Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #191

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As a person who actually wants to know what happened that day and get real justice for the girls, if the case against RA is as strong as the pro-guilt side says, it should be able to stand up to the jury knowing about the first 5 years of the investigation and not being restricted to only knowing about the few weeks they investigated RA. This is what I would consider a fair trial.

MOO
Background noise level. Relevance. Wheat versus chaff. The defense is just playing for one or two confused jurors who can’t hear the signal over the noise. You appear to want it handed them on a platter before the trial begins.
 
Background noise level. Relevance. Wheat versus chaff. The defense is just playing for one or two confused jurors who can’t hear the signal over the noise. You appear to want it handed them on a platter before the trial begins.
I believe in due process and a fair trial so I believe that the jury should be aware of the entire investigation including a man confessing to the crime with details “only the killer would know” before the girls were even found. That’s a really important event to me. If the case against RA is so solid, it should stand up to the jury knowing about all exculpatory evidence/the original investigation. MOO
 
If the D had anything to support RA’s innocence they wouldn’t need to hoodwink the general public. And what’s point other than hoping to contaminate the jury pool? I’ve never followed a case with a defense team displaying such a lack of integrity.

MOO and JMO
I’d be interested if we would be able to find someone with legal experience who would agree about this “lack of integrity”. I have yet to see a real lawyer disagree with the defenses representation.

I wonder if this was also the opinion of the defense in Karen Reads case, where they proposed a similar defense and had similar LE conduct.

MOO
 
This was in Murphys testimony from the recent court hearings that our approved source podcast covered. Www.murdersheet.com
Murphy says in episode Part 3 - I will link the actual episode: "he thought EF and his sister were full of crap" (his words), they interviewed him and got a DNA sample. Murphy drove him back home and that was when EF mentioned he spit on one of the girls.

So LE interrogated EF and got a DNA sample. EF said he spit on one of the girls, so why didn't they arrest him based on his DNA left on the body? It's because it didn't happen that way. LE, ISP and FBI are not amateurs, they would have been able to link him to the crime scene by his self proclaimed spit and his DNA.

And no where in their recount of the 3 day hearing did they say they debunked his alibi or that any of their other POI's during the entire day, quite the opposite. Holeman and Murphy both said they could NOT place any of them in Delphi that day.

#Justice4Abby&Libby

MOO

The Delphi Murders: Three Days of Pretrial Hearings: Day Three
 
If you were going on an out of town trip, to commit a double murder sacrifice, would you take someone who had the mental capabilities of a 7 yr old?
Some people might actually bring him along just to see if he would follow through with the plan out of curiosity and as a form of “gang initiation” (for lack of a better word). If he was struggling with socializing and wanted to fit in with some big group of people for whatever reason, then they may have just let him come along. I am NOT saying this happened but I can see how this COULD happen to a person with a lower mental capability. MOOO.
 
Murphy says in episode Part 3 - I will link the actual episode: "he thought EF and his sister were full of crap" (his words), they interviewed him and got a DNA sample. Murphy drove him back home and that was when EF mentioned he spit on one of the girls.

So LE interrogated EF and got a DNA sample. EF said he spit on one of the girls, so why didn't they arrest him based on his DNA left on the body? It's because it didn't happen that way. LE, ISP and FBI are not amateurs, they would have been able to link him to the crime scene by his self proclaimed spit and his DNA.

#Justice4Abby&Libby

MOO

The Delphi Murders: Three Days of Pretrial Hearings: Day Three
Oh… I guess they only report on the cross examination ? This is the second time I’m hearing them just reporting on the short cross examination and not any of the direct. The first being the geofencing. They only included Nicks short objection and none of the actual testimony or information shared.
 
I believe in due process and a fair trial so I believe that the jury should be aware of the entire investigation including a man confessing to the crime with details “only the killer would know” before the girls were even found. That’s a really important event to me. If the case against RA is so solid, it should stand up to the jury knowing about all exculpatory evidence/the original investigation. MOO

It has zero relevance and an innocent man shouldn’t be blamed when he isn’t the one on trial.
If you wish to talk about fairness, then I certainly wouldn’t want a man accused of a horrific crime to try and then use me as a scapegoat when I am not a suspect in the case and not on trial.

