PA - Assassination attempt, shooting injures former POTUS Donald Trump, leaves 1 spectator deceased two in critical condition, 13 July 2024 #4

[Betty P]

Critical Questions Raised​

1. Command Decisions: Who was in command and allowed such a critical tactical error?
2. Order to Abandon Post: Who authorized the abandonment of the overwatch position?
3. Lack of Rooftop Officer: Why was there no officer stationed on the roof to engage Crooks directly?
4. Optimal Positioning: Why was the water tower, deemed a superior position, not utilized for overwatch?

Three Snipers Left Their Post: Benny Johnson Unveils New Allegations in Trump Assassination Attempt

BUTLER, Pa. — A recent post by Benny Johnson on social media has brought to light serious allegations of incompetence within the Secret Service and local law

www.shorenewsnetwork.com

Well, there you go. It's similar to my first guess. JMO, I'm not sure how SS would know these things were going on if local LE didn't advise they were happening.

• eam Composition: The sniper team initially consisted of three members.
• Team Reduction: One member reportedly went home early, leaving two snipers on duty.
• Suspicious Activity: The two remaining snipers were alerted to suspicious activity involving Crooks outside the building.
• Investigation Error: One sniper left his post to investigate but found nothing and was subsequently locked out of the building after forgetting his access card.
• Abandonment of Post: The last remaining sniper left the overwatch position to assist his locked-out teammate, leaving the sniper nest unmanned.
• Shooter’s Action: During this period, Crooks crawled across the roof and fired on Trump without any engagement from the sniper team.

 

[Betty P]

My next question is, why isn't there any formal questioning of the lead Secret Service agent that was in charge of the rally? Surely, this event was not directly under Cheatle's supervision. There must be a chain of command and the person overseeing the event made critical decisions that were wrong. MOO

No doubt all the agents there that day and those in DC who helped with planning have been questioned extensively. That will be ongoing.

 

[SouthAussie]

"Donald Trump said he plans to hold another rally in Butler, Pennsylvania, after a gunman fired an AR-15-style rifle at the former president moments after he stepped on stage in the town on July 13.

It is unclear whether Trump will return to the same open-air fairgrounds where 20-year-old gunman Thomas Matthew Crooks fired at the former president from a rooftop outside a security perimeter.

A statement from an FBI spokesperson later clarified that “what struck former President Trump in the ear was a bullet, whether whole or fragmented into smaller pieces, fired from the deceased subject’s rifle.”

On Friday, Trump said he “fully accepted” the FBI’s latest statement as an “apology” from Wray."

Trump promises ‘big and beautiful rally’ in return to Pennsylvania town where he was shot

 

[Betty P]

"Donald Trump said he plans to hold another rally in Butler, Pennsylvania, after a gunman fired an AR-15-style rifle at the former president moments after he stepped on stage in the town on July 13.

It is unclear whether Trump will return to the same open-air fairgrounds where 20-year-old gunman Thomas Matthew Crooks fired at the former president from a rooftop outside a security perimeter.

A statement from an FBI spokesperson later clarified that “what struck former President Trump in the ear was a bullet, whether whole or fragmented into smaller pieces, fired from the deceased subject’s rifle.”

On Friday, Trump said he “fully accepted” the FBI’s latest statement as an “apology” from Wray."

Trump promises ‘big and beautiful rally’ in return to Pennsylvania town where he was shot

Yeah, I've said this before, but they need to have all the campaign events inside for now. You know how copycats become motivated. I'd venture to say the easy access to AR 15 style weapons and ammo and sophisticated tools make these events so much more dangerous. It's really making it much more difficult to protect high profile people at outdoor events.

ETA: Did you know you can even buy AR 15 style rifles online?

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Truth Social

Truth Social is America's "Big Tent" social media platform that encourages an open, free, and honest global conversation without discriminating on the basis of political ideology.

truthsocial.com

<Mod Note - Above is a Trump announcement that he will be returning to PA for another rally>

 

[SouthAussie]

Yeah, I've said this before, but they need to have all the campaign events inside for now. You know how copycats become motivated. I'd venture to say the easy access to AR 15 style weapons and ammo and sophisticated tools make these events so much more dangerous. It's really making it much more difficult to protect high profile people at outdoor events.

ETA: Did you know you can even buy AR 15 style rifles online?

I was wondering if bullet-proof glass could be used for protection. Because people have used that in the past (as per linked article).

But it will weaken ..... A high enough volume of high-caliber rounds can eventually penetrate any type of bullet-resistant glass.

Bulletproof Glass for the President Throughout the Years

Presidential protection, bullet-resistant glass-clad polycarbonate is intended to resist bullets, blasts, and forced entry.

www.riotglass.com

 

[Donswife48]

I was wondering if bullet-proof glass could be used for protection. Because people have used that in the past (as per linked article).

But it will weaken ..... A high enough volume of high-caliber rounds can eventually penetrate any type of bullet-resistant glass.

Bulletproof Glass for the President Throughout the Years

Presidential protection, bullet-resistant glass-clad polycarbonate is intended to resist bullets, blasts, and forced entry.

www.riotglass.com

It might, but what about the general public at the events? They deserve to be protected as well. The security was flawed, or simply didn't think about their assignment, and there needs to be a suck up moment in which all security assigned that day questions what when wrong, and how to fix it. MOO

 

[LetsSolvIt]

Complete investigation is not letting secret service or fbi to hide their fault in this tragedy, and lay blame on others.
I am one that has lost faith in the intelligence community. Having lived for decades in the area of nsa and dc. Keeping up with the goings on so to speak. Many ppl I know work for gov.

Jmo

@Elley Mae, had to chuckle when I read this. Ditto and touché!

