17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #35

[Karmady]

BBM: Hold on a minute, we're getting carried away, I think. TM's parents do not need fifth amendment protection; they are not suspects in any criminal action.

O'Mara can't FORCE them speak to him, but they are allowed to speak to anyone they choose. Having a lawyer doesn't change that.

(IANAL and all that.)

They can speak at O'Mara, but he cannot speak to them without Crump's permission and in his presence. Crump didn't return phone calls from O'Mara which were intended to accomplish just that. Those calls were not returned. He could not speak to the Martins.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

You listen to those 911 calls a lot of people say they don't know it was dark.

But a lot of them say they saw things.
Maybe it has to do with angles of the light beams and where the individual witnesses were.

But many could see.

 

[Yoda]

OT if you live close to a zoo go see if you can get lion poop. They say if you put that in your yard nothing will come into it. LOL

Not even Neighborhood Watch members?!

 

[beach]

He could of professionally asked Crump before court while they were all in the same room if it was alright for George to offer his condolences since it was just a communication problem getting that permission.

I dunno. Frankly, I'm confused about all the hoopla over it.

At one point I personally heard Trayvon's mother say she wanted to hear an apology. (it was a while ago...maybe on a Today show interview? no link handy) Later, I read here that she no longer wanted one??

Who knows....maybe George felt like it was something he wanted or needed to say. Or maybe, like myself, he thought they wanted to hear his condolences.


Trayvon's mom has always seemed to be a very compassionate, calm, reasonable person. I doubt she was as upset as many people here appear to be over it.

 

[jaded cat]

They can speak at O'Mara, but he cannot speak to them without Crump's permission and in his presence. Crump didn't return phone calls from O'Mara which were intended to accomplish just that. Those calls were not returned. He could not speak to the Martins.

Honestly, what would the Martins say to him? I'm not arguing your opinion, Karmady, as much as I'm wondering what would they say to each other? Were this my son, regardless of justice, I wouldn't want to hear from GZ or his attorney.

I think they wanted an apology from GZ for killing their son. I also believe that's never going to happen. They will have to get by on the forgiveness of God. I think the Martins think an apology would help them, I think they're wrong.

Either way the gavel of justice falls, GZ can't/won't apologize and the Martins won't get the peace they so desperately need right now. IMO, there was no way for GZ to apologize so I think he should have kept his mouth shut.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

I dunno. Frankly, I'm confused about all the hoopla over it.

At one point I personally heard Trayvon's mother say she wanted to hear an apology. (it was a while ago...maybe on a Today show interview? no link handy) Later, I read here that she no longer wanted one??

Who knows....maybe George felt like it was something he wanted or needed to say. Or maybe, like myself, he thought they wanted to hear his condolences.


Trayvon's mom has always seemed to be a very compassionate, calm, reasonable person. I doubt she was as upset as many people here appear to be over it.

I agree with you.

But, Crump stated both parents were very upset over it.

 

[JBean]

Instructions on how to delete your own posts:
edit
delete

deputizing you all to pass these instructions around if someone posts and then reads the warning after.

let them know before I do hehehehe.

 

[Karmady]

BBM: Hold on a minute, we're getting carried away, I think. TM's parents do not need fifth amendment protection; they are not suspects in any criminal action.

O'Mara can't FORCE them speak to him, but they are allowed to speak to anyone they choose. Having a lawyer doesn't change that.

(IANAL and all that.)

ETA Beach posted the following above:



And I'm sure Beach is correct in terms of what is considered professional courtesy. But we shouldn't confuse this with suspects and their fifth amendment right to have all LE questions go through their attorneys.

I missed the last part of your post. My posts were not based on the fifth amendment. They're based on O'Mara's ethical contraints.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

deputizing you all to pass these instructions around if someone posts and then reads the warning after.

let them know before I do hehehehe.

JBean, for some reason my deletes do not work on Tapatalk. I go through the steps, but the post remains.

I'm not sure what to do in that instance besides editing.

