Australia - Russell Hill & Carol Clay Murdered While Camping - Wonnangatta Valley, 2020 #7

[drsleuth]

I think the jury are going to have a hard time getting over how cold & calculated Lynn was in obliterating the remains of Carol & Russell.

How he has shown no remorse.

It's all been about him & how this has destroyed his life.

I don't think it will be a stretch for them to see how he provoked / taunted Russell.

I think they will come back with unanimous guilty verdicts.

JMO

 

[SouthAussie]

Any way we look at, he murdered their bodies. He obliterated them, destroyed them, until there was virtually nothing left.
It takes a 'special' kind of person to do that. Someone who seemingly does not care about the sanctity of life or death.
It was not up to him to choose how Russell and Carol were laid to rest, it was up to their families.

He is disgusting and immoral. imo

 

[drsleuth]

The five biggest moments in Greg Lynn's testimony in the Victorian campers murder trial

Lawyers for both the prosecution and the defence questioned Mr Lynn for hours on Thursday about the events surrounding the deaths of campers Russell Hill and Carol Clay.

www.abc.net.au

When asked by Mr Porceddu why he simply didn't get in his car and leave the campsite, Mr Lynn said he hadn't even thought of it as an option.

"The first time I thought about [leaving] is as you're presenting it to me right now, that's four years later," Mr Lynn said.

 

[emirates1957]

I haven't read of him being asked about it and can't believe he wasn't. It was for sale on Gumtree but the ad was removed 2 days later. I would have thought Gumtree provided that information but we've never heard anything further.

And of course he can't prove that because he would say "the man paid cash".

The police said his wife wasn't under investigation, but I just can't believe she wasn't very suspicious that he'd committed the murders. She had already commented to him that the car and trailer looked like his. Did she not think it strange that he sold the trailer? Trailers must have number plates, so what lame excuse did he have for selling it without one? Add to that she photographed him painting his car - the third time in 7 years.

JJ … Melanie had her lawyer with her in the Gallery.

 

[emirates1957]

If it was a shotgun slug it would have blown straight through and left a hole you could fit your thumb in.

He explained that away as well. The side mirror had shattered and he wanted it gone so he tried removing it himself and couldn’t…..then he thought he used a rock to smash it off. The reason being he didn’t want any memories of what happened !!

 

[Kemug]

He explained that away as well. The side mirror had shattered and he wanted it gone so he tried removing it himself and couldn’t…..then he thought he used a rock to smash it off. The reason being he didn’t want any memories of what happened !!

How did that work out for you, Greg?

 

[timezone]

Just a reminder to the newbies. On p.1 of every thread there's the following note:

"Please use links to support information stated as facts".

Links to media reports? journalists reporting back from court, sometimes with their own spin? I have provided some answers to questions that I saw and heard from the trial.

 

[Tweet57]

JJ … Melanie had her lawyer with her in the Gallery.

HER Lawyer? Why?

 

[TootsieFootsie]

I can understand why the wife of someone who was charged with murder might feel the need for someone to be there for them to protect them and their interests.
Even if they were not involved.

I would do the same if I was in that situation.

 

[Cliff Hardy]

So what is everyone thinking as we head to the close. I’ll say Guilty.

It’s been a topic of discussion in my workplace this week, seems to be split down the middle which is interesting. Many have said while they personally think he is guilty, some Jury members might buy the story so will move towards NG.

I just can’t buy the whole story. It’s just beyond far fetched.

Guilty as sin, as far as I am concerned.

 

[Cliff Hardy]

In court today he said that drone may have shown footage of the unlawful stowage of a rifle (which would have rendered him with out an ASIC)…no ASIC no job.

I am a long time holder of an ASIC (no I'm not a pilot) and they have to be renewed every 2 years and it can sometimes be more involved than getting a passport. Plus they do the police check.

 

[Cliff Hardy]

The jury will not believe the parts of Lynn's story explaining how Carol and Russell died. Any way you look at the explanation is total nonsense.

I agree. It sounds like pure fiction.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

His attitude reminds me of that "great"computer expert Dr Harold Shipman who thought he was a computer genius or an all round genius, and was far smarter than the police who arrested him.

It was rethinking the comment he made about a bullet being planted and his constant remarks about his pilot training.

He has a very high opinion of himself.

 

[emirates1957]

HER Lawyer? Why?

No idea why Tweet….when we entered the Gallery she had left a seat vacant … the lady arrived later and asked the gentleman on the door to let her in as it was her lawyer.

 

[emirates1957]

I am a long time holder of an ASIC (no I'm not a pilot) and they have to be renewed every 2 years and it can sometimes be more involved than getting a passport. Plus they do the police check.

Over the last 20 years it has been much harder to get an ASIC a full security check is done via Auscheck. My ex husband was an aircraft engineer…35 years ago he used to have a picture of his Rhodesian Ridgeback on his ASIC!!!

 

[AussieIan]

I think the jury are going to have a hard time getting over how cold & calculated Lynn was in obliterating the remains of Carol & Russell.

How he has shown no remorse.

It's all been about him & how this has destroyed his life.

I don't think it will be a stretch for them to see how he provoked / taunted Russell.

I think they will come back with unanimous guilty verdicts.

