4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #95

[Cool Cats]

I may be dreaming, but way way back, didn't we hear that BK had something in the glove box of his car that connected to the murdered students?

READ: Search warrant for Bryan Kohberger's car

Click here to view this item from wfmz.com.

www.wfmz.com

In this article you can pdf download the items seized in the search of BK'car.

 

[Betty P]

READ: Search warrant for Bryan Kohberger's car

Click here to view this item from wfmz.com.

www.wfmz.com

In this article you can pdf download the items seized in the search of BK'car.

Investigators say after searching the home during the early-morning hours, they also seized a handgun and magazines, laptop, cell phone and a "green leafy substance" in a container and bag.

Authorities also took black face masks, black gloves, and several dark-colored jackets and shirts. This could be notable because a surviving roommate said they saw the intruder wearing all black.

Also in the home was a book with underlining on a specific page, though authorities did not say what the book was or what was underlined, as well as a DeSales University notebook. Kohberger has a criminology degree from DeSales.

 

[Cool Cats]

https://www.pahomepage.com/news/crime-courts/final-two-search-warrants-for-bryan-kohbergers-pa-home-released/

https://www.pahomepage.com/news/search-warrants-for-kohbergers-pa-home-unsealed/

Items seized in BK's car .....

7 quarters, 36 dimes, 32 nickels, 8 pennies,
Gloves
Receipts
Car insurance, registration
Hiking boots
Comfort Inn room key holder
Tire irons,
Shovel
Goggles
Wrench
Door panel
Band-aids

Items seized in BK's Pennsylvania home ....

Knife
Glock 22. .40 Caliber
Smith Wesson pocket knife
Three Block .40 Caliber magazines that were empty
Tayor cutlery knife with leather sheath
Black face mask
Black gloves
Black hat
Black mask
AT&T bill for Bryan Kohberger
Book with underlining on page 118
Prescriptions
Cell phone
Laptop
Multiple dark-colored pants
Columbia navy fleece
New Balance shoes
2 pairs of dark-colored boots
Criminal Psychology book
Note to Dad from Bryan

Items seized on BK's person (body) in his home:

One Defiant silver flashlight
Four medical-style gloves
White Arizona Jean Co. large t-shirt
Champion WSU Cougars large black sweatshirt
Pair of black and white size 13 Nike shoes
Pair of black Under Armour socks
Under Armour black large shorts
Under Armour black boxers
One buccal swab for his DNA sample

 

[jepop]

As far as the whole stalking thing goes, imo what actually occurred at that hearing has been misrepresented and taken out of context. Also, BT's ref was "one of the victims" not "the victims".

Moo, the hearing was addressing facts of the then public record which was clearly taken to be the official public record, not the media as claimed by the D. BT was concerned that two of the survey questions suggested or referred to things reported in the media unrelated to the public record.

On top of that, the question re BK; stalking one of the victims was not even reported by the media. Imo BT said that the D's media/change of venue consultant should have known this ( given what he actually does as a profession no less!). It makes sense to me that BT was referring to the investigation LE conducted re reports KG may have had a stalker not long after the crime and before BK was even on the radar.

Moscow police reveal victims’ ‘stalker’ incident, rule out connection to murders

Moscow police say that the two men, who reportedly followed Goncalves into a business and as she returned to her car back in October, are not thought to be involved in the murder

www.independent.co.uk

As for whether the P will be presenting evidence of BK surveiling 1122 King Road in person in build up to crime , we will wait for trial. Nothing I'm aware of precludes it as a possibility moo.

I love how thanks to the D's behaviour in hearings ( ie Sy Ray coming in with all this mysterious hoo-ha re phone signals in what was a Motion to compel hearing and not an albi hearing) we have this lovely trial by media stuff going on. We don't even know at this point if Sy Ray will actually be used at trial to bolster BK's so called 'alibi'. Have my doubts if BK turned his phone off between 2.47 and 4.48am which is the critical time period. Moo

I'm minus a laptop atm so though I would like to post more, it's a pain doing this via phone so it will keep. Moo

 

[Betty P]

As far as the whole stalking thing goes, imo what actually occurred at that hearing has been misrepresented and taken out of context. Also, BT's ref was "one of the victims" not "the victims".

