There's a lot cases where people go bush walking/hiking and think they hear water, so they assume there's water or a waterfall nearby and wander off the track to go look and when they turn to go back to the trail, they get very disoriented and can't find their way back and sometimes walk further into the bush away from the track and get lost. My gut is telling me something like that happened and she couldn't find her way out, because they've searched all along the track and can't find her. The sounds are different in the bush and can sound like it's coming from a different direction. It's pretty sad that she has gone missing on what should have been an amazing holiday.
Australia Australia - Celine Cremer, 31, Belgium backpacker, car found at the Philosopher’s fall track, Waratah, Tasmania, 12 June 2023
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TootsieFootsie
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New lead on missing Belgian tourist's phone activity helps pinpoint search
A NSW Police cadaver dog brought into Tasmania to help with the search for Shyanne-Lee Tatnell is repurposed to look for missing Belgian tourist Celine Cremer, following new information.
www.abc.net.au
Cadaver dog helps search for Belgian tourist Celine Cremer at Philosopher Falls bushwalk
I hope Waggs the dog can find her.
StillDiggin
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Belgian friend of missing tourist Celine Cremer visits search area with police
A friend of missing Belgian tourist Celine Cremer flew to Tasmania and was shown the wilderness area where where the 31-year-old disappeared a month ago, with police reporting a cadaver dog on loan from NSW has found nothing.
www.abc.net.au
TootsieFootsie
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Never forgotten: Family says thanks for tribute to lost bushwalker
Waratah community pays tribute to missing Belgian bushwalker.
Never forgotten: Family says thanks for tribute to lost bushwalker
A simple tribute to missing Belgian bushwalker Celine Cremer will be placed at Philospher Falls near Waratah
Behind a paywall, I think. Posting it here for those who subscribe.
StillDiggin
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Call for help as search for missing Belgian tourist Celine Cremer continues
‘She was quite an experienced hiker and not one to take risks’…
pulsetasmania.com.au
S
As a Tasmanian some things disturb me about this lady's disappearance. One was that the weather that day wasn't cold, wet or particularly windy, so the chances of even an inexperienced walker coming to an end are slim. Even the snakes are quiet at that time of year.
The second is that she is a really atractive looking, 31 year old blond who looks like she enjoys going out to the bar and so in a place like Waratah she would stick out likethe proverbial. The other thing is that there are a lot of wierdos in those parts of Tasmania and Savage River, the nearby former mining town is said to house some very rough characters whose law is only their own.
I wonder if she could have picked up a hitch hiker on her way to the walk? Some male who offered to join her and who took her friendly temperament for a suggestion of 'more' which when instigated and was not reciprocatedled to a rape and then the murder of this poor unfrotunate woman?
The fact that her last phone communication was from the day she went for the walk indicates that whaever happened was too quick for her to phone for help, that is if she were able to call.
It seems odd that the authorities can't locate her body, should she have slipped and fallen at the Falls themselves and that even with cadaver dogs brought in.
Perhaps she was alone walking and came across a snake basking in the sunlight on the track, shocked she dropped her phnoe as she scurried off the track and hid until it slithered away at which time it was darkening, she'd lost sight of her phone and had no idea which way to go?
I could posit she was abducted and may still be alive, tied to a wall in a shipping container somewhere and if so then I pray she makes it out alive.
But, even on a sunny day in a place like Tasmania you can go missing in a heartbeat and the place is so big and rugged that your remains may never surface, sadly.
As a Tasmanian some things disturb me about this lady's disappearance. One was that the weather that day wasn't cold, wet or particularly windy, so the chances of even an inexperienced walker coming to an end are slim. Even the snakes are quiet at that time of year.
The second is that she is a really atractive looking, 31 year old blond who looks like she enjoys going out to the bar and so in a place like Waratah she would stick out likethe proverbial. The other thing is that there are a lot of wierdos in those parts of Tasmania and Savage River, the nearby former mining town is said to house some very rough characters whose law is only their own.
