Kyle Clifford: Wanted in connection with triple murder in Bushey, 3 women murdered in home, 9th July 2024 *arrest*

[Grouse]

Hopefully the sentence will be so high that the small reduction given for a guilty plea will not overly affect the length of prison time.
I would say a whole of life might be considered here, but sadly, as most of us know, it will not be allowed.
There will be the usual, no prior convictions, mitigation.

"In cases such as a carefully planned murder of two or more people, or a murder committed by an offender who
had already been convicted of murder the starting point for an offender aged 21 or over is a whole life tariff."

I think there will probably be aggravating factors here as well - mental/physical suffering before death and premeditation.

https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/FINAL-Murder-sentencing-leaflet-for-web1.pdf

 

[Sarahlou]

It was a well planned and exceptionally cruel (and from the sounds of it, prolonged) attack that ended the lives of 3 women. I will be shocked if he doesn't get a whole life order. I think there would be uproar if he didn't.

 

[SirDigbyChickenCaesar]

"In cases such as a carefully planned murder of two or more people, or a murder committed by an offender who
had already been convicted of murder the starting point for an offender aged 21 or over is a whole life tariff."

I think there will probably be aggravating factors here as well - mental/physical suffering before death and premeditation.

https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/FINAL-Murder-sentencing-leaflet-for-web1.pdf

Agreed, whoever is found guilty of this crime will almost certainly be spending the rest of their lives behind bars. In the extremely unlikely event they don't, they would certainly not qualify for release after only 40% time served.

 

[Grouse]

Agreed, whoever is found guilty of this crime will almost certainly be spending the rest of their lives behind bars. In the extremely unlikely event they don't, they would certainly not qualify for release after only 40% time served.

They might try to go down the mental disorder route?

 

[Yellowbelly]

"In cases such as a carefully planned murder of two or more people, or a murder committed by an offender who
had already been convicted of murder the starting point for an offender aged 21 or over is a whole life tariff."

I think there will probably be aggravating factors here as well - mental/physical suffering before death and premeditation.

https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/FINAL-Murder-sentencing-leaflet-for-web1.pdf

Clearly, this crime falls well within the scope of a whole life tariff, with precious little by way of mitigating factors to take it any lower that we know of. Perhaps his defence barrister will advise him that the only way to avoid dying in jail will be a guilty plea.

That, or they try to argue insanity.

 

[Lucy6226]

I think it's going to be very hard to plead mental health or insanity here. The murders were clearly premeditated and it's been suggested there was torture involved. Obviously we won't know the details until the trial, unless he pleads guilty of course. I really can't see any mitigating circumstances having much of an impact on sentencing. All moo.

 

[Dotta]

Clearly, this crime falls well within the scope of a whole life tariff, with precious little by way of mitigating factors to take it any lower that we know of. Perhaps his defence barrister will advise him that the only way to avoid dying in jail will be a guilty plea.

That, or they try to argue insanity.

Re Insanity

- What was his job?

- Was he able to hold the job/s for long periods of time?

- Was he undergoing some psychiatric /psychological treatments?

- What is his psychological profile?

- Was he involved in Domestic Abuse before?

- Did he suffer from confusion and disorientation before?

- Did he suffer from bizarre or unusual thinking?

- Did he withdraw from family, friends and others?

- Did he engage in destructive or high-risk behaviour?

- Did he suffer from hallucinations?

Etc., etc.

And so on...
And so forth...

Insanity symptoms must be documented.

It is not Eureka moment,
like
"Your Honour
My client is...umm...
Insane!"


JMO

 

[Teeniesmum]

The article (link below) explains Kyle Clifford will be receiving treatment at hospital for some time and that they haven't spoken to him and will be guided by healthcare professionals when it's appropriate to do so.

Murder suspect to receive treatment 'for some time'

Kyle Clifford, arrested after the murder of members of BBC commentator John Hunt's family in Bushey, is still being treated.

www.watfordobserver.co.uk

 

[Kemug]

Wow, he must have been so close to death!

