8 Die in Crash on Taconic State Parkway #2

[robinparten]

I, too, am extremely curious about what Diane and the Hances (and their daughter) discussed on those phone calls.

That her brother (and/or Danny) went to pick her up rather than call the police is interesting. Either she really had them fooled or they were covering up her drunk driving, putting their own children at risk.

And, why did Diane even call her brother, rather than her husband?

I wonder if any of this will come out in the civil litigation.

I believe Jackie said in the LHJ article that her husband went to find Diane, and she called 911. So they probably were just pulling out all the stops, "let's call the police and I will also go to where they are." Remember, their eldest daughter had given them a location, so Warren may have thought he could reach them quickly because he thought he knew where they were. Also, in his mind, even if police reached them first, he'd be there very quickly to take the children etc. I don't think Warren and Jackie were covering for Diane, they would never have let their children go with her if they'd had a clue.

 

[rpd113]

I believe Jackie said in the LHJ article that her husband went to find Diane, and she called 911.

Hmmm...

I hate to impugn her, but if that were true, wouldn't that call have been featured prominently in the documentary?

 

[robinparten]

Hmmm...

I hate to impugn her, but if that were true, wouldn't that call have been played prominently in the documentary?

Good point, I don't really doubt Jackie's intent, if she says she was going to call 911 I believe her, but it could be that she didn't for some reason, or she did and the call was unremarkable and just hasn't gotten airtime, who knows? The call that has gotten airtime was the one to the police station I believe? The one where they also had Daniel on the phone and they were trying to find Diane based on pinging her cell phone?

 

[rpd113]

Good point, I don't really doubt Jackie's intent, if she says she was going to call 911 I believe her, but it could be that she didn't for some reason, or she did and the call was unremarkable and just hasn't gotten airtime, who knows? The call that has gotten airtime was the one to the police station I believe? The one where they also had Daniel on the phone and they were trying to find Diane based on pinging her cell phone?

I just re-read the police report and Warren says that he had Jackie call the Sleepy Hollow and Tarrytown local police. That may be why there's not a recording of the call, as opposed to public-record 911 calls.

It sounds like he did get the police involved very soon after the "something's wrong with Aunt Diane" call. So, I completely withdraw the questions I raised above.

Still fascinated by Danny being such a non-entity. Didn't drive with the family, Diane didn't call him, he never called her, he didn't join Warren and Warren's dad, the person who made the call to police on the documentary (Warren or a family friend?) couldn't even get his attention when they needed to know the cell phone billing info, etc.

The police report also makes it sound like the first he knew of the situation was when Warren informed him there had been an accident. But we know from the documentary he was in the room when the family was trying to find the minivan and calling the police. I also read that Danny's lawyer offered police the chance to interview Danny again after the press conference -- but subsequently told them "Danny had to go" and couldn't do the interview. They spoke to him again eight days later. Not that him being shady/misleading is a revelation.

 

[Saffron]

I think Daniel *IS* a victim, whether or not he was a perfect husband.

I'm sure all the interviews were heavily edited and we heard/saw only a fraction of what Diane's friends and family actually said.

Oh, definitely. I only meant that, after time has gone by and others are, understandably, upset by some of the things Daniel's saying or not saying, I still only see him as a victim and can't seem to fault him for any of his actions/words that have occurred since the crash. (NOT that I think this makes me more compassionate or anything -- of course, and absolutely, not. I just can't see past his losses.)

 

[Stella5]

BBM

I had these same questions. If she had a little stash, where was it? Even if she smoked a joint in a bathroom, I feel sure she would have kept the roach and tucked it in her pocket or purse.

I agree with Nova that no smoking went on in front of the kids. But I can tell you from personal experience that it's not difficult to sneak off and smoke a little pot away from disapproving eyes.

I doubt she had a pipe or a bong as that would have been mentioned in addition to the broken Vodka bottle found. My assumption would be a rolled joint, and that would have definitely been incinerated in the vehicle fire leaving no evidence of it behind. That stuff burns quick! (Ex-boyfriend years ago was a huge smoker)

 

[Stella5]

Excellent observation!

Near the end of the doc, Jay is reading a card from Jackie Hance to someone named "Evan" - I'm not able to determine who Evan is...anyone know? I obviously missed something as far as who Evan is.

I believe Evan is Jay's son. I found an Evan Schuler on LI. I would guess Evan reached out to Jackie prompting her to respond. Evan technically wouldn't be a nephew to Jackie, but the families seemed pretty tight knit so he probably thought of her as an Aunt even though she technically wasn't. Jackie is married to Warren, Diane's brother. Diane was married to Danny Schuler, Jay is married to Danny's brother. Confused yet?

