AR - Josh Duggar Admits Molesting Girls As A Teenager - #2

[LisaB]

I can only go by the fact the parents waited until the statute of limitations was over to report, in the report the mother acknowledged it wasn't really a counseling camp, but they could have taken them later for additional counseling later. Add that together and a little research on the teachings of ATI or whatever Gothard teachings are out there on the internet and see that I'm not hopeful. One of the little kids (male) called the vagina a "pee pee holder" that to me is concerning after seeing how women are treated in this type of belief system. All the kids were sheltered and I'm sure have a skewed view of a lot of things.
(snipped for brevity)

I was pretty confused by your post. The idea that a small child DOESN'T attach a sexual component to the "genital regions" seems pretty NORMAL to me. The same child referred to a penis as a pee pee holder, so clearly his(? - I had read the report and thought this was a young girl, then 5 years old) understanding of anatomy is limited to "where urine is stored". So what about this could POSSIBLY "concern you"? I figured this was a situation where you are the type of parent who is very straightforward with children about "how babies are made" and that it was just a difference of opinion.

(I should mention here that I have only a daughter.)

Last night, as I was falling asleep, I had an "a-ha! moment." I am still not sure if I am following your train of thought, but it occurs to me that you might be the parent of boys, and that "pee pee" is a word sometimes used by little boys to mean "penis". I simply thought of it as "pee"... urine... as in "I have to go pee pee."

So. What you MAY have meant was that it disturbs you that a child so small would regard a "vagina" as "a place a man puts his "pee pee" (or "penis") which, I agree, would be VERY upsetting coming from a small child, as this (apparent) knowledge (about penises going in vaginas) is NOT age-appropriate.

 

[leah]

Somewhat OT . There is a case out of Houston Tx about a 14 yr old girl beaten by several family members to induce / abort a baby she was carrying. Its a horrible , horrible case. Point is the beating took place OVER 2 yrs ago and shes' just now old enough and independent enough to go to the police and file the report . And the police went straight out and arrest 5 of her family members from a case that took place 2 yrs ago. I'm assuming there is no phyiscal evidence of the crime, merely the girls' testimony . So , 2 yrs have past but a crime still happened. No statute on a beating but some on a molesting of kids.......... mind boggling.

After I read this I went over to my feed on facebook and saw an article about this. Just horrific

 

[threecrazykids]

Unless it maybe was some kind of DIY intervention for Josh. You tell everything, we write it down, then we pray and you will write 1000 times that you'll never do it again, amen.

Who is the "we" that wrote it down in detail? Certainly not someone they likely consider a "family friend" any longer! One of their own maybe? Can't just shoo them out - they have jurisdictions and a "buddy" aka sibling to raise, damn it! :gaah:

 

[LaneGirl]

So. What you MAY have meant was that it disturbs you that a child so small would regard a "vagina" as "a place a man puts his "pee pee" (or "penis") which, I agree, would be VERY upsetting coming from a small child, as this (apparent) knowledge (about penises going in vaginas) is NOT age-appropriate.

This is exactly what I meant to say. Sorry I wasn't clear.

I thought a male child called the vagina a "pee pee holder" and that is what got my attention especially how women are treated in their community. However I could be totally wrong. I will go reread the report.

 

[teeandcee]

gitana1, you have a great handle on this kind of cult-what about the husbands of the two women who recently got married? Are the girls considered spoiled if they were victims? Can the husbands use this as a platform to have their marriages annulled if they were so inclined?

I know this is addressed to Gitana,but I grew up in a very similar type of Christian environment. IMO the answer is no the girls won't be considered damaged goods, however, there will be immense peer pressure for them to forgive whether they're ready for that or not. They also will not be encouraged to get professional help but rather counseled by a "Godly" person in authority.

 

[LisaB]

But then why do so many of the so called "christians" get into politics? (snipped)

See this bothers me. So Christians should just not do anything to try and serve the world? Why are all Christians lumped together. (snip)

I think the comment was addressing "so-called Christians" The ones who talk the talk but don't walk the walk. The ones who hide behind faith to excuse bad behavior. The type who criticize others without examining their own lives first. The families with 19 children they can't possibly supervise adequately, who turn to "reality" TV to provide food and housing by "putting on a show" of being pious to the extreme. Not ACTUAL Christians, but "hypoChristians".

 

[LisaB]

SBM
It’s not clear who tipped Oprah off and how she knew about Josh’s misconduct, but Jim Bob and Michelle told police that when Josh was accused of molesting his sisters, a family friend wrote down the accusations in a letter that was then placed in a book in the Duggars’ home. Sometime during 2006, the Duggars loaned the book to another person and the letter was discovered.

http://defamer.gawker.com/the-web-has-known-about-josh-duggar-for-years-when-did-1706258269


The more I read this comment the more I believe this "other person" who wrote down the accusations was actually one of the sisters themselves. AND that the book was INTENTIONALLY "loaned" so SOMEONE would find it and get some damn help into that house.

