2009.22.09 Nancy Grace

[SeriouslySearching]

uh...yep...and didn't they have a very large yard sale...and didn't his wife want to "get her kids away from there b/c she was worried about them" with everything going on...hmmm...sort of makes a person wonder. Seems to me the only people staying where they need to stay have been Misty & Ron, and Crystal & Chad.

I have a question. Earlier in the case, it became known that DS stayed with Tommy & Lindsey, or was friends with them or something. Does anyone remember if it was Snodgrass or Sapp? There was some confusion earlier in these threads regarding this issue, so please only answer if you "know" - meant with a ton of respect...please.

The rumor was Snod.

The central figures in this case have made no mention of moving anywhere only the Croslin family has ventured out of state...conveniently when things were to hit the fan...I might add. (Altho...some of Crystal's family moved earlier, IIRC)

 

[Bathbuddys]

Not to my knowledge. Rob got Casey's pings pretty soon after they arrived in Orlando. He didn't need to jump through judicial hoops to get them. I can't imagine how difficult it should be for LE to be able to obtain them either in an investigation of this nature.

They usually have to have a warrant if the person does not willingly give them over and Lee gave them to Rob and LP when they first got there.

 

[Bathbuddys]

It is exactly what I have been saying since he placed himself at the scene closer than anyone else to the time she went missing. I think they already told him someone saw his truck or him plus they have the call from Ronald which is on the records and this was his explanation. I believe he did go over there like he said, but he has lied about what happened afterward.

Yeah but think about this(as I thought he was lying too) but if he is lying would he place himself there and since him and Ron are fighting at the moment and he is in jail, would he cover for Ron saying Ron called him to check on her? I am almost believing this guy. but ya never know.

 

[azwriter]

Heeeyyy!!! I've been lurking. Now I'm a member.

I've been following this case awhile!

Welcome and stay awhile! Your posts are welcome too.

 

[azwriter]

I've been reading posts here in this thread about Haleigh's disappearance for over an hour and the only comfortable conclusion I've come to is that all the players are lying. I can't figure out who's telling the truth and who isn't.
However, it doesn't matter what we think about who is truthful or not.
What does LE think? Who do they believe?
Do they believe Hank jr's account of being at the home the night Haleigh went missing?
Or, are they putting out that information (believe it or not) as a ploy in order to shake up Misty and others and pressure someone to reconsider their story?
Since February, LE has released very little to the public about this case. Now, Boom! all of a sudden we hear about Hank Jr. saying he was at the home that evening checking on Misty. Why was this made public?
We can discuss who is lying and who is telling the truth for hours, but my concentration now falls into the legal end of this case - who do the cops trust is telling the truth?
I'm figuring, something is going to break very soon in this case.
Good Night all!

 

[sttct]

I agree with everyone here who has said that it's a little convienant that Hank Jr has placed himself at the crime scene! He said Misty wasn't home. It's probably true. She probably wasn't home and when she came home the kids were gone and he took them. Or maybe she wasn't home burying a body. All I know is all these Croslins need reinterviewed.

I also can't understand why Ronald would call Misty's brother to check on her and the kids. I'm sorry....if your girlfriend isn't answering the phone and you work 15 min away DRIVE OVER THERE YOURSELF. Or when he found out what happend the first person he called was his mom. He would call her first right? Instead of Misty's brother? Strange Strange. It all isn't good for Haliegh.

 

[sttct]

I'm sorry not kids were gone...Haleigh was gone. But gosh darn it, it could have been the both of them!

 

[CarmelEyesD]

I really do think Misty is telling the truth. I think no one like her answers, or wants different answers. or are unsatisfied with the ones she gives. When she tries to 'clarify', she mixes everything up even more. But I don't think she is lying. I think she is unable to give any more defined information-either because she doesn't know it, or has been intimidated or threatened, (or possibly drugged, whether voluntarily or involuntarily) She speaks in a 'weird' sort of way, and I think that leaves a lot of her answers open to interpretation. She has been questioned, examined, studied, accused, and analyzed.
Kool, I don't think you should be upset with yourself, (forgive me my opinion)-it wouldn't be something you would have noticed unless you were looking for it. I was only seeing it (I think) because she reminds me of my (ex)daughter-in-law in Jacksonville, who talks and thinks quite the same way. She also has LD, and left school somewhere around the 7th grade. But listening to Misty is like listening to her. Same sweet, innocent type girl, who has her own way of looking at life, talking and jumps to different subjects in the same short space of a thought. It is very difficult getting direct answers from her too-we take a long winding road instead of a short street in conversations. And she truly is the sweetest girl! Because Misty reminded me so much of her, I think I was subconsciously looking for it, or at least spotted it faster. But I honestly think Misty doesn't have anything more she can tell us.