MOO
 
If she learned about the girls going missing, she probably realised she had been driving in that area the night before.

Probably the time she remembered driving by---maybe the time she got off work?


Did she say he was walking right along the street? I wouldn't think so...

And if so, her responses are probably consistent and credible if the state is using them.
I agree with some of your points, but credible doesn’t mean factual. It means believable. Her story is believable and she was seen on the camera when she said she was there which is good! But if the guy isn’t also on the camera, then I wonder why not? Could she have mixed up her dates? Could he have hidden just out of sight of that camera? Was the guy she saw too much in shadow for the camera to pick him up by chance? Credible is a good start but is not evidence that: the guy she saw killed the kids, or that she saw him on the day she said she did. I’m sure her story will line up with whatever other evidence LE has - hopefully they did a fantastic job of interviewing her and getting her statement!
 
Murphy says in episode Part 3 - I will link the actual episode: "he thought EF and his sister were full of crap" (his words), they interviewed him and got a DNA sample. Murphy drove him back home and that was when EF mentioned he spit on one of the girls.

So LE interrogated EF and got a DNA sample. EF said he spit on one of the girls, so why didn't they arrest him based on his DNA left on the body?

The Delphi Murders: Three Days of Pretrial Hearings: Day Three
Stupid question coming up... I've been wondering for a long time about EF saying he spit on one of the girls, yet we never heard there was a DNA match for him or an arrest. So my question is... do they automatically swab a victims entire body for DNA? Or only a few spots here and there? If not 100% of a victims body... perhaps the area(s) they swabbed didn't have EF's spit on it, hence it not showing up.
 
If you were going on an out of town trip, to commit a double murder sacrifice, would you take someone who had the mental capabilities of a 7 yr old?
It’s their friend. If they all wanted to join a gang and have brothers, they would all go together. Robert Pickton argued “diminished mental capacity” defense as well and no one excuses his murders. MOO
 
IIRC From the appendix in the Franks, this witness was interviewed in June. They say that they found the time that she drove by that day by reviewing the HH camera. How did she remember the date she drove by? 4 months later. What times did they check? Is the HH camera that clear they can read her license plate or does she have a very unique car? If it’s this clear, why can’t they see the guy walking ? is it a popular car model like a silver Honda Civic that could be driven by anybody? A lot of uncertainty.

But ! From a response filing by the defense it does make it seem (thankfully) as though this interview was video recorded and this recording survived the erasure event, so it will be documented on video what type of interviewing/questions LE asked and the actual responses from the witness. That gives me relief that still exists. MOO

""If it’s this clear, why can’t they see the guy walking ?""

Has it been said or released that the HH video had not picked up a guy walking? I am hoping at trial we are shown video of this, and the guy getting into his vehicle. At this point, have to wait for trial to see how much the HH camera was able to pick up. (remembering Ross Harris trial, video did pick up RH getting into his car at lunch time) Don't recall that information being released prior to trial.
 
Stupid question coming up... I've been wondering for a long time about EF saying he spit on one of the girls, yet we never heard there was a DNA match for him or an arrest. So my question is... do they automatically swab a victims entire body for DNA? Or only a few spots here and there? If not 100% of a victims body... perhaps the area(s) they swabbed didn't have EF's spit on it, hence it not showing up.
I had an idea that the spit is why the clothes ended up in the river.

just to add to your question - I wonder if spit would illuminate under some type of light so that the CSI people would be able to tell where it is, whether it’s on a leaf or a victim. On a leaf in a forest filled with leaves would be really hard to find. Also, If it dried by the time LE got there, would they still be able to tell?

We need someone with some good knowledge to educate us !

MOO
 
I believe in due process and a fair trial so I believe that the jury should be aware of the entire investigation including a man confessing to the crime with details “only the killer would know” before the girls were even found. That’s a really important event to me. If the case against RA is so solid, it should stand up to the jury knowing about all exculpatory evidence/the original investigation. MOO
And it will when the TRIAL starts, not now before trial in social media or by the doo process gang and internet cranks. The only noise we're hearing is from the crazy antics around the D side of the equation. The State has kept a tight lid on their case as they should and per the gag order.