 

[TorisMom003]

Any "apology" that has a but in it is not really an "apology" at all. With Zimmerman making an excuse while on the stand, there is a but. I'm sorry for your loss BUT I thought he was only a few years younger than me. I find it very hard to believe that MOM does not read and watch everything that has to do with this case. Same goes for Zimmerman. They both knew that it would not be appreciated and yet they both went along with it. They knew that it would make Zimmerman "look better" in the publics eyes so they did so in open court with cameras rolling.

MOO

 

[Ambrosia]

And I'm still not certain that someone didn't help GZ corner Trayvon. I'm not saying they thought GZ was going to kill him, just that they thought he was going to try to detain him via intimidation until LE arrived on scene.

Ambrosia Post #272 'George Zimmerman Police Call w. Time Stamps and Notes' Zimmerman: "Um if they come in through the uh....(taptap / taptap) gate ."Tell them to go straight past the clubhouse....(taptaptaptap) and uh.....(then a waiting pause as distracted) + screech sound) then back to dispatch. Zimmerman: "straight past the clubhouse..and make a left." (SCREECH TYPE SOUND AT 7:12:44 any guesses?) A cockatoo screech sound. END

After listening again, dicovered a mistake. There were FIVE taps the second time not FOUR. If it is urgent and you want to get someones attention you start tapping. See first round of tapping sounds. = (taptap / taptap) = 4 taps. To try again repeat the act, plus add 1. (tap/tap/tap/tap/tap) = 5. Just to be sure. Make the second set of tapping not only more numerous, be sure to make them louder. Add the pause of a few seconds between the first set of taps and the second, while at the same time making a vocal pause in your attempt to answer a simple question from the police dispatch = you are distracted. This would appear that 'something' was going on behind the scenes that was caught on tape yet has been missed.

 

[JBean]

JBean, for some reason my deletes do not work on Tapatalk. I go through the steps, but the post remains.

I'm not sure what to do in that instance besides editing.

edit is good or let a moderator know

 

[Karmady]

Honestly, what would the Martins say to him? I'm not arguing your opinion, Karmady, as much as I'm wondering what would they say to each other? Were this my son, regardless of justice, I wouldn't want to hear from GZ or his attorney.

I think they wanted an apology from GZ for killing their son. I also believe that's never going to happen. They will have to get by on the forgiveness of God. I think the Martins think an apology would help them, I think they're wrong.

Either way the gavel of justice falls, GZ can't/won't apologize and the Martins won't get the peace they so desperately need right now. IMO, there was no way for GZ to apologize so I think he should have kept his mouth shut.

Yes, I know what you are saying. Honestly, my posts don't have much to do with the morality of it. I think the line of posts I was originally responding to were along the lines of why O'Mara would call Crump in the first place, and why he couldn't just have asked the Martins in court. Strictly about the procedural aspects of that. I'm not nearly so fired up about this case as some are, except maybe on a more "big picture" level. I deal with very horrible stuff all day every day. For better or worse, I'm kind of numb to the emotional/moral aspects of it at an individual level. In the immortal words of Popeye the Sailor Man, I'yam what I'yam

 

[Nova]

They can speak at O'Mara, but he cannot speak to them without Crump's permission and in his presence. Crump didn't return phone calls from O'Mara which were intended to accomplish just that. Those calls were not returned. He could not speak to the Martins.

This issue is covered by a rule of the Florida Bar, not Florida law. Here is the appropriate rule:


http://www.floridabar.org/divexe/rrtfb.nsf/FV/D9F2CB6782C1A3A585257171006BBE07


The rule only applies to "parties to the action". While I'm sure Beach is correct that relatives of a crime victim might be extended this courtesy, they are not technically "parties to the action". IANAL.

ETA but I agree with you about the non-apology-apology. It's a sideshow at best.

 

[Yoda]

This is a quote from TMs mom after GZ was arrested.

Asked what she would like to ask to Zimmerman, Trayvon's mother, Sybrina Fulton, said on The Today Show that she wants an apology from him. "I believe it was an accident. I believe it just got out of control and he couldn't turn the clock back," Fulton said, revealing her opinion about what happened the night her 17-year-old son was shot to death. "I would ask him, did he know that that was a minor, that that was a teenager and that he did not have a weapon."

