Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996-1997, Perth, Western Australia - #7 *ARREST*

[sleuthlife]

Heya Sydney sleuther here, been lurking since last night & had registered awhile back when Khandalyce & Karlie Pierce case broke awhile back...greetings to all the Aussie sleuthers.

This was the #1 episode of CIA that scared me afterwards, because the case was still open.

The Claremont serial murders case always struck me with how eerily similar all 3 women looked & that they'd all vanished shortly after leaving the club on foot & rang for a taxi - this was at a time when mobile phones weren't as popular, so people still relied on pay phones pretty regularly back then.

Would imagine a Telstra / Telecom vehicle parked near a phone box would look quite authorative & not attract much suspicion from passers by.

Have been checking out National Missings Persons database & can only find one cold case of a missing female person who disappeared under the same set of circumstances as the Claremont victims

https://www.missingpersons.gov.au/who-missing/wa/brown-lisa (Mods: I believe this link is OK to post as this info is publically listed on the Govt official website )

Miss Brown has blonde coloured hair & vanished from Perth City area just after midnight on November 1998 - from the time & description of her outfit ("heeled shoes") this would suggest she had gone for a night out in the city and left, presumably to go home. If she did not have a lift, it makes sense to think she would have called for a taxi.

Have only been to Perth once to get a tattoo (pretty place) & understand the City is not Claremont area, but it is worth noting the similarities between this missing person & the Claremont incidents, because at first glance there is a similar MO.

 

[Basilisk]

Hi Everyone, Another first time poster here. A couple of things iv'e thought about since reading through some of the earlier posts. In the early days of the investigation, Taxi drivers were lining up to submit their DNA sample to clear their name. As there was also talk regarding a Telstra vehicle, would't you think the police would have requested the drivers of Telstra vehicle submit a DNA sample. Also, watching 7 news tonight where they said the accused had left behind a kimono at the Huntingdale crime scene which they said was unconnected to the CSK at that time. Some 20 years later they have brought it out out of storage and tested it. I'm left wondering how they could they link the kimono to him but not evidence from the other victims

On a number of occasions Police have alluded to improvements in forensic technology, including low copy number and familial DNA testing. Many forensic technologies readily available today were simply unheard of even five years ago. In addition there have been a large number of sexual assaults, missing persons and suspicious deaths over the intervening 20-odd years. I think we can safely assume that no similar case has escaped re-examination, possibly several times over.

 

[rhythymz]

The property being searched in Madora Bay was last sold in June 2016 for $160K and before that in June 1988 for $35K.

 

[SteveG72]

On the bright side, we no longer have to endure these crazy theories about star signs and psychics and radians!

...or maybee we do

 

[YoureNicked]

Heya Sydney sleuther here, been lurking since last night & had registered awhile back when Khandalyce & Karlie Pierce case broke awhile back...greetings to all the Aussie sleuthers.

This was the #1 episode of CIA that scared me afterwards, because the case was still open.

The Claremont serial murders case always struck me with how eerily similar all 3 women looked & that they'd all vanished shortly after leaving the club on foot & rang for a taxi - this was at a time when mobile phones weren't as popular, so people still relied on pay phones pretty regularly back then.

Would imagine a Telstra / Telecom vehicle parked near a phone box would look quite authorative & not attract much suspicion from passers by.

Have been checking out National Missings Persons database & can only find one cold case of a missing female person who disappeared under the same set of circumstances as the Claremont victims

https://www.missingpersons.gov.au/who-missing/wa/brown-lisa (Mods: I believe this link is OK to post as this info is publically listed on the Govt official website )

Miss Brown has blonde coloured hair & vanished from Perth City area just after midnight on November 1998 - from the time & description of her outfit ("heeled shoes") this would suggest she had gone for a night out in the city and left, presumably to go home. If she did not have a lift, it makes sense to think she would have called for a taxi.

Have only been to Perth once to get a tattoo (pretty place) & understand the City is not Claremont area, but it is worth noting the similarities between this missing person & the Claremont incidents, because at first glance there is a similar MO.

Hi there sleuthlife and welcome.

The first thing I thought at the time of the Lisa Jane Brown disappearance was that she was a slim blonde and that it could be the CSK who was responsible. I thought the CSK may have moved his hunting ground to Mt Lawley and changed his victimology to a prostitute (easier to get into a car without risking a struggle that might be witnessed by passersby) because the heat was getting too much in Claremont.

I think people speculated that Donald Morey was responsible for Lisa's disappearance because he had been guilty of attacking prostitutes (Lisa was a prostitute) but perhaps Lisa can be attributed to the CSK. The police would know, I guess.

