Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #5 *Arrest*

[katydid23]

Thats got to be her ex husband IMO

If it’s her Ex Husband as I suspect it is then he must be so guilty he cancelled and his loved ones died. It looks like she has been attempting to poisoning him for awhile.

I have always thought he cancelled because he didn't trust eating her food---but I don't think he ever imagined she'd poison his parents and his Auntie as well.

 

[Baby baby Jane]

I will say, I think too much has been made of the "death wall".

To me it looks like something that the kids drew. EP probably knew she would soon be selling the house and they would have to spruce the place up before putting it on the market. So, she may have just told her kids they could draw on the walls since they'd have to repaint.

There's also been a lot of speculation about the imagery and words relating to death. One tradesperson said “You’d think they’d be drawing flowers and unicorns, not gravestones and death”. But, IMO, that's ridiculous. Whoever said that knows nothing about childhood development. EP's children were right around the age where many kids become interested in the macabre. When I was that age, some kids would litter their notebooks with drawings of skeletons, gravestones, coffins, blood, etc. Some were obsessed with horror movies, death metal or other pop culture with gruesome imagery. There's a whole "goth" subculture that's a reflection of this interest. For most kids it's just a phase that they eventually grow out of. Despite all the speculation, I don't think it's an indication that there was anything wrong in EP's household.

Allowing writing on the wall, in the family/public areas of the house (and not on poster paper or butcher paper taped up) IS an indication of something wrong with mum …IMO

 

[katydid23]

No wonder he decided to skip lunch that day. I am amazed he didn’t warn his family or maybe he did and they went anyway.

What a sad case of circumstances that she had made multiple attempts at this before and then she punished the wrong people.

IMO

I don't think he ever expected she'd harm his parents. I think he assumed she was after him, not his family. He apparently underestimated her level of cruelty.

 

[katydid23]

If it's true, I wonder what she used. Same or different?

I think it was different. It was possibly something she was doing slowly so it was less evident, but slowly debilitating. JMO

 

[Salah11]

I have always thought he cancelled because he didn't trust eating her food---but I don't think he ever imagined she'd poison his parents and his Auntie as well.

Yes I realized to late it sounded like I was blaming him which I wasn’t ( as you can only edit post for 30 mins) . I did say that in a later post to clear it up.

I think he had suspicions but never expected her to go to such lengths to hurt him. Then when the worse happened it confirmed his worse fears and that’s why he lashed out in the hospital at Erin and openly accused her of killing his family.

moo

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Allowing writing on the wall, in the family/public areas of the house (and not on poster paper or butcher paper taped up) IS an indication of something wrong with mum …IMO

If you look at the wall, it was obviously where they'd been recording the heights of the kids - this is how you can tell the older one must have been quite old and tall as the line is high up. Plenty of people allow their kid freedom to write on one wall or such, although it looks like this was mostly done all in one go and the kids had been 'naughty'.

If it's someone's own home and they don't mind, I don't see what's wrong with giving the kids a graffiti area. Fixing it up at a later date is their own problem and cost, obviously well within EP's means. JMO

 

[katydid23]

The hard work is ahead: the prosecution has to prove murder beyond reasonable doubt. The old means, motive and opportunity.

Will be interesting to see if the charges get downgraded to manslaughter up the track, with some sort of plea deal.

(I'm assuming she's guilty. I formed the opinion that she's a liar right from the get go.)

I think motive and opportunity will be easy to prove. She is in the middle of a divorce and custody issues and property settlements are looming. Her in-laws were on her ex husband's side and probably told her so, politely. JMO

 

[iamshadow21]

He has eyebrows and presumably he has body hair.

You tend to need a certain length to segment for testing for poisoning. Each segment is representative of a period of time, and it can tell you when someone was poisoned and give you an idea how big the dose was. I don't think eyebrows or body hair are long enough. Pubes maybe.

MOO

 

[katydid23]

I'm not sure how they would have evidence of the Simon Patterson alleged poisonings, given the elapsed time and also AFAIK no reports of any police involvement in relation to those events at the times.

Police often lay numerous charges at the outset and by the time a case hits court they will sometimes drop/downgrade some charges -- sometimes as the result of a deal to plead guilty on the remaining charges.

The police didn't fully investigate Simon's accusations previously but after the 3 deaths I sam sure they took a deep dive.

The hospital probably has lots of tests and data about his condition and maybe they were able to connect the dots?

He claimed she was feeding him during the times he got sick. So they may have evidence of those connections?

 

[MsMarple]

If SP’s illness really wasn’t able to be diagnosed then IMO it would be likely that the hospital retained at least one specimen for possible future testing. If so then LE probably asked for further tests.

In one of the early msm articles it was suggested that his illness could have been caused by something in the nightshade family. So I wonder if he was ever exposed to solanine poisoning?

Edited to add a link.

Inside the mushroom-lunch death mystery that’s gripping Australia

An alleged poisoning is captivating Australia, where authorities suspect Erin Patterson intentionally laced a lunch of mushrooms and beef Wellington for her former in-laws, killing three and sicken…

nypost.com

 

[katydid23]

IMO had there been any pathology samples relating to Simon, we would have heard about them before now, and I believe that charges in that matter would have been laid earlier than today.

