Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #188

[Cyber sleuth]

I agree, I see it as whistleblowing as well. Posting on internet is not like the old days when letters could be burned, nothing is private when a group is involved. I’m shocked that none of this group is more cautious - especially if becoming involved in a professional capacity - of this old but true adage -

*Never Write Down What You Don't Want Others to Know*​

IMO it serves them right that they were outed. They ought to be ashamed of their foolish, thoughtless and arrogant behaviour. Hopefully they might learn something from this and realize how over the line they acted and back away from their power trip to nowhere.

​

Agree - I know many attorneys and if they had been brazen enough to put these disgusting thoughts to actual words it would have been over a phone call
I am absolutely beyond disappointed in the actions of individuals that should have had the professional wherewithal to not partake in this behavior.
I am also surprised that some otherwise smart, logical people that typically show discernment are defending or downplaying this behavior.
One can be a faithful supporter of the defense team and not condone this behavior. At some point it’s more dignified to recognize that the behavior was out of line, and call a spade a spade.
It’s painfully obvious it was a bad move. They got caught and now they will pay whatever legal, professional and/or social penalties that follow.

 

[photographer4]

Agree - I know many attorneys and if they had been brazen enough to put these disgusting thoughts to actual words it would have been over a phone call
I am absolutely beyond disappointed in the actions of individuals that should have had the professional wherewithal to not partake in this behavior.
I am also surprised that some otherwise smart, logical people that typically show discernment are defending or downplaying this behavior.
One can be a faithful supporter of the defense team and not condone this behavior. At some point it’s more dignified to recognize that the behavior was out of line, and call a spade a spade.
It’s painfully obvious it was a bad move. They got caught and now they will pay whatever legal, professional and/or social penalties that follow.

So I am wondering: if there are to be repercussions for B & R over whatever was said in the Ms podcast, what are they likely to be? Who is likely to seek repercussions and how? Eg: is JG likely to throw them off the case at the upcoming pretrials? Is NM likely to file some sort of contempt motion? Is someone (who?) likely to complain to whichever board has oversight of the law profession (eg: ethics board)?

2. How about the players involved in the chat? What repercussions if any could they experience as a result?

3. When would we expect to begin to learn of any consequences for all concerned?

 

[Cyber sleuth]

So I am wondering: if there are to be repercussions for B & R over whatever was said in the Ms podcast, what are they likely to be? Who is likely to seek repercussions and how? Eg: is JG likely to throw them off the case at the upcoming pretrials? Is NM likely to file some sort of contempt motion? Is someone (who?) likely to complain to whichever board has oversight of the law profession (eg: ethics board)?

2. How about the players involved in the chat? What repercussions if any could they experience as a result?

3. When would we expect to begin to learn of any consequences for all concerned?

I don’t have the answers to these questions.
I suspect that socially and professionally there may have already been some consequences. What, I don’t know.
Sometimes the wheels of justice turn slowly when it comes to legal consequences. I guess we will see.
In the interim I imagine they are being shunned in some dignified circles.
More importantly; consequences shouldn’t be the only thing deterring civilized human beings from making bad judgements. Everyday we are expected to govern ourselves within the confines of what is legally, ethically and morally responsible. It’s impossible for all of us to be monitored at all times by enforcing bodies.
Otherwise we will see a repeat of The Lord of the Flies where rules just go out the window when penalties aren’t being consistently provided.
That would be a dangerous and shameful experience IMO

 

[TTF14]

So I am wondering: if there are to be repercussions for B & R over whatever was said in the Ms podcast, what are they likely to be? Who is likely to seek repercussions and how? Eg: is JG likely to throw them off the case at the upcoming pretrials? Is NM likely to file some sort of contempt motion? Is someone (who?) likely to complain to whichever board has oversight of the law profession (eg: ethics board)?

2. How about the players involved in the chat? What repercussions if any could they experience as a result?

3. When would we expect to begin to learn of any consequences for all concerned?

Great questions!

 

[sunshineray]

So I am wondering: if there are to be repercussions for B & R over whatever was said in the Ms podcast, what are they likely to be? Who is likely to seek repercussions and how? Eg: is JG likely to throw them off the case at the upcoming pretrials? Is NM likely to file some sort of contempt motion? Is someone (who?) likely to complain to whichever board has oversight of the law profession (eg: ethics board)?

