ARRESTED- Luka Rocco Magnotta:1st deg murder charge;INTERPOL alert #6

[KOUKLA75]

I seem to remember in early news reports that it was said his friends checked his email accounts and whatnot for news of him. I wouldn't make too much of this.

Well, we know he was online (internet) on the 24th @8:55am now

 

[2goldfish]

Makes total sense but in a perfect world the person who posted it online would have had enough empathy not to post it or the grace to comply with her grieving relatives request to remove it. We need to fight for a world where empathy thrives, not the rights of those who possess none but want to satisfy their morbid curiosity.

What if that was me on that video is what people should be asking. If you wouldn't want to be internet fodder for the masses then you have to be the change you want to see in the world and not exploit the victim here who has no voice. Do unto others as you would have them do onto you. It's humanity 101 really IMO.

BBM with all due respect for your opnion, the person that posted that video to begin with is the same person who did the things IN the video, which I am with you fully that in a perfect world, these things would not happen.


it's on the web - forever. magnotta KNEW that and this is why he posted it.

I havent watched it - I wont watch it - I accept that people will - good ones like some as WS, not so good ones like people like magnotta.

I fully agree it should have never been online ....if it was me murdered and filmed I would be absolutely devastated to know that the only glimpse most of the world had of me would be in such a way and linked visually for eternity to my murderer - my opinion goes for anyone I know INCLUDING THE VICTIM JUN LING. it's sick how unfair it is.

but the argument as I see it in this thread ...does the gov't get to censor the web? they should not and in most cases they CAN NOT. on a canadian or US server? sure. on a chinese one with a chinese national as the victim? possibly ....in any other country's? not bloody likely.

 

[pippirose]

PAXIMUS, I'm not sure which country you're in, but Canada has very reasonable laws regarding the rights of individuals. Canada does not have anything similar to the US Patriot Act. Canadians have many rights, but it is not a right to make a film of the torture, murder, dismemberent of anyone and then publish it for an international audience. It is not censorship to ensure that this does not happen.

I agree.
Just my 2 cents:
Not even talking about the morality issue or anything else, what about just the legal issue? It is the film of a crime. For that reason alone, I would think it should be illegal for any sites to host it.
Same with videos that have "real" rape shown.
And obviously, child *advertiser censored* and violence.

 

[jeanne]

Well, we know he was online (internet) on the 24th @8:55am now

There's nothing important about that detail. We know Lin Jun was alive until at least 9pm on the 24th when he left a text message for a friend.

 

[Dutchie43]

Hi everybody,

I have been reading this thread since yesterday and it is horrible what LM has done. He's a sick man....all these different names he uses on the internet. All these pictures he posted of himself. These stories he's made up.....how many personalities does he have???

I have found some pictures of him, probably you have seen them already, but I shivered when I saw them....like he was already planning this thing months ago. Especially the last photo is weird.....

http://www.abproject.org/gallery3/index.php/VBKK/Luka-s-Photobucket-Accounts/wonderfulme34

PS: sorry for my poor writing, I am dutch so I probably have made some mistakes in my text.

 

[KOUKLA75]

There's nothing important about that detail. We know Lin Jun was alive until at least 9pm on the 24th when he left a text message for a friend.

Oh well, I think it's important

 

[Jezbel]

The entire argument is off the deep end IMO.
I don't believe every adult does have the right to watch/ read or listen to whatever they want.
I'm sure half the medical students in Canada would love to watch Mrs. Jones have her double lung transplant but unless Mrs. Jones agrees to allow them to have that learning opportunity at her expense, they're ***** out of luck. Students who have a legitimate reason for watching and participating in her care, who have been vetted by the professionals assigned to her care, do get to participate and observe and patients are advised of this.

Wanting access to something and having a right to it are two very different things. I personally believe the victims rights outweigh ours.

The difference is the video was out and available for people to view, unlike the the double lung transplant of Mrs Jones.

Yes wanting something and having the right are two different things, but like I stated, people who wanted to watch the video could as it was freely available.

I am not saying our rights out weight the victims, I never said anything regarding that at all. I feel terrible for his family and hop that none of them has bared witness to it.

That being said there are many many more videos like this out there, some could be a lot worse and depicting the actual death too, and really there will never be enough resources to take the billions posted online off and there will be more sick people that do similar things as LM did and post online too. Stuff like this will always be out there.

 

[SmoothOperator]

**WARNING my response to Wondergirl's post below may be way too soap box-ish for some.. please don't hesitate to scroll on past if need be**

Originally Posted by Wondergirl
<respectfully snipped by moì>

If you were asked by a friend to come over an watch a real snuff film tonight, would you?

