Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #20

[lampformypath]

Here's an Australian link about Radio Scanners. Thought this was worth noting (underlined by me) Journalists use them, and maybe even the early days some communications techs used them? I'm amazed at this info:

[FONT=&amp]4. WHAT KIND OF PEOPLE USE SCANNERS?[/FONT]

People from many walks of life use scanners, and for different reasons. Some listen as a hobby, while others listen as a part of their job.

* Tow truck operators use scanners and monitor the police bands for information on traffic accidents.
​

*​

Volunteer fire brigade officers use scanners to monitor their local brigade frequency. This way, they can be forewarned of any serious fires in their disstrict and start getting prepared for a call-out. (It's also a lot cheaper to buy an inexpensive scanner than to buy one of the handheld transceivers used by the brigades.)

* People working in the media industry (journalists, etc.) use scanners to learn of "newsworthy" events and report on them.
​

* ​

Everyday people listen to scanners for entertainment and education. If you want to learn a little about how the Police Service operates, you can do worse than listen to them on the police radio frequencies. This gives a valuable insight into the situations and dangers our police officers face in their day-to-day duties.​

​

https://warsug.info/viewtopic.php?t=7

 

[Pandit]

I must have missed it. Or could the posts have been deleted? Or I forgot I saw it even ... who knows, it's hard to filter and retain so much over time. None of us have much that is original left to say I imagine it's been said or implied somewhere else before.

It's not a bad ruse for getting them in the car but I'm drawn more to the calculated, sadistic hatred in brutalising those girls and then walking them into the scrub to kill them. (If that's what happened, I'd like to see confirmation somewhere)

That kind of cold hatred and contempt needs a lot of fuel, a scenario which might mean the personalities of two.

As has already been said the fem fatale was mentioned long ago , the woman who was thought to be involved was named in the threads , in some theories she was the instigator of it all

 

[Frequant Flyer]

I must have missed it. Or could the posts have been deleted? Or I forgot I saw it even ... who knows, it's hard to filter and retain so much over time. None of us have much that is original left to say I imagine it's been said or implied somewhere else before.

It's not a bad ruse for getting them in the car but I'm drawn more to the calculated, sadistic hatred in brutalising those girls and then walking them into the scrub to kill them. (If that's what happened, I'd like to see confirmation somewhere)

That kind of cold hatred needs a lot of fuel, a scenario which might mean the personalities of two.

Apologies , this goes back to very early threads , threads 2 3 4 , around that time , maybe a bit later , but early on , I should have been clearer , it was first raised in the early BF forum

 

[Pandit]

Shouldn't surprise anyone that scenario was proposed early on really considering the Birnie's habits in the same area.

Apologies , this goes back to very early threads , threads 2 3 4 , around that time , maybe a bit later , but early on , I should have been clearer , it was first raised in the early BF forum

 

[no name]

Looking for something definitive that confirms the police believe the girls were killed at the site but having some trouble atm finding it.?

From the time of the murders until KO'Ks press conference announcing the arrest, they were adamant the girls were not killed at their dump site. The first time we heard the official position had changed and they now believe they were killed at the place they were found was at the press conference.

 

[Pandit]

I don't recall this at the presser.

Was it perhaps a suggestion, convenient and in line with the charges at the time because they hadn't actually found where the girls had been killed?

Or have they known it the whole time and were holding it back do you think?

From the time of the murders until KO'Ks press conference announcing the arrest, they were adamant the girls were not killed at their dump site. The first time we heard the official position had changed and they now believe they were killed at the place they were found was at the press conference.

 

[Kambo]

I don't recall this at the presser.

Was it perhaps a suggestion, convenient and in line with the charges at the time because they hadn't actually found where the girls had been killed?

Or have they known it the whole time and were holding it back do you think?

I think it was just a statement. That is what they allege happened. So the 2 possibilities are, 1. Thy have proof it did happen at the dump site, or
2. They have no proof of it occurring elsewhere at this stage.

I doubt this will have any bearing on the outcome of a trial.



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[petedavo.au]

Here's an Australian link about Radio Scanners. Thought this was worth noting (underlined by me) Journalists use them, and maybe even the early days some communications techs used them? I'm amazed at this info:

[FONT=&amp]4. WHAT KIND OF PEOPLE USE SCANNERS?[/FONT]

People from many walks of life use scanners, and for different reasons. Some listen as a hobby, while others listen as a part of their job.

* Tow truck operators use scanners and monitor the police bands for information on traffic accidents.
​

*​

Volunteer fire brigade officers use scanners to monitor their local brigade frequency. This way, they can be forewarned of any serious fires in their disstrict and start getting prepared for a call-out. (It's also a lot cheaper to buy an inexpensive scanner than to buy one of the handheld transceivers used by the brigades.)