 

[Fence Sitter]

Interesting regarding the Madora Bay property. Perhaps he still lived at home with the parents at the time. Do we really know where he lived before Kewdale? If there is any news breaking of a body found likely to be Sarah Spiers then im guessing hes confessed. That or just really efficient police work.

In addition in regards to the dna on record. Someone i knew when i was younger got in trouble with the law when he was 19 or so. Crime was nothing major, noone was harmed and was just a silly mistake of a youngster and has never stepped a foot over the line before or since then. Anyway, when he was charged at the station they gave him the option of either submitting dna by buccal swab or providing fingerprints for the records. He chose prints.

Point being you dont have to have committed a heinous crime to have your dna on record and BEs dna could have been on record for something completely under the radar.

My guess is that there was in fact no dna on the girls bodies but there was a forensic link of some sort that connected them back to karakatta rape, then another forensic (non dna) link to connect back to the Huntingdale assault and finally theyve picked up dna from that case, matched it to him and finally been able to pursue their man for the link of crimes.

His first crime (and i believe it to be his first due to the panic and fleeing) was his undoing all along IMO



Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[Jezz]

I am even more stumped on how they got into a car with him now. The taxi thing makes so much sense especially given that sarah disappeared immediately after calling one and jane was last seen at the taxi rank waiting...
Would you really feel OK with getting a ride with a Telstra worker? I never really bought the blitz theory given the high traffic nature of the areas.
Hopefully more info comes soon.

 

[mandy.maree]

Well they probably had to call a taxi from a payphone..no one would think it weird if a telstra van was nearby.

 

[YoureNicked]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...d/news-story/f34913420ecf0edf1a4b991994f8254d

Yes, this is the most informative article yet about what the police have discovered about BE.

Some points of interest - His marriage broke down a year ago. Reveals his wife's name and that she is French. Talks of finding DNA on Ciara Glennon's body and of fifty upholstery fibres narrowing down the make and model of car the killer used. Then goes on to hint at the use of familial DNA so perhaps more details about familial DNA was used will be the next info to be revealed in following articles.

 

[mandy.maree]

Hes convinced them to get in the car somehow..theres no way he could have abducted them without being seen.
The taxi theory sure did make the most sense. I'm lost how he convinced these girls to get in his car/van .
All I've got is maybe he was near the payphone in his telstra vehicle pretending to fix (maybe even claim its broken) & said something like dont bother calling a taxi,I'm about to head that way anyway-I'll give you a lift

 

[mandy.maree]

Yep the familial DNA was definitely interesting

 

[potr]

i might be wrong, but i think i recall there being phones in the vestibule of the post office directly across from the conti....he could have been at the phone under the guise of fixing or testing a fault

 

[sleuthlife]

Hi there sleuthlife and welcome.

The first thing I thought at the time of the Lisa Jane Brown disappearance was that she was a slim blonde and that it could be the CSK who was responsible. I thought the CSK may have moved his hunting ground to Mt Lawley and changed his victimology to a prostitute (easier to get into a car without risking a struggle that might be witnessed by passersby) because the heat was getting too much in Claremont.

I think people speculated that Donald Morey was responsible for Lisa's disappearance because he had been guilty of attacking prostitutes (Lisa was a prostitute) but perhaps Lisa can be attributed to the CSK. The police would know, I guess.

Greetings & was in my teens in late 90s, don't remember Donald Morey case from WA. Guess he must not have made a Crime Investigation Australia episode !

I was not aware LB was a sex worker, it would be a shame if her occupation clouded the cold hard facts surrounding her disappearance. Am sure the WA police will be looking into all open cases very closely & tracing BE's past movements with a fine toothed comb.

 

[YoureNicked]

I am even more stumped on how they got into a car with him now. The taxi thing makes so much sense especially given that sarah disappeared immediately after calling one and jane was last seen at the taxi rank waiting...
Would you really feel OK with getting a ride with a Telstra worker? I never really bought the blitz theory given the high traffic nature of the areas.
Hopefully more info comes soon.

After initially thinking the girls willingly entered someone's car, I am now in agreement with the police, that they were blitz attacks (except maybe for Jane Rimmer who appeared to have been waiting for someone she had met before).

My reasons for believing the Blitz Attack Theory are based on the fact that the Karrakatta crime was a sudden attack. Also, there are plenty of very dark nooks and crannies to park and lurk in even on a main road like Stirling Hwy (Perth streets are very poorly lit, even today) and back then in the 1990's after midnight there weren't that many cars on the road. I still feel scared walking around that area at night, even now.

