2008.07.15 Revisiting the 911 Calls

[logicalgirl]

My impression of those frantic phone calls was two points - first she was upping the ante to the 911 folks so she could actually get a response. And second she was threatening Casey to find out where Caylee was and get her back. She threatened to take her car away by reporting it stolen, and here's where Casy could get in trouble. I'm taking your wheels away, and if that isn't enough, I'm going to charge you with theft (if you don't do what I want). And then added to it by the 3rd call, by talking about the smell. I think she was using any action she could think of to get Casey to produce Caylee - that's what she wanted. Kind of like saying to a small child - you have to do this or the boogey man will get you. I also think Cindy was so frantic, she just didn't consider what the end result of her actions would be.

 

[The Eunice Burns]

Rev Crim---thanks for posting and laying out your thoughts. The 911 calls and CA's explanation have always been an issue, IMO.

I am trying to imagine why C&G did not call 911 immediately, if not at Johnson's, then when arriving home. It's the stench that pushes it over the line, for me. Let's say they had recovered the car and there had been no stench--- OK, Caylee has been missing for 31 days, and they continue to try and track KC down, and send Lee on more club missions........that would be explainable if there had been no odor of human decomp. But there was, and GA admitted to thinking/knowing it was. So, then we have that stench combined w/ a 31 day absence of a 2 year old, and the erratic, outrageous, and ongoing behavior of KC........all of that was enough to call 911 THEN.

But instead, Cindy sends George to work, goes to work herself, and then later tackles trying to find KC. None of those actions make any sense to me in light of the odor. IMO, they knew enough to at least strongly suspect something horrible had happened to Caylee, all of the pieces were there. I think 911 was called to establish w/ LE their own "cooperation", and maybe GA as former LE knew that although they had cleaned the car and (IMO) tampered w/ evidence, that there was no getting out of involving LE........and let's not forget SB, who might have, had they not called, beat G & C to the punch. If not for him, I wonder if the As would have done things a wee bit differently. IMO I'd love to hear a compelling explanation for the As delay in calling 911 and the calls themselves, b/c none of it adds up to me.

 

[RevCrim]

My impression of those frantic phone calls was two points - first she was upping the ante to the 911 folks so she could actually get a response. And second she was threatening Casey to find out where Caylee was and get her back. She threatened to take her car away by reporting it stolen, and here's where Casy could get in trouble. I'm taking your wheels away, and if that isn't enough, I'm going to charge you with theft (if you don't do what I want). And then added to it by the 3rd call, by talking about the smell. I think she was using any action she could think of to get Casey to produce Caylee - that's what she wanted. Kind of like saying to a small child - you have to do this or the boogey man will get you. I also think Cindy was so frantic, she just didn't consider what the end result of her actions would be.

CA was perfectl,y calm on the first 911 call- maybe a little ticked off, but calm nevertheless-
But again- no mention of the decomp nor Caylee to 911-
If Ca was so worried about Caylee- why didn't she panic when she saw the notice about the abandoned car? And especially when getting to the car at the towing lot? No 911 call? And- why did GA wait for CA to come before
checking the car out? He had a lot guy go with him to open the trunk? Why?
If he was that afraid it may have been Caylee in there- why no 911 call after he opened it? She was still missing. Now they had an abandoned car- no KC and no Caylee- What on earth would it take for them to report their family missing?

 

[cecybeans]

CA was perfectl,y calm on the first 911 call- maybe a little ticked off, but calm nevertheless-
But again- no mention of the decomp nor Caylee to 911-
If Ca was so worried about Caylee- why didn't she panic when she saw the notice about the abandoned car? And especially when getting to the car at the towing lot? No 911 call? And- why did GA wait for CA to come before
checking the car out? He had a lot guy go with him to open the trunk? Why?
If he was that afraid it may have been Caylee in there- why no 911 call after he opened it? She was still missing. Now they had an abandoned car- no KC and no Caylee- What on earth would it take for them to report their family missing?