* People working in the media industry (journalists, etc.) use scanners to learn of "newsworthy" events and report on them.
​

* ​

Everyday people listen to scanners for entertainment and education. If you want to learn a little about how the Police Service operates, you can do worse than listen to them on the police radio frequencies. This gives a valuable insight into the situations and dangers our police officers face in their day-to-day duties.​

​

https://warsug.info/viewtopic.php?t=7

When I was a young bloke a lot of blokes had CBs and many of them had scanners as well. A lot had them rigged up in their cars. It was just the craze at the time back in late 70's through out the 80's. The CB craze dropped off when the 27Mhz band was stopped. The UHF band never took off with kids in the same way. And CB shops closed up. But you can still get scanners from places like Dick Smith, Tandy etc in mid 1990's. They're still around today.
Even on EBay. https://www.ebay.com/b/Mobile-In-Vehicle-Radio-Scanners/40979/bn_2826136

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[Pandit]

I have to suspect it's BRE because out of all the men that couldn't be identified on the night, the guy that ended up charged for the murders just happens to be the right physical fit in height, build, colouring, hair and roughly age.

Not a coincidence imo, even if I think the CCTV is useless as evidence anyway but that if the prosecution tried to use, may even backfire and open the door for the defence to raise other possibilities of who else it actually could be. There were other violent sexual predators operating in and around Claremont at the same time.

One of them looks similar to BRE.

Police would know by now if BRE is MM in the video. Do you think that would have been released if it was him? I’m thinking it isn’t, which is why there is no mention of it lately. What do you guys think? Interesting either way it pans out. Moo


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[janwa]

Interesting comments made by John Quigley about Paul Ferguson and Caporn n Parliament.

It is absolutely shameful. The police had all of Perth believing that Lance was the murderer. Theydestroyed his life just as they destroyed Mallard’s life. It is no coincidence that after locking up Mallard withintwo weeks of the death of Mrs Lawrence, Caporn was considered the whiz-kid. They sacked a real copper frommacro, Detective Sergeant Paul Ferguson, who the member for Murray-Wellington would vouchsafe is a realcopper, and put on this impostor who said, “Lance is the man.” Because of his capacity to solve difficult murdercases, he rocketed up through the police force to the rank of assistant commissioner and was eventually in chargeof terrorism laws. God help us all that a person such as that could be put in charge! He does not even have theconfidence of the Commissioner of Police to have his contract renewed to be an assistant commissioner.

What has happened? We have a corrupt police officer running his own agenda, convicting people in the mediaand destroying families, and because of his success in doing this, he is promoted! They sacked Paul Ferguson.Does the member for Murray-Wellington know Detective Sergeant Paul Ferguson? He is a fine police officer. Iknow him, his family and all his history. He is a fine police officer, but he was sacked from the case because hewas not advancing the case quickly enough. They wanted a quick result, and this Caporn chappie had got a quickresult in the Mallard case, so they sooled him onto this case to sink Lance. They could not convict him in court,so they convicted him in the media. I do not know any more about the facts behind Mrs Rayney’s death thananyone else in this house. I am not any better informed, but I do know that what the police did was damnable. Itwas the same form again. They did what they did to Lance and Mallard. They announced that Mr Rayney wasthe prime and only suspect.

http://www.parliament.wa.gov.au/Hansard%5Chansard.nsf/0/b52e1a6529eecb9a482576e400115ead/$FILE/A38%20S1%2020081127%20p631b-640a.pdf

 

[lampformypath]

When I was a young bloke a lot of blokes had CBs and many of them had scanners as well. A lot had them rigged up in their cars. It was just the craze at the time back in late 70's through out the 80's. The CB craze dropped off when the 27Mhz band was stopped. The UHF band never took off with kids in the same way. And CB shops closed up. But you can still get scanners from places like Dick Smith, Tandy etc in mid 1990's. They're still around today.
Even on EBay. https://www.ebay.com/b/Mobile-In-Vehicle-Radio-Scanners/40979/bn_2826136

Sent from my HTC 2PQ910 using Tapatalk

Thanks for posting that info Petedavo. Have no knowledge of such things and none of my brothers/sisters were into these, nor my kids. I thought it was worth a mention as perhaps being a device someone might be able to use if they were into nefarious activities and didn't want to be disturbed by the law. I had no idea it was so easy to listen into police bands (and I'm not talking the Scottish pipers, perish the thought!) and that virtually anyone could do it. I thought it would be blocked in some way, jammed so that only those with special access requirements (Fire and emergency) could tap in. They look far too technical for me. I thought the device that ET built was amazing enough, phone home!

