Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #194

[Trebor5591]

Not the OP but I think Daily mail. Article is linked from this source.

Can you explain why an adult man would bring a knife/boxcutter and gun to walk a trail on a Monday afternoon?
Seems excessive IMO

In red states, guns and knives are just tools that might come in handy in an outdoor area with feral dogs, coyotes, etc. I'm certain plenty of guys carry both every day unless doing so is prohibited by law, without ever using them to commit a crime. I believe Indiana allows constitutional carry of firearms.

 

[joe jones]

I still find it baffling that RA was able to do all that was done to commit these crimes, to get two teenage girls under his control to such an extent he got one to strip naked and the other to partially strip (I don't fully know what has been testified as to what clothes experts think Abby took off) in daylight after chasing them down a hill and making them wade across a river, I know he had a gun but he never used it and IMO both girls could have outrun him.

I think he must have held Abby at gunpoint to make Libby compliant to his demands, but at some point he had to put the gun away and get out the item he used to cut them, so at points of the crime they were not at gunpoint, he also had to let one girl go when he was attacking the other.

From things the families have said about the girls and Libby taking surreptitious video of him it shows she was aware of stranger danger and she knew immediately that something didn't feel right about the way this man appeared to her and how he was approaching them, plus RA is not imposing by his size and he didn't know if one or both of them would run away as fast as they could in different directions. Yet he somehow managed to get them both into the river and across and to comply with his demands.

I can only think the gun was the factor that meant both girls were too scared to not do as he demanded.

 

[Trebor5591]

I didn't think either girls struggled?

Resistance might just be running away from him, not obeying his commands, throwing a rock from the creek at him, something like that.

Likely we will find out exactly what happened at the trial, or in his allocution if he pleads guilty. Until then, its all theory. JMO

 

[statt#1]

I'll opine on that sawed branch. I myself have spent lots of time in the woods, the deciduous north american woods....woods like found surrounding Monon High Bridge.

It's possible a branch was sawn by this killer, sure, anything is possible. More likely as far as I can see, there were probably trees harvested, branches, and stumps all over that wooded area, left over from the cutting and processing of firewood.

These murders were in February. From all photos I've seen over the years, those woods were fairly open, little undergrowth, and of course, being winter time, no greenery, and....prime firewood cuttin' time.

 

[Hazelnutty]

Can you explain why an adult man would bring a knife/boxcutter and gun to walk a trail on a Monday afternoon?
Seems excessive IMO

I agree with you.

jmoo

 

[statt#1]

It wouldn't be unusual for a man, or woman, to be carrying a firearm any time, anywhere, in many states in the United States. For BG to have a gun on him isn't unusual at all. Though I do think he probably had this gun on him on that day because he intended to use it in some fashion, though I can't be certain.

Currently, 2023 stats, there appears to be 865,839 firearms permits in Indiana, nearly a quarter million of them being held by females.

https://www.in.gov/isp/files/Quarterly-Firearms-Statistics-2023-Annual.pdf

 

[Vern]

I didn't think either girls struggled?

From the search warrant for Ron Logan, bullet #7:
LG and AW had no visible signs of a struggle or fight".
Link to Search Warrant

Not the OP, but believe that refers to the fact that it required 3 cuts to Libby's throat for her to finally be killed as she was moving away/in motion. She was then dragged back to the same area where Abby was laying deceased.

So IMO, did not struggle or fight with him but really fought to get away from the scene itself to save her life.

 

[joe jones]

It wouldn't be unusual for a man, or woman, to be carrying a firearm any time, anywhere, in many states in the United States. For BG to have a gun on him isn't unusual at all. Though I do think he probably had this gun on him on that day because he intended to use it in some fashion, though I can't be certain.

Currently, 2023 stats, there appears to be 865,839 firearms permits in Indiana, nearly a quarter million of them being held by females.

https://www.in.gov/isp/files/Quarterly-Firearms-Statistics-2023-Annual.pdf

I think once he moved from fantasising about killing to predation he took his gun and sharp cutting implement with him whenever he was walking on the trails alone, it probably took quite some time for him to have been a predator before he found his victims.

 

[tlcya]

I've gone back to the beginning and am reviewing the many available maps and images from our Media and Maps thread #1 and happened on this fabulous map prepared by member and my friend Skibaboo. It has markers detailing important info that was coming out in the very early days of this case. It includes images with links to substantiate where those images were taken from and where those points of interest are on the map of the area. I had forgotten just how detailed she was with this map and the information it contains. A lot of work went into it and I find it helpful with reacquainting myself with the areas of import in this case.

I hope others find it as helpful as I have.

