Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #189

[susane7]

Thank you to the moderator who granted me permission to share this James Renner interview with Kelsi German. I attempted to post it last week, but my post was deleted. Lots of hard work going on here! I originally posted it in response to someone's comment or question about if anyone there at the trails had seen the girls, besides BB who saw two girls resembling Abby and Libby.

My response went something like this: There HAD to be people who saw the girls there that day. Kelsi German told James Renner she saw 10-20 kids her age there when she dropped the girls off in that tiny little parking area. This is a small town with one public high school. You'd think out of the 10-20 kids she saw, at least some of them would have recognized her (if they saw her in the driver's seat, and they probably did since she said they had the windows down and may have even recognized her car....I knew all the cars my friends/classmates drove in high school), and some of them would probably even recognize Libby as her younger sister. I'm so curious what these 10-20 kids have told LE about what they saw that day. Did they see Abby and Libby? Did they see RA? How about BB?

This interview was filmed with a 360 view camera, so you have to drag your finger or your mouse over the screen to turn it around to be able to see James and Kelsi. This is part 1 of a 2-part interview he did with her at the yogurt shop. James has several interviews with family members and they are all good, but I've only permission to share this one .

She said that from my memory she later denied. She told it was 10-20 kids during the entire day, not in that time. I don't remember if it was with Gray Hughes when she explained that. If someone remembers help me.

Ps - I will try to watch a interview with Kelsi on Gray later or this week and see if I can find Kelsi's explanation about the 10-20 kids. I think she explained that but I'm not sure.

 

[TTF14]

She said that from my memory she later denied. She told it was 10-20 kids during the entire day, not in that time. I don't remember if it was with Gray Hughes when she explained that. If someone remembers help me.

Confusing because she said she saw them. "I only saw kids my age there." Did she see the kids her age during drop off like she said in the James Renner interview? Or at some other point during the day?

IMO MOO

 

[Ravenmoon]

Thank you to the moderator who granted me permission to share this James Renner interview with Kelsi German. I attempted to post it last week, but my post was deleted. Lots of hard work going on here! I originally posted it in response to someone's comment or question about if anyone there at the trails had seen the girls, besides BB who saw two girls resembling Abby and Libby.

My response went something like this: There HAD to be people who saw the girls there that day. Kelsi German told James Renner she saw 10-20 kids her age there when she dropped the girls off in that tiny little parking area. This is a small town with one public high school. You'd think out of the 10-20 kids she saw, at least some of them would have recognized her (if they saw her in the driver's seat, and they probably did since she said they had the windows down and may have even recognized her car....I knew all the cars my friends/classmates drove in high school), and some of them would probably even recognize Libby as her younger sister. I'm so curious what these 10-20 kids have told LE about what they saw that day. Did they see Abby and Libby? Did they see RA? How about BB?

This interview was filmed with a 360 view camera, so you have to drag your finger or your mouse over the screen to turn it around to be able to see James and Kelsi. This is part 1 of a 2-part interview he did with her at the yogurt shop. James has several interviews with family members and they are all good, but I've only permission to share this one .

I saw this interview years ago.

I guess that I wish there was more context from Kelsi.

Kelsi never got out of the car. Were the ten kids in the parking lot? Were they leaving at the time? Did she see them as she was driving away from the scene? Were they on one of the trails or up at Freedom Bridge? Could she have assumed that they were teenagers because it's a place that kids go to hang out when there is no school?

As for what and who they saw, I guess we wait for trial.

Maybe Kelsi saw the 4 teens, DP arriving and waiting for his friend to show up, BB, and perhaps C and C were over near freedom bridge?

It will be interesting to find out.

But, since we are talking about it, how do you think this impacts the case?

Ebm to add that if she said " through out the day ' then it's most likely that this would include the time that she came back to help search.

It makes the most sense to me, IMO.

 

[susane7]

In this interview, he was specifically referring to the direct area where the girls were found as the “crime scene” as they were discussing the potential of collecting evidence found in that specific location.

When people found the girls next morning, if they were found by searchers it probably happened some contamination in the crime scene. I doubt Sr. Riley said the bodies weren't there at night. Or he will be a huge witness for the defense..

 

[MiniMoo]

Because they weren't looking in that place. They saw the pic of Abby in the bridge, realized the girls had crossed the bridge and they were looking for them in the south side of the bridge (->). They were looking for alive girls and thought the girls had crossed the bridge and they were injured somehow. They had no idea the girls had crossed the creek. The place the girls are found it is a "slope", so it was difficult or impossible to see them if they are looking for them in the south side of the bridge. Especially at night.

I'm sure on this thread or the last one I read some were as close as 15 feet away from the girls bodies during that search - that is like 4.5 metres. Searchers that is...

 

[Ravenmoon]

I'm sure on this thread or the last one I read some were as close as 15 feet away from the girls bodies during that search - that is like 4.5 metres. Searchers that is...

Link please

 

[grannygates]

When people found the girls next morning, if they were found by searchers it probably happened some contamination in the crime scene. I doubt Sr. Riley said the bodies weren't there at night. Or he will be a huge witness for the defense..

Right. My comment was only regarding him acknowledging the significant contamination at the crime scene. I don’t know of his opinion about whether the girls were there overnight or not.

 

[grannygates]

Link please

That’s in the sgt reilly interview. I just can’t recall if it was 15 or 30. I will search for the interview.

 

[MiniMoo]

Link please

Im sure I read it on here in these pages somewhere, but it could have been from a newspaper article or somewhere else as some attach sources and links which I do open up from time to time if it interests me enough.

Within the last 7 days.

 

[Ravenmoon]

Im sure I read it on here in these pages somewhere, but it could have been from a newspaper article or somewhere else as some attach sources and links which I do open up from time to time if it interests me enough.