 

[lampformypath]

Interesting comments made by John Quigley about Paul Ferguson and Caporn n Parliament.

It is absolutely shameful. The police had all of Perth believing that Lance was the murderer. Theydestroyed his life just as they destroyed Mallard’s life. It is no coincidence that after locking up Mallard withintwo weeks of the death of Mrs Lawrence, Caporn was considered the whiz-kid. They sacked a real copper frommacro, Detective Sergeant Paul Ferguson, who the member for Murray-Wellington would vouchsafe is a realcopper, and put on this impostor who said, “Lance is the man.” Because of his capacity to solve difficult murdercases, he rocketed up through the police force to the rank of assistant commissioner and was eventually in chargeof terrorism laws. God help us all that a person such as that could be put in charge! He does not even have theconfidence of the Commissioner of Police to have his contract renewed to be an assistant commissioner.

What has happened? We have a corrupt police officer running his own agenda, convicting people in the mediaand destroying families, and because of his success in doing this, he is promoted! They sacked Paul Ferguson.Does the member for Murray-Wellington know Detective Sergeant Paul Ferguson? He is a fine police officer. Iknow him, his family and all his history. He is a fine police officer, but he was sacked from the case because hewas not advancing the case quickly enough. They wanted a quick result, and this Caporn chappie had got a quickresult in the Mallard case, so they sooled him onto this case to sink Lance. They could not convict him in court,so they convicted him in the media. I do not know any more about the facts behind Mrs Rayney’s death thananyone else in this house. I am not any better informed, but I do know that what the police did was damnable. Itwas the same form again. They did what they did to Lance and Mallard. They announced that Mr Rayney wasthe prime and only suspect.

http://www.parliament.wa.gov.au/Hansard%5Chansard.nsf/0/b52e1a6529eecb9a482576e400115ead/$FILE/A38%20S1%2020081127%20p631b-640a.pdf

Whoaaa! JQ don't hold back!! I was thinking about LW only today as I was reading old articles about the case and then the articles about his death from cancer started popping up. It is just so dreadfully sad. He did seem (from all I've read) to have some very unusual habits (hey, haven't we all?) and was a social misfit, but the words "hounded to death" do come to mind as I read the way he was treated. May he RIP.

 

[no name]

I don't recall this at the presser.

Was it perhaps a suggestion, convenient and in line with the charges at the time because they hadn't actually found where the girls had been killed?

Or have they known it the whole time and were holding it back do you think?

The former IMO

 

[janwa]

Thanks for posting that info Petedavo. Have no knowledge of such things and none of my brothers/sisters were into these, nor my kids. I thought it was worth a mention as perhaps being a device someone might be able to use if they were into nefarious activities and didn't want to be disturbed by the law. I had no idea it was so easy to listen into police bands (and I'm not talking the Scottish pipers, perish the thought!) and that virtually anyone could do it. I thought it would be blocked in some way, jammed so that only those with special access requirements (Fire and emergency) could tap in. They look far too technical for me. I thought the device that ET built was amazing enough, phone home!

Also very popular with burglars tuning in to the police band.

[h=3]http://uhfcb.com.au/CB-Radio-History.php[/h]

[h=3]27MHz AM/SSB (aka 'CB')[/h]
[h=3]History[/h]27 MHz CB started in the United States in the 1950s and spread worldwide in the 1970s. Australia legalised CB in the late 1970s, following a vigorous campaign by truck drivers and others who wanted cheap, local communications for personal or business purposes. The government initially allocated 18 channels for CB. Operators had to obtain a government call sign, pay an annual licence fee and use type-approved equipment. However unlike amateur radio, no technical examination was required.
In Australia 27 MHz CB was planned as a temporary allocation, with users to move to UHF in five years. However it proved so popular that the band was extended to its current 40 channels in 1982. If you hear an inexperienced person talk about 'CB' the chances are that they are referring to 27 MHz.
Most CB operators did not bother with licensing. Provided you did not cause interference, used illegal amplifiers or make a nuisance of yourself, the chance of being caught by Department of Communications inspectors was slim. The cost of policing was probably higher than revenue foregone. This was recognised in 1994, when the government abolished CB licence fees. However operators must still use their equipment in accordance with the CB class licence, a copy of which is available on the Australian Communications and Media Authority website.

Though usage of 27 MHz CB has fallen dramatically in the last decade, it remains the cheapest method of basic local communications, especially in hilly areas. 27 MHz activity peaked in the 1970s, remained fairly popular in the 1980s, and declined in the 1990s as most users moved to UHF CB, amateur radio, mobile phones, IRC internet chat or simply gave it away.