Moo, the hearing was addressing facts of the then public record which was clearly taken to be the official public record, not the media as claimed by the D. BT was concerned that two of the survey questions suggested or referred to things reported in the media unrelated to the public record.

On top of that, the question re BK; stalking one of the victims was not even reported by the media. Imo BT said that the D's media/change of venue consultant should have known this ( given what he actually does as a profession no less!). It makes sense to me that BT was referring to the investigation LE conducted re reports KG may have had a stalker not long after the crime and before BK was even on the radar.

Moscow police reveal victims’ ‘stalker’ incident, rule out connection to murders

Moscow police say that the two men, who reportedly followed Goncalves into a business and as she returned to her car back in October, are not thought to be involved in the murder

www.independent.co.uk

As for whether the P will be presenting evidence of BK surveiling 1122 King Road in person in build up to crime , we will wait for trial. Nothing I'm aware of precludes it as a possibility moo.

I love how thanks to the D's behaviour in hearings ( ie Sy Ray coming in with all this mysterious hoo-ha re phone signals in what was a Motion to compel hearing and not an albi hearing) we have this lovely trial by media stuff going on. We don't even know at this point if Sy Ray will actually be used at trial to bolster BK's so called 'alibi'. Have my doubts if BK turned his phone off between 2.47 and 4.48am which is the critical time period. Moo

I'm minus a laptop atm so though I would like to post more, it's a pain doing this via phone so it will keep. Moo

I suppose we can at least give D some credit for not attempting to tie the murders to an "Odinist Cult". It could be worse.

 

[gremlin444]

I may be dreaming, but way way back, didn't we hear that BK had something in the glove box of his car that connected to the murdered students?

It was confusion by the media over an item listed on the search warrant results from his parent's house.

The list includes "ID cards inside glove inside box."

It is item #35 and you can see it in the picture in this article if you scroll down.

Note, that this is the items from his home--the car search warrant results are an entirely different document.

Because of the quality of the officer's handwriting, some people at first thought it said "10 (ten) curls inside glove inside box."

Idaho murders update: More Bryan Kohberger documents released in Pennsylvania; knife, phone, masks seized

A Pennsylvania court has unsealed additional documents in the Idaho student murders case and the arrest of suspect Bryan Kohberger in the Pocono Mountains.

www.foxnews.com

 

[Kemug]

It was confusion by the media over an item listed on the search warrant results from his parent's house.

The list includes "ID cards inside glove inside box."

It is item #35 and you can see it in the picture in this article if you scroll down.

Note, that this is the items from his home--the car search warrant results are an entirely different document.

Because of the quality of the officer's handwriting, some people at first thought it said "10 (ten) curls inside glove inside box."

Idaho murders update: More Bryan Kohberger documents released in Pennsylvania; knife, phone, masks seized

A Pennsylvania court has unsealed additional documents in the Idaho student murders case and the arrest of suspect Bryan Kohberger in the Pocono Mountains.

www.foxnews.com

As yes, thank you, that's what I was (sort of) remembering.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Not sure I understand the significance (or insignificance?) of this. IIUC then some might allege that the defense team is attempting to skew the results of their poll? Or possibly influence the public perception of the case? Or misrepresenting certain facts? Or even potentially to as some say, ‘poison the well’? At least that is how I read it.

I don't know what the defense was doing or what their ulterior motive may have been. The only reason I brought it up is that a poster suggested a motive was stalking and killing these girls and I'm saying that the prosecutor admitted there was no stalking. That's the only relevance to the current discussion. MOO.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

As far as the whole stalking thing goes, imo what actually occurred at that hearing has been misrepresented and taken out of context. Also, BT's ref was "one of the victims" not "the victims".

