2011.06.07 Sidebar (Trial Day Twelve)

[gngr~snap]

*RANT ON:
When is someone going to tell the talking heads the Anthony's used Baquacil NOT chlorine in their pool?
Just goes to show how little they REALLY investigate before reporting!!!
*RANT OFF.

 

[egnarts]

I just noticed the large umbrella there at the alert spot. I wonder if that area was chosen to lay Caylee's body so that the umbrella could be opened for privacy from all the neighbors' windows.

In reference to this photo, do we know where that darned root was dug up?

 

[kantoo]

thanks everyone for all the great posts this afternoon while i was out :rocker:

i just learned something from Jean C on HLN a bit ago

she said that FL had recently ruled that there could be a mistrial hinging on searches with dogs....that explains why they spent sooooo much time on the dog training etc this am. i thought they just did that because they knew JB was really comin' after them on that.

Blessings to Forgey and Gerus....Caylee would thank you if she could

 

[katydid23]

I thought the dogs had their own little place to pee and poop, I'm sure Cindy didn't let them have access to Caylee's area, that's just not cindy, she would never allow dog poop near Caylee.

They may have their own place to pee and poop, but I do not see any fences or barriers that would keep them from running loose in the backyard. And Yorkies are companion dogs, and would follow Cindy anywhere she went, imo.

 

[6Cinder1ella2011]

the fluid of a decomposed body is what a trained K-9 is smelling for. Irregardless if / where / how whomsoever did or did not end precious Cayless's♥ ♥ life the scent is what happened when a human body is left exposed-to the elements, as in weather out of shelter and then another big facet is that Caylee having not yet celebrated her third birthday was a toddler-Paediatric specialty which would make for findings not consistent with an adult found out in a pet cemetery that had not evacuated their products of digestion in two weeks. The scent of a toddler is - unique, in life and as this evidence is depicting the scent was detected.

All harsh chemicals should not be discarded indiscriminately where a child might sit or play: down the san-sewer. Rolling in chemicals can make anyone sneeze, let alone get their tail feathers on high alert

 

[Capri]

I didnt hear him say the dog was not properly trained.

I heard him question how does one know if a hit is false if nothing is found? The answer can only be one , You dont.

And that was all he needed.

I dont believe his was trying to imply the dog was not trained. He was trying to imply the car hit was false and laying a road for the jury to question. A better lawyer may have been able to pull off the tactic ,it would of course take someone who isnt as baez as Jose is.

This morning started out well for Jose. He was nice to the witness and polite.

The state setting up all the ground work for the video was over kill IMO. I think to the jury the state might seem over eager to shut Baez up. At one point this morning LKB seems to almost fall on the desk when objecting to something. The SA has stopped Baez from asking or getting some very interesting answers and I dont think that reflects well for them sometimes.
They have the benefit of public trust and information that makes since and can pretty much lay out whatever they want so to the jury it might seems as they are limiting what Baez can say on purpose,and I have been watching Baez use that "defeated " act to his advantage. He stages something he knows will lead to an objection when the questions get interesting and then he will rephase it improper a few times and quit and sit down. Leaving the jury wondering why he wasnt allowed to ask that and why the state wouldnt let him ask. All my opinion.

BBM: Oh, you mean when he pouts? Not to worry, any juror who's seen pouting kids will recognize it. It looks funny on a grown man, but they'll recognize it.

 

[Mohabi]

:welcome: egnarts :greetings:

Good post. I think it's very possible decomp residue like vac water got into the ground. I also can see how Caylee was placed out there the day ICA borrowed the shovel.

Personally, I do not believe Caylee drown in the pool.

This whole body moving is reminding me of a movie.... what was that movie where they kept dragging their uncle's body around....?

The thought that ICA kept moving Caylee from place to place is making ME crazy. How can a human being DO that (to begin with) and do it to the dead body of her own child? I don't even think she was frantic; I think she just was annoyed because this chore was such a WASTE of her time. Do I put her here? No. Do I put her there? No. Who knows how many places she tried to dump the body during the days she had it in the trunk.

I drove around this last weekend, looking for a spot where I could park, unseen, long enough to "unload" an imaginary "something" in my trunk. I did this very early in the morning, right about dawn. I could not find a spot where someone would not have seen my car or my actions. People stop here when you park at a roadside in the early morning hours (or late night hours), asking whether you need help. It freaked me out because after all I didn't want to become a victim myself!

