easily could have had the others. IMO
 
He had, in the Bond Hearing what I would call a herky jerky head. His reaction to people next to him at the table talking to him. His head was like one of the new light bulbs that take a moment before they turn on. I don't know how to describe it, but I noticed and thought it was unusual. 'Herky, jerky'.
 
BBM: All these could apply to that night. The nervous tic I saw at his bond hearing... that weird eye-roll blinky thing he was doing. If he had that side effect, he very easily could have had the others. IMO

Some I think we saw too.


nervousness

weight loss

chest pain (complained about in cop car)

slow or difficult speech


believing things that are not true


feeling unusually suspicious of others

aggressive or hostile behavior
 
I asked for examples of somebody sentenced with DUI for using prescription meds.

A woman here in Salem was just sentenced to 20 years for running over 3 teenagers and killing 2 of them. I can't link to the article but look up Sophia Downing, Salem, OR.
 
Do you have any examples of a person who was taking legally prescribed medications (and not over dosing on them) being arrested for DUI manslaughter?
The thing about meds and driving and again I can only speak to California-but there is no "legal limit" for any drugs like there is for alcohol. This is an emerging problem in my state.
Consequently, impairment is subjective. What that means is one can get a DUI for taking OTC cough syrup getting behind the wheel impaired and running someone over. IF the DA can prove you were impaired.By that same token whenever one is arrested for a drug DUI, there is always a defense because who is to say "how much" impairs one person and not another? It has to be proven and our da is taking more and more prescription pill DUI's to court. But I do know that it does not have to be prescription or elicit- it can be an OTC sleep aid.
But by virtue of the fact that pills are prescribed does not mean as much as one may think it does in terms of use- abuse- and DUI.
 
I asked for examples of somebody sentenced with DUI for using prescription meds.

I can tell you that in my state you WILL be charged with DUI for prescription or even over the counter meds. If you are convicted, you will go to jail. Period. Even if it's for a brief period of time. That assumes, of course, that the prescription or med is of the type that impairs your ability to drive. Opioids probably would be, Adderall would not. The warnings would have been provided by the doc and the pharmacist. It would also depend on how much was in your system.
 
I can tell you that in my state you WILL be charged with DUI for prescription or even over the counter meds. If you are convicted, you will go to jail. Period. Even if it's for a brief period of time. That assumes, of course, that the prescription or med is of the type that impairs your ability to drive. Opioids probably would be, Adderall would not. The warnings would have been provided by the doc and the pharmacist. It would also depend on how much was in your system.

RBBM

"[Y]ou should know that [Adderall] may make it difficult for you to perform activities that require alertness or physical coordination. Do not drive a car or operate machinery until you know how this medication affects you."

more at link
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000166/
 
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7924232&postcount=27"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - George Zimmerman's injuries, per leaked reports[/ame]

IIRC GZ refused any further treatment/test but he did get himself some pain medication. Also IIRC he Asked for it, the Dr didn't offer it to him. Things that make me go hmmm.

As for driving under the influence most certainly do charge you for it, many of them under the DWI code. You are not suppose to drive while taking many medications. Cough syrup (nyquil) will show up when you blow or in your blood test as alcohol.

My friend was stopped and she blew under the legal limit. She had her pills with her and they asked for her to take a blood test. Long story short it was explained to us in court that it is illegal to drive under the influence of narcotics/pot etc and if her blood test had come back with high levels of any of that she would have been charged.
 
RBBM

"[Y]ou should know that [Adderall] may make it difficult for you to perform activities that require alertness or physical coordination. Do not drive a car or operate machinery until you know how this medication affects you."

more at link
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000166/

You do understand that Naval Aviators and Pilots flying long range Bombing missions, such as the good folks out of Whitman AFB in Missouri are given amphetamines while on mission right? They are 40 to 500 million dollar aerial platforms that they are piloting, from the F-22 Raptor to the B-2B.....my point is, these patriots are required to operate at the highest levels, executing the best judgement. The US Military would not give them mixed amphetamine salts and allow them to fly if they felt that this would jeopardize the mission, their safety, or the air frame. Just saying......I think there are many who are not biochemists or doctors just pulling things up on the internet and either not understanding the context or the information, or verifying that what is printed is indeed true, or applicable to more than .001% of the prescribed population.

While those are possible side serious side effects, these would usually onset at the first dose if a person's biochemistry will not tolerate them, which is why when they are prescribed, usually a prescription for an anti-anxiety like Xanax (or termazapam) are also prescribed, and the person is told to always carry one with them in the event they have a negative reaction. If GZ was predisposed to such reactions, he likely would not take Adderall. The next point being, while he had a prescription for Adderall, there is no indication that he was indeed actively taking it. He did not mention it to the EMTs per the released documents, so, some are assuming, that because he had the script, he must have been taking it and lying......perhaps he was prescribed the medication, and either forgot to take it, had a reaction he did not care for and ceased taking it as prescribed, etc...... Has anyone seen evidence to indicate that he had actually taken Adderall?
 
