Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #194

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RA has confessed 60+ times and was dressed like the killer and is out on the bridge moments before the girls were about to cross.

His gun ejected a shell casing between the victims' bodies. Also has no alibi for the time of the murders.
 
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Fgtrfgt
This is Indiana we're talking about and we have just celebrated our fiftieth (50th) exoneration. So when someone says "they have to do this" or "have to do that," I'm kind of skeptical.

Discovery is still coming in, to the point where the D asked for and was granted the discovery response period to be shortened. So I'm kicking around the possibility that something did come in last Friday that made the judge stop the hearing.

Having just learned of the $20,000 ISP spent for genetic genealogy takes me in all different directions. Mostly, I'd really like to see when they did it.

The Judge wouldn’t have bothered ruling on the confessions if anything that meant anything came up at that hearing.
If anything of importance had happened the defense would have made sure we all knew about it. Why would they be coy now?
ISP paying for genetic genealogy just confirms that LE had DNA. Nothing more than any of us know.
Nothing positive has happened on the defense’s side in any of this.
The defense’s case is being dismantled piece by piece.
 
I'm trying real hard to wrap my head around the idea that there is definitive evidence of other players who were on the scene at the murder of these two girls and the FBI, ISP, local police, prosecution, defense, judge, and/or any other legal entity, LE agency or persons related thereto haven't brought charges against them.
 
Fgtrfgt


The Judge wouldn’t have bothered ruling on the confessions if anything that meant anything came up at that hearing.
If anything of importance had happened the defense would have made sure we all knew about it. Why would they be coy now?
ISP paying for genetic genealogy just confirms that LE had DNA. Nothing more than any of us know.
Nothing positive has happened on the defense’s side in any of this.
The defense’s case is being dismantled piece by piece.
I hope you're right.

Fgtrfgt = what do it mean?
 
This is Indiana we're talking about and we have just celebrated our fiftieth (50th) exoneration. So when someone says "they have to do this" or "have to do that," I'm kind of skeptical.

Discovery is still coming in, to the point where the D asked for and was granted the discovery response period to be shortened. So I'm kicking around the possibility that something did come in last Friday that made the judge stop the hearing.

Having just learned of the $20,000 ISP spent for genetic genealogy takes me in all different directions. Mostly, I'd really like to see when they did it.

if there was undeniable evidence someone else was at the crime scene at the relevant time i don’t see how the trial goes ahead if the person can’t be connected to RA.

the defence would apply to get the case dismissed.

i am assuming you are talking something incontrovertible here.
 
I am not sure whether it was RA or not, either way at all. For all I know, it could still be anyone. Anyone at all, this is what is so scary. The killer could be still roaming Indiana.

To me, the case goes down in history as the example of how not to work the disappearance cases. Starting with the way the police handled the lack of any contact with the girls (Tobe Leasenby, what the heck?) that night and ending with unbridled self-promoting, all these podcasts that, as we can see now, hold zero value.

“61 confession” is not a proof. Zero results from DNA that ISP had, is indicative of something at least, to me. I suspect that it doesn’t match RA.

Comparing the Delphi case with the one in Idaho - I am not 100% sure that the Idaho murderer was BK given that the party house is an accessible place, but with good trial, I am ready to accept it. After all, in Idaho case, we are able to follow up on the investigation, the accused one got a good public defender and mainly, the Idaho law enforcement behaves professionally.

In Delphi? I doubt we shall ever know. We have heard so many odd public utterances and empty hints. Ultimately, the two sketches of the suspect, side by side, and the photo of the poor cops in the river remain “the face” of this case.
 
if there was undeniable evidence someone else was at the crime scene at the relevant time i don’t see how the trial goes ahead if the person can’t be connected to RA.

the defence would apply to get the case dismissed.

i am assuming you are talking something incontrovertible here.
Don't assume, because I'm in the weeds in this $20,000 ISP spent for genetic genealogy. I don't know if they did that in addition to the usual DNA testing. I'm surprised at the amount of money they spent; how many tests would that cover? Did they get any hits on it? Apparently not?
Is it safe to assume they have DNA that didn't match anyone? If they do have DNA and it does not match RA, then where does that take us?
 
Why wouldn’t there be a transcript of the closed hearing? Is it possible the public hearing portion was cancelled because a court reporter wasn’t available?

BBM
“About 35 minutes into the closed status hearing, a deputy came out and said there would be no public hearing.

When asked what happened and why there was a change in what we had been told, investigators shrugged and did not give an answer.

There is no transcript of Friday's proceedings, and everyone involved is under a gag order.

The families of Abby Williams and Libby German did meet privately with prosecutors and investigators in a room.

Allen’s family started to cry, confused and upset, and defense attorneys met with them.”

Quoting my own post.

Best I can find for the purpose of a closed hearing that’s ’off the record’ (ie no transcript) is to share confidential information for which there will be public record of ever having occurred.

Exonerating RA definitely would NOT fall under that category.

Other ideas, aside from an unavailable court reporter?
 
I don’t think anyone has even speculated that the closed door meeting or cancelled hearing had anything at all to do with an immediate exoneration for RA. MOO
Lol... immediate would be way too quick for this case. I wonder why she just didn't come out and explain why the hearing was cancelled = "Sorry folks, our reporter couldn't be here..."
I just can't think of any reason why she cancelled like she did.
 
Lol... immediate would be way too quick for this case. I wonder why she just didn't come out and explain why the hearing was cancelled = "Sorry folks, our reporter couldn't be here..."
I just can't think of any reason why she cancelled like she did.
Nor I, that’s why I “speculated.” :) Likely we’ll know soon enough!
 
I hope you're right.

Fgtrfgt = what do it mean?

