4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #95

[schooling]

Good time to express my belief (MOO) that if there is 1 or 2 holdouts resulting in a mistrial prosecutors will likely try BK again and again until they get a guilty verdict.

The current record is 6 retrials until a conviction. I bet Moscow prosecutors are looking to break it if they have to (they won’t have to). Eventually they’ll get a full jury to vote Guilty. For the record IMO it will be on try 1. I think the chances of a full jury voting Not Guilty is 0.0%.

This is all MOO according to the case that I’ve seen so far from public reporting. BK is entitled to all of the protections under the law and I am entitled to my opinion.

 

[maskedwoman]

My interpretation differs. MOO. I thought Sy Ray was only trying to get the prosecution to turn over more data. 1) Seems if you want something, you better tell them they benefit by turning it over. 2) Sy is running a business. He has a financial interest to get more data for analysis. No more data, limits what he can do/say. 3) Also, one of the keys for me was how he claims the data is piecemeal, missing data; yet, he has enough to know it is "incredibly inaccurate." What? Is that because the data is not showing him at the park watching the moon and stars? He made these statements because he wanted the data during the crime (when his phone was presumably turned off or something) and didn't get it. Again MOO. I look forward to seeing how this plays out in the trial.

From article: Cellphone expert testifies missing data benefits University of Idaho murder suspect "Because of the piecemealing of the data, because of the missing data, because of the data I'm reviewing that is incredibly inaccurate, everything that is missing is absolutely in benefit of the defense right now," Ray testified, adding, "There are other reports that are missing that I can't tell you are benefiting of Mr. Kohberger or the state."

His statement sounds both illogical and reaching to me. No one can possibly know if everything that's missing is "absolutely in benefit of the defense". And then Ray goes on to say there are other things missing that he can't tell who they benefit. My answer to that is DUH. No one can't tell who missing data benefits until you see it. MOOooo

 

[PinkParis2052]

Yah, it can get confusing. Those lies from the Pennsylvania inmates and the lie from the British tabloid that the housemate BF saw a naked man run out of the house.

This happens especially in the beginning of these types of cases and so I consider the source. Often a suspicious article says the info is from a source but the more reliable ones give names of the sources. I learned this on WS

I knew that it was a lie from the British tabloid that the BF saw a naked man ran out of the house wasn't true because they said that it was in the Affidavit to subpoena BF, but I haven't seen the unsealed version of it myself. I know that there are some people out there that have claimed to see the unsealed version of it but I've been waiting to see that unsealed version and I'm still waiting. So I knew it wasn't true about what that British tabloid claimed that BF saw a naked man and it came out after a youtuber had saw body cam a naked man running from a house that was near 1122 King Rd earlier this year.

 

[Megnut]

I think BK had one target and killed the other three because essentially they were witnesses. DM would have met the same fate, but for all the reasons upthread, he just didn't see her. Or rather, it didn't register in his brain immediately and may have been what contributed to his rapid vehicle exit.

I wonder if there's any indication or gap in time whereby he returned to the house, within the next spurt of time, in search of his sheath.

Without one, it would seem that knife would cut through anything, no bag or pocket safe. Maybe he was carrying the entire time and added it to whatever preplanned discard pile in his trunk. I just wondered at what point he realized he had no sheath and whether he attempted in any way to go after it.

Now I'm thinking he might not have been aware he didn't have it.

JMO

 

[Auntie Cipation]

Did we ever hear about any downstream searches for the knife?

I think we heard about some brief searches in the river at the place he was suspected to have tossed it -- was that in Lewiston?

But were there attempts to search at the nearest downstream dam, for example? Or flights overhead with some sort of metal detection ability?

Anyone recall?

 

[Cool Cats]

Did we ever hear about any downstream searches for the knife?

I think we heard about some brief searches in the river at the place he was suspected to have tossed it -- was that in Lewiston?

But were there attempts to search at the nearest downstream dam, for example? Or flights overhead with some sort of metal detection ability?

