Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #187

[sunshineray]

It's even more exceedingly odd that she was not even dressed in the clothes Libby was reportedly wearing! Where'd they come from?

IMO MOO

Do you have a link for this please, TIA

 

[Jade]

That's what I thought.
And about the jailhouse confession...overheard and recorded by LE.

The state’s eavesdropping statute, 720 ILCS 5/14-1, -2, makes it a crime to record a “private conversation” without the consent of all parties involved.

If that holds for prisoners, then the confession is inadmissible.

The confessions are admissible.

Indiana says the contents of wire tapped conversations must be disclosed to the subject prior to trial.

That’s been done officially so no problem with that evidence.

There’s no limit to Indiana Law Enforcement's disclosure of wire tapped contents:

https://books.google.com/books?id=HEL0M-boMpgC&pg=PA22&lpg=PA22&dq=eavesdropping+statute,+720+ILCS+5/14-1,+-2,+Indiana&source=bl&ots=9mquWtV1v0&sig=ACfU3U0EubxEUxM76hFiItnNFmAobSnM7Q&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi4ltzj_ZeHAxVFG9AFHVcPAd4Q6AF6BAgKEAM#v=onepage&q=eavesdropping statute, 720 ILCS 5/14-1, -2, Indiana&f=false


Offenders are advised during admission and orientation of the offender telephone system privileges and are required to sign a document indicating the parameters of the calling system.

It is posted that facility calls may be monitored and recorded:

>>>>>>>>

State of Indiana
Indiana Department of Correction
ADMINISTRATIVE PROCEDURES Manual of Policies and Procedures

[…]
The telephones used in the offender calling system may be connected to a telephone monitoring device.
[…]
Offenders shall be advised during facility orientation that telephone calls made using the offender calling system may be monitored. Signs are to be posted prominently above the telephones used in the offender calling system indicating that any telephone call may be monitored and/or recorded.
[…]

https://www.in.gov/idoc/files/02-01-105_AP_Telephone_Privileges_3-15-03.pdf


imo

 

[TTF14]

Do you have a link for this please, TIA

 

[Gunther Toody]

There is no expectation of privacy during phone calls between inmates/arrestees and their family members and friends. In fact, many jails and prisons give warnings to arrestees/inmates and their visitors that their conversations may be recorded.

Are Inmate Phone Calls Private? Are They Public Record? | Balduchi Law Office, PC.

Deleted

 

[sunshineray]

Where does GH say Abby didn't have Libby's clothes on but someone else's? TIA

 

[TTF14]

Where does GH say Abby didn't have Libby's clothes on but someone else's? TIA

I didn't say that. Let me go read what I said again in case I had a typo!

 

[Gunther Toody]

The confessions are admissible.

Indiana says the contents of wire tapped conversations must be disclosed to the subject prior to trial.

That’s been done officially so no problem with that evidence.

There’s no limit to Indiana Law Enforcement's disclosure of wire tapped contents:

https://books.google.com/books?id=HEL0M-boMpgC&pg=PA22&lpg=PA22&dq=eavesdropping+statute,+720+ILCS+5/14-1,+-2,+Indiana&source=bl&ots=9mquWtV1v0&sig=ACfU3U0EubxEUxM76hFiItnNFmAobSnM7Q&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi4ltzj_ZeHAxVFG9AFHVcPAd4Q6AF6BAgKEAM#v=onepage&q=eavesdropping statute, 720 ILCS 5/14-1, -2, Indiana&f=false


Offenders are advised during admission and orientation of the offender telephone system privileges and are required to sign a document indicating the parameters of the calling system.

It is posted that facility calls may be monitored and recorded:

>>>>>>>>

State of Indiana
Indiana Department of Correction
ADMINISTRATIVE PROCEDURES Manual of Policies and Procedures

[…]
The telephones used in the offender calling system may be connected to a telephone monitoring device.
[…]
Offenders shall be advised during facility orientation that telephone calls made using the offender calling system may be monitored. Signs are to be posted prominently above the telephones used in the offender calling system indicating that any telephone call may be monitored and/or recorded.
[…]

https://www.in.gov/idoc/files/02-01-105_AP_Telephone_Privileges_3-15-03.pdf


imo

With that in mind...do you think him dumb enough to confess over the telephone to killing the girls?

 

[TTF14]

I didn't say that. Let me go read what I said again in case I had a typo!