2. How about the players involved in the chat? What repercussions if any could they experience as a result?

3. When would we expect to begin to learn of any consequences for all concerned?

Well if it can be proven that AB & BR met with any of the "Gang" and discussed the case with them...that could be a whole lotta trouble. Ditto for their PI...and if CW was "working" for the defense writing briefs etc..with or without a NDA and talked the details of the case with others, really not good. JMO

 

[Cyber sleuth]

Well if it can be proven that AB & BR met with any of the "Gang" and discussed the case with them...that could be a whole lotta trouble. Ditto for their PI...and if CW was "working" for the defense writing briefs etc..with or without a NDA and talked the details of the case with others, really not good. JMO

Not to be pessimistic but quite honestly I doubt we will see any significant penalties here. If the past is any indication of this it is a high legal bar to prove guilt and even then the penalties are light. I don't have to like it, but unfortunately its the way it tends to go.
I believe MW walked away with a diversion program requirement for his involvement in “the leak” and AB&BR may have some professional board to answer to for their part but let’s be realistic here- the consequences will most likely be underwhelming and years from being handed down.
Unfortunately, the consequences don’t always match the misdeed and shouldn’t be the measurement used to determine the gravity of the conduct.

 

[arielilane]

@NewsyBarbara


Indiana Supreme Court DENIES Defense motion to remove Judge Gull in #Delphi case. Court ruled Gull did miss the deadlines cited by Defense, but bc they filed other motions - Allen is not protected by the trial rule cited. All sides meet again July 29-August 1...(more)


1:24 PM · Jul 19, 2024





in Delphi for a motions hearing. Trial is scheduled for October 14, 2024 in Delphi. Jury selection will happen in Allen County with an Allen Co. jury pool.


1:25 PM · Jul 19, 2024

 

[legalmomma]

Indiana Courts Case Search - MyCase

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

State of Indiana v. Richard M. Allen​

Case Number	24S-SJ-00237
Court	Supreme Court
Type	SJ - Special Judges
Filed	07/11/2024
Status	07/11/2024 , Pending (active)
Reference	Case cross references Original County Cause Number 08C012210MR1
Related	Lower Trial Court Case 08C01-2210-MR-000001

​

Chronological Case Summary​

07/11/2024	Request for Special Judge Praecipe for Determination Whether a Ruling Has Been Delayed beyond the Time Limitations Set Forth Under Trial Rule 53.1 filed in the trial court on 07/11/2024 File Stamp: 07/11/2024
07/19/2024	Notice of Determination - Withdrawal of Judge Denied Notice denying withdrawal of submission pursuant to Trial Rule 53.1/53.2 Serve: Trial Clerk 08 - Carroll Serve: Office of Judicial Admin, Chief Admin Officer Serve: Gull, Frances M. Cutino File Stamp: 07/19/2024

 

[TTF14]

@NewsyBarbara


Indiana Supreme Court DENIES Defense motion to remove Judge Gull in #Delphi case. Court ruled Gull did miss the deadlines cited by Defense, but bc they filed other motions - Allen is not protected by the trial rule cited. All sides meet again July 29-August 1...(more)


1:24 PM · Jul 19, 2024





in Delphi for a motions hearing. Trial is scheduled for October 14, 2024 in Delphi. Jury selection will happen in Allen County with an Allen Co. jury pool.


1:25 PM · Jul 19, 2024

She's in Delphi a full ten days before the hearings? Hmmm....wonder if she has some kind of inside scoop that something's gonna happen.

IMO MOO

 

[Ravenmoon]

I know that there has been some chatter about the lack of evidence on the side of the P. I was able to locate this article. It should be reassuring to those that worry that the case could be weak.

Reporter :'The probable cause affidavit, I suspect, is going to answer a lot of I-Team 8’s questions. Will it answer all of our questions?'

Carter: "Oh, no. Remember, this case is 2,100 days old, and the facts in their totality will come out at the trial and not until then. I can appreciate the desire for our citizens to have these questions answered, and my response to that is it will come when it will come. It will come, but if any of us said anything, that would be' detrimental to the prosecution of the person or persons that killed Abby and Libby, and I was responsible. You should hold me accountable, too”
diana police superintendent: Delphi murders' facts will come out at trial

 

[TTF14]

the facts in their totality will come out at the trial

rsbm bbm

Oh boy, I sure hope so.

IMO MOO

 

[photographer4]

<modsnip: Off topic>

She's in Delphi a full ten days before the hearings? Hmmm....wonder if she has some kind of inside scoop that something's gonna happen.

IMO MOO

probably had to book a hotel room way in advance or risk not being super local given the popularity of this case in the media and for various content creators.