Skibaboo's case Map

It's location on the media maps thread

 

[statt#1]

I've gone back to the beginning and am reviewing the many available maps and images from our Media and Maps thread #1 and happened on this fabulous map prepared by member and my friend Skibaboo. It has markers detailing important info that was coming out in the very early days of this case. It includes images with links to substantiate where those images were taken from and where those points of interest are on the map of the area. I had forgotten just how detailed she was with this map and the information it contains. A lot of work went into it and I find it helpful with reacquainting myself with the areas of import in this case.

I hope others find it as helpful as I have.

Skibaboo's case Map

It's location on the media maps thread

YaYa! Very nice! This shows the end of the trail, where to the left, they went 'down the hill', and the barricade there, and the thickness of the woods at that spot! Excellent

 

[tlcya]

YaYa! Very nice! This shows the end of the trail, where to the left, they went 'down the hill', and the barricade there, and the thickness of the woods at that spot! Excellent

if you zoom outward from there you can find cell towers, RL's property, all the landmarks around the park, you will see RA's workplace in relation to the park, etc. She really put a lot of good work into this map and kept it updated all the way up through when RA was arrested I believe.

 

[statt#1]

if you zoom outward from there you can find cell towers, RL's property, all the landmarks around the park, you will see RA's workplace in relation to the park, etc. She really put a lot of good work into this map and kept it updated all the way up through when RA was arrested I believe.

Indeed, I can't thank you enough for this resource. It's so important for us, in my opinion, to go back and look at things in the beginning....and to zoom out, and see other points of reference. Totally awesome!

 

[Spartygirl]

I've gone back to the beginning and am reviewing the many available maps and images from our Media and Maps thread #1 and happened on this fabulous map prepared by member and my friend Skibaboo. It has markers detailing important info that was coming out in the very early days of this case. It includes images with links to substantiate where those images were taken from and where those points of interest are on the map of the area. I had forgotten just how detailed she was with this map and the information it contains. A lot of work went into it and I find it helpful with reacquainting myself with the areas of import in this case.

I hope others find it as helpful as I have.

Skibaboo's case Map

It's location on the media maps thread

Skibaboo has always been the BEST Map person !!!

Thanks for finding this

 

[sunshineray]

But she was commenting as a "pundit." She was not even on the case yet. And THEN, when she was "on the case" and saw the actual photos, she doubled down on her initial conclusion. I am really failing to see how this matters.

Should she just not have been hired as an expert because she once commented on the case? Does that completely invalidate her?

I think not, but it's just my opinion.

JMO IMO

To me, MOO, that can be seen as just being a yes woman, getting a paycheck by doing what's expected, not necessarily what's warranted. It gives me doubts about her testimony and I believe others could also see it the same way. Again this is my opinion only.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

So these new court docs are about Dr Fiddler. She is apparently being subpoenaed by the D? I think....

But she filed motion to quash the subpoena?

Am I right? What do they want her to testify about?

​

Hendricks Regional Health | Dr. Jessica Fiddler | Jessica ...​

Facebook · Hendricks Regional Health
20+ reactions · 2 years ago

1:42
My name is Jessica Fiddler. I'm a family physician at Greencastle Family Health. I think what makes our practice special is we're in a rural ...

Oh gosh.
What fresh h*ll has the defense team manufactured to put us through now.

 

[TTF14]

To me, MOO, that can be seen as just being a yes woman, getting a paycheck by doing what's expected, not necessarily what's warranted. It gives me doubts about her testimony and I believe others could also see it the same way. Again this is my opinion only.

I think it's a normal opinion to have about experts on the "other side." I feel similarly about David Schilling, the State's rune/"jail intelligence" guy.

IMO MOO

 

[TTF14]

Oh gosh.
What fresh h*ll has the defense team manufactured to put us through now.

The audacity to want to depose the State's witness, it would seem.

IMO MOO

 

[sunshineray]

I think it's a normal opinion to have about experts on the "other side." I feel similarly about David Schilling, the State's rune/"jail intelligence" guy.

IMO MOO

Did he testify at the hearings?

 

[sunshineray]

So these new court docs are about Dr Fiddler. She is apparently being subpoenaed by the D? I think....

But she filed motion to quash the subpoena?

Am I right? What do they want her to testify about?

​

Hendricks Regional Health | Dr. Jessica Fiddler | Jessica ...​

Facebook · Hendricks Regional Health
20+ reactions · 2 years ago

1:42
My name is Jessica Fiddler. I'm a family physician at Greencastle Family Health. I think what makes our practice special is we're in a rural ...

Maybe she's treated RA in the past?

 

[TTF14]

Did he testify at the hearings?

No, he's the guy the defense wants to depose and the State filed to quash it. No ruling yet, and I think the deposition is supposed to be today.