Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #196

[Trebor5591]

Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #195

Didn't someone(s) employed at/by the prison go through every page and make copies of it first? I thought I remembered that. Sorry but that sounds farfetched since everything at the prison was video recorded per testimony.

www.websleuths.com

My fear all along with these so call "confessions" of RA is that when you drill into them and learn the details, they are going to be quite underwhelming. In this case, the guard watching Allen in his cell says he overheard Allen apologizing out loud for murdering Abby. Like I said, quite underwhelming. This is not a "confession", this is a guard in a noisy prison claiming he overheard Allen talking to himself. If I were a juror, I would have kinds of doubt about this. How many other of these "Confessions" are going to have problems if they are looked at closely? IMO

 

[photographer4]

I wasn't speaking about the entire legal system's attributes or inadequacies per se. I was speaking to the culpability of it's attorneys that are bad actors, be it by conscious choices, by inadequacies of their legal talents or both. Just some very real questions I have that have come up while following this case.

Yeah I have those same questions about all the parties in this proceeding.

 

[tlcya]

Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #195

Didn't someone(s) employed at/by the prison go through every page and make copies of it first? I thought I remembered that. Sorry but that sounds farfetched since everything at the prison was video recorded per testimony.

www.websleuths.com

My fear all along with these so call "confessions" of RA is that when you drill into them and learn the details, they are going to be quite underwhelming. In this case, the guard watching Allen in his cell says he overheard Allen apologizing out loud for murdering Abby. Like I said, quite underwhelming. This is not a "confession", this is a guard in a noisy prison claiming he overheard Allen talking to himself. If I were a juror, I would have kinds of doubt about this. How many other of these "Confessions" are going to have problems if they are looked at closely? IMO

I am most interested in drilling into the following confessions made by RA: verbal confessions (multiple) to his wife KA via recorded phone call. verbal confession to his mother via phone call (also recorded I believe). confession to warden written in his own hand.

I agree that any confessions "overheard" by inmates or guards will and should be given less weight. but even if they are given less weight, I do think it appropriate to factor them in with those verbal and written confessions the jury may give more weight to. They will become a part of the totality of evidence against him. JMO

 

[ClearAhead]

Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #195

Didn't someone(s) employed at/by the prison go through every page and make copies of it first? I thought I remembered that. Sorry but that sounds farfetched since everything at the prison was video recorded per testimony.

www.websleuths.com

My fear all along with these so call "confessions" of RA is that when you drill into them and learn the details, they are going to be quite underwhelming. In this case, the guard watching Allen in his cell says he overheard Allen apologizing out loud for murdering Abby. Like I said, quite underwhelming. This is not a "confession", this is a guard in a noisy prison claiming he overheard Allen talking to himself. If I were a juror, I would have kinds of doubt about this. How many other of these "Confessions" are going to have problems if they are looked at closely? IMO

His defense referred to them as ‘confessions’. Their only argument was what caused the ‘confessions’ to occur.

 

[Willow Knight]

Do his attorneys have any culpability in the length of time RA has waited in custody for his trial to start?

Oh....let me respond to that! A big YES

Richard Allen never had to wait in prison/jail this long. It was a CHOICE made by either him, his attorneys, or family members influence. At any time he could have filed for a speedy trial.

(B) Defendant in Jail – Motion for Early Trial.​

A defendant held in jail on a pending charge may move for an early trial. If such motion is filed, a trial must be commenced no later than seventy calendar days from the date of such motion except as follows:

(1) delays due to congestion of the court calendar or emergency are excluded from the seventy-day calculation;

(2) the defendant who moved for early trial is released from jail before the expiration of the seventy-day period; or

(3) an act of the defendant delays the trial.

If a defendant is held beyond the time limit of this section and moves for dismissal, the criminal charge against the defendant must be dismissed.

https://www.in.gov/courts/rules/criminal/#_Toc152240492

 

[Salah11]

I assume that RA likes prison as he is the one insisting on these questionable lawyers to represent him.

I mean at what stage does he think to himself they are not doing a good job here and are ruining his chances. For a so-called innocent man, he seems content enough to let his team keep him in prison for the foreseeable future. MOO

 

[photographer4]

Oh....let me respond to that! A big YES

Richard Allen never had to wait in prison/jail this long. It was a CHOICE made by either him, his attorneys, or family members influence. At any time he could have filed for a speedy trial.