I went on a stretch of highway bordered by woods. You'd think people are still sleeping at 5:30 am, but SURPRISE, SURPRISE.... that highway was full of cars.

I went to a commuter parking lot a bit off the highway. There were TWO cars on it, both had people in it. You couldn't have thrown anything out of the window without being observed. I got really nervous just imagining that I had to get rid of something. Whatever else it takes to get rid of a body, it definitely takes NERVES OF STEEL.

I'm surprised ICA wasn't seen when she dumped the body in the woods so close to home.

 

[mombomb]

Did anyone pick up on Deputy Forgey's testimony about the bio-hazards in the forensics bay next to where the car was? I think that is something JB should have known about when questioning Bloise, Vincent and Dr. Voss about the air samples? I'm sure they would have stated that it would have been handled in the control sample of the garage air, but still, it kind of makes you wonder KWIM?

 

[txsvicki]

Is the state falling down on the job? I thought yesterday that they let Vaas's testimony get too confusing as to whether he was talking about actual carpet or air. Then today, Jane Velez Mitchell said it got very confusing. She said that when the FBI guy said there weren't shocking levels of chloroform he was actually talking about the fabric of the trunk liner. She said she had to refer to her notes, that the jurors weren't taking notes, and that the state did NOT make it clear to jurors.

 

[Phoebeb]

They may have their own place to pee and poop, but I do not see any fences or barriers that would keep them from running loose in the backyard. And Yorkies are companion dogs, and would follow Cindy anywhere she went, imo.

Yes, not many Yorkie cadaver/working dogs around. :floorlaugh:
I do remember the video of Caylee's 2nd birthday party and the 2 Yorkies running freely.

 

[Themis]

*RANT ON:
When is someone going to tell the talking heads the Anthony's used Baquacil NOT chlorine in their pool?
Just goes to show how little they REALLY investigate before reporting!!!
*RANT OFF.

Let's emphasize this again so if they are reading here they will "get it." That probably rules out pool water as a source of the chloroform.

 

[mombomb]

This whole body moving is reminding me of a movie.... what was that movie where they kept dragging their uncle's body around....?

Weekend with Bernie

 

[milliac]

We've got the second dog handler tomorrow, and the computer forensics.

Then, I think the state will go into the searches by TES, putting Tim Miller on the witness stand and perhaps some TES searchers.

I think the last part of the state's case will pertain to Roy Kronk finding Caylee's remains, the forensic team recovering the remains, Dr. G, and the bug and botany experts.

This morning I tried to think of what witnesses we haven't heard from yet, and there's a lot. We've yet to hear from John Allen and Appy Wells, Jesse Grund, Richard Grund, Shirley Plesea, Annie Dowling, Kiomarie Cruz, Tim Miller, Dominic Casey, Jim Hoover, etc.

Where could we find a list of the current prosecution and defense witness lists?

 

[Scamperoo]

I didnt hear him say the dog was not properly trained.

I heard him question how does one know if a hit is false if nothing is found? The answer can only be one , You dont.

And that was all he needed.

I dont believe his was trying to imply the dog was not trained. He was trying to imply the car hit was false and laying a road for the jury to question. A better lawyer may have been able to pull off the tactic ,it would of course take someone who isnt as baez as Jose is.

This morning started out well for Jose. He was nice to the witness and polite.

The state setting up all the ground work for the video was over kill IMO. I think to the jury the state might seem over eager to shut Baez up. At one point this morning LKB seems to almost fall on the desk when objecting to something. The SA has stopped Baez from asking or getting some very interesting answers and I dont think that reflects well for them sometimes.
They have the benefit of public trust and information that makes since and can pretty much lay out whatever they want so to the jury it might seems as they are limiting what Baez can say on purpose,and I have been watching Baez use that "defeated " act to his advantage. He stages something he knows will lead to an objection when the questions get interesting and then he will rephase it improper a few times and quit and sit down. Leaving the jury wondering why he wasnt allowed to ask that and why the state wouldnt let him ask. All my opinion.

This is not correct, one could also say "so how do you know" to just about any question and elicit a similar response, training and experience make for a "beyond reasonable doubt scenario", this, added to the police officers opinion on the smell just about nailed it. The problem is you can't just brush aside all the evidence because it doesn't fit your own hypothesis. Sometimes when the evidence is overwhelming as to there being a dead body in the car, you minimize it, or don't engage it at all and move on.