 

[legalmomma]

Supreme Court denies motion to dismiss Judge Gull from Delphi Murders trial

In a recent filing, the supreme court has denied a motion to dismiss Judge Fran Gull from the Delphi Murders trial.

www.wrtv.com

The supreme court agreed with the defense that Judge Gull missed a deadline that could lead to her removal from the case, however, because the defense continued to file motions, Richard Allen is not protected by this trial rule.

The supreme court says Richard Allen filed a motion on March 31 to be ruled on by April 12. Judge Gull failed to issue a ruling by April 12.

However, instead of filing the motion to withdrawal judge Gull, Allen filed an additional motion.

Judge Gull from Delphi Murders trial​

"According to T.R. 53.1(A), if a trial judge fails to rule on a motion or set the motion for a hearing within 30 days, the cause may be withdrawn from the trial court. However,
Mr. Allen has waived any relief under T.R. 53.1 by filing motions beyond the time that either party could have legitimately raised a claim for removal," documents state.

 

[Emma Peel]

She's in Delphi a full ten days before the hearings? Hmmm....wonder if she has some kind of inside scoop that something's gonna happen.

IMO MOO

Maybe she was there for the MW hearing?

 

[SleutherGirl]

What's the current bets that the trial will actually happen in October? Anyone?

 

[photographer4]

Supreme Court denies motion to dismiss Judge Gull from Delphi Murders trial

In a recent filing, the supreme court has denied a motion to dismiss Judge Fran Gull from the Delphi Murders trial.

www.wrtv.com

The supreme court agreed with the defense that Judge Gull missed a deadline that could lead to her removal from the case, however, because the defense continued to file motions, Richard Allen is not protected by this trial rule.

The supreme court says Richard Allen filed a motion on March 31 to be ruled on by April 12. Judge Gull failed to issue a ruling by April 12.

However, instead of filing the motion to withdrawal judge Gull, Allen filed an additional motion.

Judge Gull from Delphi Murders trial​

"According to T.R. 53.1(A), if a trial judge fails to rule on a motion or set the motion for a hearing within 30 days, the cause may be withdrawn from the trial court. However,
Mr. Allen has waived any relief under T.R. 53.1 by filing motions beyond the time that either party could have legitimately raised a claim for removal," documents state.

Lmao. Oh dear. Should have sat on their hands I guess?

 

[MollyDDD]

My opinion, it’s not uncommon and it makes sense. It just means people working the case shouldnt make public statements like do news interviews, hold press conferences or post about it on social media. For an example, Kohlberger has a gag order that gives the same idea, but JJ goes into greater detail of what is allowed and not allowed. (I’m not sure if this is the most recent for BK but Im linking it for comparison) MOO

RA gag order:

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www.scribd.com

BK gag order:

https://s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/isc.coi/CR29-22-2805/06232023+Revised+Amended+Nondissemination+Order.pdf

ETA: I found the template for requesting a gag order in Indiana.

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secure.in.gov

NM motion for the gag:

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www.wishtv.com

Daybell gag order:

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www.scribd.com

I appreciate what you said and can understand the importance of keeping certain details under wraps while investigating a crime. However, after almost eight years of investigating and still no conviction yet, anyway.
I think if the general public was given a little more information about the evidence, perhaps that would or could have opened up some other avenues to look into. Perhaps that could have expedited the process as well. I’m just afraid that the longer this saga drags on, the more likely a juror could find a reasonable doubt. JMO

 

[photographer4]

What's the current bets that the trial will actually happen in October? Anyone?

I wondered this too. I think good odds but it’s gonna end up in appeals if he’s convicted imo.

 

[photographer4]

I appreciate what you said and can understand the importance of keeping certain details under wraps while investigating a crime. However, after almost eight years of investigating and still no conviction yet, anyway.
I think if the general public was given a little more information about the evidence, perhaps that would or could have opened up some other avenues to look into. Perhaps that could have expedited the process as well. I’m just afraid that the longer this saga drags on, the more likely a juror could find a reasonable doubt. JMO

IMO, there may already be quite a lot of evidence that may provide for a reasonable doubt. I’m hoping that the state has a super strong airtight case, and they can get their conviction if in fact, he is guilty. Of course I don’t want him to walk or have this drag on further but if their case isn’t easy to follow and very strong, he may not be convicted.

 

[susane7]

What's the current bets that the trial will actually happen in October? Anyone?

That's my wish but I bet it won't happen in October. The defense isn't ready and will make up some other delay tactic.