Amanda Knox tried for the murder of Meredith Kercher in Italy *NEW TRIAL*#3

[SMK]

In Italy, it is normal for the victim to have a voice, if only through the appointment of a lawyer. Maresca is the trusted legal advisor, chosen by the victim's family, to represent the interests and voice of Meredith Kercher during the trial. It is simply beyond belief that Senator Cantwell would select someone that slanders the victim's voice as a spokesperson for her cause.

You mention "book money". Did Meredith's legal representative write a book about the murder of Meredith?

Well, I would agree with you that it is always, always more dignified to take the high road, not to denigrate your opponents, especially in the case of someone representing the dead girl's family, etc. and before a Congressional presentation...

No, I was only referring to things I had heard last year, about Maresca wanting to "shake down" Knox and Sollecito for their book proceeds......all gossip, in any case.....and very unpleasant.

 

[Linda7NJ]

It is always difficult for people from the US to accept that a prosecutor has the right to appeal a verdict. People from other countries do not see a problem with this. OJ Simpson and Casey Anthony are two examples of people that got away with murder because the prosecution could not appeal a verdict. Although people from the US probably take this in stride as a downside of preventing the prosecutor from appealing a verdict, countries were a prosecutor can appeal a verdict see it as a strength. I think that it is rare where a prosecutor appeals a verdict, and I think it is only done when there is a very strong case for success.

In this case, we know that there was a strong case because instead of one or two points being re-opened for discussion, the entire decision was annulled. That is as bad as it can get for a verdict.

I love that the prosecutor gets to appeal a verdict. The whole system seems more about finding the truth than protecting the rights of the accused, often at the expense of the victims.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free

 

[otto]

I love that the prosecutor gets to appeal a verdict. The whole system seems more about finding the truth than protecting the rights of the accused, often at the expense of the victims.

The truth is what matters, and if the Judge or jury gets it completely wrong, there should be a mechanism for setting things right. As it stands, the majority of people that are aware of Casey Anthony firmly believe that she got away with murder. The result is that a murderer is free to do it again.

Without a doubt, Casey Anthony's verdict would have been appealed if prosecutors had the option. However, I very much doubt that it would be routine for a prosecutor to appeal because it is not routine for a prosecutor to appeal in countries where it is allowed.

 

[sherlockh]

Agree - I don't like the whole idea of DNA being used when those involved all had access to the cottage and interacted with one another... DNA does not provide a time-stamp as to when it got where it's found, nor can show "layering" as to who's DNA was placed below or on top of another's.

Collection of DNA is hit and miss - just little tiny samples taken; we can't scan and entire room, entire articles of clothing, sheets, etc., such that complete picture is presented of every bit of DNA that can be gotten.

It is unlikely that Meredith's blood was left at some other time so this can be dated. Therefore the moment of mixing Meredith's blood with Amanda's DNA can also be dated. Knox herself claims that there was no blood on the tap before so that can also be dated. There are several mixed traces in the bathroom and only one individual trace of Knox (blood on the tap).

At first, I thought DNA in a bathroom is normal but then where are all those individual traces? It is all blood and mixed. All these traces are easily explained by the fact that Knox and Meredith were both bleeding on the night of the murder, and that is how these traces became mixed. It is the blood that provides the time-stamp. JMO.

 

[OldSteve]

It is unlikely that Meredith's blood was left at some other time so this can be dated. Therefore the moment of mixing Meredith's blood with Amanda's DNA can also be dated. Knox herself claims that there was no blood on the tap before so that can also be dated. There are several mixed traces in the bathroom and only one individual trace of Knox (blood on the tap).

At first, I thought DNA in a bathroom is normal but then where are all those individual traces? It is all blood and mixed. All these traces are easily explained by the fact that Knox and Meredith were both bleeding on the night of the murder, and that is how these traces became mixed. It is the blood that provides the time-stamp. JMO.

This is what bothers me about collecting DNA - it all depends upon where samples are taken... To setup a fine grid pattern of sampling so nothing is missed would be expensive. I do not know if such was done here, does anyone know?

While I trust science, in general (please, this is NOT directed at you whom I respect) I not so trustful of people who find ways to manipulate findings/data...
Because of these feelings I need overwhelming and clear cut forensics...
On the other hand, (perhaps because I'm an old geezer) I find the way people act to be very important - and story changing, lying, falsely accusing others really weigh heavy in my decisions...

 

[Amber29]

It would seem so, but Italy has this procedure of appeals and reviews and Supreme Court rulings, that we in the US do not have. To them, it is not exactly a new trial or retrial with different verdicts, but the upholding or annulling of past decisions based on further review and discussion. I will admit that nearly 7 years on, it does seem overly protracted, and certainly goes against our presupposition of "the right to a speedy trial".