SBMFF. It's a direct quote from the prosecutor, quoted in print and in video. We may disagree on the interpretation, but I don't think it's fair to say it's been taken out of context. MOO.

 

[Betty P]

SBMFF. It's a direct quote from the prosecutor, quoted in print and in video. We may disagree on the interpretation, but I don't think it's fair to say it's been taken out of context. MOO.

I think we will find out when the trial takes place, when the evidence is presented by the prosecution.

 

[GRT]

That's the peril of discussing this kind of "information" on social media before the trial. If defenders say it enough times, people reading begin to think its true. However, these are usually factoids that don't stand up in court. Sounds like its just rumor or conjecture.

This is a valid point, and I've heard jokingly called the "CSI effect." Illusory innocence.

But there is also a flip side—a prejudicial effect also linked to social media or just human nature—where there is an automatic presumption of guilt based on a defendant's arrest.

Statistically speaking, most defendants are found guilty simply because prosecutors are funded by taxpayer monies. In most cases, they only prosecute when they believe they can meet the burden of proof requirement.

Still, even if a defendant committed a crime, we have no assurance a jury will convict because strong defense strategies can create enough doubt to result in an acquittal.

But most of all -- it's okay to have an opinion one way or the other. I enjoy hearing from those certain there is ample evidence to get a conviction and those who feel the evidence is weak and an acquittal is forthcoming.

 

[MissyRie]

I enjoy reading all the opinions. But jmo when he was arrested and every second since - he's just been stone cold silent. Some can and will say nobody knows how they will react in that type situation. Well bull. Imagine your innocent self strolling thru a mall or better yet, in the kitchen of your own home and officers surrounding you and arresting you for FOUR murders.
I cannot be alone when I say I would be screaming to the heavens and snot nose crying that absolutely no way. And after I was behind bars my friends and family would be doing it for me.

 

[NCWatcher]

I enjoy reading all the opinions. But jmo when he was arrested and every second since - he's just been stone cold silent. Some can and will say nobody knows how they will react in that type situation. Well bull. Imagine your innocent self strolling thru a mall or better yet, in the kitchen of your own home and officers surrounding you and arresting you for FOUR murders.
I cannot be alone when I say I would be screaming to the heavens and snot nose crying that absolutely no way. And after I was behind bars my friends and family would be doing it for me.

I wouldn't do many things many defendants do (or rather I think I wouldn't.) But simply because I wouldn't act like Person X (or his family) doesn't mean Person X committed a crime. And that's true of BK and his family too. I wouldn't do things some crime victims have done either (including several of the victims in this case.) But that certainly doesn't mean the victims were to blame for what happened to them although in the past victims' actions have been used against them in court, particularly with sex crimes. I expect that still happens in some cases with both victims and defendants-- the notion that differences between what's generally considered "normal" and "acceptable" behavior can easily be used to determine blame/criminal culpability.

I hope jurors in murder cases don't do things like decide the defendant must be guilty if he's not protesting his innocence, especially in court-- that a defendant who doesn't testify, for example, must be guilty. But despite judges' warnings not to hold not testifying against a defendant we know it happens. And we know there will always be people who serve as jurors who think the police wouldn't have arrested Person X unless he was guilty. I served on a jury where that was stated by a juror during deliberations after a week-long trial! And yes, there had been voir dire before seating jurors. I expect this person thought he was answering voir dire questions honestly.... But at the end of the day, his unconscious biases won out. He really believed the police arrested only guilty people. There may be people who hold similar opinions who serve as jurors in the trial for this case no matter where the trial is held. Voir dire isn't a magic bullet, unfortunately.
MOO

 

[Justice101]

I found the tracking and video of him driving around, in front of and behind the murder house exactly at the time the murders occurred to be very convincing evidence. Unless someone else stole his car that night and drove it from his neighborhood to the crime scene during the murders, it looks pretty bad for him. Even worse, his DNA was found on the murder weapon sheath, at the crime scene. Don't forget the roommate giving a partial description of him inside the house during the murders.

