AR - Josh Duggar Admits Molesting Girls As A Teenager - #2

[human]

Snipped and BBM. No, they don't go swimming or to the beach, per Michelle Duggar's comments. I live in an area with an increasing population of Muslims, and we regularly see women and girls in very modest swimwear, like these:

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=muslim+swimming+suit&FORM=HDRSC2

http://www.eastessence.com/islamic-...mic swimming suit&utm_campaign=Eastessence-US

So, modest swimwear exists. So that must not be the only reason MD forbids swimwear.

Modest? Ugh. What do the men wear?

I agree with previous posters who stated if men or so aroused snd cannot control themselves, lock them up.

 

[gitana1]

I have a code word with my husband too - actually it's a code phrase: "Put your eyes back in their sockets - she's too young for you anyway" and then I give him a correction.

If he does it again I say "Do you wanna get laid tonight?" then I give him another correction.

Okay, I'm joking. As an adult I find the whole "Nike" thing laughable. So what if My husband or I look at attractive people? Then again, my husband respects women enough that he would not embarrass a stranger by focusing on her breasts or the crotch of her pants. BTW, that notion of respect was taught to him by... his parents.

But when thinking about teens I understand the emotional (and often physical) reaction a boy may have. But that's the inherent problem with the Duggars' line of thinking - those feelings don't only come as a response to so-called immodest dress. A girl with a face that's appealing to the boy is just as likely to stir up certain "impure thoughts." And it's not just boys, girls get those feelings too.

So really, what's the point of trying to isolate one single factor in the course of normal sexual development and label it as sinful? Wouldn't it be more productive for teens to learn the difference between thoughts and actions? To learn about boundaries and respect for others?

I, for one, have countless impure thoughts everyday (not involving children or other beings incapable of consent) and have no intention of trying to curb them, lol. I have my handbasket all picked out for my trip, where I'll be in good company I'm sure.

You guys are really cracking me up!

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

Hulu pulls 19 Kids after allegations against Josh Duggar

http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/wireStory/hulu-pulls-19-kids-allegations-josh-duggar-31372726

 

[believe09]

I am maxxed out on the number of tags I could move over-if anyone can grab the rest it would be wonderful.

 

[Donjeta]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/chels...446304.html?utm_hp_ref=celebrity&ir=Celebrity

The media has used the word "alleged" over and over and over again. The "alleged sexual abuse." Do you know what "alleged" means? It means something said, without proof, to have taken place or to have a specified illegal or undesirable quality.

There is proof, including the admissions of the perpetrator, his parents, and wife, that Josh Duggar sexually abused young girls. There is nothing "alleged" about this.

"Semantics," maybe you say.

"Rape culture," I reply.

One analysis of several thorough studies suggests that out of reported rapes and sexual assaults, only 2 percent to 10 percent are false reports. Skepchick founder Rebecca Watson has a video that explains studies around false rape accusations; she astutely points out, "If you always believe the alleged rapist, then you will be wrong approximately 98 times out of 100."

http://www.people.com/article/jon-stewart-larry-wilmore-funny-die-parody-duggars

The Nightly Show's Larry Wilmore, The Daily Show's Jon Stewart and the brains behind Funny or Die have all ridiculed the family's handling of a dark scandal this week.

Disclaimer: There is nothing remotely funny about adolescent serial sexual offenders who sexually assault five little girls... but flaming hypocrisy deserves all the ridicule anyone can muster. IMO.

In that vein:

@TheTweetOfGod ·22. May
When you do something horrible don't try to make up for it by "getting closer to God". You're a creep and I don't want you anywhere near Me.

http://thinkprogress.org/culture/20...people-family-values-admitted-child-molester/

9 Times Josh Duggar Lectured People On Family Values Before He Admitted He Was A Child Molester

We have to make sure we’re standing up to protect the rights of privacy and protecting the well-being of women and children in our cities.