 

[Muffet]

I really do think Misty is telling the truth. I think no one like her answers, or wants different answers. or are unsatisfied with the ones she gives. When she tries to 'clarify', she mixes everything up even more. But I don't think she is lying. I think she is unable to give any more defined information-either because she doesn't know it, or has been intimidated or threatened, (or possibly drugged, whether voluntarily or involuntarily) She speaks in a 'weird' sort of way, and I think that leaves a lot of her answers open to interpretation. She has been questioned, examined, studied, accused, and analyzed.
Kool, I don't think you should be upset with yourself, (forgive me my opinion)-it wouldn't be something you would have noticed unless you were looking for it. I was only seeing it (I think) because she reminds me of my (ex)daughter-in-law in Jacksonville, who talks and thinks quite the same way. She also has LD, and left school somewhere around the 7th grade. But listening to Misty is like listening to her. Same sweet, innocent type girl, who has her own way of looking at life, talking and jumps to different subjects in the same short space of a thought. It is very difficult getting direct answers from her too-we take a long winding road instead of a short street in conversations. And she truly is the sweetest girl! Because Misty reminded me so much of her, I think I was subconsciously looking for it, or at least spotted it faster. But I honestly think Misty doesn't have anything more she can tell us.

The bolded parts make me wonder how much you've seen from Misty. I say that with pure sincerity, btw.

I too think she has issues, and if the only thing I'd seen were those tapes, I'd feel nothing but pity for her. But I've seen too many other things from her to believe she's anywhere near sweet. lol

 

[Donjeta]

I really do think Misty is telling the truth. I think no one like her answers, or wants different answers. or are unsatisfied with the ones she gives. When she tries to 'clarify', she mixes everything up even more. But I don't think she is lying. I think she is unable to give any more defined information-either because she doesn't know it, or has been intimidated or threatened, (or possibly drugged, whether voluntarily or involuntarily) She speaks in a 'weird' sort of way, and I think that leaves a lot of her answers open to interpretation. She has been questioned, examined, studied, accused, and analyzed.
Kool, I don't think you should be upset with yourself, (forgive me my opinion)-it wouldn't be something you would have noticed unless you were looking for it. I was only seeing it (I think) because she reminds me of my (ex)daughter-in-law in Jacksonville, who talks and thinks quite the same way. She also has LD, and left school somewhere around the 7th grade. But listening to Misty is like listening to her. Same sweet, innocent type girl, who has her own way of looking at life, talking and jumps to different subjects in the same short space of a thought. It is very difficult getting direct answers from her too-we take a long winding road instead of a short street in conversations. And she truly is the sweetest girl! Because Misty reminded me so much of her, I think I was subconsciously looking for it, or at least spotted it faster. But I honestly think Misty doesn't have anything more she can tell us.

It is quite possible that she has many issues with expressing herself but merely that doesn't explain why her story changes every time she retells it, IMO, because the things she relates should be well within her verbal capabilities, from what we've seen of her. She's quite fluent if sometimes a bit vague and elliptical in her interviews. We are often left quite in the dark because the taped interviews we have seen don't ask the right questions that would clarify the vague points. But LE has had lots of hours with her and skillful questioners would have known what to ask if it was just a matter of speaking weird and jumping from thought to thought. It's not the first time they've come across with people with issues with clarity of expression.

Also, vague expressions and elliptical thoughts don't explain why LE says they have found evidence that says she couldn't have been doing what she was doing. IMO. It's not a matter of not liking her answers, it's a matter of her answers not fitting in with what they know of the reality.

BBM. If she's unable to give more information because she's been intimidated it doesn't equal that she's telling the truth. It means she's lying because she's scared.

 

[CarmelEyesD]

All I have ever seen of Misty is what is shown on clips on internet or NG.

 

[Donjeta]

All I have ever seen of Misty is what is shown on clips on internet or NG.

