2009.23.09 Nancy Grace

[weasel]

<<Someone care to explain why Crystal is the better parent for RJ if she let all these things happen and never did anything about it?>>

snipped

Couldn't agree with you more. With your entire post, actually.

 

[harleysnana]

why did dcf visit rc more than once? Why did they visit as recent as ron and misty dating? Its not routine in a custody case, nor do they just stop by for milk and cookies......someone had to have reported something.......jmooc

Just because someone reported something does not make it true!
DCF is REQUIRED by law to investigate ALL claims even if they are
bogus!

 

[gypsyblue]

Just because someone reported something does not make it true!
DCF is REQUIRED by law to investigate ALL claims even if they are
bogus!

..... anyway, my response was to a post that reports were never made.......

 

[badme102]

It's funny, I have 5 siblings (well 4 now), and we all have 21 children combined. Not ONE of us have ever had DCF involved in our lives. None of my friends, coworkers, family have ever been involved or subject to a DCF investigation--EVER.

That speak volumes to me about the families involved in this case. There is nothing "routine" about DCF.

Also, DCF has made several FATAL errors in state after state by leaving helpless children in the care of people whose allegations of abuse were "unfounded"

IMO, people might try to start looking at the MAJOR mistakes that DCF made in this case, rather than LE, who IMO, are doing a stellar job...

 

[CHICANA]

It's funny, I have 5 siblings (well 4 now), and we all have 21 children combined. Not ONE of us have ever had DCF involved in our lives. None of my friends, coworkers, family have ever been involved or subject to a DCF investigation--EVER.

That speak volumes to me about the families involved in this case. There is nothing "routine" about DCF.

Also, DCF has made several FATAL errors in state after state by leaving helpless children in the care of people whose allegations of abuse were "unfounded"

IMO, people might try to start looking at the MAJOR mistakes that DCF made in this case, rather than LE, who IMO, are doing a stellar job...

I agree to a degree.
There are good people who have scandalous family members. A friend of mine who IMO is a very good mother has had DCF at her house a few times. Every time one of her sisters got mad at her they'd call the hotline. The complaints were all unsubstantiated. The thing is, her sisters are who I consider the crappy parents. They're involved in drugs, have creepy boyfriends that spend the night and pawn their kids off whenever they can. She moved and didn't tell them where she was, and there have been no DCF visits in over a year.
Too bad we can't choose our family.

 

[elle1919]

~bbm~ there....i think you answered your own question....this whole conversation is based on you saying nothing was ever reported to dcf...........jmooc

My goodness, No this whole conversation was not about reports being made to DCF. Please do not put words in my mouth. The point of my posts was to bring attention to the fact that there are others that are responsible for the care of Haleigh and RJ. Regardless of the fact that Ronald had custody of the children. if there were things going on in that household that were of concern why weren't they reported to authorities? Why wasn't anyone intervening before a child came up missing and since they were searching for her in a pond I don't think police believe she is alive.

 

[elle1919]

..... anyway, my response was to a post that reports were never made.......

I responded to you. I did not say that reports were never made. I stated that reports were made and investigated and returned unfounded.

It is obvious to me that you missed the point of my post entirely. If you think that neither Ronald nor Crystal are suitable acceptable parents then it really would not make sense for you to think I was posting to convince you of anything. I am sorry if you were confused.

 

[elle1919]

Again the point of my earlier post was to point out ......apparently in a way that no-one understood.....that others were responsible for the lives of Haleigh and RJ. Not, just Ronald and TN and GGS.

 

[cajun]

Again the point of my earlier post was to point out ......apparently in a way that no-one understood.....that others were responsible for the lives of Haleigh and RJ. Not, just Ronald and TN and GGS.

Plus, if Crystal was so worried about Jr. being with his daddy and feared for him, why hasn't she filed for custody since Feb.?

 

[Flossie JMO]

Plus, if Crystal was so worried about Jr. being with his daddy and feared for him, why hasn't she filed for custody since Feb.?

and why say he is a good Dad and wouldn't hurt the children?

 

[elle1919]

Plus, if Crystal was so worried about Jr. being with his daddy and feared for him, why hasn't she filed for custody since Feb.?

I don't think that Crystal is worried that RJ is safe. She would have went to the courts and filed for custody if she was afraid for her son.