GZ responded to what SF was asking for. I think that was respectful. Going to grab link.

 

[suzihawk]

I dunno. Frankly, I'm confused about all the hoopla over it.

At one point I personally heard Trayvon's mother say she wanted to hear an apology. (it was a while ago...maybe on a Today show interview? no link handy) Later, I read here that she no longer wanted one??

Who knows....maybe George felt like it was something he wanted or needed to say. Or maybe, like myself, he thought they wanted to hear his condolences.


Trayvon's mom has always seemed to be a very compassionate, calm, reasonable person. I doubt she was as upset as many people here appear to be over it.

Perhaps you don't understand all the hoopla over it since you've never been in their position, thankfully.

People in their position desperately want the person responsible for their child's death to be sorry. Unfortunately that rarely, if ever, happens. To receive an apology that is hollow, self serving and insincere is a major slap in the face and does nothing but rub salt into an already gaping wound.

That the perpetrator feels the need to assuage his own guilt or conscience is of no consequence to the parents and to use the parents to do so is purely selfish.

I wouldn't be so quick to diminish the additional pain this has caused the parents.

This is just my experienced opinion.

 

[beach]

This issue is covered by a rule of the Florida Bar, not Florida law. Here is the appropriate rule:


http://www.floridabar.org/divexe/rrtfb.nsf/FV/D9F2CB6782C1A3A585257171006BBE07


The rule only applies to "parties to the action". While I'm sure Beach is correct that relatives of a crime victim might be extended this courtesy, they are not technically "parties to the action". IANAL.

You're correct. It would not have violated any FL rules and not sure if it would be considered unethical, per FL standards. However, professionally speaking, it would be very, very, VERY uncool. I guarantee you even Crump would agree with that.

 

[jaded cat]

Yes, I know what you are saying. Honestly, my posts don't have much to do with the morality of it. I think the line of posts I was originally responding to were along the lines of why O'Mara would call Crump in the first place, and why he couldn't just have asked the Martins in court. Strictly about the procedural aspects of that. I'm not nearly so fired up about this case as some are, except maybe on a more "big picture" level. I deal with very horrible stuff all day every day. For better or worse, I'm kind of numb to the emotional/moral aspects of it at an individual level. In the immortal words of Popeye the Sailor Man, I'yam what I'yam

For me personally, you are often a voice a reason and your posts draw me away from the raw emotions of this case. That's difficult because I think this case has left most of us raw to the bone. So much pain, no chance at all of a happy ending. TM can't come back. GZs life is ruined, regardless of the outcome. As I've said before, there are no winners here.

 

[Concerned Papa]

deputizing you all to pass these instructions around if someone posts and then reads the warning after.

let them know before I do hehehehe.

OooWee.....dangerous thing to give me.....:floorlaugh:

 

[vlpate]

Ambrosia Post #272 'George Zimmerman Police Call w. Time Stamps and Notes' Zimmerman: "Um if they come in through the uh....(taptap / taptap) gate ."Tell them to go straight past the clubhouse....(taptaptaptap) and uh.....(then a waiting pause as distracted) + screech sound) then back to dispatch. Zimmerman: "straight past the clubhouse..and make a left." (SCREECH TYPE SOUND AT 7:12:44 any guesses?) A cockatoo screech sound. END

After listening again, dicovered a mistake. There were FIVE taps the second time not FOUR. If it is urgent and you want to get someones attention you start tapping. See first round of tapping sounds. = (taptap / taptap) = 4 taps. To try again repeat the act, plus add 1. (tap/tap/tap/tap/tap) = 5. Just to be sure. Make the second set of tapping not only more numerous, be sure to make them louder. Add the pause of a few seconds between the first set of taps and the second, while at the same time making a vocal pause in your attempt to answer a simple question from the police dispatch = you are distracted. This would appear that 'something' was going on behind the scenes that was caught on tape yet has been missed.

Clicks on the dispatcher's keyboard? It's in all of the 911 tapes, just a thought?