Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #180

[Pyrite]

All outgoing phone calls made are recorded and subject to monitoring. It says that very clearly to the person making the call and the person receiving the call. I learned all about that in the Murdaugh trial.

That’s true. My brother is in a South Carolina prison and I hear the same message every call. Who is calling and from where, How to block him from calling, how to block all calls from SCDOC, the call is being recorded and may be monitored, and finally hit 1 to accept this call. I have to listen to it all before hitting 1 works.

It may be different in Indiana, but I’d bet it’s mostly the same.

 

[Schatz]

Also. lots of folks have mental illness and still hold jobs. Lots.

 

[steeltowngirl]

Thanks for this article. Do we know if it is true the FBI was “kicked off” the case circa 2021? I see the article you linked was from 2022. Was there ever an article that verified the FBI wasn’t working on the case 2021-2022?

I doubt any local or state agency kicks the FBI off of anything. This press release was Feb 2022.

February 11, 2022

FBI Joins Law Enforcement Partners to Mark Anniversary of Delphi Murders​

DELPHI—Sunday, February 13, marks five years since the murders of 14-year-old Liberty German and 13-year-old Abigail Williams in Delphi, Indiana. Their bodies were discovered in a wooded area on February 14, 2017, not far from the Monon High Bridge trail.
The FBI has provided assistance and resources to the Carroll County Sheriff’s Department, Indiana State Police, and Delphi Police Department in an effort to identify the individual(s) responsible for Libby and Abby’s murders. We remain committed to providing support to our state and local partners.
Anyone with information is requested to call the tip line at 765-822-3535. Callers can remain anonymous. Tips can also be submitted online at abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com.
The case is being featured on the FBI’s Most Wanted page as the Case of the Week: https://www.fbi.gov/wanted.

https://www.fbi.gov/contact-us/field-offices/indianapolis/news/press-releases/fbi-joins-law-enforcement-partners-to-mark-anniversary-of-delphi-murders

 

[snooptroop88]

BBM- There are more confessions that the defense did not mention or include parts of in this filing. Of course they picked things he said that were not true to put in this filing because they have an agenda with this and they want to use these few statements he made that are not supported by evidence to get ALL of the conversations, letters he wrote, and statements he made thrown out.

So imagine if he told his wife accurate information and he told his mother accurate information that only the killer would know. Imagine he wrote the warden and added a detail that wasn't released to the public. Now his lawyers know how damning THAT is so they write up this filing and only include things he said that were bogus, which I think were made AFTER he confessed to his wife and mother. I am sure his mental health went downhill when he realized he was sunk. The reality of his life and how it was going to be now must have really caused him to lose it. I don't know if it was faked or if it was real, but I do think the purpose of him making all the fake statements was to then be used just as they are now. His lawyers can exclude or include any detail they want when they file something. They want ALL the confessions out because they know some of them are not going to help him at all because they contain info that he should not know if he didn't do the crime.

Just my opinion.

If that actually is the case, it would be incredibly alarming for all. This would be the act of someone so wily, scheming and manipulative that he could literally get away with murder. And it would fit with what might emerge as a pattern. If RA reported to LE he had the phone on the trail but in fact did not, it's the same wily type of behavior, he "slips through the cracks" later and does not even become a suspect. It would fit with his surge of panic over the "Odinite guards," and personally, I wouldn't even have made the connection in his situation to the patches. He did, though, even though he's supposed to be so mentally distracted while incarcerated. And it might even fit weirdly with the phone with his image recovered at the scene. He seems perhaps like he wants to be exposed, he wants to be seen-- but only to a point. In the end, he still wants to get away with murder, MOO. And tragically, it might also line up with the CS generally, and its ritualistic qualities. It's been suggested that was done to misdirect LE.
So maybe it was. RA went through a pretty intense program of study to become a pharmacist, it's a STEM focused program and he'd have to be highly intelligent to do it. One would also have to be highly intelligent to have gotten so close to escaping punishment for heinous murders. All MOO, but if he's convicted, I hope they start looking at other murders with similarly distinctive CSs in the area because a pattern like that starts looking like an SK. The "involvement of others" might be pretty indirect in nature in that he uses them to find victims.

 

[katydid23]

For sure. There's been a lot of talk about the memo and why those phone calls were not included. I'm just wondering if maybe they sort of were included, under the context I've been talking about, only not spoken of directly, for whatever reason. I don't think I'm making sense, but that's okay.

I have seen trials where the recorded phone calls from jail or prison have been used against the defendant. No one has ever tried to say they were inadmissible because the authorities were listening in.

I've seen actual recorded confessions used in trials---no one claimed they were coerced and thus inadmissible.

In fact there was a recent TV series on the ID channel--based solely upon recorded conversations and how the recorded calls got the inmates into further legal troubles.

Calls From the Inside​

Season 2 Episodes​

• 2021-2024
• 2 Seasons
• Investigation Discovery
• Documentary
• TV14
• Watchlist
  Where To Watch

A true crime series using jailhouse phone calls to frame the narrative of murder investigations.

