Alec Baldwin fired prop gun, killing 1 on movie set, Oct 2021 #2

[SuziQ]

I would ask that every actor in a scene that required them to use a deadly weapon to have basic gun safety education, that does not take being an expert. No one would accept the lack of basic gun safety in any other situation, especially after a deadly shooting, so I don’t know why they accept it on a movie set.

Even with gun safety lessons, I could see people accidentally shooting themselves or someone else doing a safety check. Imo, experts should be left to this as well as the AD. It works most of the time. This time there wasn't an expert and an AD that didn't care about safety.

Personally I think all real guns should be banned from filming. Last night I watched a tv show and I never noticed before that it looked like they were using plastic guns. Most people probably would never notice. What was most concerning was the little explosions simulating ricochets going off right by the actors head. It was the actor not a stuntman. No safety glasses or anything.

Moo.

 

[mickey2942]

One person who is handing the gun to the other person in the real world, doesn't have prop master, an armorer, and an assistant director.
Movies are not the real world.
And furthermore, the real world, plenty of gun "accidents' happen.
So the real people aren't always following those procedures. It'd be nice if all gun owners were really careful with their guns.

True. Everyone who handles a gun should take gun safety classes, at least one.

I have never seen the carelessness with guns that was apparently the "norm" on this set. It sets a new low bar for complete disregard for any type of safety protocols. Leaving guns lying around. All sorts of ammo mixed with blanks and live. This was an accident waiting to happen.

And apparently it did, before people were shot. And no one did anything about it. It is insanity.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

Even with gun safety lessons, I could see people accidentally shooting themselves or someone else doing a safety check. Imo, experts should be left to this as well as the AD. It works most of the time. This time there wasn't an expert and an AD that didn't care about safety.

Personally I think all real guns should be banned from filming. Last night I watched a tv show and I never noticed before that it looked like they were using plastic guns. Most people probably would never notice. What was most concerning was the little explosions simulating ricochets going off right by the actors head. It was the actor not a stuntman. No safety glasses or anything.

Moo.

I don’t think there’s any reason to ever have a real gun or live ammo on a set

So if explosives were being used on the set, would we expect Baldwin to go personally inspect the explosives?

If he was going to be the one igniting them then yes. I would expect him to have the proper education and know the proper safety protocol. I doubt Alec Baldwin would let explosives be blown up around him without going through every safety check available and verifying that those tasked with that responsibility are doing it correctly.

 

[Thora_Jay]

Ironic since that is where Alec might still be there


Vermont gun group leader blames Alec Baldwin for on-set shooting

Vermont gun group leader says Alec Baldwin ‘broke every single rule of basic firearm safety’

Alec Baldwin may want to lie even lower if he’s still in Vermont.

The leader of a pro-gun group in the state where Baldwin is thought to be hiding out has publicly blamed the “Hollywood hypocrite” for his deadly on-set shooting — saying the star “broke every single rule of basic firearm safety that exists.”

 

[jjenny]

Does this exempt the person who handles the firearm from the law? I am failing to see how, but I am not an attorney.

2020 New Mexico Statutes :: Chapter 30 - Criminal Offenses :: Article 7 - Weapons and Explosives :: Section 30-7-4 - Negligent use of a deadly weapon.



If he was going to ignite the explosives himself, yes. MOO only, but I find it hard to believe actors are the ones actually using explosives themselves. Again, I may be incorrect about this and I welcome corrections.

What if he was playing a mad bomber and was told to push a button to ignite fake explosives? Only explosives were actually real, but he wasn't aware?

 

[Thora_Jay]

Alec Baldwin posts story blaming AD over fatal 'Rust' shooting


Alec Baldwin posts story blaming his AD over fatal shooting of Halyna Hutchins



Alec Baldwin appears eager to shift the focus from his on-set deadly shooting of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins onto the assistant director who handed him a gun loaded with live ammunition.

The 63-year-old actor late Wednesday tweeted out a news story about AD David Halls’ admission that he “should have checked” all the rounds in the gun before handing it to Baldwin on the New Mexico set of “Rust.”

more at link

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

<modsnip - quoted post removed>
Yes I would if he is going to be the one setting it/igniting it. If he is not going to be the one setting the explosives/igniting them then I would not expect him to go inspect it. I would, as he is one of the producers, expect him to verify that the site was safe and all safety protocols were followed so nobody was injured by the explosives.

 

[GatorFL]

The gun was loaded with dummy rounds. Opening it up wouldn't prove the gun is cold. It would have to be unloaded and each round inspected.