Idaho murders: Roommate saw killer in mask leaving the house, docs say

Bryan Kohberger, the 28-year-old suspect in the University of Idaho murders, has arrived back in Idaho to face charges.

abcnews.go.com

IIRC, the DNA was retrieved from the knife sheath before Kohberger's DNA was tested back in PA near his parents home. No lab cross contamination. The two samples were retrieved and tested in labs on opposite sides of the country.

ETA: I know its subjective, but I recently watched Gray Hughes analysis of the videos of the killer's car driving around the death scene. Very obvious what he was doing. The timing is spot on with the beginning and end of the murders. Very unsettling to watch.

Unless they have a license plate number (or something else obvious like a dent on the side of a car), there is no way they can say that is BKs car. Especially at night when still frames on video are blurred and headlights drown out other details of the car. However, if his cell phone data before he turned it off can be linked to when the car changes towers, then they can at least say the car that left Pullman was BKs.

I agree the DNA evident is really the only solid concrete evidence they may have. BUT, circumstantial evidence piled upon circumstantial evidence is used all the time to convict people. it is compelling the number of coincidences that would have to happen for it not to be that person.

 

[maskedwoman]

Only problem is that usually means a sequestered jury like in the Anthony trial. And that seems like a big problem.
MOO

True, but I'm not sure that can be avoided in this trial. These days, avoiding news of a trial is more difficult than just not watching the news or reading the paper. You can't watch TV without getting top of the hour and bottom of the hour new updates, or news alerts on our phones, social media rants and post forwarding, you name it. I opened Youtube last night to watch some crafting videos and on the top row of suggested videos were videos from the Lawyer You Know guy. Just going to the grocery store could expose a juror to something they shouldn't know.

 

[arielilane]

Very reasonable people live in Moscow. This might be one comment they received. I, on the other hand, I'm very exhausted by this process. I recognize that I could not be impartial and that I do in fact have biases. Most people here would but they think they can control that energy. I do not delude myself. Despite some folks wanting to keep it here, moving it would be better but of course that's JMOO.

Everybody keep their hats on, there's not a mob mentality here. There is deep concern, frustration, and possibly media stirring the pot. Moscow is a regular town with extraordinary events the day of November 13th. Again, JMOO.

Agree there is no mob mentality. To add, even though we dont know all evidence pointing to BK, if he ever goes to trial, he will not walk. I believe there's a lot of evidence pointing to BK.

Concerning the article, defense deflection? As you know, the defense fully supports BK's innocence. To be clear their objective is for BK to receive a fair trial and that includes a change of venue. Is defense overstating case of words, idk. AT's agenda has always been change of venue. She’s been quite adamant about the topic. I suspect the article is on par w/the upcoming August 29 change of venue hearing.

Additionally, these are some strong comments made by the survey respondent who participated, who mostly are anonymous and imo, will choose to write anything, and not necessarily act on it. Maybe didn't take the survey serious?

But, again, if this goes to trial, he’s not walking, only walking he will be doing is from prison.

All is a matter of opinion, at this time.

 

[Boxer]

What does his cell phone location tell us about his connection to the crime? Can you narrow down what you mean? Last time I checked in on this case, his cell was off during the crucial hours and turned on later that morning. Is there something new about his cell phone location during the murders that makes you say that?



I don't think anyone would be satisfied with a killer going free. None of the posts I've read have suggested that. Instead, what people seem to be saying is that guilty or not, this case is not BARD.

MOO.

MOO but a killer going free is exactly what happens with evidence suppression.
In this case AT did not argue that the DNA is not BKs, just that genealogical searches themselves are legally deficient.
The alibi they are trying to "find" is a cell shadow to place him.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

MOO but a killer going free is exactly what happens with evidence suppression.
In this case AT did not argue that the DNA is not BKs, just that genealogical searches themselves are legally deficient.
The alibi they are trying to "find" is a cell shadow to place him.