Right to a speedy trial? Martin MacNeil is on trial now for the death of his wife in 2007.
Jodi Arias is still in the trial process for a murder that was committed in 2008.

These 2 examples have been going through our system for years.
Americans seem to have an attitude of our system being better than others. While personally I wish our prosecutors had options to take a case to the supreme level. In fact many countries use this "medieval" judicial system that Italy uses. I wish people would stop using the term retrial because we are still in the same place as we were when the defendants appealed. I do hope due process is served and Meredith Kerchers family gets the justice they deserve, she is the victim here not amanda.

 

[Amber29]

I have no doubt that they would have been convicted. The circumstantial evidence (omitting the DNA) is very strong, especially when we look at the lies, absence of alibi, shifting stories, concocted stories, false accusations, bizarre reaction to discovering a crime scene, staged break in and so on. I'm also of the opinion that if this case had been tried in the US, the verdicts would have been the same. Additionally, if it had been a woman from the US that was murdered in Perugia, I suspect that we wouldn't be reading about how to get around extradition laws.

I can't thank you enough for this post. You say exactly my thoughts.

I do hope that the UK would get involved if it comes to getting around extradition.

 

[SMK]

Right to a speedy trial? Martin MacNeil is on trial now for the death of his wife in 2007.
Jodi Arias is still in the trial process for a murder that was committed in 2008.

These 2 examples have been going through our system for years.
Americans seem to have an attitude of our system being better than others. While personally I wish our prosecutors had options to take a case to the supreme level. In fact many countries use this "medieval" judicial system that Italy uses. I wish people would stop using the term retrial because we are still in the same place as we were when the defendants appealed. I do hope due process is served and Meredith Kerchers family gets the justice they deserve, she is the victim here not amanda.

That's why I put it in quotes: I am all too aware of how due process is violated daily in the US, and I believe our criminal justice system has become vastly inferior to that of all other Westernized democracies. Victims aside: The sole question now is if Knox and Sollecito are guilty of this 2007 crime or not.

 

[Amber29]

That's why I put it in quotes: I am all too aware of how due process is violated daily in the US, and I believe our criminal justice system has become vastly inferior to that of all other Westernized democracies. Victims aside: The sole question now is if Knox and Sollecito are guilty of this 2007 crime or not.

I'm sorry SMK if that reply came off as directly towards you. I did not mean it that way, I meant generally speaking. I only used your post as where mine was coming from. Again sorry for that. I fully respect your opinions here.

 

[SMK]

I'm sorry SMK if that reply came off as directly towards you. I did not mean it that way, I meant generally speaking. I only used your post as where mine was coming from. Again sorry for that. I fully respect your opinions here.

Thanks, ditto.

 

[SMK]

Andrea Vogt has added a piece for today's update:

The prison guard whom Amanda Knox accused of sexual harassment is to stand trial for harassing another female in like manner:

Prosecutors in Perugia this week requested that the head guard who was in charge of Amanda Knox during her incarceration in Capanne prison, Vice Commander Raffaele Agiro’, stand trial for sexual abuse of a female officer who was briefly incarcerated in Perugia during 2007. According to court documents, prosecutor Massimo Casucci decided to require Agiro’ to stand trial after investigating what happened in the women’s section of the high-security prison of Capanne between December 2006 an January 2007. The first trial hearing is Nov. 19th. Specifically — the case involves the jail cell rape of an Italian woman who is now out of prison and working as a city cop in Milan. [. . . ]

Vogt closes with these words:

It took courage for Amanda Knox to write about her harassment by Agiro’, who has since retired quietly from his job as vice-commander of the Capanne women’s ward. If only she could tap into the same well of courage to tell the whole, unfiltered truth about what happened in Perugia six years ago. All too often in Italy, the corrupt bureaucrats are allowed to retreat all too quietly into retirement . . . leaving justice behind. I hope Perugia prosecutors pursue this. A bad apple is a bad apple.

http://thefreelancedesk.com/front_featured/amanda-knox-appeal-2/

 

[sherlockh]

This is what bothers me about collecting DNA - it all depends upon where samples are taken... To setup a fine grid pattern of sampling so nothing is missed would be expensive. I do not know if such was done here, does anyone know?

While I trust science, in general (please, this is NOT directed at you whom I respect) I not so trustful of people who find ways to manipulate findings/data...
Because of these feelings I need overwhelming and clear cut forensics...
On the other hand, (perhaps because I'm an old geezer) I find the way people act to be very important - and story changing, lying, falsely accusing others really weigh heavy in my decisions...