I've heard that the usual protocol is as follows: The armorer presents the gun to the actor, shows the rounds that are in it, and they both verify the barrel has no obstructions. That did not happen in this case.

 

[GatorFL]

Based on this prop master's comments it seems it hasn't be all that unusual to combine the talents of the prop master and the armourer. Here's the link:

I'm a prop master for 'Law & Order: SVU' who helped create a weapons-safety class for union workers. Here's what my job is like.

Nice find branmuffin!

 

[jjenny]

I've heard that the usual protocol is as follows: The armorer presents the gun to the actor, shows the rounds that are in it, and they both verify the barrel has no obstructions. That did not happen in this case.

Heard it where? I don't know what usual is. If some people do it this way, and some don't. Would that be Baldwin's fault if armorer didn't do it in Rust movie?

 

[CrimeAway]

With a revolver, just opening the loading gate and rotating the cylinder would show it has dummy rounds or show that a live round was loaded. It would take 5-10 seconds.

I know very little about guns, but it appears that it is not as easy as just spinning the cylinder to check for rounds on the Pietta Long Colt 45 Revolver. I am ony phone, so I cannot easily copy text from the article, but if someone else can, I would be grateful. There is a video at the link also:

An inside look at type of gun used in Alec Baldwin 'Rust' shooting incident

ETA: YT version of the video from the article linked above

 

[cocomod]

I've heard that the usual protocol is as follows: The armorer presents the gun to the actor, shows the rounds that are in it, and they both verify the barrel has no obstructions. That did not happen in this case.

The problem is, there can be different protocols on different sets with different crews.

 

[GatorFL]

So if explosives were being used on the set, would we expect Baldwin to go personally inspect the explosives?

Do actors handle and/or trigger explosives? I bet not. And that is completely different scenario.

I don't know how many sets actually use explosives, I think most explosions are pyrotechnics. But that is just what I think, I don't know for sure. I am sure the protocol for pyros is similar to explosives. You clear the area, check it multiple times to ensure nobody is within the blast range, and horn multiple alerts before detonation.

A gun is different because it contains a projectile which has a limited blast range but a very definite danger zone.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

So if explosives were being used on the set, would we expect Baldwin to go personally inspect the explosives?

Apples and oranges, imo.
If he was stabbing someone with a retractable movie prop knife, would we expect him to make sure it’s not a real knife?

 

[GatorFL]

I know very little about guns, but it appears that it is not as easy as just spinning the cylinder to check for rounds on the Pietta Long Colt 45 Revolver. I am ony phone, so I cannot easily copy text from the article, but if someone else can, I would be grateful. There is a video at the link also:

An inside look at type of gun used in Alec Baldwin 'Rust' shooting incident

Yes, this firearm would have to be manually unloaded and reloaded to verify the status of each round.

 

[CrimeAway]

Accident on set of "Rust" is not the armourer's first brush with a wrongful death suit

Insurance company paid out, with the proviso that this would not be brought to court.

I wonder if whoever hired HG knew this? I'm guessing that the insurers of Rust may be rising their eyebrows.

Character counts.

Details matter.

All, JMO.

 

[GatorFL]

Heard it where? I don't know what usual is. If some people do it this way, and some don't. Would that be Baldwin's fault if armorer didn't do it in Rust movie?

In this very thread, earlier. Scroll back.

 

[GatorFL]

I saw this on another site: https://www.csatf.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/01FIREARMS.pdf

 

[cocomod]

I keep meaning to ask: Why did HG remove the casing from the gun after the shooting? It seems like everything, including guns and ammo, should have been left untouched for LE to inspect. Is there a legitimate reason for handling the gun? Could there have been additional bullets in the gun?

The Armorer (Hannah Gutierrez) was given the prop gun after it was fired by Actor Alec Baldwin, she then took the spent casing out of the prop-gun. When deputies arrived on scene, the prop-gun was handed to arriving deputies by Armorer (Hannah Gutierrez).
‘Rust’: Released Affidavit Reveals Details About Fatal Shooting – Read It – Deadline
https://deadline.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/rust-oct-27-search-warrant_Redacted.pdf

I would say that is obstruction of justice, tampering with evidence. I really don’t think anyone should have touched it before LE arrived.

 

[jjenny]

The problem is, there can be different protocols on different sets with different crews.

That's exactly right. AD of Rust explained their protocol was him checking the gun after armorer loaded it, then declaring it a "cold" gun. They didn't do it in front of actors. But is that Baldwin's fault?