 

[Elley Mae]

Yeah, I've said this before, but they need to have all the campaign events inside for now. You know how copycats become motivated. I'd venture to say the easy access to AR 15 style weapons and ammo and sophisticated tools make these events so much more dangerous. It's really making it much more difficult to protect high profile people at outdoor events.

ETA: Did you know you can even buy AR 15 style rifles online?

Did you know that any good deer rifle could have made the same shot?

 

[Donswife48]

If secret service can't control an outdoor event, I haven't any faith that they could secure an indoor event. Can someone light a fire, absolutely, trapping and killing people. Indoors isn't any safer, in fact it's worse because of all the places someone could hide. They need to be answering to the security for any event, not just indoors or outdoors. The more I see and read, the more I believe there is something they are covering up. MOO

 

[Ruminations]

Complete investigation is not letting secret service or fbi to hide their fault in this tragedy, and lay blame on others.
I am one that has lost faith in the intelligence community. Having lived for decades in the area of nsa and dc. Keeping up with the goings on so to speak. Many ppl I know work for gov.

Jmo

Well, okay.

Still, it is my opinion that nobody here is downplaying the significance of the assasination attempt.

It is still my opinion that speculation about what exactly hit Trump as it has occurred on this thread is not downplaying the significance of the assassination attempt.

I happen to be more in the bullet camp- my theory is that it was a bullet that was just close enough to cause a minor injury. By my theory, Crooks attempted to shoot and kill Trump.

Some people think Trumps ear was pierced by a bullet. By that theory, Crooks attempted to shoot and kill Trump.

Some people think that shards of items torn apart by a bullet hit Trumps ear. By that theory, Crooks attempted to shoot and kill Trump.

The seriousness of the crime is unchanged in each theory. No theory is "downplaying anything, IMO.

We all want the facts to come out. Facts can only come out if they are followed. Deciding prematurely that it was a bullet without being sure will prevent an accurate investigation should it turn out it was not a bullet. And telling people they are not serious about the crime if they think it was not a bullet is a way of shutting out information.

MOO

Edited to add: I just noticed that someone posted that the FBI has confirmed the bullet theory.

 

[Luna20]

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/20/trump-shooting-doctor-letter-00169963

It looks like 2 holes on the top of the ear.

<modsnip: Image removed. Members can view at link if they wish.>

 

[Donswife48]

I don't know why the FBI, whose main job is to investigate, chooses instead to try dodge the job. I'm pretty good at reading between the lines, and when there is an obvious attempt to discredit a fact, they come off as either not being able to fact find or being partisan. Wray needs to remain neutral, and it appears from my point of view that he is not. I think this will be a case of the FBI and SS trying to wait out interest, and then quietly closing the investigation with nothing found. And I think there is potentially a coverup. MOO

 

[Betty P]

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/20/trump-shooting-doctor-letter-00169963

It looks like 2 holes on the top of the ear.

<modsnip: Image removed. Members can view at link if they wish.>

Considering it was an AR15 style rifle and ammo, he is so lucky. Just a fraction of an inch the wrong way and he probably would have died, most certainly. The damage those shells do is substantial.

The analysis in the NYT article today showed how at least 2 bullets missed him and this one barely grazed him. Fractions of an inch in any direction and he would have been killed.

ETA: I'm not a medical expert. If they say he was grazed by a bullet, then I believe them. Either way, it was very, very close.

 

[layer]

I can't believe we have dozens, perhaps hundreds of posts regarding the ear damage and what caused it. It would strike me as more unusual if I didn't spend so much time on the board. That's how we roll. The devil's in the details.

 

[layer]

Considering it was an AR15 style rifle and ammo, he is so lucky. Just a fraction of an inch the wrong way and he probably would have died, most certainly. The damage those shells do is substantial.

I saw an interview with a gentleman who used the gun range with Crooks, possibly recent to the shooting. He said Crooks put his targets way out and was a very good shot. I'll see if I can dig out an acceptable link.

 

[Tricia]

The thread is closing for the night. It will open again in the morning.
Thanks,
Tricia

 

[Knitty]

Thread is open.

 

[Dotta]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1816957161840263646

https://twitter.com/x/status/1816957190835409113

 

[Mica]

[…]
Air Force veteran Bill Jenkins, 62, was on the range at Keystone Shooting Centre in Cranberry, Pennsylvania, with Crooks less than a month before he managed to get off eight shots at the Republican presidential nominee as he spoke at a rally, grazing his ear.
[…]
Jenkins, who has been questioned by the FBI over his eerie encounter with Crooks, recalled how they took an intermediate handgun course together at the range in Cranberry, Pa. — about a 30-minute drive from Butler, where the shooting took place on July 13.
[…]
The course claims to help “improve accuracy and distance through stance, grip and follow through,” according to its website and, alongside the instructor, Jenkins and Crooks were the only two taking it that day.

Crooks was dressed in casual attire and brought his own 9mm handgun to the class, according to Jenkins.

“The course went on for three hours and I could see this kid was confident with guns. When we went to the range he started shooting
straight away,” Jenkins told the outlet. “It seemed like he had experience with weapons.”
[…]
“I noticed on his target at ten yards he blew a big hole right through the centerpiece,” Jenkins recounted to The Sun. “I congratulated him on how good he’d done and he just laughed.”
[…]

Would-be Trump assassin Thomas Crooks was ‘real evil’ but a good shot, according to shooting range classmate

Days before unleashing gunfire at presumptive Republican nominee Donald Trump’s rally in Butler, Pa., suspect Thomas Mathew Crooks went to a gun range to hone his skills, according to a man w…

nypost.com