Within the last 7 days.

Many of us are called out repeatedly for adding information without a link.
It can be exhausting to gather the information when trying to make a statement, so I understand not always having one ready.

All the same, I understand that there is a need for factual information and not posting rumors.

But, I digress, could you clarify what that means in regards to the case in your opinion?

Please and thank you

Edited by me

 

[MiniMoo]

That’s in the sgt reilly interview. I just can’t recall if it was 15 or 30. I will search for the interview.

My memory is on the line @grannygates.
Ouch!

 

[MiniMoo]

Many of us are called out repeatedly for adding information without a link.
It can be exhausting to gather the information when trying to make a statement, so I understand not always having one ready.

But, I digress, could you clarify what that means in regards to the case in your opinion?

I was wondering why the girls weren't found sooner than they were and someone mentioned it was because only the other side was searched.

That is why I brought that up because I recalled reading it on here.

I was wondering if perhaps the way the branches were put over them and what have you was done in a way that standing above them or at the same level would have concealed them enough.

JMO

Please and thank you

 

[sunshineray]

I don't think they crossed the creek. Probably not even the bridge to the end.

IMO MOO

Where'd they go then?

 

[TTF14]

When people found the girls next morning, if they were found by searchers probably happened some contamination in the crime scene. I doubt Sr. Riley said the bodies weren't there at night. Or he will be a huge witness for the defense..

I have never heard Riley claim they weren't there that night (and I don't think GG was implying that). But in episode 6 of the Down the Hill Podcast, Barbara MacDonald asks, "With so many people looking for them that first night, why weren't they found?" Doug Carter answers, "Um...I..I think I'll leave that question...unanswered."

IMO MOO

 

[Cyber sleuth]

Thank you to the moderator who granted me permission to share this James Renner interview with Kelsi German. I attempted to post it last week, but my post was deleted. Lots of hard work going on here! I originally posted it in response to someone's comment or question about if anyone there at the trails had seen the girls, besides BB who saw two girls resembling Abby and Libby.

My response went something like this: There HAD to be people who saw the girls there that day. Kelsi German told James Renner she saw 10-20 kids her age there when she dropped the girls off in that tiny little parking area. This is a small town with one public high school. You'd think out of the 10-20 kids she saw, at least some of them would have recognized her (if they saw her in the driver's seat, and they probably did since she said they had the windows down and may have even recognized her car....I knew all the cars my friends/classmates drove in high school), and some of them would probably even recognize Libby as her younger sister. I'm so curious what these 10-20 kids have told LE about what they saw that day. Did they see Abby and Libby? Did they see RA? How about BB?

This interview was filmed with a 360 view camera, so you have to drag your finger or your mouse over the screen to turn it around to be able to see James and Kelsi. This is part 1 of a 2-part interview he did with her at the yogurt shop. James has several interviews with family members and they are all good, but I've only permission to share this one .

It’s unfortunate the interviewer felt the need to interrupt Kelsi mid sentence because it sounds like she qualified the 10-20 kids as being inclusive to kids that were there during the day even before she dropped them off.(14:40 mark)
The question wasn’t about who she saw when she dropped them off but how popular MHB and trails were as a hangout.

I did find it interesting when she was asked if kids jumped off the MHB during the summer she laughed and said that it was too high and the water was “only a foot of water”. (13:38)

 

[TTF14]

The question wasn’t about who she saw when she dropped them off but how popular MHB and trails were as a hangout.

RSBM

I was talking about her answer, though. Not the question. "I only saw kids my age there." And she was specifically talking about drop off.

Perhaps it was a false memory.

But, if it wasn't...did these kids see Abby and Libby, I wonder. What did they see? Who did they see? Were some of them possibly the "unknown" phones from the geofence map/data?

IMO MOO

 

[Ravenmoon]

I was wondering why the girls weren't found sooner than they were and someone mentioned it was because only the other side was searched.

That is why I brought that up because I recalled reading it on here.

I was wondering if perhaps the way the branches were put over them and what have you was done in a way that standing above them or at the same level would have concealed them enough.

JMO

Well, by the time the search began, day light was quickly fading.

If they were that close, I also imagine that depending on where the searchers stood would be relevant.

Were they still across the creek?
Were they actually on Ron Logan's property?

 

[sunshineray]

The Hobbs-Tobias case is very disturbing. Suspicion immediately centered on the father as the killer, and after 24 hours of interrogation, Hobbs confessed to the murders. He spent five years in jail awaiting trial while the real killer, former Marine Jorge Avila-Torrez, was attacking and killing others.

Ex-Marine pleads guilty to 2005 murders of girls, ages 8 and 9, in Illinois

Nine-year-old Krystal Tobias and 8-year-old Laura Hobbs were murdered in 2005, and the plea Tuesday brought an end to a tortuous story of loss that gained national attention, both for the innocence of the victims and the mistakes of the justice system.

abc7ny.com

That's what's missing in RA's case. None of his confessions happened during interrogation.

 

[susane7]

I think I found the explanation about the 10-20 kids.31:03 until 32:06. She said she didn't see anyone. I think there are even another video with Kelsi talking with Gray Hughes when she explained again the 10-20 kids but I'm not sure. I will try to find that later also.

 

[grannygates]

14:45 of linked interview; KG reports there were 10-20 kids there when she dropped them off but less kids when they returned and they started searching. Interviewer asks if she saw anyone hanging about and she says she only saw kids her age.

There were far more people on the trials than appears in the PCA. I am curious if any of these other kids or people reported to LE seeing RA, YBG, OBG, the girls or the first group of family searchers and at what time.

MOO