4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #86

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So did I read correctly that state prosecutors want to force BK to submit an official alibi before the trial date or forfeit the right to use one at all?

In response to his defense team seemingly saying in their filing that they’ll be using alibi by inference or “alibi on the fly” (quotes mine).
 
Boxer said:
Agree, this is why I don't think the DP is appropriate. Defenses are too uneven.
MOO box them up without parole and let nature fulfill the DP
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MOO, there are a host of issues, wrangling, and other considerations with a DP case which is why I said upthread that imo, that there is a better than 50% chance that it may eventually be withdrawn and taken off the table. We don't know yet. Time will tell. But he(Bill Thompson) had to file his notice of intent or the state would have lost their right to seek it should they decide to go through with it. There are multiple aggravating factors here imo.

jmo
 
schooling said:
So did I read correctly that state prosecutors want to force BK to submit an official alibi before the trial date or forfeit the right to use one at all?

In response to his defense team seemingly saying in their filing that they’ll be using alibi by inference or “alibi on the fly” (quotes mine).
Click to expand...
Not force I think. What's going on is instead of just letting the deadline pass, the D responded to the alibi demand but with an 'alibi' that is out of line with what is required under ICRs; the response is extremely ambiguous, it says almost nothing and ignores the ICRs; and this, after an extension of time was requested, stipulated to and granted. It's extremely underhand Imo.

To me, the state is taking the position that the D's response is the D filing a notice of intention to bring a defense of alibi. That is the best thing to do Imo -given the ambiguous and underhand response to the State's demand on the day that the Notice was due.. D may be trying to get alibi witnesses in but avoid the time limits for doing so. Moo.

The State is taking the response as a notice of alibi defense. The response was lodged on the deadline for the D to produce the notice of alibi. Right move by the state, Imo. Therefore state are simply pointing out notice of Alibi is deficient on every level possible. The state is saying 1) either do this properly within 10 days (yet another time concession!) or 2) Judge - make a ruling that will exclude D calling future witnesses to use for alibi with inappropriate/illegal notice to the state (alibi ambush). The state is demanding clarity of this ambiguous Notice of 'Alibi'. Moo

EBM sentence in para 2.
EBM spelling
 
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kittythehare said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1684958245218050049
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I don't think it's going to be bad for the prosecution. They have built a solid case, much of which I don't think we even know about yet. What exactly can they even get thrown out? Nothing I know of. Heaven forbid Judge Tripps rules against the GJ indictment, the Prosecution can just turn around and impanel another one, Or a PH. BK isn't going anywhere.

BK has no alibi because he was right on King Street committing these murders. They can spin the cell data, the car identification and GGI all they want, but the evidence is going to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he is the killer. The GGI doesn't have squat to do with the STR DNA evidence found that proved BK was the likely contributor 5+ octillion times any other individual.

Why in the h e l l was BK disposing of garbage (evidence) in zip loc baggies in a neighbors garbage can at 3 am in stealth mode? I believe he was dismantling and disposing of the hard drives and or phones he brought back from WA.

No, the Defense is arguing and they have the most theatrical, bloviating Attorney in Logsdon to do so, it's their jobs. But in the end, a jury of 12 peers are going to find BK guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. I have faith in Bill Thompson & Company.

ALL MOO
 
girlhasnoname said:
I don't think it's going to be bad for the prosecution. They have built a solid case, much of which I don't think we even know about yet. What exactly can they even get thrown out? Nothing I know of. Heaven forbid Judge Tripps rules against the GJ indictment, the Prosecution can just turn around and impanel another one, Or a PH. BK isn't going anywhere.

BK has no alibi because he was right on King Street committing these murders. They can spin the cell data, the car identification and GGI all they want, but the evidence is going to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he is the killer. The GGI doesn't have squat to do with the STR DNA evidence found that proved BK was the likely contributor 5+ octillion times any other individual.

Why in the h e l l was BK disposing of garbage (evidence) in zip loc baggies in a neighbors garbage can at 3 am in stealth mode? I believe he was dismantling and disposing of the hard drives and or phones he brought back from WA.

No, the Defense is arguing and they have the most theatrical, bloviating Attorney in Logsdon to do so, it's their jobs. But in the end, a jury of 12 peers are going to find BK guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. I have faith in Bill Thompson & Company.

ALL MOO
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it feels totally outrageous to me.. the GG 'beyond every shadow of a doubt' is simply NOT a thing.

They're not doing their precious client any favours here.

What next? Self defence?
 
In my experience citizens do not realize what a big deal GJ is. It is a big deal and they are really who determines whether a case goes forward or not. In my lifetime I have seen where a case was pretty airtight but the GJ would not let it go forward. They essentially look to see if someone can be convicted or not. I think the delay and timing of having the GJ probably hurt this case. However lady justice will have her way. Not saying that BK is super intelligent, but he knows much about the system and how it works. Sad.....
 
di anna said:
In my experience citizens do not realize what a big deal GJ is. It is a big deal and they are really who determines whether a case goes forward or not. In my lifetime I have seen where a case was pretty airtight but the GJ would not let it go forward. They essentially look to see if someone can be convicted or not. I think the delay and timing of having the GJ probably hurt this case. However lady justice will have her way. Not saying that BK is super intelligent, but he knows much about the system and how it works. Sad.....
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I dunno. The famous saying is that “a grand jury would indict a ham sandwich.” That being said, I have every confidence this case will be rock solid.
 
