2008.06.16 James T. says he saw Caylee alive around Noon #1

[MD MOMMY]

IIRC, we heard something similar from Jesse ('bout bein' into photography as a hobby) when he stated that he noticed mucho photos of Caylee deleted from Casey's online account(s) the night/morning of 7/15-7/16. Just depends on your definition of "into" it in this case, IMHO. I think it is safe to say Casey prolly liked to take alot of pics...so...in some peeps view that means she's "into" photography IYKWIM.

Rambled a little about this earlier. Methinks the attempt-to-purchase-monitor-@-Techbay episode actually included the Caylee-opening-door scene and happened on 6/16 (vs. Walmart on 6/16). Given that context...I think there's tremendous value to be sleuthed in why 10-minutes-@-a-time Casey needed/wanted a monitor for a laptop precisely @ THAT time.

Methinks it was for Caylee to watch her own movie that evening @ Tony's (or elsewhere) so Casey could give her undivided attention to Tony. Then...w/ the purchase of the monitor not working out...was thinking it might've been an attempt to leave Caylee in the car w/ the laptop/DVD playing...in the backseat or trunk...:shocked2: but, then again, the laptop Encase report would show activity if she used her/Cindy's laptop.

Yeah but she could have picked up a portable DVD player way cheap and it's less bulky. IDK I'm still trying to figure out why she went into that store. JMO.

 

[april_showers]

*snipped*

Now there's the other bookend on the spectrum...

Occam's razor <=> Bond's limb​

Kinda rolls of the tongue doesn't it.

*snipped*

I'd actually inadvertantly typed "Bond's LIMP theory" at first, and had to go back and edit! That could have had a whole new set of connotations!

However, Bond, I'm not sure I agree we're sitting at the opposite end from Occam. This could still be far less complex than half the facets of this case! Perhaps JT came foward in July '08, but at that time was just another of the 'routine' countless tips received. Maybe he saw the initial report on the local news, recognized Casey & and Caylee, and called. At that point, the June 9th missing date was still being emphasized everywhere... And knowing he saw them on a weekend in June, just went with it. Perhaps we just have yet another victim of the Anthony family's 'date-washing.'

Of course, this still doesn't explain away many of JT's inconsistencies. But for some reason, his innacurate testimony has been deemed important. I guess I'm just saying that maybe we don't have to be SO far out on the limb where we're breaking the branch. FWIW

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

Okay, BJB. So is this where we're at?
1. I can't criticize JT because he withheld his information because we don't really know when he reported it. We only know for a fact that it was notarized in July 09. Since the Maitland police came to his place of business to take his statement (they would not keep a notary in the police car in case of emergencies) which is undated we have no idea how early he may have report this.
2. We jumped to the conclusion that the beanie baby was Taz because Taz had been taken into discovery. But Taz did not come from the Anthony home; it may not have been Taz. Casey's reaction, then, might not have been because of Caylee's choice of toys from the box (a bear would have been so much sweeter) but a true reaction of jealousy or impatience. Totally iaw her true and reported relationship with Caylee.
3. Already convinced me on the man-stuff. I'm just not used to people (especially in this case) being so forth-coming and detailed.
4. Very likely that his dates are inaccurate; a common error with witnesses.
5. And most importantly, I think he sounds smart enough to know that he has more to lose than to gain by involving himself in this horrible mess.

Guess I'm not the other bookend anymore. But, Bond, I wanted to believe him from the get-go. It's just that his statement is such a huge revelation that I felt I had to question everything about him.

 

[abel]

I skipped the last few pages of this thread so I don't know if this has been brought up but whose check was she planning to use if he said he would acceot a check? Has it ever been established that she had her own checking account? She didn't have AH's checks yet.

Also, JT says he gave Caylee a "beanie baby". I know this is kind of nit-picky but a beanie baby isn't just any old bean bag toy, it's a significant brand, at least it was about twelve years ago when I collected them, I'm out of that loop now. I guess a lot of people might just say beanie baby when referring to a bean bag toy, but I don't think the "Beanie Baby" company makes a 'Taz'.

The only problem I have with this is the how long it appears it took him to come forward, if it indeed took a year. The rest of his statement seems spot-on, except for the ping issue.

As far as the mention about her legs and cleavage: I'm about JT's age (20 or so years older than KC) and that's the first thing I noticed about her too, so I could never fault him for that!