 

[atherella]

Maybe the answer is that Crystal did not feel that Haleigh and RJ were in danger with Ronald? Perhaps Ronald was a good father and Crystal knew that.

Just like Crystal said - Yes - he's a good father.

BBM

VAN SUSTEREN: He's hurting. He is a good father, isn't he?

SHEFFIELD: Yes. He loves Haleigh. I know Haleigh is his heart, and I do not think he hurt her.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,502766,00.html

 

[kiki the parrot]

Hello friend... and what I am seeing is equally troubling to me, the not too subtle shifting of blame... while professing to be uniquely ones who avoid taking sides... w added emotional burdens, ("if only you cared for Haleigh as I do..."?) W/e our differences I remain firmly convinced that nearly everyone here carries Haleigh in their hearts, in their waking thoughts, their haunted dreams, their tearful prayers....
rayer:
I believe had RC not fought so insistently, using what many--including myself--feel were deceptive and underhanded tactics to gain custody of Haleigh in the first place... ie pointing the finger at the children's mother making baseless accusations of drugs, how unfit she was, how unsafe and detrimental to the children her environment would be... all while knowing in reality he's the one who is still paying off drug fines when rearrested on still further drug charges etc, perhaps it wouldn't now be such a bitter pill to swallow. But to then, when the outcome proves tragic for Haleigh to simultaneously fault Crystal and Marie for not being privy to the activities and conditions he has so clearly sought to conceal, and to hold them equally responsible when it is from RC's 'safer' watch that Haleigh 'vanished' and may be now gone from her life forever... is, well, simply beyond comprehensible to me.

Yes failed beyond measure or amends, you have quite a way w words yourself, elle. DCF/CPS is a fallible, manmade system--and hindsight is 20/20. They can and frequently do make mistakes--as do the courts--particularly where a concerted effort is launched to obtain or maintain custody. Parents living separately unfortunately are not always amicable, let alone transparent, w one another, and in the real world won't always conduct themselves w maturity or integrity. From what we hear RC has been immature and controlling to the point of blocking her car eg, not returning children at Crystal's scheduled time, and insisted upon neutral meeting places for "handing off" the children eg... No, from all we've heard, it doesn't sound like RC was throwing open wide the door inviting Crystal and her mother into the home... and some grandparents (esp when estranged from eachother) may not even be involved in their grandchildrens' lives nor does that have any bearing or relevance on what Crystal can be expected to have known. She may have had suspicions, and taken initial steps and in the face of his angry persistent denials she may also have felt she could never win when up against RC, or just prayed for some shred of peace in her childrens' lives. But RC certainly wasn't going to be forthcoming. And her children were young, elle, barely able to even understand much less articulate the activities of their father or the conditions under which they were living yet still you demand an explanation for why she didn't know all of this...
:waitasec:
...and furthermore for why she didn't have the emotional, financial, and legal resources, ability, fortitude or tenacity to overcome his shrewd, duplicitous and IMO contemptuous actions. I've only attempted to provide the "serious" answers you say you want, hopefully this provides a satisfactory explanation. I think donjeta and stilettos both spoke to these issues. You don't need "wading boots," only a little wisdom and discernment. LORD PLEASE order the steps of the investigation, as you direct the path of the detectives and those searching, let Haleigh finally be found, the person/s responsible brought to swift justice, and Junior carried from the chaos to the security of a safer, more stable, home. JMO
rayer:
arrot:

 

[Flossie JMO]

Just like Crystal said - Yes - he's a good father.

BBM

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,502766,00.html

I believed her when she said that.

 

[YellowSubmarine]

Just like Crystal said - Yes - he's a good father.

Before I comment, I just want to say I am on the fence over who I think is involved and cannot say whether I think RC or MC did anything more than trying to cover up something.

With that said, after all we've heard, I don't know how anyone could say RC was a good father. I'm sure he does love Haleigh and Jr, but with all the drugs, guns, violence and total dysfunction surrounding this family, I don't see one person fit to have taken care of those children.