I actually thought there was some statement to the effect that a "male family member" wrote it and a "61 year old woman" found it in the book. It occurred to me then that, as a teen, when I had done something stupid or wanted to ask my parents for something without being yelled at, I wrote them a note. I immediately suspected the note could have been written BY JOSH HIMSELF and contained his "confession" to his parents, OR that they made him write it all down so he could be forgiven for everything without any unresolved issues. I also understood this letter to have been written between the two "reports" that is, between March 2002 and March 2003.

 

[LaneGirl]

Ok so after re-reading the report one child identified both the penis & vagina as a "pee pee holder" so this to me is referencing just holding urine.

When I first read the report I didn't read what word the child uses for each of the body part. I only read the bottom of the report where the inv. Taylor asked did redacted see anyone touch anyones "chest or pee pee holder" and I thought that is what they were calling a vagina. My bad.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

I noted the Fox interview tonight on the Crime-Related TV thread but have no intention of watching what I think will be nothing more than sanctimonious drivel by M/M Duggar. I will, of course, be eager to read comments here later tonight or tomorrow.

Question for anyone who's familiar with this religious sect's views on mental illness: If or when these young girls who were molested by Josh begin to experience emotional issues often experienced by victims of sexual abuse, how will the family handle this? Will these girls be told to pull themselves up by their boot straps, forgive and forget, and be sweet? Will they be allowed to seek professional treatment for emotional problems, or will this be handled within the family and/or by church elders? I can't imagine that these girls will emerge from this ordeal unscathed, and I hope and pray they are allowed to get help if needed.

 

[LisaB]

This is exactly what I meant to say. Sorry I wasn't clear.

I thought a male child called the vagina a "pee pee holder" and that is what got my attention especially how women are treated in their community. However I could be totally wrong. I will go reread the report.

The child described the female and male genitals BOTH as "pee pee holder". That's what made me assume they were referring to it as a receptacle for urine, since that is where it comes out.

 

[Morag]

From the Daily Mail:

'They said that at the time these things occurred, a family friend who was aware of what had happened had written down in a letter what he knew of [redacted, Josh's] actions with [redacted minors],' reads the report.
'The letter had been placed in a book and subsequently forgotten about. Just recently the book had been loaned to someone else with the letter in it and the person who discovered the letter had called the hotline.'


This sounds as though the family friend was a 'he'. Perhaps the letter writer was the parent of the couch-sleeping girl. And this doesn't say that the letter was placed in a book belonging to the Duggars. Perhaps the book belonged to the letter writer and was kept in his home before being borrowed. And why is it called a letter? Could this letter have been a confession/acknowledgement signed by one of the Duggars? If I jot down things I don't call it a letter unless it's being sent to someone and signed by me.

It's hard to imagine that someone sat in the Duggar home and wrote this down and tucked it into a Duggar book.

 

[JerseyGirl]

Also, perhaps the "he" is/was a crew member of Discovery Network / TLC.

 

[teeandcee]

Question for anyone who's familiar with this religious sect's views on mental illness: If or when these young girls who were molested by Josh begin to experience emotional issues often experienced by victims of sexual abuse, how will the family handle this? Will these girls be told to pull themselves up by their boot straps, forgive and forget, and be sweet? Will they be allowed to seek professional treatment for emotional problems, or will this be handled within the family and/or by church elders? I can't imagine that these girls will emerge from this ordeal unscathed, and I hope and pray they are allowed to get help if needed.

I grew in a similar type of belief system. Based on my experiences and what I saw things will be handled in-house by an unqualified religious person. No professional help will be had. There will be an immense amount of peer pressure to forgive whether they're ready or not. I think the Duggars are charismatics so it's possible there will be some laying on of hands. I experienced this and it's horrible. People put you in the center, circle around you, lay hands on your head and shoulders and begin praying. I can almost garauntee a "spirit of lust" will be brought up thereby shaming the victims even further. Josh probably underwent this BS as a kid as well and faked his recovery. It's what you do. If you're smart like I was you faked your "healing" so you didn't have to get spiritually assaulted and circle-shamed any more.

 

[lonetraveler]

Just jumping off your post.

First I'll put it out there I'm a Megyn Kelly fan, but I really hope she doesn't try to sugar coat the interview. However, I do understand what she is saying about the report being released. No matter that it was FOIA, it did expose the victims again. It wasn't to difficult to figure out who, at least the sisters were. That has to be devastating for the girls. First to be pushed aside by their "loving" parents and then to have everything thrown out in front of millions of people. I really feel for those girls.