I wonder if she could have picked up a hitch hiker on her way to the walk? Some male who offered to join her and who took her friendly temperament for a suggestion of 'more' which when instigated and was not reciprocatedled to a rape and then the murder of this poor unfrotunate woman?
The fact that her last phone communication was from the day she went for the walk indicates that whaever happened was too quick for her to phone for help, that is if she were able to call.
It seems odd that the authorities can't locate her body, should she have slipped and fallen at the Falls themselves and that even with cadaver dogs brought in.
Perhaps she was alone walking and came across a snake basking in the sunlight on the track, shocked she dropped her phnoe as she scurried off the track and hid until it slithered away at which time it was darkening, she'd lost sight of her phone and had no idea which way to go?
I could posit she was abducted and may still be alive, tied to a wall in a shipping container somewhere and if so then I pray she makes it out alive.
But, even on a sunny day in a place like Tasmania you can go missing in a heartbeat and the place is so big and rugged that your remains may never surface, sadly.
What?!? Why would you even write something like that?!?
Just keep it factual please. You have some good local knowledge, but there is no need to write disturbing potential scenarios that are very unlikely to be true.
A recent article in the Tasmanian Times describes a perceived reluctance by Tasmania police to back up in action their request for public assistance, as reported by a highly skilled and experienced bushman, Ken Mead, a man they have previously used to assist them to find lost persons. https://tasmaniantimes.com/2023/08/where-is-celine-cremer/
Just out of interest for those of you who aren't familiar with this track and might think perhaps it would be very easy for someone to become lost in the dense bush, here's an image from around the same time period, taken on the track to Philosopher Falls on which Celine Cremer was believed to have walked on the day of her disappearance. As you can see, it's not particularly ill-defined, nor treacherous for someone with a medium level of experience such as Celine was known to possess.
www.google.com
Just out of interest for those of you who aren't familiar with this track and might think perhaps it would be very easy for someone to become lost in the dense bush, here's an image from around the same time period, taken on the track to Philosopher Falls on which Celine Cremer was believed to have walked on the day of her disappearance. As you can see, it's not particularly ill-defined, nor treacherous for someone with a medium level of experience such as Celine was known to possess.
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As a Tasmanian, a couple of other things have occurred to me in regard to the disappearance of this young woman, Celine Cremer. The period in which she disappeared is close to what is known as 'mushroom season' in which Tasmania's magic mushrooms appear and grow for a few months.
This forest is especially well known for the presence of its unusual fungi, so the likelihood that the type of mushrooms required to have a psychedelic trip would be growing there during that time period.
I do not know if she was known to use these types of drugs at all, and I apologise for speculating about her character in this manner to those who consider it denigrating, but if Celine was looking for magic mushrooms during her walk then perhaps this might explain why she apparently inexplicably left the clearly identified track and mysteriously headed off into the bush, as revealed by the police through the records of her mobile phone pings.
As a visitor to the state, Celine would not have been familiar with which mushrooms she was supposed to be looking for and, such as is a common practice amongst those searching for this type of fungi, she may have been in the presence of a local who knew what the right kind looked like, since it's quite a dangerous thing to do, to accidentally take the wrong type of mushroom, many of them being extremely toxic.
These mushrooms tend to grow in 'patches' which people discover and then return to each year when they're in season, since places well frequented by the public, like the nearby sides of the track would most likely have been long ago 'picked out' by people seeking to experience the mushrooms and accidentally destroying the regenerative growth pattern of these pants by picking all of them from an area and thus depriving it of the crucially necessary spores required to seed next year's crop, hence the necessity of Celine and her guide to move away from the defined track.
I know all of this is mere gross speculation on my part, but should Celine have been in this situation then the proposition I've described is not outside of the realms of possibility. If you'll permit me this, then perhaps during this excursion 'off the beaten path' some type of terrible accident may have befallen Celine. Her guide, panicking and not wanting to get into trouble, (since possession of these mushrooms is illegal in Tasmania,may have not reported this incident in a self preservation effort.