Like the Rowe Park attack, the killer could have parked in a darkened carpark or side street, ahead of where the victim was walking and then, as she passed, he grabs her from behind and drags her to his nearby car. There are many businesses along that highway so noone to hear you scream - plus, the houses are all solid brick with lush greenery (rich area) so anyone at home is not likely to hear much, either.

 

[rhythymz]

Hes convinced them to get in the car somehow..theres no way he could have abducted them without being seen.
The taxi theory sure did make the most sense. I'm lost how he convinced these girls to get in his car/van .
All I've got is maybe he was near the payphone in his telstra vehicle pretending to fix (maybe even claim its broken) & said something like dont bother calling a taxi,I'm about to head that way anyway-I'll give you a lift

Nice theory there Mandy. I think you have put the final piece to the puzzle into place.

 

[Basilisk]

Nice theory there Mandy. I think you have put the final piece to the puzzle into place.

Not that difficult...I worked in hospitality in Perth in the 1980s and on long weekends or holidays we often waited hours for a cab after closing time!

 

[dilettante]

Hi Everyone, Another first time poster here. A couple of things iv'e thought about since reading through some of the earlier posts. In the early days of the investigation, Taxi drivers were lining up to submit their DNA sample to clear their name. As there was also talk regarding a Telstra vehicle, would't you think the police would have requested the drivers of Telstra vehicle submit a DNA sample. Also, watching 7 news tonight where they said the accused had left behind a kimono at the Huntingdale crime scene which they said was unconnected to the CSK at that time. Some 20 years later they have brought it out out of storage and tested it. I'm left wondering how they could they link the kimono to him but not evidence from the other victims

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...t/news-story/7354e965cc2d7d087d7d207ae1d04d20 has more info on the 'kimono' and how it was used to link the attack to others:

[FONT=&amp]A SILK dressing gown stolen from a washing line 28 years ago is believed to have been the vital clue that helped lead police to finally make an arrest in the notorious Claremont serial killer case.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]It can be revealed that in 1988, eight years before Sarah Spiers was abducted off a street in the Perth suburb of Claremont, the white kimono was dropped by an intruder who broke into the home of an 18-year-old Huntingdale woman and tried to rape her...

[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Her screams caused him to flee and police believe he dropped the stolen kimono as he ran from the home.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]The case was never solved and the robe was put into storage at WA Police’s evidence receival centre, where it sat unnoticed until a few months ago.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]In a continuing operation to retest old evidence, State Crime Operations officers ran DNA tests on the kimono.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Police claim the DNA samples came back as a match to samples already on the police database — samples that had been recovered from the body of the third Claremont victim, Ciara Glennon, and from a 17-year-old woman grabbed in a Claremont street in 1995 and then assaulted at the nearby Karrakatta Cemetery...

[a lot more new info at the link][/FONT]

The article suggests he became a suspect (or a stronger suspect) after the 1988 attack files were reexamined. Article also says his DNA was not taken until after he was arrested, which means they must have been pretty sure.

Not sure if serious edit: I'm guessing they didn't catch him by asking google or isps who was google earthing the known dump sites the most, otherwise they would be searching other areas by now.

 

[GoT]

As I understand it, around the same time there was another guy going around killing prostitues (i was 10 at the time but have read posts about it since). There was an arrest but only ever for one, but there was a few taken. They police believed them to be not connected.

 

[screwdriver]

Mandy might be onto something (i had to register for this)

I grew up in Claremont and would frequent the conti a lot from 1998-2005. The payphones were annoyingly down the end of bay view.. Stirling hwy end

 

[billywhizz]

3000 taxi drivers gave DNA. This database could potentially have been used to find this guy... chances are one of them is loosely related to him.

Also interesting to see the age of his daughter/step-daughter. May have potentially been in the vehicle as well to give off a trustworthy/fatherly vibe.

Ever since this occured there were rumours about a telstra/telecom worker tapping or monitoring phone booths. It's absolutely crazy that if they had DNA they didn't test the entire fleet like they did with taxi drivers.

There is some irony in the fact that his first (likely first) crime has brought him undone, when he thought he was being clever by continually escalating so as not to be identified. What a dunce.

It said he had been questioned before in relation to CSK, maybe he is one of the people in the CCTV that is not MM.

Interested in hearing why he took KK to the cemetery when he already had her in a van.

It was obvious the bag on the head of KK was either to hide a distinctive vehicle or the fact he had a recognisable face. Everyone that drove a fleet vehicle should have been tested including police.