OK, I didn't have a typo. I think I was just misunderstood.

When the girls went missing, the family said Abby was wearing XX and Libby was wearing YY.

When the girls were found, Libby was nude and Abby was wearing ZZ, reportedly Libby's clothes.

What happened to YY? What happened to XX? Gray Hughes says "that concept (of what the girls were originally wearing) is no longer a reality."

 

[Spartygirl]

With that in mind...do you think him dumb enough to confess over the telephone to killing the girls?

Yes

and apparently he did just that !! IMO

 

[sunshineray]

I didn't say that. Let me go read what I said again in case I had a typo!

TTF14 said:
"It's even more exceedingly odd that she was not even dressed in the clothes Libby was reportedly wearing! Where'd they come from?"

This was it. Can you give an approximate time stamp, TIA

 

[sunshineray]

OK, I didn't have a typo. I think I was just misunderstood.

When the girls went missing, the family said Abby was wearing XX and Libby was wearing YY.

When the girls were found, Libby was nude and Abby was wearing ZZ, reportedly Libby's clothes.

What happened to YY? What happened to XX? Gray Hughes says "that concept (of what the girls were originally wearing) is no longer a reality."

Abby, according to the FM, was wearing Libby's jeans. I believe there's a photo of clothes recovered from Deer Creek and it looks like Libby's shirt is included in them. I believe also in the FM it said Abby had her shirt on and a sweatshirt (probably the same one she's shown wearing in the bridge picture Libby took of her?)

What "ZZ" clothes are you saying GH was talking about on Abby?

 

[TTF14]

Abby, according to the FM, was wearing Libby's jeans. I believe there's a photo of clothes recovered from Deer Creek and it looks like Libby's shirt is included in them. I believe also in the FM it said Abby had her shirt on and a sweatshirt (probably the same one she's shown wearing in the bridge picture Libby took of her?)

What "ZZ" clothes are you saying GH was talking about on Abby?

When Abby was found, she was not wearing the sweatshirt she was pictured in on the bridge. She was wearing a black Delphi swim sweatshirt. And Libby's jeans.

XX: Abby's skinny jeans, pink top, gray hoodie
YY: Gray sweatpants with black lettering, tie-dye T-shirt
ZZ: Black Delphi swim hoodie, Libby's jeans

If RA is the killer, how'd he get a hold of Libby's outfit to dress Abby in? Libby wasn't wearing it. Did the girls bring a change of clothes?

ETA: to clarify my first sentence

 

[sunshineray]

Abby was not wearing the sweatshirt she was pictured in on the bridge. She was wearing a black Delphi swim sweatshirt. And Libby's jeans.

XX: Abby's skinny jeans, pink top, gray hoodie
YY: Gray sweatpants with black lettering, tie-dye T-shirt
ZZ: Black Delphi swim hoodie, Libby's jeans

If RA is the killer, how'd he get a hold of Libby's outfit to dress Abby in? Libby wasn't wearing it. Did the girls bring a change of clothes?

I think the misunderstanding is Libby wearing jeans, not grey sweatpants. The other sweatshirt was probably borrowed from in Kelsei's car?

I suppose it's always a possiblity that Libby wore her tight jeans (meaning tight for her build) under some sweatpants? But I thought long ago it was cleared up that BP was mistaken about the sweatpants?

The girls were only going to be at the trails for an hour or so, being dropped off right before 2pm and DG to pick them up 3pm or little after. I doubt they brought a change of clothes, just borrowed sweatshirts from Kelsi's car. MO

 

[Salah11]

When Abby was found, she was not wearing the sweatshirt she was pictured in on the bridge. She was wearing a black Delphi swim sweatshirt. And Libby's jeans.

XX: Abby's skinny jeans, pink top, gray hoodie
YY: Gray sweatpants with black lettering, tie-dye T-shirt
ZZ: Black Delphi swim hoodie, Libby's jeans

If RA is the killer, how'd he get a hold of Libby's outfit to dress Abby in? Libby wasn't wearing it. Did the girls bring a change of clothes?

ETA: to clarify my first sentence

Where has this information come other than the unreliable defense and the franks motion?

Didn’t Libby’s sister give them sweatshirts to take with them?!

 

[TTF14]

But I thought long ago it was cleared up that BP was mistaken about the sweatpants?