 

[southcitymom]

I'm not Daniel's official apologist (although it probably seems that way to some), but because I feel so sorry for him, I keep thinking on behalf of him as a victim. I thought the documentary was somewhat unemotional, it had a kind of clinical coldness to it, probably deliberately, and I'd guess the filmmaker didn't ask questions about the actual loss of Daniel's wife and daughter while filming. I easily assume that Daniel grieved the loss of his wife and daughter significantly, though not publicly, and that he's lived through an absolute nightmare.

I too have a TREMENDOUS amount of sympathy for Daniel. I don't know how you couldn't - his life has been as completely shattered as everyone else's.

 

[southcitymom]

I think it was that and more....She had the burden of her ruined childhood trying to mother her siblings, the pain of her own mother's abandonment, resentment toward her siblings who reconciled with said mother rather than remaining loyal to her, and the horror of potentially turning into her own mother because she was no longer able to cope with her own life.

Absolutely - most people who wind up abusing substances have a trail of pain that led them there.

 

[southcitymom]

I think Daniel *IS* a victim, whether or not he was a perfect husband.

I'm sure all the interviews were heavily edited and we heard/saw only a fraction of what Diane's friends and family actually said.

Unquestionably.

 

[Stella5]

Thank you. I didn't think "35 minutes" sounded like enough time to make it down the Taconic, through NYC and out to the Island, particularly in the midst of end-of-the-weekend traffic. But I swear I heard that time. I thought I heard it in the doc, but maybe I read it in an article.

***

It's possible the Hances are being careful what they say about the phone calls from Diane for fear of being accused of enabling her conduct and/or failing to prevent the crash by calling 911. I'm not blaming them, I'm not calling them liars and, in any event, I think they've suffered enough. But as litigious as people can be these days, I can imagine being careful not to give too many details.

I'd like to understand the "facts" set forth in the suit against them and their countersuit. I don't see where the Hances are at fault for owning the van, but then I'm not sure how Dan Schuler is to blame either.

You're welcome! I found that very odd too... no way could the drive be made that fast. Perhaps the 35 minutes is how long it would take to get from the home to the bridge where they were pulled over? I don't know!!!

I highly recommend reading the police report. I found it after Ariel posted it... there is a lot of info there that I didn't know. For example Jackie refused to speak to the police, and she also refused a visit from the police when they went to the house days later to deliver some information. I would imagine she was beyond grief stricken and possibly incapable of speaking to them?! There were also a TON of witnesses not on the docu that spoke of Diane driving very erratically at different points that were not addressed. Even on the highway we have one witness saying she was straight as a pin, but another saying she was straddling the lane and the shoulder.

As for the lawsuits, I have not been successful in finding them online but would LOVE to read them. I did find a link that Jackie is now suing Danny, that suit was filed the day after Danny filed suit again the State and against Warren.

I agree Danny isn't to blame for the actual accident, that falls solely on Diane. The problem I have with Danny is his attitude that Diane's alcohol and marijuana use is "all lies" (as he states in the docu and all over press conferences). In the police report he admits to them drinking Friday, but not Saturday even though they were around multiple other people and up late at night. If I were to hedge a bet, I would guess there was drinking going on Saturday and that would account for her blood alcohol level being already elevated prior to her drinking the Vodka on Sunday depending on how fast her body metabolized the alcohol.

 

[Stella5]

Thank you. I didn't think "35 minutes" sounded like enough time to make it down the Taconic, through NYC and out to the Island, particularly in the midst of end-of-the-weekend traffic. But I swear I heard that time. I thought I heard it in the doc, but maybe I read it in an article.

***

It's possible the Hances are being careful what they say about the phone calls from Diane for fear of being accused of enabling her conduct and/or failing to prevent the crash by calling 911. I'm not blaming them, I'm not calling them liars and, in any event, I think they've suffered enough. But as litigious as people can be these days, I can imagine being careful not to give too many details.

I'd like to understand the "facts" set forth in the suit against them and their countersuit. I don't see where the Hances are at fault for owning the van, but then I'm not sure how Dan Schuler is to blame either.

You're welcome! I found that very odd too... no way could the drive be made that fast. Perhaps the 35 minutes is how long it would take to get from the home to the bridge where they were pulled over? I don't know!!!