There are some people who would never, ever in a million years deliberately go watch a snuff and dismemberment film, but because of many different influences and factors, not the least of which is because it was so readily available on the internet, hundreds of thousands of people watched that real life snuff and dismemberment video of Jun Lin.

That to me is an issue worth discussing because we all know those types of videos are out there. Not choosing to watch them, is not "sticking my head in the sand". I am hopeful that some poor soul who has to track these monsters down, catches them because of repurcussion of sites like these.

To blatantly display the video that is known to be a true, real life murder and dismemberment, crosses the boundaries, and to deliberately leave it on is a crime, IMO.

You pose a very good, relevant, thought provoking question.. A question that IMO could spark a very important and rather in depth conversation about the varying different individuals that we are combined with what technology has laid in our laps, that is always at our convenience only mere finger "taps" away.. And what such easy access along with open, full media coverage of some of this universe's most evil and despicable subjects and issues(that not so long ago were even more than taboo.. They were just downright WRONG and weren't to be openly displayed).. And certainly not openly displayed and documented on international prime time news coverage.. IMO the combination of these subjects and gaping, wide open up close&personal in full *color these particular subjects that are of the purest of evil are not only documented in recording, but then blasted at peak volume with megaphones and plastered worldwide in the clearest and latest gazillion.5 mega pixel clarity FOR ANY/ALL TO SEE.. To SEE FOREVER.. FOR ETERNITY.. Not just here today and gone tomorrow.. BUT FOREVER IN LIVING COLOR OF THE BEST CLARITY EACH DAYS TECHNOLOGY CONTINUES TO IMPROVE AND HAVE AT OUR DISPOSAL..

The evil is out there in such a vivid and raw view that IMO(and in MOO!) it can ONLY bring about, further encourage, and continue its path of destroying the good that's left here in this universe.. And I haven't a doubt that is exactly what this combination will in fact do, will in fact ravage, will in fact ruin, will in fact steal the very souls of innocence from our precious children.. IMO that is the path of such wide, open gaping "coverage" and "documentation" of the evil that daily walks among us WILL CONTINUE TO DO!!! We are being desensitized by the millisecond..

And let me be very clear here in I am not making these statements of judging anyone's view, and certainly no individual.. Because I am one who chose to press play on that wide, open gaping REAL LIFE EVIL DISPLAYED RIGHT BEFORE MY VERY EYES!!.. I'm one of those that some are of the opinion that must be "sick" for choosing to press play on what I full well knew was going to be evil personified and in the flesh to watch with my very own eyes, with my very own soul bear witness to what is IMO pure evil that has made its way into you and I's home.. Our very own living rooms or bedrooms..

IMO this combination is spreading more rapidly than any drought riddled wildfire burning through and across the earth at lightning fast speeds.. These few combinations that MOST alone, and by themselves are for ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES positive entities that our intelligence and hard work have allowed us to bring forth in technology for ALL "POSITIVE" INTENTS AND PURPOSES.. Created by individuals with nothing but the best of intentions of bettering our lives, serving to better protect the good from the "bad".. The *24/7/365 FULL MEDIA COVERAGE was not intended to bring us harm, nor detriment, but rather to enable us to better protect ourselves from the storms of mother nature, or the RSO that's newly moved into your child's community.. Same goes for the leaps and bounds made in forward progression of interlinking OUR ENTIRE GLOBE AND UNIVERSE VIA THE WORLD WIDE WEB.. For all "positive" intents and purposes in an infinite amount of differing ways..

But yet you add in the evil that any who are not totally and completely blind know walks among us.. And everything good somehow seems to spin a millimeter at a time in the opposite direction, in such small and tiny increments that we in and about our daily lives do not even remotely begin to notice or even be the least bit suspicious of.. Yet it's continually, ever growing, millimeter by millimeter taking and spinning into a completely opposite direction.. Into each of these different areas that our intelligence and hard work have diligently worked to provide as positive technologies to "benefit" us ... They are within the blink of our eyes opening up gaping, wide open views of the evil that has crept into that which is "good".. And well.. Once there we, the very people who have created and worked hard for the good of mankind begin to be the very ones that inadvertently begin to not only allow the evil to continue to creep in, but even more destructively we begin to actually inadvertently "protect" the right for the evil to be here and literally are responsible for encouraging and protecting its growth and continued wide spread path it's suddenly set as its permanent course.