I think they knew immediately KC's car = KC's big problem and did not want to notify LE until they knew for sure it was not some dead drug dealer. They already knew KC was alive - she'd been texting on and off since the car was impounded. They may have thought she had simply sold her car for drug money and that a crime had occurred later. KC had been telling them since July 3 she was in Jacksonville. I think they wanted to eliminate KC from the line-up of possible perps before they called LE. And if they could locate Caylee in the interim, then they could minimize the damage in case KC was actually connected to the smell. They may have been hoping KC was simply hiding Caylee out of town at that point. Clean-up and minimizing - what KC's parents were used to from years of practice.

 

[RevCrim]

Another thought- KC was 21 yrs, old, and no matter how much CA wanted to see Caylee, if KC decided to keep her away, there's nothing CA can do. So why did she panic and pull such a terrible stunt 31 days later? And I do mean stunt.
KC was capable of getting into more than enough trouble on her own, but for a mother to lie and falsely accuse her own child, is way beyond anything I can understand.
Why not, I am worried about my granddaughter and my daughter is not co-operating -and I feel something is very wrong?
Had to be the decomp in the car.
CA didn't call 911 on 7/3/08, when she wrote on her Myspace that Caylee was missing.
Or that night when KC was dodging LA.

 

[The Eunice Burns]

I think they knew immediately KC's car = KC's big problem and did not want to notify LE until they knew for sure it was not some dead drug dealer. They already knew KC was alive - she'd been texting on and off since the car was impounded. They may have thought she had simply sold her car for drug money and that a crime had occurred later. KC had been telling them since July 3 she was in Jacksonville. I think they wanted to eliminate KC from the line-up of possible perps before they called LE. And if they could locate Caylee in the interim, then they could minimize the damage in case KC was actually connected to the smell. They may have been hoping KC was simply hiding Caylee out of town at that point. Clean-up and minimizing - what KC's parents were used to from years of practice.

Thanks, cecy. In reference to them possibly thinking a drug dealer had been lying dead in the car.....there is, for me, the issue of George already going "there" in his mind, that Caylee was in the trunk--before he and SB opened the trunk, he already had wondered w/ dread if Caylee could have been in there. IMO, he really knew. Why he then went on in the course he and Cindy took, I'll never understand.

 

[debs]

Why does Cindy wait until Amy is out of the car to call 911?

 

[Elley Mae]

Why does Cindy wait until Amy is out of the car to call 911?

iirc, Cindy stated in one of her interviews with LE that she and Casey were "talking", "discussing" getting Caylee. iirc, Amy's interview with LE was a bit different to say the least on that subject.Cindy was not a happy camper in the car. Probably just didn't want to involve Amy any further.

 

[RevCrim]

Why does Cindy wait until Amy is out of the car to call 911?

In my thinking- for what it's worth-
By now CA knows about KC stealing money from AH and doesn't want KC to get arrested for that- it has no advantage for her- she knows full well she is going to drop the charges against KC, but maybe AH wouldn't. Remember, we are dealing with personalities where no one else exists no are there any people more important then themselves. So the heck with AH.
Proof is in the pudding- CA took the money out of KC's purse and claimed it as probably her own- not even giving a thought about KC just having stolen from AH.
Again- I don't buy the 911 calls- even though I am certainly glad CA brought attention to Caylee being gone.

 

[SleuthyMama]

iirc, Cindy stated in one of her interviews with LE that she and Casey were "talking", "discussing" getting Caylee. iirc, Amy's interview with LE was a bit different to say the least on that subject.Cindy was not a happy camper in the car. Probably just didn't want to involve Amy any further.

I also think a little bit of "the apple doesn't fall far from the tree" applies here as well.

Cindy called Amy because she needed Amy to try and find out where Casey was. Once she had Casey, she didn't need Amy's assistance any longer and surely, because she's so big on maintaining the family's image, didn't want Amy to hear any more family biz than was absolutely necessary.

