Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #5

[Bartholemeus]

Not talking to you Bart. Remember you threatened not to talk to me. Yet you keep doing it. You have not contributed anything. You just ridicule.

You claimed the motive for the killings could have been to get his hands on some insignificant pieces of adornment. How did you think that was going to be answered? ** Not sure I ridiculed you on this either. All I did was point out it was highly unlikely.

 

[CSK?]

Why take low value key ring, and broach as trophy, yet leave a higher value watch? - Crabstick

Well for one the CSK wanted a trophy, and I'm sure he wasn't concerned with how much the trophy was worth, a key ring or broach would be much easier to take spur of the moment than un-cuppling a watch, The purpose of a trophy is to relive the act itself, not to pop down to cash converters and pawn it for as much dosh as possible so therefore value of the item is of no importance whatsoever.

 

[crabstick]

I'm not buying it. Taking a watch off is so simple it is ridiculous

The one aspect is, I think, Jane was on that spot within 24 hours of her abduction. And Janes watch was not attached. It had fallen off based on the info reported

Why take low value key ring, and broach as trophy, yet leave a higher value watch? - Crabstick

Well for one the CSK wanted a trophy, and I'm sure he wasn't concerned with how much the trophy was worth, a key ring or broach would be much easier to take spur of the moment than un-cuppling a watch, The purpose of a trophy is to relive the act itself, not to pop down to cash converters and pawn it for as much dosh as possible so therefore value of the item is of no importance whatsoever.

 

[CSK?]

"Of all serial rapists in the study, 74 percent had at least one prior felony arrest, and 95 percent had at least one felony after."

So there is a very possible chance our killer is sitting on the www.mako.org.au list either 74% chance before the murders took place or 95% chance after, having been jailed for an unrelated sexual assault or attempted abduction would be a great explanation as to why the killings just stopped. I can understand stopping at the time due to the heat of police in the area but after 20 years I'm sure there would have been an opportunity to commit another offense (unless you are a named POI who is too scared of getting caught knowing you have blown your shot at anomity) and/or stopping to raise a family is also feasible, but once again when the kids have grown up (it has been 20 years), most of the known serial killers around the world have returned back to at least one murder. and the other only real logical scenario's are having left WA or he died.

I've done a quick browse through the Mako site but it might be worth spending a bit of time on there looking for similarities to the CSK abductions, Of course he could also be one of the lucky 5% who has never been caught or convicted.

 

[CSK?]

There could be a thousand reasons why the CSK chose a key ring / broach over a watch, least of all being because he liked patterns. Removing the watch was a mere example I gave, my entire point was a serial killer is not concerned with the price of a trophy, the trophy has a far greater value to him than money.

 

[CSK?]

Well searching Mako is going to be harder than I first thought, on the site for 30 seconds and already found one that fits :facepalm:

http://www.mako.org.au/steven_ainsworth.html

Thought I'd be able to pull a short list of matches, if #2 of 2 searches makes it to the list I can see I'm in for a lot of work and a huge list of potential suspects.

 

[crabstick]

The broach was a symbolic gift from Ciaras mother.

Debi, Marshall, 2007. The Devil's Garden: The Claremont Serial Killings. 2nd ed. Australia: Random House.

Serial killers love trophies. It has been stated in the case prior that these items may have been taken as trophies. The watch can be a trophy, but why wasnt that trophy taken?

The watch doesn't have any symbolic value more than likely. Motive was derived from the watch police have said.

Sunflowers all round, or is it a daisy

Havent checked Pamela Lawrence business dates. Metallica Flora or Flora Metalllica. (Pamela Lawrence was murdered in 1994)
Did Sarah get her keyring from Pam, or was the Metallica Flora not open then? Flora Metallica was on Glyde st? This is where the undercover copper was dropped?

There could be a thousand reasons why the CSK chose a key ring / broach over a watch, least of all being because he liked patterns. Removing the watch was a mere example I gave, my entire point was a serial killer is not concerned with the price of a trophy, the trophy has a far greater value to him than money.

 

[elleAU]

Well searching Mako is going to be harder than I first thought, on the site for 30 seconds and already found one that fits :facepalm:

http://www.mako.org.au/steven_ainsworth.html

Thought I'd be able to pull a short list of matches, if #2 of 2 searches makes it to the list I can see I'm in for a lot of work and a huge list of potential suspects.

Interesting. IMO, some similarities with the March 1996 assault in the lane behind CBV - "he also threatened her with a brick" (SA); young woman's head bashed against brick wall (1996 assault); use of lanes.