I get it!! I very much get exactly what Wondergirl and many others are posting about in their great concern in seeing happen *to the world we live in.. And at the very same time I get just how damn easy it is to without any ill intention whatsoever have IMO in some ways allowed the evil to further become open, widespread, and our individual right to do so if we so should choose.. Just as I blatantly with full knowledge chose to press play on that 10+ minute window allowing me to personally bear witness to evil in its purest form savagely and brutally slaughter a fellow human being and for that evil to desecrate, dehumanize, and inflict, incite, and enjoy every last second of having NOT only done this to innocent, Jun Lin.. *IMO this evil that I witnessed, his greatest and most fulfilling intent and purpose was for you and me and her.. And her.. And him.. And the 10 down the road.. And the couple thousand in the neighboring town.. And the hundreds of thousands in the metropolitan cities.. States.. And. Countries..

"IT'S" GREATEST INTENT AND MOTIVE WAS FOR EACH OF US AS INDIVIDUALS AND ALL OF US *MILLIONS AS A WHOLE TO HAVE FIRST HAND BEARED WITNESS, UP CLOSE AND PERSONAL TO HIS EVIL FOREVER DOCUMENTED ON THAT 10+ MINUTES OF FOOTAGE!!!.. Forever now engrained in our hearts, minds, and souls..

Without a doubt I get exactly what you are saying Wondergirl and while I am for each to have their rights.. And to each their own.. But how far does that go?? How deep does that continue to apply?? Because IMO that's where the line blurs and the good intentions are unintentionally blurred into the negative that absolutely eventually leads to literally protecting that which is evil.. IMO its exactly what in a very real sense is happening in situations such as this..

In the end this is nothing more than strictly my own opinion that sadly formed after unwisely choosing to press play.. That very simple.. Yet in reality that VERY COMPLEX "tiny" issue..

Sorry for the soap box but as I said I absolutely "get" both sides of the issue here and in truly looking at what these doors that we are opening are leading to.. Well.. IMO its definitely worth discussing as well as individuals thinking twice about and taking a closer look at what "IT" really is..

(again my apologies for the long soap box.. Please those who are mildly irritated to strongly irritated by my sometimes long, droning posts.. Please don't hesitate to just scroll on past when ya see my username or pop me onto the Ignore List.. Lol.. Sorry for my long winded nature:blushing: )

 

[prima.facie]

I don't see the evil in his pictures post arrest. I don't see anything. I think without someone to mimic and an idol to imitate, Luka will turn out to be quite the blob. Not really any real personality of his own to be seen.

It cracks me up that his lawyer says he is nice and polite and looks nothing like a psychopath. There's a video she should watch..
I wonder what she thinks a psychopath looks like. i hope that no one is fooled or charmed by the act.

that is the begninng of her defending him....
a good defense lawyer is going to make sure the jury sees him as a nice & polite boy....no way someone like him could do these things....

and so on...

 

[Fl Breeze]

This case has stirred strong emotions.

I believe that no government has the right to interfer with ones private life nor how they live it.


But, if how I live my life infringes on the rights of others then society has to create laws to prevent this.

For example: If I want to murder someone who's to say it is wrong? It is wrong because I have taken someone's right to life away.

There has to be certain restrictions on individual rights for the society as a whole to function.

Some individual freedoms have to be compromised to protect the rights that all people are entitled to.

I believe that a victim's right to privacy is such a right that should be protected.


If a rape is recorded by the assailant and put on the web, does my right to watch it trump the victim's right to have it taken down?

Does the family of a victim of violent crime have the right of privacy to not have that crime shown?

I don't think it is a question of morals or censorship but the balancing of rights.


Just because the internet makes things easy to see doesn't make viewing them my right.

 

[kevmoley]

Cops in Quebec town to search for ties between Magnotta and unsolved 2011 murder

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/ca...notta-and-unsolved-2011-murder-157299545.html


I don't think there is a connection but who knows. The alleged suspect was fluent in french which I don't believe LRM is.

Here is the sketch of the suspect.

Didn't they say this guy was over 200lbs too? What is ML? 90lbs wet .. I think these are two different cases

 

[otto]

You can pick and choose all sorts of individual reasons why this or that should not be allowed, my concern here is the BIG PICTURE and the smaller issue of a few people being offended by something is a lot less important than the larger issue of freedom of expression and a free uncensored internet. I respect everyone's opinion but what I do have a hard time respecting is those who do not consider the LONG TERM CONSEQUENCES OF THE THINGS THEY ADVOCATE FOR AND SUPPORT. The IMMEDIATE gratification that may result in censoring something like this from the internet is not worth sacrificing the larger issue of a free and uncensored world wide web in my opinion. I realize that not everyone cares about the big picture and they are more concerned with the here and now but I just cant bring myself to support things in the here and now that will likely have devastating effects on the type of world my grandchildren will grow up in? Does that mean I want my grandchildren to grow up in a world where videos like this are OK, no, it does not, but I certainly DO NOT want them, even more so, to grow up in a world where a SELECT FEW get to decide everything for everyone else, and that is the world we are headed to full steam ahead and I will personally do everything I can to prevent that world or slow down the train that is headed for it.