 

[logicalgirl]

I just can't see that Cindy connected Caylee with the smell in the trunk at first. It seems Cindy thought Casey may be up to her usual no good, and this time was really in serious trouble, but don't think she'd allow herself to connect the two thoughts until Casey told her Caylee was missing. It seems she was cleaning up the car to protect Casey from whatever drug deal gone bad or whatever had happened - and then it was okay Casey - now your behavior has gone off the rails and you obviously aren't living the kind of life Caylee should be around so just bring her home right now. IMO
Not trying to make excuses for Cindy at all - I think she is a miserable excuse for a grandmother/mother/wife and her behavior over the last year has been reprehensible.

 

[wenwe4]

The 911 calls were all about having power and control over KC. These were in an effort to force KC to produce Caylee immediately. It was the only thing CA had left to force KC to begin talking. She hadn't gotten the confirmation that we had a missing child at that point and the only thing she could do was begin upping the ante to prove Caylee was ok. The smell in the car was foremost in their mind and GA said "please don't let this be KC or Caylee" to the tow truck driver. After hours of trying to get to the bottom of the story, KC "finally admitted my granddaughter's been missing for a month - we need to find her".

 

[RevCrim]

But- even if Ga and Ca still thought Caylee was alive- how and why would they think it was okay to cover up an apparent crime, and destroy evidence? Ga was in LE- he knew he should call 911. This all goes back to DAY ONE---But---Just when in Creation -was
DAY ONE-----certainly it was not June 15th, 2008.

 

[grammieto5]

What are the chances of CA knowing about what KC had done to Caylee from the very begining? And then involving GA and then LA. The 4 of them had 31 days to come up with a story. Anyone else think this could be possible?

 

[wonders]

I think we as humans should listen to our first instincts. In the case of GA and CA they should have done just that if they cared a cent for Caylee or even KC (could have supported her in an honest way) for that matter. They should have called LE at the tow yard (I never would have driven off with that smell in my car so that makes me wonder about them) They never should have cleaned the car. They should have let KC adopt Caylee out ( they all denied she was pregnant when she was 7 months along (( that to me says not one of the A's wanted her in the first place)) at CA's brother Rick's wedding) when she was born. I guess I could go on and on but I'm sure you see my point. They knew the truth but they chose to ignore what they smelled and saw. Even if they sat me down and explained it to me it would go over my head b/c I just can't think like that.

 

[Searchfortruth]

Rev, you bring up some good questions here.

IMO, Cindy didn't report the smell in the car until she had the "nanny took Caylee" story from Casey (third 911 call). Prior to that, it was about the car, theft...I believe Cindy had a good idea from the smell, and not seeing Caylee for a month, that there was a big problem, early on. She didn't want to tell LE about her real fears, she was protecting Casey. She was trying to control LE just like she likes to control everyone else, using the calls to make Casey talk.

The third 911 call where Cindy says "the car smells like a dead body", was only after she had a suspect to give LE, Zanny. She knew about the smell before 911 call number one, she chose not to mention it until the "baby sitter stole Caylee" story was available. All my opinion only.

 

[Elley Mae]

I think we as humans should listen to our first instincts. In the case of GA and CA they should have done just that if they cared a cent for Caylee or even KC (could have supported her in an honest way) for that matter. They should have called LE at the tow yard (I never would have driven off with that smell in my car so that makes me wonder about them) They never should have cleaned the car. They should have let KC adopt Caylee out ( they all denied she was pregnant when she was 7 months along (( that to me says not one of the A's wanted her in the first place)) at CA's brother Rick's wedding) when she was born. I guess I could go on and on but I'm sure you see my point. They knew the truth but they chose to ignore what they smelled and saw. Even if they sat me down and explained it to me it would go over my head b/c I just can't think like that.

Personally I think that Casey is and was a thorn in George's side, and has been for years. One of the first problems was her "graduation" he knew something was up with that, you don't find out 2 days before that you won't graduate. And we all know that pictures are taken months ahead of graduation. He knew that she was not working at Sports Authority. He knew she was "taking", stealing gas for months. Now back to George, he had just started a new job when he picked up the car, and iirc he has had another job since then. Cindy has been carrying him for years. She found out "it was cheaper to keep him" what 4-5 years ago. I am sure George would have loved for Casey to graduate, get a job, and move the heck out. Life would have been so good for him. Cutting the grass, cleaning the house, watch cooking show and cook dinner, and have an occasional swim. But that didn't happen, and who's fault is it? Casey is the reason George had to get a job, if not for her he wouldn't have to work.Sure he Loved Caylee and Cindy did too, but it is not what either one wanted for Casey.