Anyone recall?

Many warrants have been issued for searches but none for the river, although I don't think they need a SW for that if it is public access. Private land yes.

I have seen photos in other cases where LE dive teams use metal detectors in water and on land. There might be a way LE can "drag" for objects in the water as well.

I believe things like this were done but not caught by the media.

2 Cents

 

[Boxer]

I think BK had one target and killed the other three because essentially they were witnesses. DM would have met the same fate, but for all the reasons upthread, he just didn't see her. Or rather, it didn't register in his brain immediately and may have been what contributed to his rapid vehicle exit.

I wonder if there's any indication or gap in time whereby he returned to the house, within the next spurt of time, in search of his sheath.

Without one, it would seem that knife would cut through anything, no bag or pocket safe. Maybe he was carrying the entire time and added it to whatever preplanned discard pile in his trunk. I just wondered at what point he realized he had no sheath and whether he attempted in any way to go after it.

Now I'm thinking he might not have been aware he didn't have it.

JMO

I think he wrapped it up in the coveralls and had some place ready to hide the bundle till better times.

 

[Cool Cats]

I think he wrapped it up in the coveralls and had some place ready to hide the bundle till better times.

This is what I am perplexed over.

As soon as he wraps up the knife he should have noticed the sheath was gone. Wouldn't most people put their knife back in the sheath?

And it seems like BK would have planned to put the knife in the sheath and then wrapped them up together and then planned to bury them together in the woods. Got rid of them together somewhere outside.

A sheath would float if it loses the knife, so do clothes, plastic sheeting, shoes, gloves, masks, etc....

This is why I think he had a very deep pre-dug hole ready and dug it on one of his 11 night trips to Moscow. This could be why he was driving all over the place down country roads after he left King Rd.

Maybe he took his phone to use his GPS to locate the exact location of a pre-dug hole. Hard to find in the dark fog.

2 Cents

 

[whiterhino]

This is what I am perplexed over.

As soon as he wraps up the knife he should have noticed the sheath was gone. Wouldn't most people put their knife back in the sheath?

And it seems like BK would have planned to put the knife in the sheath and then wrapped them up together and then planned to bury them together in the woods. Got rid of them together somewhere outside.

A sheath would float if it loses the knife, so do clothes, plastic sheeting, shoes, gloves, masks, etc....

This is why I think he had a very deep pre-dug hole ready and dug it on one of his 11 night trips to Moscow. This could be why he was driving all over the place down country roads after he left King Rd.

Maybe he took his phone to use his GPS to locate the exact location of a pre-dug hole. Hard to find in the dark fog.

2 Cents

IMO normally people sheath their knife after they're finished with it however, I think it's very possible that BK was so overcome with everything that he lost track of the sheath. He likely realized it was missing once he stripped down but maybe too late to go back?

RBBM: Fog?

 

[Boxer]

This is what I am perplexed over.

As soon as he wraps up the knife he should have noticed the sheath was gone. Wouldn't most people put their knife back in the sheath?

And it seems like BK would have planned to put the knife in the sheath and then wrapped them up together and then planned to bury them together in the woods. Got rid of them together somewhere outside.

A sheath would float if it loses the knife, so do clothes, plastic sheeting, shoes, gloves, masks, etc....

This is why I think he had a very deep pre-dug hole ready and dug it on one of his 11 night trips to Moscow. This could be why he was driving all over the place down country roads after he left King Rd.

Maybe he took his phone to use his GPS to locate the exact location of a pre-dug hole. Hard to find in the dark fog.

2 Cents

MOO I dont think he knew the sheath was gone till got back to the car, he thought it was secured in a pocket.

 

[Boxer]

This is what I am perplexed over.

As soon as he wraps up the knife he should have noticed the sheath was gone. Wouldn't most people put their knife back in the sheath?

And it seems like BK would have planned to put the knife in the sheath and then wrapped them up together and then planned to bury them together in the woods. Got rid of them together somewhere outside.