JMO

His story isn't exactly cold or calculated though. He dumped the bodies, sure, but then he leaves them for a very long time before trying to totally dispose of them which I think is more in line with his story of panicking than being calculated. When he does return and decide to 'end it' they'd be in bad state and I totally believe him vomiting alot while burning them. Whether true or not, saying he vomited shows weakness and that hes aware what he's doing is disgusting and I think that will move the jury away from seeing him as a completely cold monster and more have them thinking 'yeah I would vomit too'.... theres a word for it but it escapes me, but basically they're subconsciously putting themselves in his shoes and connecting with his story and makes GL appear human, not a monster.

I have no idea why he bought up the clubs tbh I thought that was the worst part of his testimony because it does make him sound very shallow and heartless. Unless he's trying to play the 'dumb honest' ploy.

 

[AussieIan]

I am a long time holder of an ASIC (no I'm not a pilot) and they have to be renewed every 2 years and it can sometimes be more involved than getting a passport. Plus they do the police check.

I lost my MSIC once and when I rang to get a replacement and told them I'd lost it they were nooooot very happy with me.

 

[SouthAussie]

His story isn't exactly cold or calculated though. He dumped the bodies, sure, but then he leaves them for a very long time before trying to totally dispose of them which I think is more in line with his story of panicking than being calculated. When he does return and decide to 'end it' they'd be in bad state and I totally believe him vomiting alot while burning them. Whether true or not, saying he vomited shows weakness and that hes aware what he's doing is disgusting and I think that will move the jury away from seeing him as a completely cold monster and more have them thinking 'yeah I would vomit too'.... theres a word for it but it escapes me, but basically they're subconsciously putting themselves in his shoes and connecting with his story and makes GL appear human, not a monster.

I have no idea why he bought up the clubs tbh I thought that was the worst part of his testimony because it does make him sound very shallow and heartless. Unless he's trying to play the 'dumb honest' ploy.

I don't see any way that the jury will think that him "vomiting" during that atrocious act makes him appear human.
The atrocity of it overrides everything. He did not have to do that. It is absolutely horrible.

imo

 

[drsleuth]

His story isn't exactly cold or calculated though. He dumped the bodies, sure, but then he leaves them for a very long time before trying to totally dispose of them which I think is more in line with his story of panicking than being calculated. When he does return and decide to 'end it' they'd be in bad state and I totally believe him vomiting alot while burning them. Whether true or not, saying he vomited shows weakness and that hes aware what he's doing is disgusting and I think that will move the jury away from seeing him as a completely cold monster and more have them thinking 'yeah I would vomit too'.... theres a word for it but it escapes me, but basically they're subconsciously putting themselves in his shoes and connecting with his story and makes GL appear human, not a monster.

Sorry we'll have to agree to disagree.

He basically immediately did a forensic clean of the site, including knowing to wear gloves. His first thoughts were to clean up & burn everything.

2 accidental deaths........really.

If someone is holding a knife & coming at you & they fall, how does the knife happen turn around & fatally stab you??.........it makes no sense.

IMO he was in a rage & then the methodical clean up began, only thinking of himself & his precious job & clubs.

He has a heart of stone.

All IMO & JMO

 

[AussieIan]

Sorry we'll have to agree to disagree.

He basically immediately did a forensic clean of the site, including knowing to wear gloves. His first thoughts were to clean up & burn everything.

2 accidental deaths........really.

If someone is holding a knife & coming at you & they fall, how does the knife happen turn around & fatally stab you??.........it makes no sense.

IMO he was in a rage & then the methodical clean up began, only thinking of himself & his precious job & clubs.

He has a heart of stone.

All IMO & JMO

Meh, people clean their crime scenes all the time, just because they're trying not to spend the rest of their life in jail doesn't make them cold and calculating.

I'm not trying to say he isn't cold, I just find it interesting that he made sure everyone including the jury got several glimpses of his human weakness. Petty retaliation, openly owning up to and admitting his mistakes now he's been caught, the vomiting, it's all language designed to humanise him.

This article touches on it. You've probably noticed the changes in language it talks about.

Prosecutors are supposed to dehumanize people charged with crimes. That’s what we’re taught in law school.

As my professor instructed, if you’re a prosecutor, always refer to the person accused as “the defendant.” Using “defendant” distances the judge or jury from seeing the accused as a person and makes it easier to pass judgment on them.

But if you’re a defense attorney, use your client’s name. That reminds the judge or jury that a human being’s liberty is at stake.

GL is trying to counter this imo

https://www.vera.org/news/whats-in-a-name-a-small-step-prosecutors-can-take-to-build-a-more-humane-system

I made a post about the knife. I've seen a lot of stabbings and people falling onto their own knife absolutely happens.

If you're being attacked you grab the arm or wrist and try to point the knife in any direction other than pointy end at you, (dont actually do this if someone has a knife, run away, but this is what GL likely did) if you fall over backwards bringing the other bloke with you it could result in them being stabbed.

When the body starts falling forwards you enter a state of reflex action or postural response where your brain prioritises putting your hands out to stop the impact above anything else. Someone falling backwards can maintain better control of their hands as the brain reacts differently and you aim to land on your backside or curl your back to absorb the impact and head away from impact since your arms don't bend the right way to stop it. This means whoever falls backwards can maintain control of a wrist or hand position than the person falling forwards who is automatically not resisting that control but trying to outstretch their arms. Of course this carries the risk if the pointy end is facing you that the persons weight impact on top of you drives the knife into you instead.

Most people would carry a knife outstretched pointy end up and in close quarters trying to put your hands out to prevent a fall would still result in it pointing inwards. If angled down it would penetrate GL. If angled sideways it would likely hit GL, angle up and possibly penetrate RH.