 

[wonders]

Personally I think that Casey is and was a thorn in George's side, and has been for years. One of the first problems was her "graduation" he knew something was up with that, you don't find out 2 days before that you won't graduate. And we all know that pictures are taken months ahead of graduation. He knew that she was not working at Sports Authority. He knew she was "taking", stealing gas for months. Now back to George, he had just started a new job when he picked up the car, and iirc he has had another job since then. Cindy has been carrying him for years. She found out "it was cheaper to keep him" what 4-5 years ago. I am sure George would have loved for Casey to graduate, get a job, and move the heck out. Life would have been so good for him. Cutting the grass, cleaning the house, watch cooking show and cook dinner, and have an occasional swim. But that didn't happen, and who's fault is it? Casey is the reason George had to get a job, if not for her he wouldn't have to work.Sure he Loved Caylee and Cindy did too, but it is not what either one wanted for Casey.

With all due respect Elley Mae,
I was just trying to say that a normal every day person such as myself would have called 911 upon smelling that stinch. I'm not or ever been in LE or a nurse. I would not have touched that car for the simple fear of what I may have found in the trunk. To drive it away and then do clean up on it, uh huh. It just defies my common sense I guess.

 

[logicalgirl]

Thanks, cecy. In reference to them possibly thinking a drug dealer had been lying dead in the car.....there is, for me, the issue of George already going "there" in his mind, that Caylee was in the trunk--before he and SB opened the trunk, he already had wondered w/ dread if Caylee could have been in there. IMO, he really knew. Why he then went on in the course he and Cindy took, I'll never understand.

It seems to me when I read back over files - it was always George who was more aware of the kind of person Casey had become as she moved out of her teens, but Cindy would never admit it, and took Casey's side. I also think George suspected Casey may be capable of hurting Casey, but I don't think it occurred to Cindy, even after the smell in the car. I think Cindy was in cover-up mode re cleaning up the car because she thought Casey may be mixed up with the wrong crowd - but I just don't see her even having a conscious thought about connecting Caylee with it. Casey had been telling her for a month she was with someone - I just don't think that's where her first thought went. IMO of course. Way too busy with the perfect family in her head.

 

[impatientredhead]

Rev, you bring up some good questions here.

IMO, Cindy didn't report the smell in the car until she had the "nanny took Caylee" story from Casey (third 911 call). Prior to that, it was about the car, theft...I believe Cindy had a good idea from the smell, and not seeing Caylee for a month, that there was a big problem, early on. She didn't want to tell LE about her real fears, she was protecting Casey. She was trying to control LE just like she likes to control everyone else, using the calls to make Casey talk.

The third 911 call where Cindy says "the car smells like a dead body", was only after she had a suspect to give LE, Zanny. She knew about the smell before 911 call number one, she chose not to mention it until the "baby sitter stole Caylee" story was available. All my opinion only.

I still cut Cindy some slack on the events of that night. While we now have them laid out, analyzed, dissected, etc... she was living them in the moment.

Without a doubt she knew something was very wrong when they found out about the car but I do not think she believed in that moment that Caylee was dead, let alone at Casey's hands.

I do believe she picked her up with the intent of forcing her to produce Caylee. Called the police with the intent of scaring Casey. And then when the nanny story came spilling out I think the third 911 call was made in a moment of pure panic and the comment about the smell came tumbling out as she processed all of the info.

I don't condone how she handled it before the calls, during the calls, or after... I just don't think she was in cover up mode at that moment. I don't think it had sunk into her how bad things were at that exact moment.

Upon realizing Caylee could not be produced Cindy did exactly what Casey did not do. Call the police in a sheer panic. Once the reality set in she went into cover for Casey mode full bore.