I'm sure there are numerous other potential situations which might be possible and, keeping in mind being earlier discouraged from suggesting foul play as an apparently unsuitable option, in my defense as a response in the context of my 'insider knowledge' as a Tasmanian, if you look at the comments from other local Tasmanian people attached to Ken Mead's article in the Tasmanian Times, you'll see that my thinking is very much in keeping with what other locals also think, particularly those who've had experiences around that area of the state, which their comments confirm is very much as I described, an economically depressed area, mainly populated by ex-miners looking for some way of making money after the end of the mining industry and living in a culture not particularly caring about following the rule of law.
Amongst those comments the general consensus is that Celine's disappearance seems too inexplicably odd for it not to involve foul play. What exactly the level or the circumstances of which, I will leave at what so far I've detailed, (in the interests of not offending further).
This forest is especially well known for the presence of its unusual fungi, so the likelihood that the type of mushrooms required to have a psychedelic trip would be growing there during that time period.
I do not know if she was known to use these types of drugs at all, and I apologise for speculating about her character in this manner to those who consider it denigrating, but if Celine was looking for magic mushrooms during her walk then perhaps this might explain why she apparently inexplicably left the clearly identified track and mysteriously headed off into the bush, as revealed by the police through the records of her mobile phone pings.
As a visitor to the state, Celine would not have been familiar with which mushrooms she was supposed to be looking for and, such as is a common practice amongst those searching for this type of fungi, she may have been in the presence of a local who knew what the right kind looked like, since it's quite a dangerous thing to do, to accidentally take the wrong type of mushroom, many of them being extremely toxic.
These mushrooms tend to grow in 'patches' which people discover and then return to each year when they're in season, since places well frequented by the public, like the nearby sides of the track would most likely have been long ago 'picked out' by people seeking to experience the mushrooms and accidentally destroying the regenerative growth pattern of these pants by picking all of them from an area and thus depriving it of the crucially necessary spores required to seed next year's crop, hence the necessity of Celine and her guide to move away from the defined track.
I know all of this is mere gross speculation on my part, but should Celine have been in this situation then the proposition I've described is not outside of the realms of possibility. If you'll permit me this, then perhaps during this excursion 'off the beaten path' some type of terrible accident may have befallen Celine. Her guide, panicking and not wanting to get into trouble, (since possession of these mushrooms is illegal in Tasmania,may have not reported this incident in a self preservation effort.
I'm sure there are numerous other potential situations which might be possible and, keeping in mind being earlier discouraged from suggesting foul play as an apparently unsuitable option, in my defense as a response in the context of my 'insider knowledge' as a Tasmanian, if you look at the comments from other local Tasmanian people attached to Ken Mead's article in the Tasmanian Times, you'll see that my thinking is very much in keeping with what other locals also think, particularly those who've had experiences around that area of the state, which their comments confirm is very much as I described, an economically depressed area, mainly populated by ex-miners looking for some way of making money after the end of the mining industry and living in a culture not particularly caring about following the rule of law.
Amongst those comments the general consensus is that Celine's disappearance seems too inexplicably odd for it not to involve foul play. What exactly the level or the circumstances of which, I will leave at what so far I've detailed, (in the interests of not offending further).
After viewing various news stories trying to work out a few details, it appears the last confirmed reported sighting of Celine Cremer was on the 17th June 2023, which was a Saturday.
Her vehicle was discovered in the car park of the Philosopher Falls walking track on the 27th of June, six days after she was reported missing. She was reported missing on the 21st of June when she was supposed to have arrived in Melbourne after traveling on the Spirit of Tasmania ferry across Bass Strait to Victoria (a 9 to 11 hour trip).
The 20th of June was apparently also the last time her phone signal 'pinged' from somewhere estimated to be around 50m off the marked track.