Exposing the Cover Up​

Tue, Dec 27, 2022 60 mins

When a former crime reporter is found murdered inside his home, investigators eye his spouse and his neighbours, until intercepted jailhouse calls reveal the true killer.

 

[katydid23]

I was shocked to hear so much evidence had been lost. I would have thought that more than EVER, they (local LE) would have been extraordinarily careful with evidence since none of them had ever (I'm assuming) seen a case like this in their life. They were in over their heads from the very beginning, and I wrongly assumed that would make them extra, extra vigilant. But, it seems they really didn't care about that and "filed" like I do....throw everything in one box and hope to find it later if I need it.It's totally mind boggling to me. We count on these people. We pay them to protect us. And they can't even operate a DVR.

IMO MOO

As to the bolded portion above, BBM, I think that is a bit over the top, a bit too critical to say 'we pay them to protect us' and throw everyone into the mix.

Bureaucracy messes stuff up. Trying to hold on to and store large amounts of data can get screwed up. Things get corrupted or deleted---it's not that unusual nor is it usually one guy's fault. These officers were going about their business, doing their best 'to protect us' in spite of the massive digital failure that corrupted all those interviews.

It sucks. But after working for a large urban school district for years, I have compassion for their mess up. It is hard to keep track of so much data, continuously. Sh___ happens.

 

[Emma Peel]

Journalists trying to do their job...

 

[steeltowngirl]

Since we were talking about the FBI and also a bit about KAK today, I’d like to share a couple of old articles. It’s no secret here that I still think there may be a connection.

Oct. 2022
Doug Kouns, retired FBI agent from the Indianapolis area, discussed one-time person of interest in the Delphi murder investigation Kegan Kline on NewsNation’s “Rush Hour.”

Kouns said it is “very likely” Kline, who admitted to using a fake online profile to solicit photos from at least 15 underage girls, is connected to the arrest of Allen.

“It’s possible, just speculating, of course here, but it seems likely to me based on my professional experience, you know, he’s got his own issues with the charges that he’s facing. And perhaps he had, he provided the information that led to this arrest and could be given some credit,” Kouns said. “It’s hard to say but I would think it’s very likely.”

Report: Man in custody in connection with Delphi homicides

…………
Feb. 2022
Michael Tabman, a retired FBI special agent in charge, talked Monday with News 8 about the possible connection between the deaths, a child *advertiser censored* case, and a social media account. Tabman is not involved in the investigation of the murders.

Kegan Kline has admitted to creating the “anthony_shots” profile, which is being investigated by Indiana State Police in the murders of Abby, 13, and Libby, 14.

Kline has not been charged in the girls murders; no one has. He’s in the Miami County Jail awaiting trial on 30 counts including child *advertiser censored* and child solicitation. He is due back in court at the end of this month.

Tabman said about Kline, “If he was let go after confessing, if he was let go after all these documentations and forensic evidence that the FBI and the state police shared and he was so cooperative, my guess is that he was cooperating on something else, against someone else and they didn’t want to bring that to anyone’s attention.”

Former FBI agent theorizes about elusive search for answers in Delphi murders

 

[TTF14]

As to the bolded portion above, BBM, I think that is a bit over the top, a bit too critical to say 'we pay them to protect us' and throw everyone into the mix.

Bureaucracy messes stuff up. Trying to hold on to and store large amounts of data can get screwed up. Things get corrupted or deleted---it's not that unusual nor is it usually one guy's fault. These officers were going about their business, doing their best 'to protect us' in spite of the massive digital failure that corrupted all those interviews.

It sucks. But after working for a large urban school district for years, I have compassion for their mess up. It is hard to keep track of so much data, continuously. Sh___ happens.

Yes, I get what you're saying. But, if your school district was, say, awarded a huge grant to implement a program you'd been hoping to get started for years, I'd expect extra care and attention would be paid to ensure you pulled it off even better than "regular" school district activities. Not apples to apples of course, but with great responsibility comes great care!

 

[TTF14]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed> Last year I took a different brand name of the anti-depressant I'm on, just for a few days, and had a scary/confusing mental/brain reaction to it. I thought I was going crazy! It was the weirdest thing and nothing like that had ever happened to me before. Looking back, I'm glad it happened because it gave me compassionate insight into just how your mind can play tricks on you when chemically altered. It is hard to comprehend unless you've experienced it. (Edibles do that too in a different way, but that's another topic for another time! )

 

[snooptroop88]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed> Last year I took a different brand name of the anti-depressant I'm on, just for a few days, and had a scary/confusing mental/brain reaction to it. I thought I was going crazy! It was the weirdest thing and nothing like that had ever happened to me before. Looking back, I'm glad it happened because it gave me compassionate insight into just how your mind can play tricks on you when chemically altered. It is hard to comprehend unless you've experienced it. (Edibles do that too in a different way, but that's another topic for another time! )

This is how a lot of us feel after reading the Franks memo.

 

[Cyber sleuth]

This is how a lot of us feel after reading the Franks memo.