A sheath would float if it loses the knife, so do clothes, plastic sheeting, shoes, gloves, masks, etc....

This is why I think he had a very deep pre-dug hole ready and dug it on one of his 11 night trips to Moscow. This could be why he was driving all over the place down country roads after he left King Rd.

Maybe he took his phone to use his GPS to locate the exact location of a pre-dug hole. Hard to find in the dark fog.

2 Cents

Agree.

 

[schooling]

IMO normally people sheath their knife after they're finished with it however, I think it's very possible that BK was so overcome with everything that he lost track of the sheath. He likely realized it was missing once he stripped down but maybe too late to go back?

RBBM: Fog?

IMO….

There’s two possibilities

1) BK attempted to sheath his knife after killing Kaylee and Maddie and may have tried to look for it in the room/bed but was interrupted by sounds coming from downstairs. And he may have gone down with the intention of going back up to the room but the unplanned killing of two more people spooked him into leaving.

OR alternatively

2) BK never attempted to sheath his knife after killing Maddie and Kaylee. He kept it in his hand because he might have anticipated or wanted to be ready for a confrontation on his way out. Meaning it wasn’t until after killing Xana and Ethan (when he would need both hands for his escape) that he noticed the sheath was gone. And you’d have to question whether he thought about going back upstairs.

MOO

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

MOO I dont think he knew the sheath was gone till got back to the car, he thought it was secured in a pocket.

Yes, and another possibility might be it was in his gloved hand and it was dislodged or misplaced in one of the attacks? (This is theorized, since there was IIUC DNA associated with the suspect BK only contained in the sheath strap snap. So seems gloves were involved IMO.)

Is it known whether BK was right or left handed? IIRC, in some cases there has been evidence presented whereby the ‘hand’ of the individual wielding the knife or other weapon can sometimes be determined by the nature of the wounds. MOO

 

[Cool Cats]

MOO I dont think he knew the sheath was gone till got back to the car, he thought it was secured in a pocket.

Then I have to wonder why he didn't go in to get it?

 

[Megnut]

Then I have to wonder why he didn't go in to get it?

Maybe he did. Or at least attempted to. House would have been deathly quiet... and stealthily, so would he, just was unsuccessful.

Or... he intended to leave it all along, purposefully slid it under her as he exacted his blow. It was intended to be his calling card, the DNA unintended.

Or... he was belatedly aware of DM, realizing he'd been seen, and anticipated LE arriving swiftly, and had to get gone pronto.

JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

She must present him with all his options and be honest about his chances. I saw a DP case where there was overwhelming evidence and the defense attorneys had to level with their client because the main job of a defense attorney is to keep their client off of death row and be honest about overwhelmingly evidence.

If BK ends up on DR I will be pretty angry at AT for all her hand ringing at how unequivocally innocent she announces her client is, the whole defense team for that matter.

2 Cents

I'm sorry but if BK ends up on Death Row, I'll be doing a happy dance period. The dude is guilty and a wanna be serial killer IMO.

JMO

 

[al66pine]

BK. Right or Left Handed?

....Is it known whether BK was right or left handed? IIRC, in some cases there has been evidence presented whereby the ‘hand’ of the individual wielding the knife or other weapon can sometimes be determined by the nature of the wounds. MOO

snipped for focus @I am not Sherlock H.
IIRC, waaay back, someone posted about seeing BK sign a doc. w his LEFT hand. On vid, at a ct. hearing? Not sure.
No link to the source, so again, just IIRC.

Yes, have seen/read testimony re angle of wounds/injuries on vic being used to help determine whether attacker was right or left handed.
Usu. from testimony of forensic pathologist or med. examiner who conducted autopsy.

 

[Cool Cats]

I'm sorry but if BK ends up on Death Row, I'll be doing a happy dance period. The dude is guilty and a wanna be serial killer IMO.

JMO

Well he is heading in that direction so I believe you can start perfecting your dance.

