Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #187

[grannygates]

https://www.scribd.com/document/611146469/Unsealed-Probable-Cause-Affidavit-Richard-Allen-Delphi


There is quite a bit of circumstancal evidence.

A few things to remember:
.
RA originally placed himself on the trail from 1:30 until 3,:30.

He saw a group of girls on his way to walk on the high bridge as the group was departing. The left at approximately 1:30.

RA describes himself wearing the same clothes that BG wore that day.

He has no alibi that proves his changing statement that he departed earlier than originally stated.

His gun has a ballistic match to the round that was discovered between 3 dead girls. This is a gun that he has adamantly stated was never loaned out to anyone.

While this information may not feel compelling, if someone takes even just this SMALL tidbit of information, it is powerful.

How many grown men, wearing the same clothing, walked that trail at those exact times and had THEIR bullet from their gun found at the crime scene?

This is only the tip of the iceberg for the public IMO.

He has made repeated confessions to many people.

Circumstancal evidence still wins many cases. TV shows have us believing that a crime cannot be proven without DNA and/or fingerprints. And...I am willing to bet that a bombshell could be dropped during trial. Of course, that is my only.

AJMO

https://www.scribd.com/document/611146469/Unsealed-Probable-Cause-Affidavit-Richard-Allen-Delphi

Unsealed Probable Cause Affidavit - Richard Allen, Delphi | PDF | Arrest Warrant | Probable Cause

Unsealed Probable Cause Affidavit - Richard Allen, Delphi

www.scribd.com

In all fairness, according to DD, Richard Allen Whiteman was at the trial between the hours of 1:30-3:30. If there’s errors in the name, there could be errors elsewhere. That’s why LE should be video/audio recording everything. During the actual video recorded interview, RA says he left at 1:30 and his car is seen on the HH video driving towards his house at 1:27.

IMO The PCA witness statements are piecemealed to fit TLs decided narrative. The 4 girls was changed to 3, BB says she saw a 20 year old with poofy hair and a mercury comet, SC says she saw a muddy man in a tan jacket. That’s all omitted/changed to force the PCA.

So I do agree if you manipulate the witness statements like TL did, you could work a way to circumstantially put RA there. But if we are looking at direct evidence, JH and TL have stated under oath there is none.

All MOO

 

[TTF14]

I highly doubt the family were hiding anything and simply were overwhelmed at the time.

Do you have a link so I can see the crime scene photos of the clothes?

I didn't say the family was hiding anything. I said the sweatshirts weren't mentioned at all until about 8 months after the crime.

And no, I do not have a link to the crime scene photos. Gray Hughes saw them though, and discussed them in the video I posted above.

 

[CCJD]

OK, I didn't have a typo. I think I was just misunderstood.

When the girls went missing, the family said Abby was wearing XX and Libby was wearing YY.

When the girls were found, Libby was nude and Abby was wearing ZZ, reportedly Libby's clothes.

What happened to YY? What happened to XX? Gray Hughes says "that concept (of what the girls were originally wearing) is no longer a reality."

Article from when the girls went missing. Not a fan of GH so just looked for something in print.

Libby is described as standing 5'4" tall with a heavy build. She has blonde shoulder-length hair and blue eyes. She was last seen wearing a tie-dyed shirt with fringe at the bottom, gray sweat pants with unknown black lettering and black Nike shoes.

Abby is described as standing 5'4" tall with a small build, medium length blonde hair and hazel eyes. She was last seen wearing a gray zip-up sweatshirt with a burgundy T-shirt underneath and blue jeans.

MISSING: Two 13-year-old Carroll Co. girls

Two 13-year-old Carroll County girls are missing after they were dropped off to go hiking Monday afternoon.

www.wrtv.com

 

[Salah11]

I didn't say the family was hiding anything. I said the sweatshirts weren't mentioned at all until about 8 months after the crime.

And no, I do not have a link to the crime scene photos. Gray Hughes saw them though, and discussed them in the video I posted above.

So why mention it unless you believe there is something amiss with it not coming out until 8 months later?

And thanks so basically no proof until trial this story of the changing clothes is right. Imo

 

[TTF14]

So why mention it unless you believe there is something amiss with it not coming out until 8 months later?