Well, I didn't say the DNA evidence *should* be suppressed. But I will say that if evidence (ANY evidence) was obtained illegally in any case, not just this one, then I'm a fan of holding those responsible for illegally obtaining it responsible and it being suppressed. We can't be lawless in seeking justice because it becomes a thin line between justice and framing people.

In this case, my understanding is that it wasn't necessarily illegally obtained, but that there's lack of legal standing on it or something? I'm not quite clear on it and don't really have an opinion on whether or not it should be suppressed because I don't quite understand the legal arguments.

In any case, even if the DNA evidence is allowed, I still don't think this case is BARD. I think that's the strongest piece of circumstantial evidence, but it isn't a done deal given other deficiencies in the case and the fact that it's touch DNA.

MOO

 

[Boxer]

MOO

Well, I didn't say the DNA evidence *should* be suppressed. But I will say that if evidence (ANY evidence) was obtained illegally in any case, not just this one, then I'm a fan of holding those responsible for illegally obtaining it responsible and it being suppressed. We can't be lawless in seeking justice because it becomes a thin line between justice and framing people.

In this case, my understanding is that it wasn't necessarily illegally obtained, but that there's lack of legal standing on it or something? I'm not quite clear on it and don't really have an opinion on whether or not it should be suppressed because I don't quite understand the legal arguments.

In any case, even if the DNA evidence is allowed, I still don't think this case is BARD. I think that's the strongest piece of circumstantial evidence, but it isn't a done deal given other deficiencies in the case and the fact that it's touch DNA.

MOO

I so disagree.
Crimes are not streamed, events have to be put together from evidence.

MOO The evidence that supports his arrest and eventually a conviction is strong.

He is a DNA match to the crime scene, an item literally fojnd under/by one of the murder victims.

He owns the type of car seen circling the house and fleeing the house. His phone was tracked going toward Moscow before the crime and leaving Moscow after the crime.

He has no alibi.
AT is conspicuously trying to create one from the state's cell data. First there was the assertion he was near Wawawai Park on the Snake, too far west to be involved but now it has evolved from the DT to that he was in some sort of cell shadow south of Moscow.

 

[windrower]

From the link posted:

"A polling team hired by Bryan Kohberger's defense has been spreading false information that he stalked one of the four murder victims in the case, a prosecutor has said in court."

"That Mr. Kohberger allegedly stalked one of the victims, that's false...You knew that to be false?" asked the prosecutor, Bill Thompson."

I’m not sure anyone can say for sure BK did not stalk any of the residents of the murder house, even with what the prosecutor said.

He could have been in his car or had other vantage points (outdoor seating, etc.) and watched any one of the residents out and about in public, with no one the wiser.

Stalking in person, unnoticed.

There doesn’t appear to be a digital trail of stalking, but I’m not convinced there was absolutely no stalking at all.

Well, I didn't say the DNA evidence *should* be suppressed. But I will say that if evidence (ANY evidence) was obtained illegally in any case, not just this one, then I'm a fan of holding those responsible for illegally obtaining it responsible and it being suppressed. We can't be lawless in seeking justice because it becomes a thin line between justice and framing people.

In this case, my understanding is that it wasn't necessarily illegally obtained, but that there's lack of legal standing on it or something? I'm not quite clear on it and don't really have an opinion on whether or not it should be suppressed because I don't quite understand the legal arguments.

In any case, even if the DNA evidence is allowed, I still don't think this case is BARD. I think that's the strongest piece of circumstantial evidence, but it isn't a done deal given other deficiencies in the case and the fact that it's touch DNA.

MOO

I believe this case is very strong, but of course, JMO.

I will say, if my daughter was found stabbed to death, and a knife sheath with a man’s DNA was found under or near her body—plus all the other evidence, circumstantial and otherwise (ie. a car very much like that man’s car in the neighborhood at the time of her murder)—I would not consider the case deficient. At all.

IMO