 

[strach304]

Wasn't there a reported sighting at JBP that same day? Did we ever get the scoop on that?

I don't think this will be the only witness to testify about Caseys demeanor and mothering skills with Caylee. We have Tracy talking about the jealousy as well. The roommate who Casey left Caylee with while she was in the bedroom with Tony. Caylee sleeping with her and RM. I'm sure many of you here can add to that list as we so far know it.

 

[strach304]

I skipped the last few pages of this thread so I don't know if this has been brought up but whose check was she planning to use if he said he would acceot a check? Has it ever been established that she had her own checking account? She didn't have AH's checks yet.

Also, JT says he gave Caylee a "beanie baby". I know this is kind of nit-picky but a beanie baby isn't just any old bean bag toy, it's a significant brand, at least it was about twelve years ago when I collected them, I'm out of that loop now. I guess a lot of people might just say beanie baby when referring to a bean bag toy, but I don't think the "Beanie Baby" company makes a 'Taz'.

The only problem I have with this is the how long it appears it took him to come forward, if it indeed took a year. The rest of his statement seems spot-on, except for the ping issue.

As far as the mention about her legs and cleavage: I'm about JT's age (20 or so years older than KC) and that's the first thing I noticed about her too, so I could never fault him for that!

I brought up the check issue way back when and we just don't know. Glad to see that aspect is being considered as well.

There are beanie baby Taz toys. There are several posted in this thread by several sleuthers.

Apparently the pings aren't in conflict with the time line. Several posters have researched that as well.

 

[abel]

I figured all my points had already been discussed, I just didn't have the stamina to read every post. Thanks for the update!

 

[magiemay]

Since the SA is obviously aware of the big "ping conflict" with his written statement, I'm thinking the SA has some other important angle in mind for his testimony--something we just aren't able to glean from his written statement alone. Maybe it's the TAZ beanie baby and KC's behavior in his store alone that they'll have him testify to--ergo the only thing the Defense will be able to cross examine him about.

Much better yet, (and much less likely ), maybe there's a big "bombshell" associated with his seeing her at K-Mart, a bombshell that that defies/explains the pings and proves something useful to the SA.

I guess I'm trying to find any morsel of encouragement from this latest disheartening doc dump because I'm honestly beginning to feel like KC is being protected by some Evil Force, and I don't normally think things like that. Even the FBI lab screwed up, contaminated evidence, etc., thus enabling the Defense to cast doubt for the jury on everything done at the FBI lab.

One thing seems increasingly obvious: If the Defense looses this case, it won't be because they didn't get every d@mned conceivable break!

Agree with all said Friday specially about seeming as though she is protected by some unseen force who else could have a child missing and not have to answer for it for 31 days, and then plead give me just 1 more day!!!! Maybe that is what is called luck of the Irish ???

 

[strach304]

I figured all my points had already been discussed, I just didn't have the stamina to read every post. Thanks for the update!

Sure, no proble. I have a lot of time on my hands lately so I've been following the thread since it was first started.

 

[HRCODEPINK]

I wonder if there is video surveillance? Perhaps already gone since the witness apparently did not come forward until more than a year later.

I haven't finished this thread yet so please forgive if this has been mentioned, but I do wonder if they already had her on video at Wal-Mart before this guy came forward. We all saw her ping reports and we were able to follow her all over town. If it is proven on ping reports that she was at Wal-Mart that day, I would have to imagine that LE figured that out too and got the tapes from Wal-Mart and that is why, iirc, they have mentioned it happened on the 16th. To clarify, I believe I remember that is the day LE believes it happened and so many of us believe it was the night before but it has been so long now and I've had to process so much I would have to go check. I am just saying that I would think they got surveillance footage from everywhere they thought she was with the baby. Were the seemingly frantic string of calls after this incident at Wal-mart? Does Cindy act the way she does out of guilt for not answering?

ETA: I'm cathin up. Scrath all this...at least till I'm finished, lol!

 

[noonie]

I believe the guy. Maybe he didn't see it on news, didn't watch a lot of t.v. When he saw them in his shop KC probably put it on him so she could cash a check, and then was pizzed when it didn't happened. Treated Caylee badly since she was out of her loop! Probably always did that! He remembered Caylee looking a bit scared? Wh knows. I think LE knows. Hope for Caylee sake it is true!