RSBM

Not that I'm aware of. I mean, it's likely she told Gray Hughes what to say, but this information didn't come out until after the gag order was in place.

IMO MOO

 

[girlhasnoname]

With that in mind...do you think him dumb enough to confess over the telephone to killing the girls?

I absolutely believe RA confessed the truth to his wife and mother, the 2 people closest to him. For what purpose; debatable:

He could have wanted to tell them before the States Discovery Dump was released to the public.

He may have felt overwhelming shame (not guilt IMO) that the information was going to become known to everyone in the world. The CS details, at least per the D's FM, paints one of the most gruesome, twisted, sick crime scenes I've ever heard of.

JMO

 

[Ravenmoon]

Nothing. The main investigators were deposed by the defense team and it was confirmed there is no direct evidence. No dna, fingerprints or digital data that connects RA to crime scene or victims.

https://www.scribd.com/document/611146469/Unsealed-Probable-Cause-Affidavit-Richard-Allen-Delphi


There is quite a bit of circumstancal evidence.

A few things to remember:
.
RA originally placed himself on the trail from 1:30 until 3,:30.

He saw a group of girls on his way to walk on the high bridge as the group was departing. The left at approximately 1:30.

RA describes himself wearing the same clothes that BG wore that day.

He has no alibi that proves his changing statement that he departed earlier than originally stated.

His gun has a ballistic match to the round that was discovered between 2 dead girls. This is a gun that he has adamantly stated was never loaned out to anyone.

While this information may not feel compelling, if someone takes even just this SMALL tidbit of information, it is powerful.

How many grown men, wearing the same clothing, walked that trail at those exact times and had THEIR bullet from their gun found at the crime scene?

This is only the tip of the iceberg for the public IMO.

He has made repeated confessions to many people.

Circumstancal evidence still wins many cases. TV shows have us believing that a crime cannot be proven without DNA and/or fingerprints. And...I am willing to bet that a bombshell could be dropped during trial. Of course, that is my opinion only.

AJMO

https://www.scribd.com/document/611146469/Unsealed-Probable-Cause-Affidavit-Richard-Allen-Delphi

Unsealed Probable Cause Affidavit - Richard Allen, Delphi | PDF | Arrest Warrant | Probable Cause

Unsealed Probable Cause Affidavit - Richard Allen, Delphi

www.scribd.com

 

[TTF14]

Where has this information come other than the unreliable defense and the franks motion?

Didn’t Libby’s sister give them sweatshirts to take with them?!

The leaked crime scene photos.

And yes, about eight months after the crime, the "I gave them sweatshirts to wear" emerged as part of the events/timeline of that morning. It was not in the original description.

IMO MOO

 

[Salah11]

The leaked crime scene photos.

And yes, about eight months after the crime, the "I gave them sweatshirts to wear" emerged as part of the events/timeline of that morning. It was not in the original description.

IMO MOO

I highly doubt the family were hiding anything and simply were overwhelmed at the time.

Do you have a link so I can see the crime scene photos of the clothes?

 

[Jade]

With that in mind...do you think him dumb enough to confess over the telephone to killing the girls?

Richard Allen confessed to his wife and mother. His closest family supporters.

I wouldn’t characterize it as dumb as it’s his right to freely confess during his phone calls to his wife and mother.


[...]
Carter said. "To the murderer, I believe you have just a little bit of a conscience left.
[...]
Why 'The Shack' 2017 film was mentioned in reference to unsolved Delphi murders


Probably figured his goose is cooked as he is awaiting trial on his dumb crime he might as well go ahead and confess to them and get it off his mind.

RA settled in once he got his confessing over with and then wiped his hands of his wife not acknowledging her in court after the confession phone call.



[…]

Allen's wife, Kathy Allen, reportedly burst into tears at the sight of him as he was led into the courtroom.

Also present for the hearing were Aine Caine and Kevin Greenlee, the journalist-lawyer couple behind the investigative true-crime podcast, The Murder Sheet.

The pair told The U.S. Sun that as Allen was led by officers past his wife he offered Kathy no acknowledgement whatsoever.

"Because in the past, in previous hearings, he usually acknowledges her in some way: his eyes will meet her and on one occasion he mouthed the words, 'I love you,' to her.

"But when he walked past her [on Thursday] it was really striking because there was no sign of any recognition at all.

"His face was just completely blank."

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen ignores wife in court & leaves her in tears



imo