Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #194

[TTF14]

I don't think it's really working so hard to file a simple motion.. seems short and to the point. It is his job to present as clear of a case as he can so that it will be easy to follow for the jury. The defense will try to muddy all the waters so the jury is confused because they don't have any solid evidence to exclude their client from the bridge or from the trail from 130-330. They want the jury to be confused, the state wants it to be clear. This trial should not be going through every single thing LE did to investigate this case. It would take months to do that and it comes back to having zero to do with RA, who is on trial. Jurors have lives too and this shouldn't take 3 months just so the defense can drag it on calling everyone that ever was looked at to the stand and trying to pin it on them.

They aren't doing that, thankfully. Only the ones that make sense based on the staging of the crime scene. For example, we haven't heard the DT mention DN even once, have we? He was looked it. Or TB, CE, BJC, or PE. All of them were "looked at" and the defense is not trying to "pin it on them."

Only the ones involved in activities closely related to how the crime scene was staged. (ETA: And allegedly confessed to a sibling, had ties to one of the victims through a dating relationship, etc.)

IMO MOO

 

[Vaderman]

So what was it that the attorney could walk into a hearing with, that was strong enough evidence to shut down a hearing for an upcoming murder trial? Is it a gas receipt? A photo with a timestamp? A confession?

Also, if it was legitimate...wouldn't the case itself change? If there was undeniable evidence that someone else did it, why continue on with the wrong guy?

 

[TTF14]

Also, if it was legitimate...wouldn't the case itself change? If there was undeniable evidence that someone else did it, why continue on with the wrong guy?

Maybe they won't?

 

[ClearAhead]

Maybe they won't?

The hearing being discussed was held a month ago on July 30th, was it not?

The Judge just issued this ruling a couple days ago:

Judge rules suspect's reported confessions in Delphi, Indiana girls' murders can be used

Richard Allen is charged with two counts of murder in the 2017 slayings of 14-year-old Liberty German and 13-year-old Abigail Williams.

www.cbsnews.com

Sure doesn’t look like RA’s charges are about to be dropped to me. The trial is proceeding ‘using’ his confessions.

 

[Vaderman]

The hearing being discussed was held a month ago on July 30th, was it not?

The Judge just issued this ruling a couple days ago:

Judge rules suspect's reported confessions in Delphi, Indiana girls' murders can be used

Richard Allen is charged with two counts of murder in the 2017 slayings of 14-year-old Liberty German and 13-year-old Abigail Williams.

www.cbsnews.com

Sure doesn’t look like RA’s charges are about to be dropped to me.

The canceled hearings were supposed to be held last week:

Delphi murder suspect's public hearing canceled; officials speak privately with relatives

New filings ask for subpoenas to be thrown out, question therapist's actions in the case.

www.jconline.com

Maybe they won't?

It really just seems to defy logic at this point, though. Undeniable evidence that someone else did it but we're also going to allow in 61 confessions before the jury?

Edited for grammar.

 

[Vern]

The canceled hearings were supposed to be held last week:

Delphi murder suspect's public hearing canceled; officials speak privately with relatives

New filings ask for subpoenas to be thrown out, question therapist's actions in the case.

www.jconline.com

It really just seems to defy logic at this point, though. Undeniable evidence that someone else did it but we're also going to allow in 61 confessions before the jury?

Edited for grammar.

There is no source for "undeniable evidence" being found to show someone else's guilt.

I've seen only a rumor/speculation of that today, but no link to back up "undeniable evidence" of some other perps participation.

IMO, that's because there is no evidence of someone else's guilt (in this case via the genetic DNA expense bit) else we would have had another arrest. We haven't. IMO, we won't.

Onward to seeing justice for Libby & Abby.

 

[TTF14]

There is no source for "undeniable evidence" being found to show someone else's guilt.

I've seen only a rumor/speculation of that today, but no link to back up "undeniable evidence" of some other perps participation.

The OP didn't say it was fact. They posited it as a theory, a maybe. No claim at all of fact.

IMO MOO

 

[Tealgrove]

The canceled hearings were supposed to be held last week:

Delphi murder suspect's public hearing canceled; officials speak privately with relatives

New filings ask for subpoenas to be thrown out, question therapist's actions in the case.

www.jconline.com

It really just seems to defy logic at this point, though. Undeniable evidence that someone else did it but we're also going to allow in 61 confessions before the jury?

Edited for grammar.

Do you have a link to support your assertion that there is undeniable evidence that someone else did it? I’d sure like to see that.

TIA

 

[Salah11]

I was thinking and RA claims he went and sat on a bench, but can any witnesses place him on one that afternoon?

It seems like he vanished off the trails at the exact moment the girls did imo

 

[susiQ]

The OP didn't say it was fact. They posited it as a theory, a maybe. No claim at all of fact.