They have been professional, the D, not so much IMO.

JMO
 
""If it’s this clear, why can’t they see the guy walking ?""

Has it been said or released that the HH video had not picked up a guy walking? I am hoping at trial we are shown video of this, and the guy getting into his vehicle. At this point, have to wait for trial to see how much the HH camera was able to pick up. (remembering Ross Harris trial, video did pick up RH getting into his car at lunch time) Don't recall that information being released prior to trial.
I guess it’s just my assumption that if they had more video of this guy, they would release it to the public to try to find him. Especially if this camera could be clear enough to pick up license plate numbers etc. That would be an additional video for the public to help identify him. MOO
 
Stupid question coming up... I've been wondering for a long time about EF saying he spit on one of the girls, yet we never heard there was a DNA match for him or an arrest. So my question is... do they automatically swab a victims entire body for DNA? Or only a few spots here and there? If not 100% of a victims body... perhaps the area(s) they swabbed didn't have EF's spit on it, hence it not showing up.
Pretty sure if a potential POI professed to spitting on one of the victims they would have swabbed her entire body.

MOO
 
Murphy says in episode Part 3 - I will link the actual episode: "he thought EF and his sister were full of crap" (his words), they interviewed him and got a DNA sample. Murphy drove him back home and that was when EF mentioned he spit on one of the girls.

So LE interrogated EF and got a DNA sample. EF said he spit on one of the girls, so why didn't they arrest him based on his DNA left on the body? It's because it didn't happen that way. LE, ISP and FBI are not amateurs, they would have been able to link him to the crime scene by his self proclaimed spit and his DNA.

And no where in their recount of the 3 day hearing did they say they debunked his alibi or that any of their other POI's during the entire day, quite the opposite. Holeman and Murphy both said they could NOT place any of them in Delphi that day.

#Justice4Abby&Libby

MOO

The Delphi Murders: Three Days of Pretrial Hearings: Day Three
Is it possible that EF got lucky that his DNA wasn’t found on the bodies? Is it possible it was washed off by a deliberate wash off or by the weather elements? Lack of DNA at the scene doesn’t mean someone who places themselves there was not there. In fact, actual dna evidence at the scene doesn’t always mean an accused was the killer! Just ask Germany: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7966641.stm

DNA evidence or lack thereof is NOT as infallible as many people believe. I’d like to know how exactly LE determined that the group named by the D was not there, could not have been there and could not have done this crime. I hope they went in depth and beyond a precursors check of their stories, because as I recall, EF’s alibi wasn’t as air tight as it would seem because someone from that group was interviewed and gave some details that didn’t line up with what EF told LE. I don’t have a link handy at the moment - so MOOOOO on this for now. I read this in a chart last night but I do not know if I can share that link as I don’t believe they’re approved here. How do we ask a mod to approve a link to a chart for things like this?
 
And it will when the TRIAL starts, not now before trial in social media or by the doo process gang and internet cranks. The only noise we're hearing is from the crazy antics around the D side of the equation. The State has kept a tight lid on their case as they should and per the gag order.

They have been professional, the D, not so much IMO.

JMO
This is pre-trial when the trial is organized. That’s why they had the hearings to discuss what would and wouldn’t be allowed at trial. You don’t hold everything back until trial to ambush the other side.

The only reason we know about “61” confessions and a man proudly blurting out “box cutter” on the stand is because of the state. The gag order doesn’t restrict the lawyers ability to work on their case. I think there might be a lack of understanding of what the gag order means.

And finally, if a person thinks “doo process” is a cuss or a bad thing, I would assume there is another significant lack of knowledge regarding the law and the court process, so I can understand why this person would hold the certain opinions they do.

I’m not here to try to change the minds of people who think due process is a bad thing. I’m here to discuss my opinions of the case.

MOO
 
How do you know SC didn't tell someone(s). She very well could have
Your post made me wonder- if she had called in a muddy / bloody guy immediately after having seen him, would police be all over it that night especially knowing the kids were missing from that area? Would they have called off the search that night? Would they have brought in dogs to track the kids? Of course we don’t know the answers because hindsight tells us all the things we wish they’d done / not done that night. It just does not SEEM like she alerted LE that night due to these things. MOO.
 

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