 

[schooling]

I'm on my 28th book of the year. I'll be careful to mention that it's an audiobook so I don't get credit for being able to read a single sentence without my ADD kicking in. Skip to the end if you want to cut to the chase and my point about Moscow Idaho.

Bare with me as I'm going to draw a parallel to the book I'm currently listening to and this Moscow Idaho case. And how it's giving me a new perspective on the defenses' tactics and the argument of some (not the disingenuous ones, IMO) of the BK defenders.

The book is called CHAOS. And it's a deep dive into the investigation of the murders carried out by the "Manson Family". I, like many others on here have read Helter Skelter and the dozens of other books/podcasts/articles/videos on these murders throughout the years.

But this book takes a different tact. It's a book about the investigation. Presented mostly from the POV of the lead investigators and the shady people on the periphery. People who presented dozens of red flags that were never pursued during the investigation and in a lot of cases outright dismissed. A few that may have even been a connection between the victims and the murderers. Leaving the case mostly cold until the real killers fell into investigators laps via a jailhouse snitch.

It's not that the pursuit of the red flags would have led to a different outcome. The "Manson Family" committed the murders. There's very little doubt about that. But it goes into how law enforcement can wait until the outcome they desire is presented to them. And how they can look the other way when there's obvious problematic behavior but the suspects don't fit the mold or are connected. There's more but I'm going to digress so i don't violate rules.

IMO BK did it. I'm 100% convinced of that. But I do see the argument presented by some that law enforcement could have done a better job of looking outside of BK once he came on their radar. I'm sure there's more that we don't know that will come out though.

That's my Sunday rambling. Hope everyone is having a restful weekend.

 

[Cool Cats]

I'm on my 28th book of the year. I'll be careful to mention that it's an audiobook so I don't get credit for being able to read a single sentence without my ADD kicking in. Skip to the end if you want to cut to the chase and my point about Moscow Idaho.

Bare with me as I'm going to draw a parallel to the book I'm currently listening to and this Moscow Idaho case. And how it's giving me a new perspective on the defenses' tactics and the argument of some (not the disingenuous ones, IMO) of the BK defenders.

The book is called CHAOS. And it's a deep dive into the investigation of the murders carried out by the "Manson Family". I, like many others on here have read Helter Skelter and the dozens of other books/podcasts/articles/videos on these murders throughout the years.

But this book takes a different tact. It's a book about the investigation. Presented mostly from the POV of the lead investigators and the shady people on the periphery. People who presented dozens of red flags that were never pursued during the investigation and in a lot of cases outright dismissed. A few that may have even been a connection between the victims and the murderers. Leaving the case mostly cold until the real killers fell into investigators laps via a jailhouse snitch.

It's not that the pursuit of the red flags would have led to a different outcome. The "Manson Family" committed the murders. There's very little doubt about that. But it goes into how law enforcement can wait until the outcome they desire is presented to them. And how they can look the other way when there's obvious problematic behavior but the suspects don't fit the mold or are connected. There's more but I'm going to digress so i don't violate rules.

IMO BK did it. I'm 100% convinced of that. But I do see the argument presented by some that law enforcement could have done a better job of looking outside of BK once he came on their radar. I'm sure there's more that we don't know that will come out though.

That's my Sunday rambling. Hope everyone is having a restful weekend.

After arrest Thompson said this is just a new beginning of the investigation and they still want tips called in.

He also said that he is limited by Idaho Supreme Court law on what he can say about a suspect before they have their first appearance in court. If they are looking at someone else they cannot announce that.

The FBI could be investigating a POI or suspect right now in another state and no one but them would know.

There were 10,000 tips before arrest and still an on-going investigation after arrest.

They ruled out a great many POI and investigated many many people.

Live updates: Latest on the Idaho University student killings

Local police will hold a news conference regarding the investigation into the killings of four Idaho college students as law enforcement sources tell CNN a suspect has been arrested. Follow here for the latest news updates here.

www.cnn.com

2 Cents