My theory is this-Celine ran into foul play and never actually went to the Philosopher Falls walking track. She possibly ran into that foul play on Saturday night in Waratah, the 17th. Those responsible then, in an effort to disguise their crime and to make it appear she had become disoriented and lost in the bush, drove her car to the Philosopher Falls walking track car park somewhwere betwen the 17th of June and the 20th of June and left it there after walking in a way to throw her phone around 50m (a pretty good throw, but possible) off the track and into the surrounding bush where it went flat on the 20th because it hadn't been charged since the 17th, (Saturday night). This would go as way to explain the inexplicable lack of any physical evidence of her either being lost or having died anywhere near the track, even though her phone records indicate this as her final location. It would also potentially explain the most irksome of all the oddities surrounding this situation and the number one question the police themselves have stated publicly they "just can't understand", which is why Celine would have chosen to leave the track? It makes sense that she did not if someone instead threw her phone off the track in an effort to decive the police into believing this was her final location, and doing so whilst knowing full well that a flat mobile phone would be more impossibly to find in the bush as the cadaver of a lost walker.
Her vehicle was discovered in the car park of the Philosopher Falls walking track on the 27th of June, six days after she was reported missing. She was reported missing on the 21st of June when she was supposed to have arrived in Melbourne after traveling on the Spirit of Tasmania ferry across Bass Strait to Victoria (a 9 to 11 hour trip).
The 20th of June was apparently also the last time her phone signal 'pinged' from somewhere estimated to be around 50m off the marked track.
My theory is this-Celine ran into foul play and never actually went to the Philosopher Falls walking track. She possibly ran into that foul play on Saturday night in Waratah, the 17th. Those responsible then, in an effort to disguise their crime and to make it appear she had become disoriented and lost in the bush, drove her car to the Philosopher Falls walking track car park somewhwere betwen the 17th of June and the 20th of June and left it there after walking in a way to throw her phone around 50m (a pretty good throw, but possible) off the track and into the surrounding bush where it went flat on the 20th because it hadn't been charged since the 17th, (Saturday night). This would go as way to explain the inexplicable lack of any physical evidence of her either being lost or having died anywhere near the track, even though her phone records indicate this as her final location. It would also potentially explain the most irksome of all the oddities surrounding this situation and the number one question the police themselves have stated publicly they "just can't understand", which is why Celine would have chosen to leave the track? It makes sense that she did not if someone instead threw her phone off the track in an effort to decive the police into believing this was her final location, and doing so whilst knowing full well that a flat mobile phone would be more impossibly to find in the bush as the cadaver of a lost walker.
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Yeah it does sound possible that she was never there. Maybe more probable than wandering off that track. I had thought that maybe her car didn't start and someone - maybe offering her a lift - took her or maybe just took her not even under the guise of helping. Maybe coming back and tossing the phone?
Do we know where she was staying in Waratah? It's not a very big place.
Do we know if anyone saw her car in that carpark before the 27th?
Do we know where her phone was from the 17th-20th? That must be on record? Or was it off?
Finally, does anyone's phone actually last 3 days without charging? (My only phone that ever has was old Nokia)
I can't believe there's so little info. Maybe police have much more. I hope so.
I think modern phone batteries can last a few days on average. I wonder what her movements were on that Saturday night?
You'd think in a town of 180 or so people they'd notice her movements. For example, I know there's a photo of Celine, apparently taken in what looks like the local pub, and there's a guy in the background at the bar who's staring at her from behind as the photo's being taken, since a woman with that type of beauty stands out in a place like Waratah, (as the example of the guy staring at her illustrates).
The other thing is that she had been in Tasmania for 6 months and that's long enough to have been warned amply of the potential dangers of the changeable conditions in the bush.
However, she was photographed out on a bush track (presumably in Tasmania) wearing a crop top and cut off jeans, which certainly isn't the type of attire you'd want to go bush-walking in, no matter how nice a day it was.
If the cops knew more and suspected foul play they'd likely say nothing, so they didn't alert the perpetrator(s).
You'd think in a town of 180 or so people they'd notice her movements. For example, I know there's a photo of Celine, apparently taken in what looks like the local pub, and there's a guy in the background at the bar who's staring at her from behind as the photo's being taken, since a woman with that type of beauty stands out in a place like Waratah, (as the example of the guy staring at her illustrates).