RBBM

"[Y]ou should know that [Adderall] may make it difficult for you to perform activities that require alertness or physical coordination. Do not drive a car or operate machinery until you know how this medication affects you."

more at link
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000166/

that's quite a bit different than the warnings given for drugs that WILL DEFINITELY hinder your ability to operate a vehicle or heavy machinery, for example. Those drugs say right on the label that do NOT do xyz. Those drugs produce the same results (drowsiness and lack of coordination) in almost every (if not every) individual that takes them. Adderall does not. You will be dui if you drink a half bottle of Nyquil or take an Ambien and get behind the wheel. If you take adderall "recreationally" or with alcohol you will probably be dui as well. But, imo, not if you are taking it as prescribed for a documented medical condition.
 
RBBM
You do understand my post was not my opinion and was a direct quote from the National Institute of Health, right? Perhaps any real or perceived discrepancies should be taken up with them.
ETA: And I'm quite certain that I never claimed to be a biochemist (I'm getting flashbacks to Baez here), nor a doctor, and believe it or not, I actually do understand that some resources are more reliable than others, hence my use of a government thread from the National Institute of Health. Since you didn't provide a link at all, I'll take your information fwiw.


You do understand that Naval Aviators and Pilots flying long range Bombing missions, such as the good folks out of Whitman AFB in Missouri are given amphetamines while on mission right? They are 40 to 500 million dollar aerial platforms that they are piloting, from the F-22 Raptor to the B-2B.....my point is, these patriots are required to operate at the highest levels, executing the best judgement. The US Military would not give them mixed amphetamine salts and allow them to fly if they felt that this would jeopardize the mission, their safety, or the air frame. Just saying......I think there are many who are not biochemists or doctors just pulling things up on the internet and either not understanding the context or the information, or verifying that what is printed is indeed true, or applicable to more than .001% of the prescribed population.

While those are possible side serious side effects, these would usually onset at the first dose if a person's biochemistry will not tolerate them, which is why when they are prescribed, usually a prescription for an anti-anxiety like Xanax (or termazapam) are also prescribed, and the person is told to always carry one with them in the event they have a negative reaction. If GZ was predisposed to such reactions, he likely would not take Adderall. The next point being, while he had a prescription for Adderall, there is no indication that he was indeed actively taking it. He did not mention it to the EMTs per the released documents, so, some are assuming, that because he had the script, he must have been taking it and lying......perhaps he was prescribed the medication, and either forgot to take it, had a reaction he did not care for and ceased taking it as prescribed, etc...... Has anyone seen evidence to indicate that he had actually taken Adderall?
 
I can tell you that in my state you WILL be charged with DUI for prescription or even over the counter meds. If you are convicted, you will go to jail. Period. Even if it's for a brief period of time. That assumes, of course, that the prescription or med is of the type that impairs your ability to drive. Opioids probably would be, Adderall would not. The warnings would have been provided by the doc and the pharmacist. It would also depend on how much was in your system.

RBBM

"[Y]ou should know that [Adderall] may make it difficult for you to perform activities that require alertness or physical coordination. Do not drive a car or operate machinery until you know how this medication affects you."

more at link
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000166/

that's quite a bit different than the warnings given for drugs that WILL DEFINITELY hinder your ability to operate a vehicle or heavy machinery, for example. Those drugs say right on the label that do NOT do xyz. Those drugs produce the same results (drowsiness and lack of coordination) in almost every (if not every) individual that takes them. Adderall does not. You will be dui if you drink a half bottle of Nyquil or take an Ambien and get behind the wheel. If you take adderall "recreationally" or with alcohol you will probably be dui as well. But, imo, not if you are taking it as prescribed for a documented medical condition.

RB&EBM
I provided further information in response to your original statement.
I'm not even sure what the argument here is...you stated with apparent confidence that Adderall would not impair someone's driving. I provided a link that states that it may. My link didn't specify that you may be impaired only if used recreationally and wouldn't be if used as prescribed.

FWIW, one of the medications I take is listed under the National Institute of Health as having the same warning I quoted for Adderall. Yet my pharmacist told me to never drive while taking it. So it seems there are some discrepancies in the health field on these things.

I'm waiting to see if there's any sort of tox info available for GZ the night of the shooting. Until then, I suppose this conversation is kinda moot?
 
Why am I not surprised that our government gives pilots speed? But I digress. For all we know GZ could have been in that .001% of the population, and he might have been using them for more than what they were rx'd for. The sad thing is we will never know because no one tested him that night and I think that's one of the reasons he would not seek additional medical help. (that night). His family Dr prolly wasn't gonna test him and he knew it.

I think the links Flourish posted pretty much speak for themselves and unlees you are a biochemist or a DR....I don't understand why drug info would be challenged? It is what it is.
 