 

[BondJamesBond]

Okay, BJB. So is this where we're at?
1. I can't criticize TJ because he withheld his information because we don't really know when he reported it. We only know for a fact that it was notarized in July 09. Since the Maitland police came to his place of business to take his statement (they would not keep a notary in the police car in case of emergencies) which is undated we have no idea how early he may have report this.
2. We jumped to the conclusion that the beanie baby was Taz because Taz had been taken into discovery. But Taz did not come from the Anthony home; it may not have been Taz. Casey's reaction, then, might not have been because of Caylee's choice of toys from the box (a bear would have been so much sweeter) but a true reaction of jealousy or impatience. Totally iaw her true and reported relationship with Caylee.
3. Already convinced me on the man-stuff. I'm just not used to people (especially in this case) being so forth-coming and detailed.
4. Very likely that his dates are inaccurate; a common error with witnesses.
5. And most importantly, I think he sounds smart enough to know that he has more to lose than to gain by involving himself in this horrible mess.

Guess I'm not the other bookend anymore. But, Bond, I wanted to believe him from the get-go. It's just that his statement is such a huge revelation that I felt I had to question everything about him.

I'd say we're in pretty violent agreement, EU. And you gotta have a jaundiced eye on everyone...no gettin' around that. I tried on the notion that G&C planted this guy as a means to put Casey w/ Caylee outta the house in general agreement w/ the timing of George's account...just to see where that would go...but IMHO, it doesn't work out to benefit Casey any way you turn it. It doesn't mean I'm ready to take JT hook, line & sinker either...ref all the limb climbing I've been doing lately on his behalf.

I thoroughly agree that JT is a "huge revelation". I think we're going to see the fog lift from his account...putting Caylee alive >4:11PM exit from G&C's. That alone is a big step. :thumb: And I'm 'bout ready to walk away from the thought that Casey could've taken Caylee back to G&C's between the 4:53 & 5:57PM pings near Tony's (travel time would allow her to be back @ G&C's ~5:16-5:34PM) because that's too close to the time Cindy would've arrived home from Gentiva. FWIW, we have Cindy's cell & Hopespring's home phone records. From them we can surmise that Casey did not leave any vmails for Cindy 6/16. And Cindy called Casey from her cell @ 5:56PM and left a ~1minute vmail from Casey. Then Cindy called Casey from the Hopespring phone @ 6:32PM (just a little longer than req'd travel time from Gentiva to G&C's...suggesting Cindy left work ~6PM and had her phone off prior (no incoming texts advising missed calls). IMHO, if Casey was p'd @ Cindy for not answering her phone...and thought Cindy might've headed home after Casey left...Casey would've at least tried calling the Hopespring house # before she wouldve driven all the way back...and she didn't call the Hopespring # until 6:32 .

Something appears to have had Casey occupied between 5:56PM-6:31PM. Because @ 6:31PM Casey repeatedly starting calling Cindy back (perhaps a response to seeing that Cindy had called @ 5:56PM?) I'd hafta re-read Tony's statements about when Casey showed up, but, he pinged @ his apt. starting a 40min phone call w/ Drew @ 7:01PM just prior to heading to Blockbuster. During this period Casey talked to Cindy for ~2mins @ 7:06 (per Cindy telling her that Caylee was gonna stay w/ the nanny - but we just dunno...I kinda envision a brief shouting match myself) and tried Amy a couple of times ~7:20 all pinging from near Tony's apt.

I'm still hung up on the two attempts to Amy @ ~7:20PM as a sign that Caylee was still alive and Casey was looking for someone to take her. That would allow the 4:53-6:31PM timeframe to be a pretty good candidate for Casey & Caylee to be @ Techbay w/ JT, IMHO, and perhaps grabbing a quick bite to eat too before Casey walked into Tony's place sometime before 7:54PM w/o Caylee.

Still thinking if anything showed Casey bought Caylee dinner that evening it would be Casey's best chance to plea this thing to being accidental - negligent...but accidental.

 

[justthinkin]

As usual, she was likely coming on to him pretty strong. He got the message from her that she was available to him, maybe she thought she would flirt her way in to him making an exception and taking her check. She wasn't presenting herself as aloof and out of his reach, and you are right he was fantasizing about it, until he sized her up as a jerk to her child. He may be married or had a girlfriend so not coming forward with his colorful account in vivid detail of why and how he remembered the nearly jail bait so fondly could be good old fashioned guilt. No matter, he could have come forward and left out the gory details of how he drooled over her.