The other thing is that she had been in Tasmania for 6 months and that's long enough to have been warned amply of the potential dangers of the changeable conditions in the bush.
However, she was photographed out on a bush track (presumably in Tasmania) wearing a crop top and cut off jeans, which certainly isn't the type of attire you'd want to go bush-walking in, no matter how nice a day it was.
If the cops knew more and suspected foul play they'd likely say nothing, so they didn't alert the perpetrator(s).
I was just looking at the photos on Google Earth related to Philosopher Falls where Christine was last seen apparently by a man also on the track that day.The photo was taken of a sign at the entrance to the track or some way along it which explains a certain phenomenon particular to the area which may have some bearing on how Christine disappeared on that day had she stepped off the track at any point and her remains then afterwards never been located. It reads:
"Down to unknown depths..."
'Among the giant Myrtle trees, the plants of the forest floor of this Tarkine rainforest provided many challenges for early explorers. The banks of the Arthur river are covered by a plant known as horizontal, a densely covering plant which made progress slow going for explorers such as Bell and Philospher Smith.
The woody interlacing branches, even when not an inch in diameter will bear the weight of a man laden with his knapsack. But woe betide the luckless wight who. while travelling through this scrub, treads on the mossy disguised twig or branch which as decayed. Should this not infrequent case happen, down to unknown depths may he drop, while the green treacherous mossy carpet springs into its place like a trap, concealing the engulfed explorer. It is to be feared one or two of our missing mining prospectors have met their fate this way...'
-R.M. Johnson 'Systematic account of geology of Tasmania' Hobart, 1888.
Given this information I would like to revise my previous theory to suspect instead that on the fateful day Celine took a walk on the track and thought she might step away a short distance from it to rest a while in some enticingly sweet spot nearby, all the while sadly unknowing that this deadly phenomenon, as described above, was perilously near.
When the quote states 'to unknown depths' I have had first hand experience as a youngster when climbing throught similar rainforest on the side of kunanyi/Mt. Wellintgton, the mountian beneath which the city of Hobart sits.
When lowering myself from tree branches, I dared to step down onto what I suspected was firm ground. I found it instead to be it a deceptively thin lattice of dead branches decayed, yet capable of suporting enough fallen dried leaves ad etc to create the illusion of solid ground, when concealed there lay dark, rocky crags into which one may have easily fallen and seriously injured themselves. The scale of these hidden depths were quite even potentially fatal, and this was in an area unlike that described above where a nearby river runs feeding the flora to increase its presence muliply.
The native Myrtle trees in the area of Waratah also have a tendency to grow huge but only so tall before their roots rot away and they fall under high winds thereby leaving large void spaces for this horizontal plant and its mossy cover to grow across and conceal deep, dark crevices below in which water often sits unevaporated, impenetrated by sunlight and able then to drown a person injured and perhaps unconscious after a fall.
Perhaps fully submerged prostate in these waters they might lay later unable to be detected even by a trained cadaver detecting dog and so leaving the mystery of what has happened to them covered by these false bush floors, never to be seen again.
What a pity that the original 'old style' of language employed by the writer of this historical quote containing sign, (no doubt designed by foresters with a dual expectation of giving fair warning to any native English speaker who read it), may have been utterly lost on Celine whose native toungue perhaps interfered with her examination of every critically important piece of safety data it contained, neglecting to read it in full under the expectation that it was only some extraneous and unimportant historical data and not necessarily required reading, when instead a far better dedicated public information warning serving sign might have read (in big red letters) something like-
'WARNING DANGER: Please do not step away from the track as the forest floor may be false, weak and long dangerous depths often lay beneath'.
A message that might have well served to prevent this loss from occurring in the first place and something, the presence of which might prevent anyone else in the future from also suffering a similar mysterious loss of their self, or dear loved one.
"Down to unknown depths..."