 

[Dotta]

Wow, he must have been so close to death!

I suspected murder suicide from the start -
as I wrote about it earlier.

But botched suicide.

After all,
I don't think killing oneself is easy,
as it is against natural instinct.

He might have wanted
"Suicide by cops".

And also,
I think choosing cemetery as his final place is significant.

JMO

 

[Cherwell]

For some reason I'm not getting alerts for this thread. Maybe this will kickstart it again.

 

[Seryth]

Thank goodness they got to him before he succumbed to his injuries. It must have been touch and go for a while. I would imagine and hope that any good judge and jury will convict with the harshest possible sentencing.

 

[dm799]

Thank goodness they got to him before he succumbed to his injuries. It must have been touch and go for a while. I would imagine and hope that any good judge and jury will convict with the harshest possible sentencing.

Whole life order almost certainly awaits, in my opinion.

 

[Inspector Evans]

It was a well planned and exceptionally cruel (and from the sounds of it, prolonged) attack that ended the lives of 3 women. I will be shocked if he doesn't get a whole life order. I think there would be uproar if he didn't.

Yes, can't really present case on the grounds of diminished responsibility given the suspected timeline of arriving on the premises at around midday and not leaving until just before 7pm.

The details in the case are going to be gruesome with the prolonged period before their deaths.

 

[crespo29]

Yes, can't really present case on the grounds of diminished responsibility given the suspected timeline of arriving on the premises at around midday and not leaving until just before 7pm.

The details in the case are going to be gruesome with the prolonged period before their deaths.

I am not sure there will be a trial. Clifford will probably plead guilty.

 

[Teeniesmum]

I am not sure there will be a trial. Clifford will probably plead guilty.

I hope so for the husband and daughters sake. To have this unimaginable horror played out even longer and in public would be very cruel, no one needs to hear or relive it. Lets hope Kyle pleads guilty and isn't sadistic enough to cause even further suffering to this family.

 

[Cherwell]

I'm not convinced it was "carefully planned". I think it's possible he went round there to scare and punish Louise, expecting her to be alone in the house. It all went pear-shaped when the others turned out to be there and it escalated. There's no way he could have expected to get away with a triple murder like this.

 

[Grouse]

I'm not convinced it was "carefully planned". I think it's possible he went round there to scare and punish Louise, expecting her to be alone in the house. It all went pear-shaped when the others turned out to be there and it escalated. There's no way he could have expected to get away with a triple murder like this.

That is a possibility, or certainly a likely basis for a defence, to get the sentence down if they claim lack of premeditation.
A lot of things were taken from his house for evidence which may help to determine this.

I think the fact he parked on a different street but with easy means of escape via the alley does indicate planning. If he just intended to scare her there'd be no need to do that I wouldn't have thought.

Also, as I mentioned up thread there were at least 3 and possibly 4 cars outside the house when he was leaving - potentially one for each of the victims and maybe one was their father's depending on how he travels to work. Unless they arrived at different points during the attack (doorbell cctv should be able to confirm that) he would almost certainly have known on his approach that it was a full house, so he could have just turned around.

 

[steeltowngirl]

I’m surprised to read here that there’s a question as to whether or not KC will received a life sentence in prison, if convicted.

In many states of the USA, this would likely be a death-penalty case.

jmo

 

[bobbymkii]

I’m surprised to read here that there’s a question as to whether or not KC will received a life sentence in prison, if convicted.

In many states of the USA, this would likely be a death-penalty case.

jmo

The sentence for murder over here is always life, but usually with the possibility of parole after a minimum sentence is served. It's unusual for a convicted murderer to get life without parole, or a "whole life order" (WLO) as we say here, and it's only reserved for the most serious cases, and this case would definitely be considered serious enough for a WLO.

Otherwise, there might be a question of any mental health issues diminishing his responsibility down to manslaughter. Or whether he'll be fit to stand trial at all as by the look of it, his suicide attempt may have left him with significant life-changing injuries.

MOO