The big picture is that Canadians will not tolerate the publication of videos made by someone that is torturing and murdering someone. In the past, videos of that nature have been destroyed and they will continue to be destroyed. There is no value in preserving or memorializing the sickness inside the minds of violent criminals.

"Danson successfully obtained a court order following the Bernardo and Homolka proceedings to have the videotapes depicting the sexual assault and torture of their victims destroyed."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/pointofview/...hould-the-videos-and-photos-be-destroyed.html

"I know with the Frenches and Mahaffys the only way they could guarantee their daughters would never be violated again was to destroy the videotapes."

Read more: http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/W5Archive/20101022/williams-lawyer-101022/#ixzz1x2exd0Nc

"Burgess told a packed courtroom that all evidence collected in the arrest and conviction of former CFB Trenton base commander Russell Williams should be destroyed or forfeited, a request Justice Robert Scott also agreed to."

http://www.trentonian.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2810464

 

[PAXIMUS]

BBM

That is the problem with allowing it to be a on a website that is freely accessed - children certainly may be subjected to it. Not every child's internet use is monitored. Many folks here found it easily, so I have to believe that a child could, too. And IMO, that is wrong. All just MOO

That is taking one issue and confusing it with another. The issue you present is one of bad parenting and not an issue that has anything to do with censoring the internet. If parents cant prevent their children from seeing things they should not see no amount of internet censorship or any kind of censorship for that matter is going to fix that. Kids were seeing things they should not see long before there was an internet and they will continue to see things long after. That is an issue for parents to address and to suggest that we should punish everyone else for their laziness and inability to properly supervise their children is terribly short-sighted and small-minded. And I am not calling YOU such, just the IDEA. I do not attack people but I will attack certain ideas.

 

[otto]

That is taking one issue and confusing it with another. The issue you present is one of bad parenting and not an issue that has anything to do with censoring the internet. If parents cant prevent their children from seeing things they should not see no amount of internet censorship or any kind of censorship for that matter is going to fix that. Kids were seeing things they should not see long before there was an internet and they will continue to see things long after. That is an issue for parents to address and to suggest that we should punish everyone else for their laziness and inability to properly supervise their children is terribly short-sighted and small-minded. And I am not calling YOU such, just the IDEA. I do not attack people but I will attack certain ideas.

Allowing a child to use a computer is not bad parenting as it's an educational tool that they require. Allowing a child to use youtube is not bad parenting ... that's how they access lots of music.

The bottom line is that Canadians will not tolerate anything similar to the Patriot Act and they will not tolerate the publication of video of the torture and murder of innocent victims. It's not censorship, it's about protecting our rights. We have a right to use youtube and the internet and not fear that we will stumble onto horrific footage that re-victimes the victims and perpetuates the sickness of the criminal.

 

[PAXIMUS]

The big picture is that Canadians will not tolerate the publication of videos made by someone that is torturing and murdering someone. In the past, videos of that nature have been destroyed and they will continue to be destroyed. There is no value in preserving or memorializing the sickness inside the minds of violent criminals.

"Danson successfully obtained a court order following the Bernardo and Homolka proceedings to have the videotapes depicting the sexual assault and torture of their victims destroyed."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/pointofview/...hould-the-videos-and-photos-be-destroyed.html

"I know with the Frenches and Mahaffys the only way they could guarantee their daughters would never be violated again was to destroy the videotapes."

Read more: http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/W5Archive/20101022/williams-lawyer-101022/#ixzz1x2exd0Nc

"Burgess told a packed courtroom that all evidence collected in the arrest and conviction of former CFB Trenton base commander Russell Williams should be destroyed or forfeited, a request Justice Robert Scott also agreed to."

http://www.trentonian.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=2810464

I dont believe ALL Canadians support that, in fact there are many fine Canadians right here in this thread who have said otherwise. So the big picture is not that Canadians wont tolerate it but rather that certain Canadians, typically the ones who are intolerant of just about anything that they dont like or agree with including homosexuality, a woman's right to choose and other controversial issues, do not tolerate it. And that is really no surprise as they are usually the same people who are trying to tell everyone else how they should live, what they should like and what they should be allowed to do in the privacy of their bedrooms. Fortunately for them, there is the rest of us, who work tirelessly to fight for the right for people to believe whatever they want and to express those beliefs so that even if we dont agree with intolerance we fight for them to have the right to be intolerant anyway.