'Among the giant Myrtle trees, the plants of the forest floor of this Tarkine rainforest provided many challenges for early explorers. The banks of the Arthur river are covered by a plant known as horizontal, a densely covering plant which made progress slow going for explorers such as Bell and Philospher Smith.
The woody interlacing branches, even when not an inch in diameter will bear the weight of a man laden with his knapsack. But woe betide the luckless wight who. while travelling through this scrub, treads on the mossy disguised twig or branch which as decayed. Should this not infrequent case happen, down to unknown depths may he drop, while the green treacherous mossy carpet springs into its place like a trap, concealing the engulfed explorer. It is to be feared one or two of our missing mining prospectors have met their fate this way...'
-R.M. Johnson 'Systematic account of geology of Tasmania' Hobart, 1888.
Given this information I would like to revise my previous theory to suspect instead that on the fateful day Celine took a walk on the track and thought she might step away a short distance from it to rest a while in some enticingly sweet spot nearby, all the while sadly unknowing that this deadly phenomenon, as described above, was perilously near.
When the quote states 'to unknown depths' I have had first hand experience as a youngster when climbing throught similar rainforest on the side of kunanyi/Mt. Wellintgton, the mountian beneath which the city of Hobart sits.
When lowering myself from tree branches, I dared to step down onto what I suspected was firm ground. I found it instead to be it a deceptively thin lattice of dead branches decayed, yet capable of suporting enough fallen dried leaves ad etc to create the illusion of solid ground, when concealed there lay dark, rocky crags into which one may have easily fallen and seriously injured themselves. The scale of these hidden depths were quite even potentially fatal, and this was in an area unlike that described above where a nearby river runs feeding the flora to increase its presence muliply.
The native Myrtle trees in the area of Waratah also have a tendency to grow huge but only so tall before their roots rot away and they fall under high winds thereby leaving large void spaces for this horizontal plant and its mossy cover to grow across and conceal deep, dark crevices below in which water often sits unevaporated, impenetrated by sunlight and able then to drown a person injured and perhaps unconscious after a fall.
Perhaps fully submerged prostate in these waters they might lay later unable to be detected even by a trained cadaver detecting dog and so leaving the mystery of what has happened to them covered by these false bush floors, never to be seen again.
What a pity that the original 'old style' of language employed by the writer of this historical quote containing sign, (no doubt designed by foresters with a dual expectation of giving fair warning to any native English speaker who read it), may have been utterly lost on Celine whose native toungue perhaps interfered with her examination of every critically important piece of safety data it contained, neglecting to read it in full under the expectation that it was only some extraneous and unimportant historical data and not necessarily required reading, when instead a far better dedicated public information warning serving sign might have read (in big red letters) something like-
'WARNING DANGER: Please do not step away from the track as the forest floor may be false, weak and long dangerous depths often lay beneath'.
A message that might have well served to prevent this loss from occurring in the first place and something, the presence of which might prevent anyone else in the future from also suffering a similar mysterious loss of their self, or dear loved one.
imstilla.grandma
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*Tasmania Police have renewed calls for any information that may help find missing Belgian backpacker Celine Cremer, on the year anniversary of her disappearance.The 31-year-old was last seen at Waratah in the state's north-west on June 17 last year, and her car was found at the nearby walking trail to Philosopher Falls
Cross-posting links with this Australian Drone Search initiative..
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Australia - Help reviewing aerial images from missing persons searches
Just found this out and thought others may find it interesting and may want to help out. Working Drones Australia is a commercial drones operator who has been involved in multiple missing persons searches in the last few years. Visiting this website you have access to their aerial images for...
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Or an even simpler explanation - to go to the toilet.
There was a case on the Appalachian trail where this happened and the lady could not find her way back to the trail.
Found Deceased - ME - Gerry Largay, 66, Appalachian Trail, 21 July 2013
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The first part of this current article is about Celine.
www.abc.net.au
'Predatory behaviour': Psychics accused of exploiting grieving families
Thousands of Australians go missing every year, so what's it like spending years grieving and searching for answers?
www.abc.net.au