Now as for the JBD, MD, and JD.....their fair game. I really hope she goes after them. I can not even stomach hearing MD's voice so I'll not be watching this interview. But I'll be here reading the comments!

Mel ~



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

I too am a fan of Megyn Kelly but after hearing what she had to say about the upcoming interview tonight I'm getting heartburn. My first impression is that Josh is going to be portrayed as a victim whose sealed juvenile court records were leaked to the media. She did point out that the girl victims were revealed by the leak and that is true. I guess it is what I didn't hear that is bothering me the most, ie., the parents and other adults covering up the molestation and that no court held Josh accountable or to intense counseling for sex abusers, or most important to me, counseling for the victims of his sexual abuse. Of course I'm spouting off before I even see the interview but I'm basing my thoughts right now only on the statements made last night by Megyn Kelly. Maybe she will be the journalist I know her to be.

 

[LaneGirl]

Also, perhaps the "he" is/was a crew member of Discovery Network / TLC.

Report states and I will add xxxx for redacted sections this is Inv Taylors relaying info....



She said she talked to xxxx and found that xxxxx was the person who wrote the letter. xxxxxx was the person that xxxxxx was suppose to have xxxxxxxx with until the allegations started.

Inv. Taylor stated that after the letter was written is was placed inside of a book. The book was later loaned to xxxxxx from either Elm Springs or Cave Springs. The person that disclosed this information did not know the xxxxxx first names. They allegedly have the letter.

 

[teeandcee]

Report states and I will add xxxx for redacted sections this is Inv Taylors relaying info....



She said she talked to xxxx and found that xxxxx was the person who wrote the letter. xxxxxx was the person that xxxxxx was suppose to have xxxxxxxx with until the allegations started.

Inv. Taylor stated that after the letter was written is was placed inside of a book. The book was later loaned to xxxxxx from either Elm Springs or Cave Springs. The person that disclosed this information did not know the xxxxxx first names. They allegedly have the letter.

I'm confused. What are you saying here? I know you're quoting the report and responding to the question, but I'm having a clueless moment and can't figure out your point. Thanks!

And allow me to say Way To Go! to the person who wrote that letter and the person who reported it, thereby breaking out of the sick circle. In my imaginary scenario the Letter Writer overheard the Borrower say they wanted to one day borrow that book, so the Letter Writer wrote that letter and tucked it into that same book as soon as they got the chance.

 

[LaneGirl]

Also kinda sad one of the females interviewed didn't want to give the police the names of the church elders that was told of the abuse. She had to ask her father first.

 

[SCHMAE]

I noted the Fox interview tonight on the Crime-Related TV thread but have no intention of watching what I think will be nothing more than sanctimonious drivel by M/M Duggar. I will, of course, be eager to read comments here later tonight or tomorrow.

Question for anyone who's familiar with this religious sect's views on mental illness: If or when these young girls who were molested by Josh begin to experience emotional issues often experienced by victims of sexual abuse, how will the family handle this? Will these girls be told to pull themselves up by their boot straps, forgive and forget, and be sweet? Will they be allowed to seek professional treatment for emotional problems, or will this be handled within the family and/or by church elders? I can't imagine that these girls will emerge from this ordeal unscathed, and I hope and pray they are allowed to get help if needed.

First question, YES. If these girls pray enough with an open enough heart and turn away from sin enough and have enough faith, they will be 100% healed and anyone who tries to tell them differently is trying to give them doubts about God's healing. Second question, church leaders only. My only experience is my own and it's similar ( AOG) and that would be mental illness is the devil making your brain think bad thoughts or in some extreme cases, possibly even a demonic possession. No one outside the church can help you because they're sinners from a secular world and may try to give you non biblically approved manners of therapy. Anyone taking medication for a mental illness is essentially a ' drug user' and a sinner. One would only want to take ' drugs' to get high and feel differently and not because a doctor prescribed it for duress.
Do the Duggars go to doctors when they're ill for antibiotics? Did any of the children require medication? I guess upstream I see one of her latter births was very premature so she must have needed extreme medical intervention........ so they 're not opposed to doctors and medication.... just opposed to it to help the victims of Josh Duggar the Pedophile .

 

[LaneGirl]

I'm confused. What are you saying here? I know you're quoting the report and responding to the question, but I'm having a clueless moment and can't figure out your point. Thanks!

No point. There was speculation who wrote the letter. I was just giving the info contained on the report.

I did think this part was interesting though speaking about the letter writer....

xxxxxx was the person that xxxxxx was suppose to have xxxxxxxx with until the allegations started

 

[LisaB]

Also, perhaps the "he" is/was a crew member of Discovery Network / TLC.

They were not on TLC yet.