I highly recommend reading the police report. I found it after Ariel posted it... there is a lot of info there that I didn't know. For example Jackie refused to speak to the police, and she also refused a visit from the police when they went to the house days later to deliver some information. I would imagine she was beyond grief stricken and possibly incapable of speaking to them?! There were also a TON of witnesses not on the docu that spoke of Diane driving very erratically at different points that were not addressed. Even on the highway we have one witness saying she was straight as a pin, but another saying she was straddling the lane and the shoulder.

As for the lawsuits, I have not been successful in finding them online but would LOVE to read them. I did find a link that Jackie is now suing Danny, that suit was filed the day after Danny filed suit again the State and against Warren.

I agree Danny isn't to blame for the actual accident, that falls solely on Diane. The problem I have with Danny is his attitude that Diane's alcohol and marijuana use is "all lies" (as he states in the docu and all over press conferences). In the police report he admits to them drinking Friday, but not Saturday even though they were around multiple other people and up late at night. If I were to hedge a bet, I would guess there was drinking going on Saturday and that would account for her blood alcohol level being already elevated prior to her drinking the Vodka on Sunday depending on how fast her body metabolized the alcohol.

 

[southcitymom]

I doubt she had a pipe or a bong as that would have been mentioned in addition to the broken Vodka bottle found. My assumption would be a rolled joint, and that would have definitely been incinerated in the vehicle fire leaving no evidence of it behind. That stuff burns quick! (Ex-boyfriend years ago was a huge smoker)

That makes sense if it were in her purse or stuffed not on her person. But if she slipped it in her pocket, it might still be there - I don't think her clothes were burned off her.

 

[Nova]

After seeing the documentary, my take on Daniel is that he is a pretty simple guy, not very emotional, not very deep. I've known guys just like him, in fact, one of my husband's friends is from NY and he is very much the same as Daniel. What you see is what you get, not given to being intellectual or analyzing things, not emotional, pretty laid-back go with the flow kind of a person. Nothing wrong with that. I think the problem most people have with Daniel are the blinders he is wearing regarding his wife. But I have to say, my stepfather is EXACTLY the same way about my mother's drinking.........he could watch my mother down a couple of shots and rationalize it away. It blows my mind the excuses he makes for her.

Well said, robin.

And I would add that, yes, Daniel should have helped more with the house and the kids. But are we sure that would have made Diane happy, or even whether she would have allowed it?

I think it's been established from several sources that Diane wanted things done her way and had little patience for anyone who didn't do things as she thought they should be done. I've had some otherwise wonderful women in my family who were like that and their attitude was, "Oh, just let me do it so it'll be done right."

Of course, now Daniel needs to recognize that things have changed and he can't just expect his sister-in-law to do everything Diane did. But he isn't the first of us to resist change.

 

[Nova]

Oh, definitely. I only meant that, after time has gone by and others are, understandably, upset by some of the things Daniel's saying or not saying, I still only see him as a victim and can't seem to fault him for any of his actions/words that have occurred since the crash. (NOT that I think this makes me more compassionate or anything -- of course, and absolutely, not. I just can't see past his losses.)

I agree with you, Saffron. As I said above, I don't think people have to be perfectly blameless to deserve our sympathy.

 

[Nova]

I believe Evan is Jay's son. I found an Evan Schuler on LI. I would guess Evan reached out to Jackie prompting her to respond. Evan technically wouldn't be a nephew to Jackie, but the families seemed pretty tight knit so he probably thought of her as an Aunt even though she technically wasn't. Jackie is married to Warren, Diane's brother. Diane was married to Danny Schuler, Jay is married to Danny's brother. Confused yet?

No, I think you explained it well. And I agree: I was very close to one of my mother's sisters and grew up spending a lot of time with that aunt's in-laws.

I knew they weren't technically related to me, but I still thought of them as part of the extended family.

 

[Nova]

You're welcome! I found that very odd too... no way could the drive be made that fast. Perhaps the 35 minutes is how long it would take to get from the home to the bridge where they were pulled over? I don't know!!!....

Based on what another poster wrote above, I think the "35 minutes" was the driving time for Daniel at 7 a.m. Diane didn't start back until late morning, so she probably hit the massive traffic of people returning from their weekends.

(For those who don't live in NYC, between Memorial Day and Labor Day, millions of people leave the city every weekend to go to cooler places at the shore or in the woods.)

 

[sharkeyes]

I believe Evan is Jay's son. I found an Evan Schuler on LI. I would guess Evan reached out to Jackie prompting her to respond. Evan technically wouldn't be a nephew to Jackie, but the families seemed pretty tight knit so he probably thought of her as an Aunt even though she technically wasn't. Jackie is married to Warren, Diane's brother. Diane was married to Danny Schuler, Jay is married to Danny's brother. Confused yet?