Me too. We have had a couple of hours worth of footage, and no opportunity to ask her for clarifications. But they said ages ago that LE has interviewed her for what, over 30 hours, and now some more, and they have access to physical evidence and other people's interviews that we know nothing about. Based on that, if they think she's lying I'm inclined to trust them. (I had come to that conclusion on my own before they said so but even if I hadn't it wouldn't be easy for me to dismiss what LE said.)

 

[CarmelEyesD]

I wish I knew what LE knows that we don't know.

 

[Muffet]

One non-video thing that influenced my opinion of her was the message she left on another girl's __ page. (I don't think we're allowed to post that up here, though?)

Another was her reaction to the LEO who told her he thought she was lying, and her description of the incident on the Today show.

Also, I talked to my brother about all this tonight, and he assured me that LE is well-versed in the varieties of cognitive issues we're talking about, since the majority of people they have to deal with suffer from them. Profilers like the FBI sends would be particularly good at recognizing them.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Heeeyyy!!! I've been lurking. Now I'm a member.

I've been following this case awhile!

Welcome Padua - thanks for joining Websleuths!

 

[Jersey*Girl]

I will estimate her IQ between 80 and 85. I read the note during the Tim Miller thing and watched the videos...the writing, context, verbal language skills. Between 80 and 85.

But let me just say, I have not evaluated her!

Funny you should say this. My son is in 10th grade...wants to be a cop after he goes to college. He started teasing me b/c I'd been on here for hours...said it couldn't be that interesting. He read some of this stuff and said to me - "Mom, this is ridiculous! I'd be surprised if her IQ is above 90!". Now, that's coming from a kid...pretty uncanny if ya ask me, and he said it to me before you even wrote this. Of course I don't mean this literally b/c I have no idea how to measure her IQ, I could only compare her to myself or my family. The difference is drastic. There's been many-a-people that have raised children without having an education and the children have turned out beautifully...but...this is a different day & time we live in. With all the circumstance surrounding Misty's upbringing, and the fact that she's uneducated, I'm not surprised by how she answers questions. She's probably trying to protect herself - either b/c she was raised on the streets or something's amiss & she's afraid to speak.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

I really do think Misty is telling the truth. I think no one like her answers, or wants different answers. or are unsatisfied with the ones she gives. When she tries to 'clarify', she mixes everything up even more. But I don't think she is lying. I think she is unable to give any more defined information-either because she doesn't know it, or has been intimidated or threatened, (or possibly drugged, whether voluntarily or involuntarily) She speaks in a 'weird' sort of way, and I think that leaves a lot of her answers open to interpretation. She has been questioned, examined, studied, accused, and analyzed.
Kool, I don't think you should be upset with yourself, (forgive me my opinion)-it wouldn't be something you would have noticed unless you were looking for it. I was only seeing it (I think) because she reminds me of my (ex)daughter-in-law in Jacksonville, who talks and thinks quite the same way. She also has LD, and left school somewhere around the 7th grade. But listening to Misty is like listening to her. Same sweet, innocent type girl, who has her own way of looking at life, talking and jumps to different subjects in the same short space of a thought. It is very difficult getting direct answers from her too-we take a long winding road instead of a short street in conversations. And she truly is the sweetest girl! Because Misty reminded me so much of her, I think I was subconsciously looking for it, or at least spotted it faster. But I honestly think Misty doesn't have anything more she can tell us.

Thank you for this. To further add to it, could you imagine a person with such incapabilities dabbling in drugs? I personally think it all adds up with her inconsistencies. I truly think she's scared to death. Maybe b/c she knows more, maybe negligence comes into play, maybe drugs were a factor, maybe somebody was over that shouldn't have been over, maybe it has something to do with family - there's alot of what-ifs and maybes. Maybe drugs were still in her system when she was initially interviewed by police. That could very well help to explain her inconsistencies...she knows she could do jail time, if so, especially if it had something to do with Haleigh's demise or abduction.

I am one of those people that do think drugs play a role in Haleigh's disappearance. I still think a very bad person "took" Haleigh. I don't think Misty murdered her. I think she'd have cracked by now if she had. And one more time - I believe it's been proven Ron was at work during the last time Haleigh was seen up until he got home. I believe Ron is innocent in the sense that he didn't hurt his child. The pictures of Ron & Haleigh show sooo much love between father & daughter. I don't think Misty is covering for Ron at all, although I did think that in the beginning...I definitely don't think that now.