Because it wasn't in the original description of what the girls were wearing. Not by the family, LE, or MSM.

Anyone can choose to ignore the fact that Abby was found in clothing that neither Abby or Libby were reported to be missing in. I get it....it makes the facts/timeline of this case not.quite.fit. And that's uncomfortable. I'm ok with it being uncomfortable because I want the right person(s) to be convicted of this crime and there's a lot that just does not make sense, including the clothing one of the victims was found in.

IMO MOO

 

[Ravenmoon]

In all fairness, according to DD, Richard Allen Whiteman was at the trial between the hours of 1:30-3:30. If there’s errors in the name, there could be errors elsewhere. That’s why LE should be video/audio recording everything. During the actual video recorded interview, RA says he left at 1:30 and his car is seen on the HH video driving towards his house at 1:27.

IMO The PCA witness statements are piecemealed to fit TLs decided narrative. The 4 girls was changed to 3, BB says she saw a 20 year old with poofy hair and a mercury comet, SC says she saw a muddy man in a tan jacket. That’s all omitted/changed to force the PCA.

So I do agree if you manipulate the witness statements like TL did, you could work a way to circumstantially put RA there. But if we are looking at direct evidence, JH and TL have stated under oath there is none.

All MOO

Let's not forget that the change in time could be purposely changed because RA was now a suspect.

I am unaware of anything stating that RA'S vehicle was leaving the scene rather than arriving.

The rest is basically going to have to be clarified at trial.
And I respectfully disagree that statements were manipulated....
I think that the one that could be easily explained is the " muddy and bloody" one.

If I am not mistaken, the original statement was "<muddy and bloody, he looked like he had been in a fight.'

Well, if a person appears to have been in a fight, would you imagine seeing a person both dirty and bloody? I would. Otherwise, I would not have assumed a fight had taken place.

Of course that's just my opinion.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

With that in mind...do you think him dumb enough to confess over the telephone to killing the girls?

Yes.
And I’ll add that his own attorneys conceded that he had done it in open court last summer.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Richard Allen confessed to his wife and mother. His closest family supporters.

I wouldn’t characterize it as dumb as it’s his right to freely confess during his phone calls to his wife and mother.


[...]
Carter said. "To the murderer, I believe you have just a little bit of a conscience left.
[...]
Why 'The Shack' 2017 film was mentioned in reference to unsolved Delphi murders


Probably figured his goose is cooked as he is awaiting trial on his dumb crime he might as well go ahead and confess to them and get it off his mind.

RA settled in once he got his confessing over with and then wiped his hands of his wife not acknowledging her in court after the confession phone call.



[…]

Allen's wife, Kathy Allen, reportedly burst into tears at the sight of him as he was led into the courtroom.

Also present for the hearing were Aine Caine and Kevin Greenlee, the journalist-lawyer couple behind the investigative true-crime podcast, The Murder Sheet.

The pair told The U.S. Sun that as Allen was led by officers past his wife he offered Kathy no acknowledgement whatsoever.

"Because in the past, in previous hearings, he usually acknowledges her in some way: his eyes will meet her and on one occasion he mouthed the words, 'I love you,' to her.

"But when he walked past her [on Thursday] it was really striking because there was no sign of any recognition at all.

"His face was just completely blank."

Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen ignores wife in court & leaves her in tears



imo

Not surprising to me at all, once RA saw the State's evidence in black and white he knew he had to tell wife and mom first, and once that was done, he was done with the shame and done with them. I never felt RA confessed out of guilt because I don't believe he felt guilt, just the shame and embarrassment of being caught.

I bet RA downplayed the details significantly to wife and Mom as well, something along the lines of:

"I killed those girls (RA distancing himself from their names Abby &Libby) I did it but I did not do any of those horrible things you might hear SA, posing, etc." .

You know KA called Rozzi/Baldwin right after she hung up on RA and told him what RA had said IMO. This happened on April 3rd and they had a Motion to Transfer from Westville filed the next morning.