Thank You! I've watched the doc several times now and I see the teenaged/young man in the scenes with Bryan...and I never put two and two together.....I need to refocus!

 

[sharkeyes]

... Daniel should have helped more with the house and the kids. But are we sure that would have made Diane happy, or even whether she would have allowed it?

I think it's been established from several sources that Diane wanted things done her way and had little patience for anyone who didn't do things as she thought they should be done.

Excellent observations, I've thought about Diane being an "oh, just let me do it" kind of girl too.

Interesting theory noted in psych class today - Brain Fatigue/Derealization

http://boingboing.net/2008/07/22/science-of-brain-fat.html
"New research suggests that the brain's "executive function," the mental system involved in abstract thinking, planning, and focusing on one thing instead of another, can be fatigued to the point that your ability to make decisions is badly hampered."

A person with "brain fatigue" can also suffer "jaimas vu".

From Wikipedia:
Often described as the opposite of deja vu, jamais vu involves a sense of eeriness and the observer's impression of seeing the situation for the first time, despite rationally knowing that he or she has been in the situation before.

Derealization:
Derealization (sometimes abbreviated as DR) is an alteration in the perception or experience of the external world so that it seems strange or unreal.

Emotional response to visual recognition of loved ones may be significantly reduced. Feelings of deja vu and jaimas vu are common. Familiar places may look alien, bizarre, and surreal. The world as perceived by the individual may feel like it is going through a "dolly zoom" effect. Such perceptual abnormalities may also extend to the senses of hearing, taste, and smell.

Cannabis can produce feelings resembling derealization, particularly when taken in excess. It can also result from alcohol withdrawal...

Now, while none of the above justifies her consumption/use of alcohol and marijuana that morning, it did make me pause and consider how a person might behave if they were suffering from brain fatigue/jaimas vu; especially someone with Diane's personality. It cannot be easy to maintain "superwoman" all the time, and from the way Diane is described, she was a "type A" multiplied.

Anyway, the more I think about it, the more I theorize. I do hope Danny is able to procure an exhumation for an additional autopsy - if only to give him the peace of knowing he did everything possible, although I doubt they will find anything new.

 

[twinkiesmom]

The above sounds like a black out to me...[/QUOTE]


I agree.

Blackouts represent episodes of amnesia, during which subjects are capable of participating even in salient, emotionally charged events—as well as more mundane events—that they later cannot remember (Goodwin 1995). Like milder alcohol–induced memory impairments, these periods of amnesia are primarily “anterograde,” meaning that alcohol impairs the ability to form new memories while the person is intoxicated, but does not typically erase memories formed before intoxication. Formal research into the nature of alcohol–induced blackouts began in the 1940s with the work of E.M. Jellinek (1946). Jellinek’s initial characterization of blackouts was based on data collected from a survey of Alcoholics Anonymous members. Noting that recovering alcoholics frequently reported having experienced alcohol–induced amnesia while they were drinking, Jellinek concluded that the occurrence of blackouts is a powerful indicator of alcoholism.

In 1969, Goodwin and colleagues published two of the most influential studies in the literature on blackouts (Goodwin et al. 1969a,b). Based on interviews with 100 hospitalized alcoholics, 64 of whom had a history of blackouts, the authors posited the existence of two qualitatively different types of blackouts: en bloc and fragmentary blackouts. People experiencing en bloc blackouts are unable to recall any details whatsoever from events that occurred while they were intoxicated, despite all efforts by the drinkers or others to cue recall. Referring back to our general model of memory formation, it is as if the process of transferring information from short–term to long–term storage has been completely blocked. En bloc memory impairments tend to have a distinct onset. It is usually less clear when these blackouts end because people typically fall asleep before they are over. Interestingly, people appear able to keep information active in short–term memory for at least a few seconds. As a result, they can often carry on conversations, drive automobiles, and engage in other complicated behaviors. Information pertaining to these events is simply not transferred into long–term storage. Ryback (1970) wrote that intoxicated subjects in one of his studies “could carry on conversations during the amnesic state, but could not remember what they said or did 5 minutes earlier. Their immediate and remote memory were intact” (p. 1003). Similarly, in their study of memory impairments in intoxicated alcoholics, Goodwin and colleagues (1970) reported that subjects who experienced blackouts for testing sessions showed intact memory for up to 2 minutes while the sessions were taking place.


http://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/arh27-2/186-196.htm