BONA FIDE

 

[iamshadow21]

If that actually is the case, it would be incredibly alarming for all. This would be the act of someone so wily, scheming and manipulative that he could literally get away with murder. And it would fit with what might emerge as a pattern. If RA reported to LE he had the phone on the trail but in fact did not, it's the same wily type of behavior, he "slips through the cracks" later and does not even become a suspect. It would fit with his surge of panic over the "Odinite guards," and personally, I wouldn't even have made the connection in his situation to the patches. He did, though, even though he's supposed to be so mentally distracted while incarcerated. And it might even fit weirdly with the phone with his image recovered at the scene. He seems perhaps like he wants to be exposed, he wants to be seen-- but only to a point. In the end, he still wants to get away with murder, MOO. And tragically, it might also line up with the CS generally, and its ritualistic qualities. It's been suggested that was done to misdirect LE.
So maybe it was. RA went through a pretty intense program of study to become a pharmacist, it's a STEM focused program and he'd have to be highly intelligent to do it. One would also have to be highly intelligent to have gotten so close to escaping punishment for heinous murders. All MOO, but if he's convicted, I hope they start looking at other murders with similarly distinctive CSs in the area because a pattern like that starts looking like an SK. The "involvement of others" might be pretty indirect in nature in that he uses them to find victims.

Pretty sure it was determined early on that RA wasn't a pharmacist. Just a salesperson in the section that included the pharmacy. I'll see if I can find a source.

 

[iamshadow21]

Pretty sure it was determined early on that RA wasn't a pharmacist. Just a salesperson in the section that included the pharmacy. I'll see if I can find a source.

According to the media thread, he is a pharmacy tech, not a pharmacist.

IN - Abigail Williams & Liberty German, Delphi, Media, Maps, Timelines NO DISCUSSION #2

Please post media maps & timelines here. *NO DISCUSSION* MISSING: Two 13-year-old girls dropped off to go walking at Carroll County trail Carroll County Sheriff Toby Leazenby said Abigail Williams and Liberty German were last seen around 1 p.m. when they were dropped off to go hiking at...

www.websleuths.com

So he needs the equivalent of a high school diploma, not a degree.

MOO

 

[vinayd]

Pretty sure it was determined early on that RA wasn't a pharmacist. Just a salesperson in the section that included the pharmacy. I'll see if I can find a source.

I remember he may have been a manager who recently promoted to tech. May not have even started the position IIRC.

 

[steeltowngirl]

According to the media thread, he is a pharmacy tech, not a pharmacist.

IN - Abigail Williams & Liberty German, Delphi, Media, Maps, Timelines NO DISCUSSION #2

Please post media maps & timelines here. *NO DISCUSSION* MISSING: Two 13-year-old girls dropped off to go walking at Carroll County trail Carroll County Sheriff Toby Leazenby said Abigail Williams and Liberty German were last seen around 1 p.m. when they were dropped off to go hiking at...

www.websleuths.com

So he needs the equivalent of a high school diploma, not a degree.

MOO

He would have to pass an exam. He has an active license with the Indiana pharmacy board. License #67031838A

Verification

Indiana Pharmacy Tech License | 2024 State Requirements!

Learn more about the 2024 state requirements to obtain an Indiana pharmacy tech license; how to become a pharmacy technician in Indiana!

ptcbtestprep.com

 

[iamshadow21]

He would have to pass an exam. He has an active license with the Indiana pharmacy board. License #67031838A

Verification

Indiana Pharmacy Tech License | 2024 State Requirements!

Learn more about the 2024 state requirements to obtain an Indiana pharmacy tech license; how to become a pharmacy technician in Indiana!

ptcbtestprep.com

Absolutely, but it wouldn't be intensive years of study at university like a pharmacist. They are different roles with completely different qualifications.

MOO

 

[steeltowngirl]

Absolutely, but it wouldn't be intensive years of study at university like a pharmacist. They are different roles with completely different qualifications.

MOO

Agree. I think the OP wanted to point out that he had to study for the position. Not like a walk up hire at McDonalds. He has demonstrated decent intellectual capacity.

 

[Emma Peel]

I was shocked to hear so much evidence had been lost. I would have thought that more than EVER, they (local LE) would have been extraordinarily careful with evidence since none of them had ever (I'm assuming) seen a case like this in their life. They were in over their heads from the very beginning, and I wrongly assumed that would make them extra, extra vigilant. But, it seems they really didn't care about that and "filed" like I do....throw everything in one box and hope to find it later if I need it.

It's totally mind boggling to me. We count on these people. We pay them to protect us. And they can't even operate a DVR.

IMO MOO

As OldCop says: Not reasonable.

 

[Cyber sleuth]

He would have to pass an exam. He has an active license with the Indiana pharmacy board. License #67031838A

Verification

Indiana Pharmacy Tech License | 2024 State Requirements!

Learn more about the 2024 state requirements to obtain an Indiana pharmacy tech license; how to become a pharmacy technician in Indiana!

ptcbtestprep.com

Yes he was licensed as Pharmacy tech in training on 10/3/17 and then became a licensed Pharmacy technician on 2/21/18.
Not sure what his position title was at the time of the murders.