You've got a good point. I was distracted by JT's statement, and forgot for a sec this is KC we're talking about who would likely do anything for a freebie this or a freebie that or to get a clerk to take a hot check. She wouldn't have necessarily known JT was the store owner.

But I have to say, this 42 yr. old man's description of KC is more befitting that of an 8th. grade boy than a middle aged man. He could have said, "I'm a guy, and when a really attractive woman comes into my store, I pay attention," even going so far as to say KC was a knockout, and really, that would have been enough. The way he said it is what casts doubts in my mind as to the credibility of this witness.

The defense is going to question his mental health over that business about him saying he didn't want to get involved with another bad mother. I mean, that one sentence in his statement makes this guy sound like a whacko whether he is or not.

 

[AZRiverRat]

He was added to the states witness list on Aug. 24, 2009.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/10387804/Casey-Anthony-additions-to-state-witness-list

 

[MissJames]

I'd say we're in pretty violent agreement, EU. And you gotta have a jaundiced eye on everyone...no gettin' around that. I tried on the notion that G&C planted this guy as a means to put Casey w/ Caylee outta the house in general agreement w/ the timing of George's account...just to see where that would go...but IMHO, it doesn't work out to benefit Casey any way you turn it. It doesn't mean I'm ready to take JT hook, line & sinker either...ref all the limb climbing I've been doing lately on his behalf.

I thoroughly agree that JT is a "huge revelation". I think we're going to see the fog lift from his account...putting Caylee alive >4:11PM exit from G&C's. That alone is a big step. :thumb: And I'm 'bout ready to walk away from the thought that Casey could've taken Caylee back to G&C's between the 4:53 & 5:57PM pings near Tony's (travel time would allow her to be back @ G&C's ~5:16-5:34PM) because that's too close to the time Cindy would've arrived home from Gentiva. FWIW, we have Cindy's cell & Hopespring's home phone records. From them we can surmise that Casey did not leave any vmails for Cindy 6/16. And Cindy called Casey from her cell @ 5:56PM and left a ~1minute vmail from Casey. Then Cindy called Casey from the Hopespring phone @ 6:32PM (just a little longer than req'd travel time from Gentiva to G&C's...suggesting Cindy left work ~6PM and had her phone off prior (no incoming texts advising missed calls). IMHO, if Casey was p'd @ Cindy for not answering her phone...and thought Cindy might've headed home after Casey left...Casey would've at least tried calling the Hopespring house # before she wouldve driven all the way back...and she didn't call the Hopespring # until 6:32 .

Something appears to have had Casey occupied between 5:56PM-6:31PM. Because @ 6:31PM Casey repeatedly starting calling Cindy back (perhaps a response to seeing that Cindy had called @ 5:56PM?) I'd hafta re-read Tony's statements about when Casey showed up, but, he pinged @ his apt. starting a 40min phone call w/ Drew @ 7:01PM just prior to heading to Blockbuster. During this period Casey talked to Cindy for ~2mins @ 7:06 (per Cindy telling her that Caylee was gonna stay w/ the nanny - but we just dunno...I kinda envision a brief shouting match myself) and tried Amy a couple of times ~7:20 all pinging from near Tony's apt.

I'm still hung up on the two attempts to Amy @ ~7:20PM as a sign that Caylee was still alive and Casey was looking for someone to take her. That would allow the 4:53-6:31PM timeframe to be a pretty good candidate for Casey & Caylee to be @ Techbay w/ JT, IMHO, and perhaps grabbing a quick bite to eat too before Casey walked into Tony's place sometime before 7:54PM w/o Caylee.

Still thinking if anything showed Casey bought Caylee dinner that evening it would be Casey's best chance to plea this thing to being accidental - negligent...but accidental.

forgive me if I have mistaken what you meant,but I thought KC and Caylee were in Techbay the WEEK BEFORE Caylee went missing and that he saw her at WalMart the 16th.He noticed her at WalMart as the pretty girl who had been in his shop the week before.

 

[BondJamesBond]

forgive me if I have mistaken what you meant,but I thought KC and Caylee were in Techbay the WEEK BEFORE Caylee went missing and that he saw her at WalMart the 16th.He noticed her at WalMart as the pretty girl who had been in his shop the week before.