IMO MOO

Yes, it was merely a theory, a possibility, blown up to be what it wasn’t. SMH
Of course, even if it were true, all it would accomplish would give further reason to allow the SODDI defense, not cancelling the trial. That would be a bit much to hope for at this point. JMHO MOO

 

[Vaderman]

Do you have a link to support your assertion that there is undeniable evidence that someone else did it? I’d sure like to see that.

TIA

I was referencing another post that posited this was the reason for the canceled hearing. I do not believe there's proof that any one else did it and no longer question RA's likely guilt.

 

[Tealgrove]

I was referencing another post that posited this was the reason for the canceled hearing. I do not believe there's proof that any one else did it and no longer question RA's likely guilt.

Thanks for clarifying. I read it differently.

Again, many thanks.

 

[ClearAhead]

The canceled hearings were supposed to be held last week:

Delphi murder suspect's public hearing canceled; officials speak privately with relatives

New filings ask for subpoenas to be thrown out, question therapist's actions in the case.

www.jconline.com

It really just seems to defy logic at this point, though. Undeniable evidence that someone else did it but we're also going to allow in 61 confessions before the jury?

Edited for grammar.

Thank you, you’re right. But still the point of it all, the Judge is NOT going to waste time with a ruling against the D allowing the confessions to stand if the trial is not proceeding. That’s proof that nothing significant happened.

I wouldn’t doubt D’s definition of ‘undeniable evidence’ is someone’s cousin overheard someone talking in a bar on a Saturday night in 2021 that their ex-roommate knows who did it because they had a vision. MOO

 

[justtrish]

I was thinking and RA claims he went and sat on a bench, but can any witnesses place him on one that afternoon?

It seems like he vanished off the trails at the exact moment the girls did imo

It's possible he came off the bridge after BB saw him and then followed along the same way she was walking. This would be heading toward the bench and the parking lot that BB arrived/left and the one Abby and Libby were dropped off at. It would be a good place to ensure no other cars were arriving and to make sure BB left. Maybe something happened during that passing of Abby and Libby that set him off. He waits till they move along from the beginning of the bridge and head across to the far side and then he follows. He knows nobody was behind him so he feels safe to go ahead and pull out the gun and order them down the hill. I am unsure how close the bench is to the parking area in question. I'll see if I can find that info.

I also think it's possible he went into the woods and waited.. maybe that was what initially made Abby and Libby uneasy. Just my opinion on possible scenarios.

 

[Vern]

The OP didn't say it was fact. They posited it as a theory, a maybe. No claim at all of fact.

IMO MOO

Exactly. Please see the word "speculation" in the second sentence of my post you quoted. I was responding to another member who thought it was fact and I was pointing out it was not; the confusion seems to be cleared up now.

 

[TTF14]

Thank you, you’re right. But still the point of it all, the Judge is NOT going to waste time with a ruling against the D allowing the confessions to stand if the trial is not proceeding. That’s proof that nothing significant happened.

Another way to look at it: The public hearing was abruptly canceled without any explanation or warning. Nobody's talking (even the Youtubers The Murder Sheet!). The Judge has yet to rule on the State's Motion in Limine/SODDI defense. I'd say that all adds up, in my opinion, to proof that something significant did happen.

IMO MOO

 

[FrostedGlass]

Also, if it was legitimate...wouldn't the case itself change? If there was undeniable evidence that someone else did it, why continue on with the wrong guy?

Let's try this again: What if they found an undeniable link showing some other person was at the crime scene at the time of the murders, do you think the P would just toss a million $$$ out the window and walk away?

 

[Salah11]

Considering that RA made 60+ confessions and never included other people, I find it highly doubtful the defence has managed to find somebody else who was there. RA doesn't have an alibi for the time of the murders either, so he would still be in the frame.

IMO

 

[Tealgrove]

Let's try this again: What if they found an undeniable link showing some other person was at the crime scene at the time of the murders, do you think the P would just toss a million $$$ out the window and walk away?

I hope that wouldn’t happen.

If someone else is involved I would hope that that it would be investigated thoroughly.

Listen, I don’t want to see an innocent person put in prison and the key thrown away. I really don’t.

If someone else did it PROVE IT! I’m game. Show me the evidence. So far I have not seen evidence of SODDI. I’m open to it. But rumours and lies aren’t getting me there.

I just want a trial. Let’s see ALL the evidence on both sides.

If RA didn’t do it and it can be proven, well there we go.

We don’t know all the evidence.

We need a trial.

MOO

 

[ClearAhead]

Another way to look at it: The public hearing was abruptly canceled without any explanation or warning. Nobody's talking (even the Youtubers The Murder Sheet!). The Judge has yet to rule on the State's Motion in Limine/SODDI defense. I'd say that all adds up, in my opinion, to proof that something significant did happen.

IMO MOO

Considering RA’s family members were observed to be upset, confused and crying, that certainly doesn’t point positive events by the defense. There’s no limit to speculation but the fact is we just don’t know, might’ve been significant or not. Not yet ruling on a motion doesn’t prove anything - she’s neither granted it nor ruled against it. MOO