JMO

 

[StarryStarryNight]

We don’t even know if BG was the one carrying the gun or if one exists. All we know is that a person wearing jeans is videotaped walking, tiny blurry image, the camera goes down but audio keeps rolling,

LE thinks they hear the word “gun”. Could that be “that guy is a weirdo, I wish we had a gun” or “oh, he has a gun”. We haven’t heard.

Muddy turned into bloody, so I’m hesitant to believe context without hearing it myself.

Contrary to the patchwork PCA, I don’t think BG is “seen and heard” saying down the hill. If true (and I don’t think it is) that would up close and give a way better image to share with the public. IMO a man’s voice is heard, we don’t know if it’s BGs or someone else who came up from the private drive.BG could be an accomplice and someone else did the actual murders. There’s allegedly no direct evidence linking anyone to the crime scene, even with that very involved staging.

And the bullet. How do we know it’s connected to this crime? IMO It was found buried in the ground near the crime scene. IMO It could dropped by one of the hundreds of people wearing guns who tromped through there over the years or carried through the silt in freshet.

There’s too many other options and explanations for me and no real evidence to back up the Ps claims. I think that this crime doesn’t match the prosecutions timeline at all, way too much to do in like 45 minutes and then the walk back to the car for 3:30. I think more than one person is involved (and so did LE). I think RAs charges still include accomplice liability?

I’ll be interested to see what type of evidence comes up at trial. From what I’ve been reading the P’s entire case pivoted from the actual crime into focusing on the “incriminating statements”. I’d prefer they focus on proving the crime actually did occur in the manner they claim via real evidence first.

Goodness.
You can have your opinion, but I can have mine too, and this is rubbish.
Under the guise of explaining the case to someone new to it, you have completely twisted everything and are simply blasting out the highly slanted statements and lies of the defense team that you adhere to. Shameless.
Why not just advise them to do some research because the case is complicated. The mob, who believe RA is probably guilty, are berated often to do some research. But not here. Fresh meat I guess.
Whoever is the OP, please do your own research. It’s a lot to do, but you need more than a one sided look. Then you can take sides if you want.

MOSBI——my opinion stand by it

 

[Salah11]

Because it wasn't in the original description of what the girls were wearing. Not by the family, LE, or MSM.

Anyone can choose to ignore the fact that Abby was found in clothing that neither Abby or Libby were reported to be missing in. I get it....it makes the facts/timeline of this case not.quite.fit. And that's uncomfortable. I'm ok with it being uncomfortable because I want the right person(s) to be convicted of this crime and there's a lot that just does not make sense, including the clothing one of the victims was found in.

IMO MOO

It doesn’t make me at all uncomfortable. RA has admitted it’s him and placed himself on the bridge moments before the girls got there.

He is as guilty as sin the only questions that remain is the why and did he act alone.

IMHO

 

[sunshineray]

When Abby was found, she was not wearing the sweatshirt she was pictured in on the bridge. She was wearing a black Delphi swim sweatshirt. And Libby's jeans.

XX: Abby's skinny jeans, pink top, gray hoodie
YY: Gray sweatpants with black lettering, tie-dye T-shirt
ZZ: Black Delphi swim hoodie, Libby's jeans

If RA is the killer, how'd he get a hold of Libby's outfit to dress Abby in? Libby wasn't wearing it. Did the girls bring a change of clothes?

ETA: to clarify my first sentence

Where are you getting the information that Libby wasn't wearing the jeans that day?

 

[Vaderman]

If RA knew they were coming

If he is guilty, I wonder if he did know they were coming and if so, how.

I don't know what's worse--it being a crime of opportunity or a crime that was pre-planned.

 

[TTF14]

It doesn’t make me at all uncomfortable. RA has admitted it’s him and placed himself on the bridge moments before the girls got there.

He is as guilty as sin the only questions that remain is the why and did he act alone.

IMHO

How do you think he got his hands on a completely different change of clothes for Abby? Clothing that neither one of them were originally wearing? I realize you think it's a lie simply because it's in the Franks memo, but many, many people saw the photos and commented publicly on them. So, IF it's true....what's your feeling about it? Willing to brush it under the rug as unexplained? Just curious how you'd rationalize it.

 

[Cyber sleuth]

Because it wasn't in the original description of what the girls were wearing. Not by the family, LE, or MSM.