Josh Duggar, the oldest of 19 children, made the rounds Friday at a central Missouri rally for Santorum after previously doing the same in Iowa, Oklahoma, Georgia and many places in between. “Our family is like the epitome of conservative values,” Duggar said. “People connect to us in that way.”

http://www.salon.com/2015/05/27/the..._hypocrisy_how_this_should_have_been_handled/

The greatest concern here for all of us should be appropriate treatment for the perpetrator and the victims, who seem to have been forgotten by both their parents and their brother. You can probably chalk that up to their uber-patriarchal, women-hurting, woman-hating belief system. But society should have an interest in stopping this type of abuse regardless of who is doing it (looking at you, powerful white men), and stopping this type of abuse requires treatment. It isn’t safe or healthy for any perpetrator to not seek appropriate, evidence-based, clinically effective treatment. Nor should any child, regardless of his or her parents’ religious beliefs, have to be subjected to this type of abuse, so it goes without saying that the girls should also receive the best treatment available. So what does that treatment look like?

A Christian spin doctor who wouldn't help the Duggars:

http://www.christianpost.com/news/c...o-satisfy-sexual-molestation-scandal-139688/#!

Hunter Frederick, a Christian public relations expert once rumored to have been hired to help manage the fallout from the sexual abuse allegations surrounding Josh Duggar, star of "19 Kids and Counting," by the Duggar family, says the recent apology from the embattled Christian figure and his parents is not enough to sate the effects of the scandal that has engulfed the family.

Frederick explained that his clients go through an intense vetting process to determine whether they are capable of being helped and whether it's worth the company's investment. Despite rumors that he was hired to help the Duggars get through the scandal, Frederick said things did not work out with the Duggar family for reasons he could not reveal.

He said that his firm looks for clients who have: "a willingness to admit fault, transparency, willingness to want to change. … Especially with our Christian clients, repentance is critical. This isn't our first time doing this, we know when something's going to work out and when it's not."

Read more at http://www.christianpost.com/news/c...lestation-scandal-139688/#jtqCZpQyegD8b92F.99

He doesn't come straight out and say so but the way the article is written seems like darling little Josh failed something in the willingness to admit fault and change department (which is sorta scary considering that historically he's a child molester and willingness to change would be essential).

 

[Mrs G Norris]

FOXTEL has axed unseen eps of 19 years and counting in Australia ..

 

[Montjoy]

http://thinkprogress.org/culture/20...people-family-values-admitted-child-molester/

9 Times Josh Duggar Lectured People On Family Values Before He Admitted He Was A Child Molester

Good read, and I think it's the tip of the iceberg. Thanks for finding and linking this.

 

[Donjeta]

http://www.christiantoday.com/artic...rters.and.critics.are.getting.wrong/54698.htm

So is there any way back for the Duggars? Perhaps: but this is what their defenders are getting wrong.

1. They're minimising Josh Duggar's offences. They seem to be saying that because he 'repented', everything's OK. But you don't avoid paying the price for wrongdoing just by saying the right things.

2. They aren't talking about the victims. The focus is all on Josh and the Duggar family. Actually, five girls were involved too, and the impact on them is simply not known. They might have been deeply marked, or not at all, but it surely wasn't the senior Duggars' call to make.

3. They're angry and defensive. The Duggar family has been inspirational for a lot of conservative evangelicals and the temptation is to defend them to the hilt. That makes them blind to the real issues. Yes, some of their critics might be godless liberals who just want to give them a good kicking, but that doesn't mean they're wrong to criticise.

4. They aren't admitting that the senior Duggars got it wrong. They seem to have thought the problem wasn't a problem because they'd 'dealt with it'. But they sidestepped the law. If they'd done the right thing, they might not have had a TV show but they wouldn't be facing this firestorm.

Then, among things that attackers are getting wrong in his opinion:

3. We don't do the same things at the age of 14 as we do at the age of 27. Accusing Josh Duggar of having been a child molester might be true, but however inappropriate the Duggar parents' intervention was at the time of the offences, Josh Duggar seems to have lived a blameless life since then. People do change, and here's where Christians need to take the critics on: yes, grace works.

I gotta disagree with this really. "Seemed" to have lived a blameless life doesn't cut it when people have been covering for his dirty deeds before. Some people still might.

Everybody who's been reading WS for any length of time has encountered tons of stories of child molesters who seemed to live blameless lives until they got caught.

I hope he's changed... but no way for anyone to be sure.