(B) Defendant in Jail – Motion for Early Trial.​

A defendant held in jail on a pending charge may move for an early trial. If such motion is filed, a trial must be commenced no later than seventy calendar days from the date of such motion except as follows:

(1) delays due to congestion of the court calendar or emergency are excluded from the seventy-day calculation;

(2) the defendant who moved for early trial is released from jail before the expiration of the seventy-day period; or

(3) an act of the defendant delays the trial.

If a defendant is held beyond the time limit of this section and moves for dismissal, the criminal charge against the defendant must be dismissed.

https://www.in.gov/courts/rules/criminal/#_Toc152240492

Once JG removed the counsel from the case without a hearing, there was a long delay as the matter went to the SCOIN. This was an error on JG’s part imo (lack of hearing). This meant new counsel had to be appointed and learn the case / begin a strategy and then another delay to transfer it all back to the original counsel. They did file for speedy and then waived it at some court appearance due to reasons I no longer recall.

This is a mess on all sides. It’s unreasonable to focus solely on one party imo when there have been so many issues throughout the proceedings.

Indiana Supreme Court: Delphi judge failed to prove attorneys’ removal was necessary - Daily Journal

Indiana’s highest court does not believe the removal of the attorneys representing the man accused of killing two Delphi teenagers was “a necessary last resort,” a formal opinion says.

dailyjournal.net

Court-appointed attorneys withdraw from Delphi case after reinstatement of original defense team

CARROLL COUNTY, Ind. – Court-appointed attorneys for Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen have withdrawn from the case. On Wednesday, public defenders William S. Lebrato and Robert C. Scremin filed…

fox59.com

Delphi defense withdraws speedy trial request, murder trial now set for October

FORT WAYNE — After a fiery back and forth between themselves and Judge Fran Gull, the legal team for Delphi murder suspect Richard Allen withdrew their right to a speedy

www.newsbug.info

Special judge cancels hearings for Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen

Defense attorneys Brad Rozzi and Andrew Baldwin, who are representing Richard Allen, filed a second motion to disqualify Frances Gull from the case.

www.wthr.com

 

[tlcya]

[SBM for focus]
It’s unreasonable to focus solely on one party imo when there have been so many issues throughout the proceedings.

Now I can agree with this. It IS indeed unreasonable to focus solely on the perceived faults and issues of one party while steadfastly ignoring those of the other.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I am not a lawyer but it seems that all the parties have culpability in this. Maybe it is time to evaluate the justice system for inefficiencies and update the systems used to transfer info (eg: disclosure), and other inadequacies such as time it takes to respond to filings (or even if a response is required), time it takes to get to a hearing, lack of productivity in some hearings as things are often taken under advisement for several weeks in some cases etc…. The entire system could really use an overhaul imo.

That sounds like discussions for a new thread.
I thought this one was about the murders of Libby and Abby and the arrest of RA.
I’m so weary of talk here that focuses totally on what some believe are universal failings of the judicial system instead of this case.
I’m just one person here, and if everybody else steers the discussion that way, I can put up with it, I just needed to voice my opinion that the focus has slipped away from the case itself.
But I can deal with it.
Justice for Libby and Abby will bring justice for RA.

My opinion I have needed to express for a long time

 

[sunshineray]

Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #195

Didn't someone(s) employed at/by the prison go through every page and make copies of it first? I thought I remembered that. Sorry but that sounds farfetched since everything at the prison was video recorded per testimony.

www.websleuths.com

My fear all along with these so call "confessions" of RA is that when you drill into them and learn the details, they are going to be quite underwhelming. In this case, the guard watching Allen in his cell says he overheard Allen apologizing out loud for murdering Abby. Like I said, quite underwhelming. This is not a "confession", this is a guard in a noisy prison claiming he overheard Allen talking to himself. If I were a juror, I would have kinds of doubt about this. How many other of these "Confessions" are going to have problems if they are looked at closely? IMO

Why do you suppose RA's defense lawyers didn't look at them more closely then and address them individually?