Anyone can choose to ignore the fact that Abby was found in clothing that neither Abby or Libby were reported to be missing in. I get it....it makes the facts/timeline of this case not.quite.fit. And that's uncomfortable. I'm ok with it being uncomfortable because I want the right person(s) to be convicted of this crime and there's a lot that just does not make sense, including the clothing one of the victims was found in.

IMO MOO

My opinion is the author(s) of the Franks made an error in describing the crime scene. They did not get correctly identify who was wearing what article of clothing.
Simple as that.
All my opinion

 

[Ravenmoon]

How do you think he got his hands on a completely different change of clothes for Abby? Clothing that neither one of them were originally wearing? I realize you think it's a lie simply because it's in the Franks memo, but many, many people saw the photos and commented publicly on them. So, IF it's true....what's your feeling about it? Willing to brush it under the rug as unexplained? Just curious how you'd rationalize it.

Do we know for a fact that neither girl carried a backpack that day?
Do we have any information on whether or not DG was supposed to take AW home after picking the girls up?

Is it possible that there was a backpack containing changes of clothing ?

I AM NOT STATING ANY OF THIS AS FACT.

It is just something that I have wondered about and I believe it could be possible.

JMO

 

[grannygates]

Goodness.
You can have your opinion, but I can have mine too, and this is rubbish.
Under the guise of explaining the case to someone new to it, you have completely twisted everything and are simply blasting out the highly slanted statements and lies of the defense team that you adhere to. Shameless.
Why not just advise them to do some research because the case is complicated. The mob, who believe RA is probably guilty, are berated often to do some research. But not here. Fresh meat I guess.
Whoever is the OP, please do your own research. It’s a lot to do, but you need more than a one sided look. Then you can take sides if you want.

MOSBI——my opinion stand by it

Lol I’m the one constantly regurgitating for people to do their own research.

Not even law enforcement can agree on what happened here. I think it’s fair to say that there are a lot of unknowns, very little evidence and a lot more questions than answers.

If the FBI, CCSO, ISP can’t even agree on what happened and have completely opposing theories with actually seeing all the evidence, it’s also fair that regular people have varying theories as well.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

It doesn’t make me at all uncomfortable. RA has admitted it’s him and placed himself on the bridge moments before the girls got there.

He is as guilty as sin the only questions that remain is the why and did he act alone.

IMHO

Agree.
Folks who believe the defense nonsense never want to discuss RA admitting to being on the first platform of the bridge,
or that a witness saw him on the first platform of the bridge,
and that the witness told LE that in 2017,
and LE had been waiting through the years to find out who that guy was, and, voila!,
RA freely admits it in October of 2022. And the witness saw who believed to be Libby and Abby headed to the bridge just moments after she turned and headed up the trail.
or that LE showed a picture of RA to the witness who said, that’s the guy I saw.
These are facts from the PCA, which explains why some people are attacking it. The truth hurts.

My opinion.

Edit: left something out

 

[sunshineray]

With that in mind...do you think him dumb enough to confess over the telephone to killing the girls?

I certainly do, yes indeed. Although I wouldn't call it stupidity, just finally growing a tiny bit of a conscience. Probably talking to his Mom and wife waa the catalist. Maybe it all coincided with the talk with the mental health doctor where he also confessed...or letters to the warden? Sometimes people do want to confess for the good and true reasons. AJMO

 

[TTF14]

Do we know for a fact that neither girl carried a backpack that day?
Do we have any information on whether or not DG was supposed to take AW home after picking the girls up?

Is it possible that there was a backpack containing changes of clothing ?

I AM NOT STATING ANY OF THIS AS FACT.

It is just something that I have wondered about and I believe it could be possible.

JMO

A backpack hasn't been mentioned, but of course absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, so I suppose it is possible. But, IIRC, Anna said she told Abby that she could stay at Libby's house longer than planned that day (go to the trails) if either they could take her home or she'd have to wait until Anna was off work to be picked up, which I think (?) she said would be after dinner.

 

[TTF14]

These are facts from the PCA, which explains why some people are attacking it. The truth hurts.

My opinion.

And Tony Liggett has been accused of lying to obtain the PCA.