 

[Doghairrules]

Okay, so molestation not funny, but hypocrisy is hilarious.

http://mobi.perezhilton.com/2015-05...helle-duggar-funny-or-die-parody#.VWhcp_69LCQ

 

[nightwatch]

I missed the airing of True Crime Radio broadcast last evening where can I find the Duggar segment?

ciao

 

[Bravo]

I missed the airing of True Crime Radio broadcast last evening where can I find the Duggar segment?

ciao

http://www.truecrimeradio.com/radio-archives/dr-lillian-glass-carl-k-radio-archive-july-2015/

 

[leah]

I'll be thinking about the Duggar swimwear all day today, and can honestly say, never, ever have I seen anyone dressed like that on any beach. Might as well stay home in the air conditioner to cool off.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

Maybe the problem is Josh thought "Nike" was code for "Just do it."

:giggle:

 

[threecrazykids]

I have FINALLY read through the entire 2 threads to get caught up. This whole situation makes me furious, and also sad for all victims of sexual abuse.

I am also sitting here torn, wondering who all deserves not only sympathy and compassion, but also blame.

Hear me out here - and please know I am NOT defending pedophilia or sexual molestation or how the Duggar's have chosen to "handle" this situation...I am still simply trying to understand and process this.

These people obviously have a very different set of beliefs and followings from what we, as a society, deem "normal" or "accepted", right? So...I wonder, do these girls, boys, etc. who WE deem as victims of this abuse really feel the same violations, shame, etc. that other victims do?

If you are raised from birth in a circle where X = Y and there is NO deviation from those beliefs, no questions asked, no other thoughts or feelings, do they "naturally" feel what others raised OUTSIDE of those beliefs feel?

As an example - Mr. CannotKeepHisHandsToHimself (stealing that because I can't stop laughing at the name LOL) touches a person in a private area. They have apparently been told - on some level - this is wrong. However, do they know WHY it's wrong? Because (as sick as this sounds) it may not FEEL bad. It may actually feel good. (God that makes me want to barf just typing it).
But, if they DO tell someone that this event happened, and Mom and/ or Dad say "Ok...thanks for letting us know, we will take care of it" - what's next? If Michelle and Jim Bob TRULY and HONESTLY believe that based on THEIR church, THEIR belifs, THEIR followings, they took the steps to handle the situation as THEIR prophet desires by the words of HIS teachings - do they even understand that what they did is wrong?
Are they "brainwashed" (I guess you could call it) enough that regardless of what the LAW states - they followed the protocol of THEIR scriptures. They went to elders, the went to law enforcement, they prayed etc. But maybe above all - in THEIR religion, beliefs, etc. they were told in scripture that protecting your own comes before what "outsiders" (the rest of society" have deemed The Law of the Land.

We ASSUME there is intentional deceit - that they are INTENTIONALLY deceiving the laws, INTENTIONALLY covering up this scandal with $$$ in their eyes, INTENTIONALLY etc....but what IF they are -for lack of a better word- too "blind" to know any better? Are their beliefs SO strong that "Laws of the sinners society be damned...this is how WE deal with a situation in the religion WE choose to follow"? That IF they choose to go the route of what the REST of us filthy sinners do, they are disobeying the word of their God...

Does that even make sense? They do everything else in their religion differently and more conservative than what society at large considers "normal" or "traditional". Why would handling a situation like this be any different?

I feel horrible for all of his victims - Anna as well. However (again) - she doesn't KNOW any different (or better). She has been raised from a baby to believe that God chooses your husband under the direction of her FATHER (who is apparently the protector of the family - by God's word). If her FATHER approved her marrying him and she prayed, etc. and wrote off any hesitation as just "normal nervousness" why WOULDN'T she blindly do what she's been told? SHE DOESN'T KNOW ANY BETTER!! And I mean this in the most literal terms. She LITERALLY does not know that there are options to say NO. Even if she DID feel any sort of hesitation - it's not because it's not right and God is telling her that - it's that God is asking her to be more open, more forgiving, more modest, more InsertWhateverShortcomingsSheMayHave.