 

[Gerrymd8]

09/11/2024

Order Issued The Court, having had the Defendant's Motion for Court to Certify Court Orders For Interlocutory Appeal Pursuant to Appellate Rule 14 and Request to Rule Expeditiously on Said Motion, filed September 9, 2024, and the State's Objection to Certification of Orders to Allow for Interlocutory Appeal, filed September 10, 2024, under advisement, now denies the Motion to Certify Court Orders. Trial remains set October 14, 2024 - November 15, 2024, with jury selection being conducted in Allen County, Indiana, and trial being conducted in Carroll County, Indiana. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Noticed: McLeland, Nicholas Charles Noticed: Baldwin, Andrew Joseph Noticed: Rozzi, Bradley Anthony Noticed: Luttrull, James David JR Noticed: Diener, Stacey Lynn Noticed: Auger, Jennifer Jones Order Signed: 09/11/2024

 

[iamshadow21]

09/11/2024

Order Issued The Court, having had the Defendant's Motion for Court to Certify Court Orders For Interlocutory Appeal Pursuant to Appellate Rule 14 and Request to Rule Expeditiously on Said Motion, filed September 9, 2024, and the State's Objection to Certification of Orders to Allow for Interlocutory Appeal, filed September 10, 2024, under advisement, now denies the Motion to Certify Court Orders. Trial remains set October 14, 2024 - November 15, 2024, with jury selection being conducted in Allen County, Indiana, and trial being conducted in Carroll County, Indiana. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Noticed: McLeland, Nicholas Charles Noticed: Baldwin, Andrew Joseph Noticed: Rozzi, Bradley Anthony Noticed: Luttrull, James David JR Noticed: Diener, Stacey Lynn Noticed: Auger, Jennifer Jones Order Signed: 09/11/2024

Boom.

Now let's go to trial.

MOO

 

[Tealgrove]

So what cards are left to play?

The Defence must be shuffling the deck.

MOO

 

[Salah11]

So what cards are left to play?

The Defence must be shuffling the deck.

MOO

Yes because they are clearly not ready for trial so no doubt they will throw another spanner in the works.

IMO

 

[Cyber sleuth]

Boom.

Now let's go to trial.

MOO

Let’s roll!

 

[iamshadow21]

So what cards are left to play?

The Defence must be shuffling the deck.

MOO

52 card pickup.

MOO

 

[Salah11]

They are probably writing another Franks as I type this

All kidding aside, their main issue is that RA is guilty, and they can’t place him anywhere but the bridge. So the rest is all smoke and Mirrors IMO.

 

[steeltowngirl]

That sounds like discussions for a new thread.
I thought this one was about the murders of Libby and Abby and the arrest of RA.
I’m so weary of talk here that focuses totally on what some believe are universal failings of the judicial system instead of this case.
I’m just one person here, and if everybody else steers the discussion that way, I can put up with it, I just needed to voice my opinion that the focus has slipped away from the case itself.
But I can deal with it.
Justice for Libby and Abby will bring justice for RA.

My opinion I have needed to express for a long time

Thank you for saying this. There are threads for folks to discuss gun control when threads for mass shootings go too far O/T. This thread has been overwhelmed with discussion of the perceived failings of the Indiana judicial system. It could make for an interesting thread of its own.

jmo

 

[photographer4]

That sounds like discussions for a new thread.
I thought this one was about the murders of Libby and Abby and the arrest of RA.
I’m so weary of talk here that focuses totally on what some believe are universal failings of the judicial system instead of this case.
I’m just one person here, and if everybody else steers the discussion that way, I can put up with it, I just needed to voice my opinion that the focus has slipped away from the case itself.
But I can deal with it.
Justice for Libby and Abby will bring justice for RA.

My opinion I have needed to express for a long time

It is terrible what happened to the kids - heart breaking!! But to be very honest, although I have compassion for them and their families and loved ones, my interest in this case is more about the justice system and how it works or doesn't in some instances. A man's life hangs in the balance, and precedents may be set over orders made or denied which may affect many other accused suspects down the line. I want justice for the kids, but I do not believe there can be justice when nothing anyone does can bring them back and make it so the atrocities never happened. I think what bothers some members is that the focus is not always on the victims or their loved ones - and they seem to get lost in the shuffle of the slow wheels of justice. Hopefully we can proceed to trial and the state has the goods to put RA away if he is infact guilty.

 

[SouthEnd]

Thank you for saying this. There are threads for folks to discuss gun control when threads for mass shootings go too far O/T. This thread has been overwhelmed with discussion of the perceived failings of the Indiana judicial system. It could make for an interesting thread of its own.

jmo

I also think that wider discussions of the judicial system should belong in another thread.

JMO

Justice for Abby and Libby