As to the rest, well that's vice versa the are both employing the same tricks but the state is doing it better. JMO

 

[Mountain_Kat]

In reference to this photo, do we know where that darned root was dug up?

I don't believe there ever was a root.

I'm wondering about the pavers used to "floor" the playhouse. No real theory, just curiousity. Were those moved? Did they appear disturbed to LE?

 

[katydid23]

Maybe so katydid..I have had terriers..and snoop, bark and scratch..although had full run of backyard. So do agree with you on a certain level..

Seeing the Anthony Furbabies..they were very small, ( Yorkies I think) and for some reason I just cant imagine they allowed them free run of their backyard...in fact I have known these small little dogs (4-7 lbs) are often trained to do their business in a "Litter Box"..Of course and as I said I am only speculating..but doubt very much these pups ever got close to that area of the yard...

Those K-9 dogs proved to me that Caylee had been in that yard long enough to leave residue decomp odour/scent..not just her death..decomp residue doesnt occur immediately to leave enough for any cadaver dog to hit on..at least from what I recall..and GEORGE would neveer have stashed her back there either....Yikes this must be so heart breaking for both CA and GA to hear!!

I don't see any fences or restrictive barriers in that little yard anywhere. And yorkies tend to follow their owners whenever possible, imo. But IDK foir sure.

I don't think that poor baby was left in that yard very long. I think Casey was too afraid of Cindy to do that. But if the body was taken from the trunk after a day or two, to bag her up and wrap it up, then that would leave the decomp
residue for the dogs to hit on. imoo

 

[Themis]

This whole body moving is reminding me of a movie.... what was that movie where they kept dragging their uncle's body around....?

The thought that ICA kept moving Caylee from place to place is making ME crazy. How can a human being DO that (to begin with) and do it to the dead body of her own child? I don't even think she was frantic; I think she just was annoyed because this chore was such a WASTE of her time. Do I put her here? No. Do I put her there? No. Who knows how many places she tried to dump the body during the days she had it in the trunk.

I drove around this last weekend, looking for a spot where I could park, unseen, long enough to "unload" an imaginary "something" in my trunk. I did this very early in the morning, right about dawn. I could not find a spot where someone would not have seen my car or my actions. People stop here when you park at a roadside in the early morning hours (or late night hours), asking whether you need help. It freaked me out because after all I didn't want to become a victim myself!

I went on a stretch of highway bordered by woods. You'd think people are still sleeping at 5:30 am, but SURPRISE, SURPRISE.... that highway was full of cars.

I went to a commuter parking lot a bit off the highway. There were TWO cars on it, both had people in it. You couldn't have thrown anything out of the window without being observed. I got really nervous just imagining that I had to get rid of something. Whatever else it takes to get rid of a body, it definitely takes NERVES OF STEEL.

I'm surprised ICA wasn't seen when she dumped the body in the woods so close to home.

You also just shot a big hole in the DT theory that RK could have done it without being seen.

 

[miabellamoure]

They may have their own place to pee and poop, but I do not see any fences or barriers that would keep them from running loose in the backyard. And Yorkies are companion dogs, and would follow Cindy anywhere she went, imo.

bbm

I have three...and they don't call them velcro dogs for nothing...lol!

 

[3doglady]

*RANT ON:
When is someone going to tell the talking heads the Anthony's used Baquacil NOT chlorine in their pool?
Just goes to show how little they REALLY investigate before reporting!!!
*RANT OFF.

Do you know how it was discovered that the A's use Baqaucil? Was it on the search warrant list or did someone state it in a depo? I can't remember. TIA

 

[6Cinder1ella2011]

in the breed of the animal, the K-9 has specific behavioural clues that if you are aware it is in the dogs (DNA) genetic make up- that is like a siren. 1 example: a pure breed labrador retiever dog will mark/select the spot where they intend to ly dow, They will go around it in a very short circumference one or twice and they will ly down. They do that because at the beginning of the breed line they were incredible at working with game hunters and they would have to ly down, hence when in tall grass they would go in a small circle to smoosh the grass down and lay on the loft.

I would trust a dog and the K 9 handler was spot on