It's sick and twisted - that's for sure. But I seriously have NO understanding of why they believe what they do. But again, I wasn't RAISED that way. I don't always do what I'm told. I argue with my husband. We (as the rest of society at large) consider that NORMAL. That I have just as much of a say as he. I don't live in a world where my voice has no authority. But if you were RAISED to believe that your only job on earth was to put out, make babies and shut up - would I really feel that I was DESERVING of sympathy when someone violated me?

I hope I'm making sense...I feel like I just rambled, but I just can't put into words what I'm trying to say. I guess to summarize - WE know it's wrong, because that's what WE have been raised to KNOW. But when you aren't raised from birth in our world - do you even KNOW that things SHOULD be handled differently than they are? Maybe they all HONESTLY feel that what Josh did had been "resolved" (per their religious teachings and doctrine of how to handle situations) and don't understand why everyone else is up in arms about it. That we are all filthy sinners anyway - NOT following what they believe to be "The Words of God" - that OUR way of dealing with things is the WRONG way.

I really hope DHS steps in here - I really do. I hope that IF these kids don't know any better, that somehow, some way, someone can break their silence and teach them that the rest of the world isn't filled with hell bound, horrible people. That they CAN trust others outside of their religion and no harm will come their way.

 

[human]

I don't know of any society on earth right now that thinks sex abuse of children is OK there are marriages in. The Middle east of old men and young girls. Is it acceptable in society in general there? I do not know.

They can think what they want. The laws of the US say it is a crime. And like I said, any society says it is wrong

 

[blue22]

I don't know of any society on earth right now that thinks sex abuse of children is OK there are marriages in. The Middle east of old men and young girls. Is it acceptable in society in general there? I do not know.

They can think what they want. The laws of the US say it is a crime. And like I said, any society says it is wrong

There are so many countries where child brides is common. The child sex industry is out in the open. And many societies tend to blame the victim and protect the abuser. It's all over the world. Rampant.

 

[Inthedetails]

I have FINALLY read through the entire 2 threads to get caught up. This whole situation makes me furious, and also sad for all victims of sexual abuse.

I am also sitting here torn, wondering who all deserves not only sympathy and compassion, but also blame.

Hear me out here - and please know I am NOT defending pedophilia or sexual molestation or how the Duggar's have chosen to "handle" this situation...I am still simply trying to understand and process this.

These people obviously have a very different set of beliefs and followings from what we, as a society, deem "normal" or "accepted", right? So...I wonder, do these girls, boys, etc. who WE deem as victims of this abuse really feel the same violations, shame, etc. that other victims do?

If you are raised from birth in a circle where X = Y and there is NO deviation from those beliefs, no questions asked, no other thoughts or feelings, do they "naturally" feel what others raised OUTSIDE of those beliefs feel?

As an example - Mr. CannotKeepHisHandsToHimself (stealing that because I can't stop laughing at the name LOL) touches a person in a private area. They have apparently been told - on some level - this is wrong. However, do they know WHY it's wrong? Because (as sick as this sounds) it may not FEEL bad. It may actually feel good. (God that makes me want to barf just typing it).
But, if they DO tell someone that this event happened, and Mom and/ or Dad say "Ok...thanks for letting us know, we will take care of it" - what's next? If Michelle and Jim Bob TRULY and HONESTLY believe that based on THEIR church, THEIR belifs, THEIR followings, they took the steps to handle the situation as THEIR prophet desires by the words of HIS teachings - do they even understand that what they did is wrong?
Are they "brainwashed" (I guess you could call it) enough that regardless of what the LAW states - they followed the protocol of THEIR scriptures. They went to elders, the went to law enforcement, they prayed etc. But maybe above all - in THEIR religion, beliefs, etc. they were told in scripture that protecting your own comes before what "outsiders" (the rest of society" have deemed The Law of the Land.

We ASSUME there is intentional deceit - that they are INTENTIONALLY deceiving the laws, INTENTIONALLY covering up this scandal with $$$ in their eyes, INTENTIONALLY etc....but what IF they are -for lack of a better word- too "blind" to know any better? Are their beliefs SO strong that "Laws of the sinners society be damned...this is how WE deal with a situation in the religion WE choose to follow"? That IF they choose to go the route of what the REST of us filthy sinners do, they are disobeying the word of their God...

Does that even make sense? They do everything else in their religion differently and more conservative than what society at large considers "normal" or "traditional". Why would handling a situation like this be any different?

