Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #189

[steeltowngirl]

He never should have been in prison in the first place, but why don't they want him in Delphi? Are they still saying they can't transport him to and from his hearings?

Defense's request:

Richard Allen’s defense team is requesting to vacate the safekeeping order, which would move Allen out of IDOC custody. The defense is requesting Allen to be housed in either the Cass County or Tippecanoe County jail.

Here’s what will be argued at the Delphi murders trial hearing

The judge in the Delphi murders trial is set to consider a series of key issues during a hearing this week.

www.21alivenews.com

 

[AugustWest]

RSBM

Has anyone seen this before in trials they have followed? I don't recall it, but there aren't a lot of trials where I've followed all of the pre-trial hearings.

Just wondering how usual or unusual it is to request words and phrases be banned.

It's not unusual for this to occur in a trial. A prosecutor asking for certain language to be censored is less common, but not unheard of. Usually, a defense will ask for suppression of certain language that is defamatory in some way to the defendant. This is done to shield the jury from bias. This is also why defendants are offered street clothes to wear at trial, and why sometimes defendants are not put in restraints that the jury could see.

 

[sunshineray]

Morning article from IndyStar. grrrrr I've already emailed the article author about this statement.
Once and for all - molesting can occur and NOT be visible on an autopsy.

"One of those motions addressed whether statements Allen allegedly made to inmates and prison guards, claiming he killed Abby and Libby, should be suppressed. He's also made statements about molesting the girls, although autopsy results show that did not happen."

Hearings in Delphi murder case could shape how Richard Allen's trial plays out in October

At the hearing Tuesday morning, Allen's attorney argued for moving murder suspect from state prison 140 miles away to local jail.

www.indystar.com

I wonder why...still...if an adult intimidates a child into undressing against their will just so they can see them naked is not considered child sexual abuse...ie molestation!? They must be touched for it to be considered sexual abuse molestation?

Molestation: sexual assault or abuse of a person, especially a child.

 

[twall]

Reporter Kaitlyn Kendall has some updates

https://twitter.com/x/status/1818327068775702704

 

[sunshineray]

Voluntary questioning can become custodial interrogations. I offered a link earlier to what constitutes a custodial interrogation, and it explains it well, as do the other links it includes.

Here it is again: custodial interrogation

I guess the video will show if RA wanted to leave the interview and wasn't allowed exit

 

[TTF14]

I guess the video will show if RA wanted to leave the interview and wasn't allowed exit

Similar to how child SA isn't always physical, neither is this. We may not be able to see any physical manifestation. I mean, I doubt Jerry Holeman is on video physically blocking the door.

IMO MOO

 

[FromGermany1]

This was the one where RA wasn't read his rights. Also the one where Holeman said, "I know you did it and I'm gonna prove it!" (paraphrasing) I think it might have also been when RA said to keep his wife out of it or something?

IMO MOO

Apropos his wife: Is it common, that a man, who gets interviewed by police, would be demanding for letting his wife out of the double murder-story? First I'm thinking, he exactly with that demand confirmed his guilt. Nobody, who is innocent and hasn't done something criminal, would beg for his "innocent" wife to let out (even if he didn't use the word "innocent"). Second I'm thinking: did he something for her, because of her? At least, it sounded suspect a bit, what he said and when he said it. IMO

 

[AugustWest]

I guess the video will show if RA wanted to leave the interview and wasn't allowed exit

There are factors the court looks at to determine whether an interrogation is custodial, when it turns to such, and so on. Doors, position of interviewee, place, circumstances of interview, all factor in the determination. We had a pretty robust discussion about this topic earlier; it is found in thread #181.

 

[grannygates]

For those who would like to read the filing themselves.

This is a link to the motion to suppress 2nd statement that goes into detail about the interrogation and provides case law and examples as to why the defense feels the interrogation was improper

2024 4/15 suppress 2nd statement .pdf

drive.google.com

 

[Willow Knight]

DBM

 

[legalmomma]

#Delphi Update Court started an hour late as Judge Gull was delayed. The morning session consisted of two defense motions being heard: 1)Motion to Vacate or Modify Safe Keeping Order; and 2) Motion to Compel and For Sanctions for failure to provide discovery in a timely manner and in some instances failing to turn over discovery altogether. Defense called Sheriff Tony Liggett as its only witness. Defense is asking that #RichardAllen be moved to Cass County Jail through trial. McCleland believes status quo is appropriate. Judge took it under advisement.Motion to Compel and sanctions was strictly legal argument. Attorney Auger argued for the Defense, McCleland on behalf of State. McCleland argues that State is in compliance and that any violations due to timeliness should result in a continuance as opposed to the item being excluded from being introduced. Judge took this matter under advisement as well. Two more motions to be argued this afternoon. #DelphiTrial #DelphiMurders #DownTheHill

https://twitter.com/x/status/1818330377401799164

 

[sunshineray]

Similar to how child SA isn't always physical, neither is this. We may not be able to see any physical manifestation. I mean, I doubt Jerry Holeman is on video physically blocking the door.

IMO MOO

Is that what you think happened?

 

[legalmomma]

Hearings in Delphi murder case could shape how Richard Allen's trial plays out in October

At the hearing Tuesday morning, Allen's attorney argued for moving murder suspect from state prison 140 miles away to local jail.

www.indystar.com

The small courtroom where the hearing is being conducted was full this morning. The crowd included family members of the victims, reporters, and true crime podcasters who have latched onto the case involving the 2017 slayings of two local teens.

Rozzi told the court Tuesday morning that moving Allen to Cass County would make it easier for the defense team to access their client.

Carroll County Prosecutor Nicholas McLeland, however, said Allen’s situation could become “more dire” if he’s moved to Cass County, saying the jail has limited mental health services.

This story will be updated again at the end of today's hearing.

 

[TTF14]

McCleland argues that State is in compliance and that any violations due to timeliness should result in a continuance as opposed to the item being excluded from being introduced.

I'm confused by this statement. What does it mean?

 

[TTF14]

Carroll County Prosecutor Nicholas McLeland, however, said Allen’s situation could become “more dire” if he’s moved to Cass County, saying the jail has limited mental health services.

That seems....disingenuous. At best.

IMO MOO

 

[Megnut]

If RA is moved, I hope the new facility is staffed and equipped TO KEEP HIM SAFE/ALIVE for trial.

JMO

 

[TTF14]

Is that what you think happened?

Is what what I think happened? I don't understand what you're asking.

 

[sunshineray]

There are factors the court looks at to determine whether an interrogation is custodial, when it turns to such, and so on. Doors, position of interviewee, place, circumstances of interview, all factor in the determination. We had a pretty robust discussion about this topic earlier; it is found in thread #181.

Well there was something particular RA said to an ISP officer that the defense doesn't want people to hear. Hope JG rules it's admissible for trial.

 

[sunshineray]

Is what what I think happened? I don't understand what you're asking.

You said, , "I doubt Jerry Holeman is on video physically blocking the door." I was just wondering if you think that happened?

 

[sunshineray]

Similar to how child SA isn't always physical, neither is this. We may not be able to see any physical manifestation. I mean, I doubt Jerry Holeman is on video physically blocking the door.

IMO MOO

I also think an adult man would have absolutely no problem walking away, out of the room, from a voluntary interview that's making him uncomfortable in any way. He could also have said, "Ok stop, talk to my lawyer" and walked out. JMO Maybe he did.