Here you go, MJ. Posted [ame="http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4226214&postcount=283"]here[/ame] 'bout deconvoluting the two sightings and placing the Caylee @ Techbay event on 6/16...~5PM.

Be SURE to read the quoted part first...esp. regarding the detail of Casey & Caylee leaving Techbay "separately". [/QUOTE]

Maybe just totally hosed speculation...but something to consider FWIW.

 

[Ripley007]

At the risk of alientating any of my fellow posters and friends, I MUST post with my own personal truths.....
I cannot believe that any of you put one single ounce of credibility into this perverts statement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It sounds like a bunch of HorseSh** to me!!!!!!!!! I've read this post and it's MANY pages, shaking my head in disbelief.....are you all that desperate to find a "smoking gun" in this case, that you would believe this guy!? Come on....the prosecusion has a STRONG case against KC. Don't fall for crap like this, please! Am I alone? If so, that's okay. I don't need to have followers. The TRUTH will prevail when KC goes to trial. Caylee's murderer will NOT go free. Don't doubt it. Don't grasp at silly straws.....

 

[MissJames]

At the risk of alientating any of my fellow posters and friends, I MUST post with my own personal truths.....
I cannot believe that any of you put one single ounce of credibility into this perverts statement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It sounds like a bunch of HorseSh** to me!!!!!!!!! I've read this post and it's MANY pages, shaking my head in disbelief.....are you all that desperate to find a "smoking gun" in this case, that you would believe this guy!? Come on....the prosecusion has a STRONG case against KC. Don't fall for crap like this, please! Am I alone? If so, that's okay. I don't need to have followers. The TRUTH will prevail when KC goes to trial. Caylee's murderer will NOT go free. Don't doubt it. Don't grasp at silly straws.....

Hey Ripley,
can I say I have suspended my belief? It may have happened ,but without backup video or other witnesses ,I will not consider it evidence.Just MO.
I don't really understand why you would take his statement and flip it,though.Sorry BJB,but that's really stretching it for me.He recognized KC at WalMart because she had been in his store.The store visit came first,if you believe him at all.

 

[Ripley007]

Here's the thing....everything he wrote or said about KC and Caylee could be derived from published photos. KC -the sexy siren....Caylee- the little girl with the perpetual "determined" look on her face.....am I right or am I right? lol
I read his statement as a loney computer nerds statement. He reminds me of the movie "the 40 year old Virgin". Sorry, but I can't see any truth in it. Nobody has to agree with me. I'm okay with that.
On a side note-not that my side note influences my feelings about this nerd dude, but, I have ALWAYS subscribed to the theory that Caylee was DEAD before the sun rose on 6/16/08. Yeah, yeah, I know many of you disagree, thinking Caylee was killed in the afternoon on 6/16. But not me. I believe she was killed in KC's bedroom in the wee am hours of 6/16. GA statement about what KC and Caylee were clothed in when he claims to have saw them around 1:00 pm on 6/16- BS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! As I have posted over and over again till I'm blue in the face.....BULL S****!!!!!!!!!! I'm a good and observant mom, but yet I can't swear to know what clothing my daughter was wearing the last time I saw her just 2 days ago. His memory of clothes-30 days prior- give me a BREAK!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sorry if I offended anyone. Not my intention. But I feel SO strongly about this, for my own sake, I must say it aloud.

 

[ClockWatcher]

<hugs> Ripley!!

I don't think anyone is desperate for a smoking gun. We're just doin' what we do! It's like eating whole crabs, ya have to pick out every last bit for complete satisfaction!

I too was thinking that ol' JT was another Fruit Loop horning in on the action. I called BS on his statement at his recounting of the sighting of Caylee and KC at the Wal-Mart. I knew from reading the ping thread's that there was no way she could have been there. But I was wrong.

I had to go back and re-read them and learned that there was an opportunity for the Wal-mart sighting at 11 am ish on the 16th.

That little bit and the fact that the state has added Tech-Dude to the witness list has me back peddling on his veracity.

Until I can read his interview with LE, I'm not sure how far out on limb I can follow Bond's theory of Tech-Dude mixing up the sequence of event's and day's. (Bond? Have I told you lately that I love you?)

But, there has to be more to the story. If this guy was just another wanna-be, then I don't think we would have seen his name added to the state's witness list.