 

[sleepingheart]

Hello friend... and what I am seeing is equally troubling to me, the not too subtle shifting of blame... while professing to be uniquely ones who avoid taking sides... w added emotional burdens, "if only you cared for Haleigh as I do..." (?) W/e our differences I remain firmly convinced that everyone here carries Haleigh in their heart :heart: in their waking thoughts, their haunted dreams, their tearful prayers....
rayer:
I believe had RC not fought so hard, and used what many--including myself--feel were deceptive or underhanded tactics to gain custody of Haleigh in the first place... ie pointing the finger at the children's mother, making baseless accusations of drugs and how unfit she and that environment would be... all while knowing he's the one in reality still paying off fines when rearrested on still further drug charges, maybe it wouldn't be such a bitter pill to swallow. But to then simultaneously fault Crystal and Marie for not being privy to the activities and conditions he has clearly sought to conceal and to hold them equally responsible when it is from RC's 'safer' watch that Haleigh 'vanished' is simply beyond comprehensible to me.

Yes failed beyond measure or amends, you have quite a way w words yourself, elle. DCF/CPS is a fallible, manmade system--and hindsight is 20/20. They can and frequently do make mistakes--as do the courts--particularly where a concerted effort is launched to obtain or maintain custody. Parents living separately unfortunately are not always amicable nor transparent w one another, and in the real world they don't always conduct themselves w maturity or integrity. From what we hear RC was controlling to the point of blocking her car eg, not returning children at Crystal's scheduled time, even insisting upon neutral meeting places etc... From all we've heard, it doesn't sound like RC was throwing open the door inviting Crystal and her mother into the home... and some grandparents (esp when grandparents are estranged from eachother) may not even be involved in their grandchildrens' lives nor does it have bearing or relevance on what Crystal can be expected to have known. She may have had suspicions, she may have felt she could not win. But RC wasn't going to be forthcoming and her children were young, barely able for most of those years to even understand much less articulate the activities of their father or the conditions under which they were living and still you demand an explanation for why she didn't know all of this...
:waitasec:
...and furthermore to know why she didn't have the emotional, financial, and legal resources or tenacity to overcome his shrewd duplicitous contemptuous actions. I have only attempted to provide the "serious" answers you say you want, hopefully this provides a satisfactory explanation. I think donjeta and stilettos both spoke to these issues. You don't need "wading boots," only wisdom and discernment. LORD PLEASE order the steps of the investigation, direct the path of the detectives and those searching, let Haleigh finally be found, the person/s responsible brought to swift justice, and Junior carried from the chaos to the security of a safer, more stable, home. rayer: JMO

arrot:

I agree with your post 100%. I feel this is what some of us wanted to say, but could never put into words as beautifully as you just did...You're a genius, so you get to wear this for the day :gold_crown:....on second thought, just keep it forever.

 

[Flossie JMO]

Before I comment, I just want to say I am on the fence over who I think is involved and cannot say whether I think RC or MC did anything more than trying to cover up something.

With that said, after all we've heard, I don't know how anyone could say RC was a good father. I'm sure he does love Haleigh and Jr, but with all the drugs, guns, violence and total dysfunction surrounding this family, I don't see one person fit to have taken care of those children.

bbm I haven't seen anything that indicates he is not a good father, I feel for him, he was basically a single parent imo

 

[stilettos]

At this point....if his drug record, violent assaults, accused ratgate crimes, lies and threats of violence are not enough to convince some that Ronald Cummings is not Father of the year material.....they will never be convinced...even if he is convicted of a murder. There will always be excuses for his behavior. I choose not to defend, support, associate and otherwise endorse those with such behaviors...but that is just me.

He did not even care enough about his children's safety on the night in question. After he had left them with a drug addled teen...he could not even reach her....not knowing where his children and sitter were....or how they were...he worked late and went on a beer run. Concern for his children is not evident in Ronald L. Cummings behavior.

 

[gypsyblue]

My goodness, No this whole conversation was not about reports being made to DCF. Please do not put words in my mouth. The point of my posts was to bring attention to the fact that there are others that are responsible for the care of Haleigh and RJ. Regardless of the fact that Ronald had custody of the children. if there were things going on in that household that were of concern why weren't they reported to authorities? Why wasn't anyone intervening before a child came up missing and since they were searching for her in a pond I don't think police believe she is alive.

elle1919
I responded to you. I did not say that reports were never made. I stated that reports were made and investigated and returned unfounded.

It is obvious to me that you missed the point of my post entirely. If you think that neither Ronald nor Crystal are suitable acceptable parents then it really would not make sense for you to think I was posting to convince you of anything. I am sorry if you were confused.

yeppers, I am.... but I give..............

 

[snookie]

The same people who call Crystal a liar are the same ones who believe her when she says Ron's a good daddy.