Maybe there will be a DNA scanner in the future But seriously, there is no evidence of Knox's individual DNA traces all over the place. Only found in one trace of her own blood. You can blame the police for everything but if Knox's individual DNA was really all over the place there would have been evidence of this. Then there isn't just one mixed DNA trace. There are 5, and all of them contain Knox's DNA and Meredith's DNA. To me it doesn't make sense to blame police and coincidences for all of this. It is much more logical that Knox herself mixed her own DNA with Meredith's blood because the blood was still fresh. JMO.

http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/Mixed_DNA

 

[ShadyLady]

If I were to read 1 or 2 books on this case, what should they be??

 

[Harmony 2]

If I were to read 1 or 2 books on this case, what should they be??

https://www.google.com/#q=amanda+knox+book&tbm=shop

 

[ShadyLady]

I ordered Angel face but which others are the most factual?

 

[SMK]

I ordered Angel face but which others are the most factual?

The problem is, they are very polarized: Similar to the Democrats and Republicans in the US.

If you read the pro-guilt books, (such as Nadeau's Angel Face) and the pro-innocence ones (such as Candace Dempsey's Murder in Italy or Bruce Fisher's Injustice in Perugia) you will be convinced of their guilt or innocence, respectively. It's as if they are working from different facts or different scenarios. Very confusing, to say the least.

Ditto the various articles which appear, such as this piece from today:

Amanda Knox Forensic Tests Do Not Find Victim's DNA on Knife Spot
ROME Oct. 31, 2013

http://abcnews.go.com/International...ests-find-victims-dna-knife/story?id=20738813

 

[SMK]

Amanda Knox Forensic Tests Do Not Find Victim's DNA on Knife Spot
ROME Oct. 31, 2013

http://abcnews.go.com/International...ests-find-victims-dna-knife/story?id=20738813

 

[otto]

http://abcnews.go.com/International...ests-find-victims-dna-knife/story?id=20738813

I think we can see what the arguments will be in court. The defense will argue that because the new tests only confirm that Knox's DNA is on the handle of the knife, and that there is no evidence of Meredith, Guede or Sollecito on the handle of the knife, Knox and Sollecito must be innocent. The prosecution, and Meredith's lawyer, will argue that Knox's DNA on the handle of the knife means that she used the knife during the murder. The absence of any trace of Sollecito on his own knife implies that the knife was thoroughly cleaned by Knox, and the trace of Meredith's DNA near Knox's DNA on the blade of the knife means that it is the murder weapon.

November 6 will be interesting, as that is when we'll hear the results of the 91 page report. If I understand correctly, there also appears to be a second female DNA sample on the handle, but that does not belong to any of the suspects.

 

[SMK]

I think we can see what the arguments will be in court. The defense will argue that because the new tests only confirm that Knox's DNA is on the handle of the knife, and that there is no evidence of Meredith, Guede or Sollecito on the handle of the knife, Knox and Sollecito must be innocent. The prosecution, and Meredith's lawyer, will argue that Knox's DNA on the handle of the knife means that she used the knife during the murder. The absence of any trace of Sollecito on his own knife implies that the knife was thoroughly cleaned by Knox, and the trace of Meredith's DNA near Knox's DNA on the blade of the knife means that it is the murder weapon.

November 6 will be interesting, as that is when we'll hear the results of the 91 page report. If I understand correctly, there also appears to be a second female DNA sample on the handle, but that does not belong to any of the suspects.

Yes, obviously ABC news is taking the innocence stance, while something such as TJMK is viewing it altogether differently :

(see this piece of theirs, posted today, at the top: http://truejustice.org/ee/index.php )

By their accounts, the Nov 6 court report will be over 100 pages long

 

[otto]

Yes, obviously ABC news is taking the innocence stance, while something such as TJMK is viewing it altogether differently (see this piece of theirs, posted today, at the top: http://truejustice.org/ee/index.php )

It seems everyone has an agenda. The big question is: is the testing of this single piece of DNA on the handle of the knife the deciding factor in guilt or innocence, or is there a complete set of existing circumstantial evidence, including Meredith's DNA on the blade of the knife, that will be considered when delivering a verdict in this appeal. I guess we'll learn the answer to that question on November 6. If one were to rely exclusively on US media, I think people may conclude that DNA evidence on the handle of the knife is the only evidence that is relevant, and I think that may be a bit of a simplistic interpretation of a nine month long trial. Surely the court did not spend nine months discussing DNA on the handle of the knife. Still, this appeal could go either way, just like that one that was annulled.