Sorry about that.
I deleted a post when I decided not to post it after I had written it.
Sometimes when I do that, the next time I do post something, that post includes not just the post I’m responding to, but the one I was going to reply to before. Weird. Don’t know why that happens.
To prevent that I type some random letters in the responding typing area. I usually remember to delete the gibberish before typing the new post….but I forgot.
Stupid, but true.
 
Quoting my own post.

Best I can find for the purpose of a closed hearing that’s ’off the record’ (ie no transcript) is to share confidential information for which there will be public record of ever having occurred.

Exonerating RA definitely would NOT fall under that category.

Other ideas, aside from an unavailable court reporter?
When first announced, it was scheduled as a 30-minute private hearing followed by a 30-minute public hearing, I recall. I interpreted that to mean they were connected. So when the public one was canceled, that made me think the topic or request at the private hearing had been denied making the public one no longer necessary. (If it had been approved, in theory, the Judge would publicly grant the request or issue an order. )
I think it was some kind of request but have no idea what it could be. If it was related to visits with his wife (as an example), that would go through the correctional system, not the Judge, I think. Others here pointed out the large bond posted, so that would rule out a request for home-based detention. What could it be?
He looked so upbeat, if that's possible, in the photo taken when arriving at court, then we hear his mom and wife are crying/being consoled by defense counsel later. Maybe with the move to the jail, some new issue arose.

I remember hearing that at the very end of the third day of recent hearings, Judge Gall said something like, 'Oh, that. We still have to discuss that.' I apologize for no source but I believe it was MS.
If true, I believe it's connected.
I don't know if there was ever a record made of this hearing request. It seems personal, otherwise there would be filings, I think.
It is intriguing there was no court reporter.


Moo. Sorry for any typos.
 
"It's the totality of the evidence we've been developing so far that leads us to that"....that being, BG is the primary suspect. Article linked below is from Feb. 19, 2017.

A few thoughts.

DM isn't a favorite source, but actually, the article linked indicates it came from AP.

DM has a search bar. Type in "Delphi". Then click "Oldest" and scroll til ya see the first article regarding this case, and that will take you to numerous articles of what was going on in the first weeks of the investigation.....FBI, Dep't of Homeland Security, Billboards, Searches of properties long forgotten, etc. etc.

The comment above, "the totality of the evidence" is what I wanted to focus on in this post, as it is THAT evidence that, very early on, led investigators to conclude BG was their primary suspect. I believe they knew at that time, the man on the bridge, was the same man that murdered the girls at the crime scene. Question is, how'd they know that? :):):)

Ya, a lot happened thereafter, for myriad reasons, leading down various dead end paths, but the evidence they reference in this article, I opine, will be presented, along with lots of other evidence, in any upcoming trial.

This is easy to answer. The man on the bridge is walking towards them and I am sure LE tried to match that up with the voices from Liberty German's phone seconds later. I could never understand why people thought it was anything else.

The only conclusion I could come to from the video is that either the person on the bridge is the killer or they would have to be a very strong material witness who literally would have seen the girls and the abductor/murderer in front of them while on the bridge at nearly the same time.
 
I’ll say this regarding what the possible reason for the cancelling of the open portion of the last hearing: evidence of a 3rd party’s guilt or broken alibi does not exonerate Richard Allen.

Jmo

On another note, as someone who has seen both the horrific crime scene photo AND the picture that BH posted to his Facebook shortly after the crime I will say that there is 0 doubt in my mind there is something there. It is unbelievable how closely they resemble each other.


All just my opinion.
 
Whether or not Richard Allen is guilty a jury will decide. He confessed 61 times to the crime so I suppose this is what is so amazing about this case.

I still cannot understand why he came forward to the conservation officer after the crime.

They could have taken his phone information right there and tried to get information to see what time his phone was at the trails. They could have brought him in for questioning right away during the first few weeks or brought in witnesses to see if they could identify him or show his picture to the witnesses on the trails that day to see if they could remember him or what time he was there. They could have asked him to say the words, "Down the hill" to see his reaction. Maybe LE did not do this stuff, but they could have.
 
Whether or not Richard Allen is guilty a jury will decide. He confessed 61 times to the crime so I suppose this is what is so amazing about this case.

I still cannot understand why he came forward to the conservation officer after the crime.

They could have taken his phone information right there and tried to get information to see what time his phone was at the trails. They could have brought him in for questioning right away during the first few weeks or brought in witnesses to see if they could identify him or show his picture to the witnesses on the trails that day to see if they could remember him or what time he was there. They could have asked him to say the words, "Down the hill" to see his reaction. Maybe LE did not do this stuff, but they could have.


Because he worked in the local CVS and multiple people had seen him that day. So he wanted to come forward to avoid suspicion in case somebody had recognized him.

MOO
 
In the whole scheme of things, the alleged staging of the crime scenes not all that vital to this investigation.

First, there is a valid question if it was really staged to be an Odinist ritual. There is a question on the table if there really was a rune painted on the tree at all.

I think there was probably blood splatter all over that tree, but the picture shown w/the alleged F makes it look like it was just there in that area. I bet that when we get to trial, we will see the whole tree and it will be splattered all over thus 'erasing' the alleged image.

And there are other reasons for the branches and twigs besides the Odinist excuse.
In my opinion, if someone is just trying to cover up a body by throwing some sticks over it, the sticks do not land and place themselves in such a formation so that criminal investigators think it could possibly be some type of Odinist ritual.
 
Because he worked in the local CVS and multiple people had seen him that day. So he wanted to come forward to avoid suspicion in case somebody had recognized him.

MOO
It did not work very well, as it left him open to suspicion even 5 and a half years later.

I wonder how this case would have turned out if he had not come forward to the conservation officer?
 

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