Fika said:
Alibi? Now? A bit late for that isn’t it?
If you are arrested, locked in awaiting trial, your face and name spread across the world as a murderer you bet having an actual alibi would be the first thing you show the police. You would be screaming from rooftops about being somewhere else when first arrested.
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Absolutely NOT! Alibi's should never, ever be given to anyone except your lawyer. They only come into play if needed and then in such a way as to inflict the greatest damage on the prosecution. The reason for this, is the chances of a prosecutor walking back an indictment are incredibly low. 90% of criminal cases end in some form of plea bargain, 8% end with dismissal, and 2% go to a jury verdict. To get a prosecutor to dismiss a charge, they have to absolutely believe that the facts and circumstances warrant it and that means the prosecutor must believe there is no chance of conviction. One thing a prosecutor might do to avoid dismissal, is reduce a charge in order to get a guilty plea. In this case, I'm not sure what will happen.
 
kittythehare said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1684958245218050049
Click to expand...
Tantamount to billable hours.

Motion printed on wet tissue paper.

It won't hold up. It can't hold up.

But he's getting the best defense possible. They're doing their homework, giving him every possible advantage, just none of it is demonstrative substantiative.

Ask for an alibi extension, then fail to proffer one, suggesting they'll backdoor one in, during the trial itself...

Get used to the language though. At trial, once the prosecution and defense rest, you'll hear them ask again for dismissal. Never mind the overwhelming trail of evidence meeting and exceeding BARD.

They gotta ask. Defense Lawyering in 101.

The defendant IS protected by the Constitution. Presumed innocent. Will be able to present before a jury of his peers. Will have a rigorous defense, which we are seeing.

And he'll be judged by sworn jurors who have listened to and reviewed the evidence in this case.

And THAT is how justice works.

JMO
 
girlhasnoname said:
I think the Defense is using these motions for some pre trial favorable publicity for their client. "Tragic and Unconstitutional"..drama much?

MOO
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Unless BK can prove without a shadow of a doubt with a strong albi, I don't believe he can explain away his car, cellphone, and DNA on a knife sheath found next to or under a murder victim. Good luck with that. this is a just case.
What's tragic is that someone, BK, murdered 4 young, innocent college students in the middle of the night taken off guard without any ability to defend themselves, now that's the real tragedy.
 
Balthazar said:
Absolutely NOT! Alibi's should never, ever be given to anyone except your lawyer. They only come into play if needed and then in such a way as to inflict the greatest damage on the prosecution. The reason for this, is the chances of a prosecutor walking back an indictment are incredibly low. 90% of criminal cases end in some form of plea bargain, 8% end with dismissal, and 2% go to a jury verdict. To get a prosecutor to dismiss a charge, they have to absolutely believe that the facts and circumstances warrant it and that means the prosecutor must believe there is no chance of conviction. One thing a prosecutor might do to avoid dismissal, is reduce a charge in order to get a guilty plea. In this case, I'm not sure what will happen.
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If the defense is going to bring an alibi defense in accordance with ICRs they are not allowed to ambush the state so that it has no time to counter.Moo

ETA: though I think the D's response re notice of Alibi after having used up it's extension of time probably indicates the defendant has no alibi. The response and ICRS are posted up thread.

Moo
 
jepop said:
Not force I think. What's going on is instead of just letting the deadline pass, the D responded to the alibi demand but with an 'alibi' that is out of line with what is required under ICRs; the response is extremely ambiguous, it says almost nothing and ignores the ICRs; and this, after an extension of time was requested, stipulated to and granted. It's extremely underhand Imo.

To me, the state is taking the position that the D's response is the D filing a notice of intention to bring a defense of alibi. That is the best thing to do Imo -given the ambiguous and underhand response to the State's demand on the day that the Notice was due.. D may be trying to get alibi witnesses in but avoid the time limits for doing so. Moo.

The State is taking the response as a notice of alibi defense. The response was lodged on the deadline for the D to produce the notice of alibi. Right move by the state, Imo. Therefore state are simply pointing out notice of Alibi is deficient on every level possible. The state is saying 1) either do this properly within 10 days (yet another time concession!) or 2) Judge - make a ruling that will exclude D calling future witnesses to use for alibi with inappropriate/illegal notice to the state (alibi ambush). The state is demanding clarity of this ambiguous Notice of 'Alibi'. Moo

EBM sentence in para 2.
EBM spelling
Click to expand...
Excellent. Thank you, underhanded is the right description.
" "I have an alibi" alibi" "
Right.
 
kittythehare said:
it feels totally outrageous to me.. the GG 'beyond every shadow of a doubt' is simply NOT a thing.

They're not doing their precious client any favours here.

What next? Self defence?
Click to expand...

That's what I thought... otherwise we have 2 trials... Trial 1 - the Grand Jury, Trial 2 - the public jury trial. Both with the standard of guilty within reasonable doubt.. But it can't be because the GJ is one sided.. just the prosecutor and evidence. No defense, right?

That's not the way it was drawn up.
 
Balthazar said:
Absolutely NOT! Alibi's should never, ever be given to anyone except your lawyer. They only come into play if needed and then in such a way as to inflict the greatest damage on the prosecution. The reason for this, is the chances of a prosecutor walking back an indictment are incredibly low. 90% of criminal cases end in some form of plea bargain, 8% end with dismissal, and 2% go to a jury verdict. To get a prosecutor to dismiss a charge, they have to absolutely believe that the facts and circumstances warrant it and that means the prosecutor must believe there is no chance of conviction. One thing a prosecutor might do to avoid dismissal, is reduce a charge in order to get a guilty plea. In this case, I'm not sure what will happen.
Click to expand...
So you're saying someone who is arrested for a mass murder who knows he is innocent,
And has a provable alibi like " I was at my sister's with lots of others who can vouch for me"--
So that person would rather sit in jail for months while his attorney plays games by filing
Motions?
 
This defense fancy dance around the alibi MOO means there is no alibi, but AT trying to keep the door open should they happen to "find" one.

Also, like standing silent, an AT tactic as we have seen, avoids saying out loud the words
"We have no alibi."
 
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