I feel horrible for all of his victims - Anna as well. However (again) - she doesn't KNOW any different (or better). She has been raised from a baby to believe that God chooses your husband under the direction of her FATHER (who is apparently the protector of the family - by God's word). If her FATHER approved her marrying him and she prayed, etc. and wrote off any hesitation as just "normal nervousness" why WOULDN'T she blindly do what she's been told? SHE DOESN'T KNOW ANY BETTER!! And I mean this in the most literal terms. She LITERALLY does not know that there are options to say NO. Even if she DID feel any sort of hesitation - it's not because it's not right and God is telling her that - it's that God is asking her to be more open, more forgiving, more modest, more InsertWhateverShortcomingsSheMayHave.

It's sick and twisted - that's for sure. But I seriously have NO understanding of why they believe what they do. But again, I wasn't RAISED that way. I don't always do what I'm told. I argue with my husband. We (as the rest of society at large) consider that NORMAL. That I have just as much of a say as he. I don't live in a world where my voice has no authority. But if you were RAISED to believe that your only job on earth was to put out, make babies and shut up - would I really feel that I was DESERVING of sympathy when someone violated me?

I hope I'm making sense...I feel like I just rambled, but I just can't put into words what I'm trying to say. I guess to summarize - WE know it's wrong, because that's what WE have been raised to KNOW. But when you aren't raised from birth in our world - do you even KNOW that things SHOULD be handled differently than they are? Maybe they all HONESTLY feel that what Josh did had been "resolved" (per their religious teachings and doctrine of how to handle situations) and don't understand why everyone else is up in arms about it. That we are all filthy sinners anyway - NOT following what they believe to be "The Words of God" - that OUR way of dealing with things is the WRONG way.

I really hope DHS steps in here - I really do. I hope that IF these kids don't know any better, that somehow, some way, someone can break their silence and teach them that the rest of the world isn't filled with hell bound, horrible people. That they CAN trust others outside of their religion and no harm will come their way.

I hear what you're saying.

But I think what people are really upset about is the hypocrisy and insensitivity to the girls by going on national television after these events happened within the family.

I think most people understand the molestation situation could, potentially, happen in any family. That's an unfortunate truth. And I think many of us, if we're honest, don't know what we would do if confronted with molestation committed by our child against our other children and a friend. I for one don't even want to think about it, let alone make a hypothetical decision on how to react.

It's the COVERUP, the HYPOCRISY, and the lack of apparent support for the GIRLS.

I just can't get over that they became a reality tv family and made those kids be in front of the camera while the serious problem was never addressed or acknowledged. That decision - to go on tv while preaching purity - is what makes me lose all respect for the family.

 

[LisaB]

The fact that his father said he "didn't want it to be made into a bigger deal than it was" when he knew his daughters and another girl had been victimized for over a year, and that his first attempt at intervention had failed, is appalling. Then for him to add that his son went to a treatment center, giving details about the place, when he did NOT go there (because they were afraid he would "pick up bad habits" there) is the icing on the dysfunctional cake.

 

[LisaB]

I hear what you're saying.

But I think what people are really upset about is the hypocrisy and insensitivity to the girls by going on national television after these events happened within the family.

I think most people understand the molestation situation could, potentially, happen in any family. That's an unfortunate truth. And I think many of us, if we're honest, don't know what we would do if confronted with molestation committed by our child against our other children and a friend. I for one don't even want to think about it, let alone make a hypothetical decision on how to react.

It's the COVERUP, the HYPOCRISY, and the lack of apparent support for the GIRLS.

I just can't get over that they became a reality tv family and made those kids be in front of the camera while the serious problem was never addressed or acknowledged. That decision - to go on tv while preaching purity - is what makes me lose all respect for the family.

I wonder if they might even be able to argue that involving the law in this would have been "against their religion" and that their "religious freedom" to act in the way of their cult is being violated when secular authorities involve themselves in church and family matters.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

I wonder if they might even be able to argue that involving the law in this would have been "against their religion" and that their "religious freedom" to act in the way of their cult is being violated when secular authorities involve themselves in church and family matters.

Not a chance, or there would still be openly polygamous marriages.