 

[crabstick]

Looks a little like mystery man. Goes to South Australia via Southern Cross to escape scrutiny? Approx 27 years of age in 1996?
What was his occupation?

Well searching Mako is going to be harder than I first thought, on the site for 30 seconds and already found one that fits :facepalm:

http://www.mako.org.au/steven_ainsworth.html

Thought I'd be able to pull a short list of matches, if #2 of 2 searches makes it to the list I can see I'm in for a lot of work and a huge list of potential suspects.

 

[firestarter]

Looks a little like mystery man. Goes to South Australia via Southern Cross to escape scrutiny? Approx 27 years of age in 1996?
What was his occupation?

Apart from the jaw line.



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[Bartholemeus]

He may have had a sex change in 1996 and then a reversal in 1998. Obviously to disguise himself in the Conti CCTV.

 

[Bartholemeus]

Motive was derived from the watch police have said.

Can you please provide a source for this because I can't see how a motive could have been derived from a watch?

Can you please post a link to that article?

 

[enzeder]

Interesting timeline with plausible scenarios if it truly was LW (and his fried) - but a few times now the "could be her time of the month" scenario has been brought up here regarding Ciara (maybe always by yourself, or maybe by others as well, I can't recall) and honestly that just makes absolutely NO SENSE to me. Why would a rapist who terrorizes and kills his victims be swayed by some menstrual blood? Lord knows these poor young women were likely to be bloodied *everywhere* in the course of the attack - I mean seriously, what do you think happens to a large percentage of women during rapes?

(Apologies to rape victims reading this thread but it needs to be said) Not to mention that he either strangled them (which usually results in incontinence of all kinds) or cut their throats. Plus, if someone is terrified and in pain there's a very good chance they are going to soil themselves from some end or another.

I'm honestly stymied about this theory. Why is it floating around? What am I missing here?

BBM ^ My sentiments exactly.

 

[crabstick]

Hes 39 there not 26. And it is a artists impression . No ear lobes?

Apart from the jaw line.



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[crabstick]

It is a couple of pages back in an image reference. Go have a look
At least read what you ask of, which is a couple of pages back.
It also states police wont state how they derived motive from the watch.

Can you please provide a source for this because I can't see how a motive could have been derived from a watch?

Can you please post a link to that article?

 

[Bartholemeus]

It is a couple of pages back in an image reference. Go have a look
At least read what you ask of, which is a couple of pages back.
It also states police wont state how they derived motive from the watch.

I checked. It doesn't exist.

This is not the first time you have used a phantom article to try and legitimise your claims (see below)

I just don't understand why you keep doing this?

it has stated in the image source, the cops are DNA testing people 'inside' the pub.

That image source says;

"The officers were tasked with identifying every person person who appeared on the security video"

I'm not sure how you jumped from a comment in DM's 2007 book regarding Macro identifying everyone in the Conti the night JR was abducted to "police are DNA testing everyone who was there"?

 

[Deleted member 153673]

I see things have stayed pretty much on track then...

 

[lampformypath]

Here's something that might help get us back on track. A cold case in UK looks like being solved after 20 years, and in this article, information about another cold case that HAS just been solved with NEW techniques in DNA testing. The cold case of Melanie Hall sounds remarkably like our CSK girls, and dumped by the side of a road and not found, in this case, for 13 years! Please read the information about the man that they have just caught, living in the community as a family man, successful career etc. Our killer could be doing exactly the same!

http://www.msn.com/en-au/news/other...rder-investigation/ar-AAgN6dC?ocid=spartandhp

 

[CSK?]

you do realise not every guy is built like a brick **** house right? take a walk outside, you will see plenty of weedy smaller guys, not every weedy man is a woman in disguise.

 

[CSK?]

"Of all serial rapists in the study, 74 percent had at least one prior felony arrest, and 95 percent had at least one felony after."

Could we conclude from these stats that there is a 5% chance the CSK has never been arrested or a 95% chance MACRO do not have DNA belonging to the CSK since it would be matched if they did since they would obtain DNA from the person as he entered the prison system (or if they did have DNA the sample is not of sufficient value to conclude a result)?? whats people thoughts on this?

Also on reading the transcript of the news story a few pages back with David Caporn my take on his answering of if they had DNA was that they didn't have DNA but were testing POI's and potential POI'S for the sole purpose of hoping the CSK would leave DNA at a future crime scene. I'd always held the theory that MACRO did have some usable amount of DNA to an extent, but his comments some what changed my view on that significantly.