 

[PAXIMUS]

Allowing a child to use a computer is not bad parenting as it's an educational tool that they require. Allowing a child to use youtube is not bad parenting ... that's how they access lots of music.

The bottom line is that Canadians will not tolerate anything similar to the Patriot Act and they will not tolerate the publication of video of the torture and murder of innocent victims. It's not censorship, it's about protecting our rights. We have a right to use youtube and the internet and not fear that we will stumble onto horrific footage that re-victimes the victims and perpetuates the sickness of the criminal.

Where did I say allowing them to use any of that is bad parenting, I simply suggested allowing them to use it UNSUPERVISED could be a problem since a poster here was trying to argue that certain things should be censored because kids could have access to it. The fix for that problem is not to censor the internet but to supervise the kids and if you choose not to then you really cant argue that what they may see on the net could hurt them, to do so, would in fact be to admit, you are a bad parent and instead of doing your duty to protect your kids you want the government to do that for you.

 

[Dushi]

I dont believe ALL Canadians support that, in fact there are many fine Canadians right here in this thread who have said otherwise. So the big picture is not that Canadians wont tolerate it but rather that certain Canadians, typically the ones who are intolerant of just about anything that they dont like or agree with including homosexuality, a woman's right to choose and other controversial issues, do not tolerate it. And that is really no surprise as they are usually the same people who are trying to tell everyone else how they should live, what they should like and what they should be allowed to do in the privacy of their bedrooms. Fortunately for them, there is the rest of us, who work tirelessly to fight for the right for people to believe whatever they want and to express those beliefs so that even if we dont agree with intolerance we fight for them to have the right to be intolerant anyway.

Where do the rights of the victim and his family come into this?

I am certainly not going to debate you about womens rights etc etc

I just want to know how you feel about victims rights

 

[PAXIMUS]

Allowing a child to use a computer is not bad parenting as it's an educational tool that they require. Allowing a child to use youtube is not bad parenting ... that's how they access lots of music.

The bottom line is that Canadians will not tolerate anything similar to the Patriot Act and they will not tolerate the publication of video of the torture and murder of innocent victims. It's not censorship, it's about protecting our rights. We have a right to use youtube and the internet and not fear that we will stumble onto horrific footage that re-victimes the victims and perpetuates the sickness of the criminal.

I understand your point but you have no such right, nowhere in any law book or statute in any nation I am aware of, is there such a right. You know when you go on the internet that there are bad things on there and you use it anyway, to suggest you have a RIGHT to not expect that is really absurd. Youre smarter than that, no such right exists, people use the word RIGHT a little too loosely, rights are in things like the bill of rights and constitutions and nowhere is such a right given or implied.


You are suggesting by saying that that you also have a right to go out in public and not see bad things, which is just..absurd my friend. There is no such right anywhere granted to any human being.

 

[~n/t~]

CBC News Alerts &#8207;@CBCAlerts
Family of murder victim Jun Lin meets with Montreal police .Police: family has gone through 'horrible episode.'


So sad. My heart breaks for the family. :cry:

 

[bluelena69]

This is my first reply here, but I think I shall enjoy this site. I was a research librarian for 10 years before I was reborn into my present career as a UX designer.

Anyhow, I can empathize with the sentiment that this story of LM carries some degree of tragedy, not only for the victim, but also the perpetrator. Strangely, I don't think it's odd to feel this way.

I don't believe that humans are born evil or with the ability to commit acts such as those this freak has committed. Learned behavior, an intense desire to fill a void in one's life or simple erosion of empathy over the course of one's life leads to this. And it is quite sad that anyone brought into this world is forced to deal with this. Sadly, it is quite common but fortunately, an overwhelming majority of people are equipped with sufficient coping mechanisms. LM was not.

I will also add that I disagree completely with the notion that we cannot ban things, as "adults have the inherent right to choose what they want to view..." Why do I disagree? Because we share this world with innocent people (children) and people who are not properly equipped to process what they manage to see (sick people). Thus, a hallmark of a civil and just society is sacrifice for the common good. We pay taxes so that we can have common services and that is an acceptable sacrifice. We should have limitations on what is freely available as viewing materials in order to protect society and our children. It too is an acceptable sacrifice. No single person's individual right to watch whatever they want is as valuable as the innocence of a child.