 

[lampformypath]

Also very popular with burglars tuning in to the police band.

http://uhfcb.com.au/CB-Radio-History.php



27MHz AM/SSB (aka 'CB')


History

27 MHz CB started in the United States in the 1950s and spread worldwide in the 1970s. Australia legalised CB in the late 1970s, following a vigorous campaign by truck drivers and others who wanted cheap, local communications for personal or business purposes. The government initially allocated 18 channels for CB. Operators had to obtain a government call sign, pay an annual licence fee and use type-approved equipment. However unlike amateur radio, no technical examination was required.
In Australia 27 MHz CB was planned as a temporary allocation, with users to move to UHF in five years. However it proved so popular that the band was extended to its current 40 channels in 1982. If you hear an inexperienced person talk about 'CB' the chances are that they are referring to 27 MHz.
Most CB operators did not bother with licensing. Provided you did not cause interference, used illegal amplifiers or make a nuisance of yourself, the chance of being caught by Department of Communications inspectors was slim. The cost of policing was probably higher than revenue foregone. This was recognised in 1994, when the government abolished CB licence fees. However operators must still use their equipment in accordance with the CB class licence, a copy of which is available on the Australian Communications and Media Authority website.

Though usage of 27 MHz CB has fallen dramatically in the last decade, it remains the cheapest method of basic local communications, especially in hilly areas. 27 MHz activity peaked in the 1970s, remained fairly popular in the 1980s, and declined in the 1990s as most users moved to UHF CB, amateur radio, mobile phones, IRC internet chat or simply gave it away.

Thanks so much for all that info Janwa. When I first posted it I thought, now prepare to be shot down in flames as this is pretty out there, but maybe not? Just because it's popularity with "joe public" waned, doesn't mean that criminal types ceased to use them. :tyou:

 

[petedavo.au]

Thanks for posting that info Petedavo. Have no knowledge of such things and none of my brothers/sisters were into these, nor my kids. I thought it was worth a mention as perhaps being a device someone might be able to use if they were into nefarious activities and didn't want to be disturbed by the law. I had no idea it was so easy to listen into police bands (and I'm not talking the Scottish pipers, perish the thought!) and that virtually anyone could do it. I thought it would be blocked in some way, jammed so that only those with special access requirements (Fire and emergency) could tap in. They look far too technical for me. I thought the device that ET built was amazing enough, phone home!

By the early 2000's police had migrated to digital technology like Tadis, same as taxis which prevented a lot of eaves dropping.

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[petedavo.au]

This might interest people>
https://warsug.info

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[Spooks-R-Us]

re: Lisa Jane Govan (not directly related to CSK case, but i thought some sleuths may be interested)

"...During the Cheaters-Deroes war, the Deroes had to cope with unwanted policeattention over the disappearance of 28-year-old Lisa Joanne Govan. She hadvanished after last being seen outside the Deroes' Kalgoorlie-Boulder clubhouse at7.30am on October 8, 1999, where she had arrived earlier from a nightclub in a taxi.Govan was believed to be dead, dumped down one of the thousands of mineshaftsdotting the Goldfields, and members of the bikie gang were murder suspects. TheDeroes stayed true to their code of silence and much to the anguish of Govan'sfamily, the disappearance remains unsolved.....

http://www.bmartin.cc/dissent/documents/Scott17b.pdf

 

[Frequant Flyer]

A few people seem to think a lot of planning went into the CSK incidences , stalking , phone tapping etc . And all of this may be possible , but where was all the pre planning when it came to the disposal sites
Why weren't they pre prepared to lessen its he chances of them being found

The area may have been decided in the planning , but why not the site , does not seem like much effort went into planning things to me

Im sure some will say he wanted them found , ok , they would have been found much sooner on Stirling HIghway or another major road

Im probably totally wrong , I guess time will tell

 

[petedavo.au]

A few people seem to think a lot of planning went into the CSK incidences , stalking , phone tapping etc . And all of this may be possible , but where was all the pre planning when it came to the disposal sites
Why weren't they pre prepared to lessen its he chances of them being found

The area may have been decided in the planning , but why not the site , does not seem like much effort went into planning things to me

Im sure some will say he wanted them found , ok , they would have been found much sooner on Stirling HIghway or another major road

Im probably totally wrong , I guess time will tell

I think you're on the right track.
If KK was anything to go by, they're not disposal sites, but rather rape sites and they were simply left for dead just as in the KK case. Raises interesting possibilities of connecting CSKs with the Hill St/Centenary Ave case and the Kerry Turner case, doesn't it?

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