One question remains at the back of my head - Why was Joe allowed to go back home? The PCSO had every opportunity to hold him. Afterall, the fact that he came to Florida was a parole/probation violation in and of itself...he wasn't allowed to leave the state without permission...literally...but he did anyway. Hmmm...

 

[KOOL LOOK]

I will estimate her IQ between 80 and 85. I read the note during the Tim Miller thing and watched the videos...the writing, context, verbal language skills. Between 80 and 85.

But let me just say, I have not evaluated her!

No, Misty would never score in the eighties. She's more in the low to high sixties. Which is where the spectrum of mild mental retardation is gaged up to the seventies, then if there's any mitigating other learning disorders/disabilities, throw in alcohol/drug abuse in gestation, then also low scoring intellectual parents, drives the diagnosis into the guidelines accepted by the medical profession. Social Security disability.

I guarantee the schools Misty attended noticed, tested and began series of tests, conferences with her parents, etc... Isn't this when Lisa was still doing strong drugs? She could have been legally held into account if it was determined as factors in Misty's condition. Which is why I conclude the Mother wanted her out of school, so these things wouldn't be discovered.

 

[Muffet]

No, Misty would never score in the eighties. She's more in the low to high sixties. Which is where the spectrum of mild mental retardation is gaged up to the seventies, then if there's any mitigating other learning disorders/disabilities, throw in alcohol/drug abuse in gestation, then also low scoring intellectual parents, drives the diagnosis into the guidelines accepted by the medical profession. Social Security disability.

I guarantee the schools Misty attended noticed, tested and began series of tests, conferences with her parents, etc... Isn't this when Lisa was still doing strong drugs? She could have been legally held into account if it was determined as factors in Misty's condition. Which is why I conclude the Mother wanted her out of school, so these things wouldn't be discovered.

For the record, I strongly disagree, and IMO, all of this line of thinking has gone so far off base, it's disturbing to see it pushed so relentlessly all of a sudden, especially with such conviction and unfounded assumption of authority.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

For the record, I strongly disagree, and IMO, all of this line of thinking has gone so far off base, it's disturbing to see it pushed so relentlessly all of a sudden, especially with such conviction and unfounded assumption of authority.

I don't think this was directed towards me but thought I'd lend a different point of view.

I'm not sure about everybody else, but I wish to make it clear from my point of view that in no way would I even begin to diagnose this girl. I'm not her physician, therefore I couldn't anyway. One cannot diagnose somebody just from seeing them on tv or reading their interviews, they can only speculate. That's why it's so misleading to the public when the media makes these so-called experts state their opinions on television. People in general look up to others that are in a position such as a psychiatrist or physician of some sort. Alot of us tend to take what they say as "fact" since they have the knowledge and degree to back that up, but since they are not the ones treating Misty, they really are treading a fine line there.

My posts regarding Misty relate to my take on her being uneducated, raised in a dysfunctional family, surrounded by drugs including being a user herself - and I wonder if that could have an impact on her statements. I just wanted to make that clear b/c I'm not completely sold on the idea that she is challenged in any other way besides being uneducated and a product of her environment. This could very well impact her rationale.

I stand by my first thought - that she could very well have been coming off a high when she was initially questioned. I personally believe she has info regarding Haleigh's disappearance, but I'm sort of thinking it's something in the back of her head rather than her direct involvement. Could she have been screwing around? Could she be telling the truth as she knows it but b/c she feels a different way inside, her analysis is "off"? Could she be lying directly but maybe want to tell the "truth" but hey - maybe she's afraid to b/c PCSO stated they'd prosecute if they found her statement to be untrue? I'm thinking that's why she's giving inaccurate statements...b/c she's afraid she may ultimately be held responsible. All I'm saying is that maybe PCSO should try a different tactic...no more, no less. They're obviously trying something different now and it seems to be working. I ask myself - Hmmm, why didn't they do this to begin with?

One more thing, if Cousin Joe was in Florida while on probation (or parole or something), why wasn't he arrested? Isn't that considered a violation? Doesn't matter if it's circumstantial or not...if they'd been following everything by the book since the beginning, then that guy would have been arrested plain & simple. I ask myself again, I wonder why (with all the rumors of drug use surrounding this child) - why wasn't a warrant obtained to drug test these individuals either before or directly after questioning? It doesn't make sense to me...at all.