Let's see what the Crown puts forward as evidence for those charges.

I don't know----they probably were not testing for all types of poisons. They were probably testing for disease or environmental toxins---not weird ones that an angry wife might slip into his coffee.

Maybe they had enough samples left over to test again for anti-freeze or something like that?

 

[Officer Dibble]

The way she said she plated it up and let them pick their own plate seemed potentially like, "if they choose the plate then they choose their own fate" to me. I could be reading far too much into that, but psychologically I think it's a method to distance oneself from the consequences.

Amonet that is a good suggestion. MOO

 

[Neet_Mc]

I agree but it was probably never going to be a 'lovely lunch' it was going to be one where they were discussing, debating, negotiating the future of her marriage and living arrangements by all accounts. And one where maybe she had already decided in advance to make a further final attempt on her ex/husband's life?

It wouldn't take much to have a small pot of ground up powdered DC mushroom which could be used to poison anything anytime. She could easily have kept it where children would never look or go or even kept it in her purse or pocket at all times. All she'd have to do is sprinkle some on or in whatever it was - in the gravy / on the dessert / in a cup of coffee.

The kids were at the movies. I suspect the kids had already left the house prior to be making the gravy (I don’t think it was in the beef Wellington) to ensure they did not get poisoned. The gravy could then be rinsed down the sink before they got home.
The whole ‘you choose your slice and I’ll choose mine’ was just to create illusion to the guests that the meal itself was fine. That suggests a highly calculated and planned move. Given she had no control over the piece they ate, even had Simon told them if his own suspicions, I think based on that randomness of the meal selection process you might not necessarily register when it comes to gravy. And oldies always love gravy so I think it was kind guaranteed they would go for it if it was there.

 

[Officer Dibble]

It’s been theorized that it was the toxic “mushroom” gravy for guests to serve themselves.
Having poison gravy, separate from the meat, and easy to dispose (down toilet), one saucepan, 1 gravy jug.
Untainted meat available for the police.

Oh now that is something else to consider - good thoughts here. Wonder if she knew the kids didn't like mushroom sauce and would find it yukky? JMO

 

[Neet_Mc]

I haven't seen Simon with hair.

Toxins, e.g. something like arsenic, can also accumulate in nails. That’s because they are also made of keratin, like hair, and it chemically binds to the protein forming the hair. So a long length of hair would be really useful because it could also show increased binding of a toxin reflective of higher doses, but any length hair will show presence of the toxin. Presumably there are other body tissues, fats etc, that will act as reservoirs also in the absence of hair.

 

[MsMarple]

Oh now that is something else to consider - good thoughts here. Wonder if she knew the kids didn't like mushroom sauce and would find it yukky? JMO

In her statement she said she fed the kids leftovers the next evening but scraped the mushrooms off because they didn’t like them.

Alibi building IMO.

 

[Officer Dibble]

I'm fairly sure that for the rest of time eternity, no-one is going to eat food offered by EP, even if she is cleared in court and found not guilty!

And if on the other hand she is found guilty, the other inmates might want to contaminate the food she is served. MOO JMO

 

[katydid23]

We know she had the means, and she created the opportunities, but what will interest me most is what is put forward as the motive(s).

Their pending divorce will offer up a variety of motives. Child custody is one big possibility. EP seemed to be the main caretaker, and complained to friends that she had to do it all herself. I'd imagine she'd be very upset if her ex suddenly wanted more legal custody than before.

She also told friends that she thought the local folks were uneducated morons. Maybe she wanted to move away with the kids and start a new life? Would her ex and his family try to block that move?

Also, she and her in-laws were not on the same page on some big issues. EP claimed to be a proud atheist. Her in-laws and her ex were devoutly religious. Was that becoming an issue in terms of how the kids were being raised? Maybe SP and his family wanted the kids to go to church and maybe attend a religious school and EP was very against that?

Also, we have possible financial motives. She owned several properties. Was her ex trying to claim some of the money from those properties in their divorce settlement? She had an inheritance but if she ever mingled any of the funds with family account she would be vulnerable to his claims.

There is also a possibility that he had moved on to a new girlfriend. Hell Hath No Fury.....

 

[Neet_Mc]

Yeah look, it feels to me like there might be collateral damage or unintended damage with this kind of crime. In general.

Thank God her children survived.

They were never going to be poisoned. Weren’t even present at the house at the time. Suggesting they survived is kinda like they dodged a bullet which isn’t the case - not even in line of fire (to stick with the analogy). Personally, I think her dog is one lucky hound as there’s more likelihood of him/her having eaten or been handed some of the meal.

 

[RickshawFan]

Also, I guess he could say how the meal was served and whether or not she ate the same dish as the others at the table, at the same time, etc, as well as any particular comments she may have made about the dish.

IIRC, EP has said that she allowed the guests to select their own servings?

So, she plates 4 servings, and then asks each person to pick one....