RBBM
You do understand my post was not my opinion and was a direct quote from the National Institute of Health, right? Perhaps any real or perceived discrepancies should be taken up with them.
ETA: And I'm quite certain that I never claimed to be a biochemist (I'm getting flashbacks to Baez here), nor a doctor, and believe it or not, I actually do understand that some resources are more reliable than others, hence my use of a government thread from the National Institute of Health. Since you didn't provide a link at all, I'll take your information fwiw.

Here you are, one of the many articles on "go pills" (Dexedrine is another name for Mixed Amphetamine Salts, Adderall is just the trade name).......http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=123779&page=1

And here: http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0809/p01s04-usmi.html

FYI- "No-Go Pills" are the Ativan/Xanex/terazapam class drugs used to assist the aviators in ensuring they have proper rest when not on mission.

Again, other than having a prescription for Adderall, can you link to something that confirms that GZ was on it at the time, or are you just speculating? And no, if you are pulled over while taking legally prescribed Adderall, you will not get a DUI. I would ask anyone who will argue otherwise, to produce some evidence that this has ever happened, anywhere in the US.
 
You do understand that Naval Aviators and Pilots flying long range Bombing missions, such as the good folks out of Whitman AFB in Missouri are given amphetamines while on mission right? They are 40 to 500 million dollar aerial platforms that they are piloting, from the F-22 Raptor to the B-2B.....my point is, these patriots are required to operate at the highest levels, executing the best judgement. The US Military would not give them mixed amphetamine salts and allow them to fly if they felt that this would jeopardize the mission, their safety, or the air frame. Just saying......I think there are many who are not biochemists or doctors just pulling things up on the internet and either not understanding the context or the information, or verifying that what is printed is indeed true, or applicable to more than .001% of the prescribed population.

While those are possible side serious side effects, these would usually onset at the first dose if a person's biochemistry will not tolerate them, which is why when they are prescribed, usually a prescription for an anti-anxiety like Xanax (or termazapam) are also prescribed, and the person is told to always carry one with them in the event they have a negative reaction. If GZ was predisposed to such reactions, he likely would not take Adderall. The next point being, while he had a prescription for Adderall, there is no indication that he was indeed actively taking it. He did not mention it to the EMTs per the released documents, so, some are assuming, that because he had the script, he must have been taking it and lying......perhaps he was prescribed the medication, and either forgot to take it, had a reaction he did not care for and ceased taking it as prescribed, etc...... Has anyone seen evidence to indicate that he had actually taken Adderall?


Well that really brings home the Public Service Message "Speed Kills"

I really don't think you can compare a highly trained Air Force Crew to George Zimmerman.

The only thing I have seen to suggest he had taken Adderall is the Dr. saying he was prescribed it and the 911 call he made and things in it matching up with the listed side effects.
 
RB&EBM
I provided further information in response to your original statement.
I'm not even sure what the argument here is...you stated with apparent confidence that Adderall would not impair someone's driving. I provided a link that states that it may. My link didn't specify that you may be impaired only if used recreationally and wouldn't be if used as prescribed.

FWIW, one of the medications I take is listed under the National Institute of Health as having the same warning I quoted for Adderall. Yet my pharmacist told me to never drive while taking it. So it seems there are some discrepancies in the health field on these things.

I'm waiting to see if there's any sort of tox info available for GZ the night of the shooting. Until then, I suppose this conversation is kinda moot?

My confidence was directed to Adderall when used under a prescription at the proper dosage. I was, and remain, confident that even if you had an unusual reaction to Adderall while driving, under those circumstances you would not be cited (although I can see an overzealous officer maybe doing so anyway), and certainly not convicted of DUI. It's only drugs that are EXPECTED to cause side-effects inhibiting your ability to drive and/or those which are being used illegally, that will get you a dui conviction, imo.

In any case, I don't see George's adderall prescription or usage (if there was any on the night of the shooting) having any bearing on the case -- even assuming there is pertinent tox testing. If his observable behavior was out of the ordinary in any way, it would have been documented. If not by LE (which I believe it would have been) than by the EMT's who checked him over. jmo
 
Well that really brings home the Public Service Message "Speed Kills"

The only thing I have seen to suggest he had taken Adderall is the Dr. saying he was prescribed it and the 911 call he made and things in it matching up with the listed side effects.

Please correct me IF I'm wrong but wasn't it you who first detected and mentioned GZ's slurring when he was talking to dispatch? JMHO
 
This whole thread, like TM's drug use is a moot point UNLESS there is absolute proof that GZ's medication made him go over the edge.

So far, nothing to indicate GZ's meds made him go over the edge.
 
Please correct me IF I'm wrong but wasn't it you who first detected and mentioned GZ's slurring when he was talking to dispatch? JMHO
I did mention it right after listening to the 911 tape the first time.
 
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