Australia Australia - Claremont SK, 1996-97, Perth, WA - #13

[Guccigal]

Hi, yes I do seem to have a lot but I think it's just because of my profession and where I live more than anything else.! I don't have any police connections unfortunately so can't help you out there. Re the random drug test, I don't know how they got it, ie whether they were tracking his phone etc but I'd say it would be quite easy to do if they had been following his movements and knew his pattern? I've never been swiped for drugs. ( only the alcohol test) but I assume they get to keep the negative test anyway?

 

[MsAnais]

Hi, yes I do seem to have a lot but I think it's just because of my profession and where I live more than anything else.! I don't have any police connections unfortunately so can't help you out there. Re the random drug test, I don't know how they got it, ie whether they were tracking his phone etc but I'd say it would be quite easy to do if they had been following his movements and knew his pattern? I've never been swiped for drugs. ( only the alcohol test) but I assume they get to keep the negative test anyway?

Hi Guccigal :seeya:

Just wanting to get clear here.

So your 'source' is saying they had BRE's DNA before his arrest?

This is contradictory to what has been published in MSM which says only familial DNA was collected pre-arrest and it was after his arrest that BRE's DNA was tested.....

(But obviously, MSM may not be revealing everything to us.)

 

[SN76]

just curious, do they now give you the sample to dispose of post negative breath test? Has not been my experience. Clever work wapol.

Just this Saturday night...my husband and I were pulled over for an RBT on the Horseshoe Bridge on the way back from Northbridge...after the test was complete, my husband asked for the plastic tube..to which the cop stated, "No, we can't do that".....

I recall my last RBT (for some reason there's many on Nicholson Road Canning Vale...right out the front of Hakea Prison...but I diverge..anyway..) and they didn't seem to have an issue with it......so, I wonder what's changed.

 

[Guccigal]

Hi Guccigal :seeya:

Just wanting to get clear here.

So your 'source' is saying they had BRE's DNA before his arrest?

This is contradictory to what has been published in MSM which says only familial DNA was collected pre-arrest and it was after his arrest that BRE's DNA was tested.....

(But obviously, MSM may not be revealing everything to us.)

Hi there.. I don't know if they got it after as well with his permission, I think there is a lot we are not told! Sorry can't help more.

 

[justified]

that is interesting SN76. Until now, i have never given it a second thought. Simply assumed they threw it away.....hmmm

 

[MsAnais]

Hi there.. I don't know if they got it after as well with his permission, I think there is a lot we are not told! Sorry can't help more.

Okay, thanks.

And yes, there's SO much we're not told - especially with this case. I guess we'll only find out all the facts at trial.

But maybe your info is the 'major breakthrough' they're referring to here:

'As a result of re-examining that case, it’s understood the major breakthrough — the details of which are not yet clear — came within weeks.'

http://www.news.com.au/national/cla...t/news-story/cdad7c5a6b825958b6d46cb11eb44c75

 

[justified]

Hi Guccigal :seeya:

Just wanting to get clear here.

So your 'source' is saying they had BRE's DNA before his arrest?

This is contradictory to what has been published in MSM which says only familial DNA was collected pre-arrest and it was after his arrest that BRE's DNA was tested.....

(But obviously, MSM may not be revealing everything to us.)

I believe there was quite a discussion about whether or not DNA had been taken covertly and in this manner prior to his arrest. If they were aware of a movement pattern, set up an RBT and test everyone going through (including BRE) then get the confirmation they needed (for themselves), carry out the stunning TRG arrest and formally test his DNA.

 

[MsAnais]

I believe there was quite a discussion about whether or not DNA had been taken covertly and in this manner prior to his arrest. If they were aware of a movement pattern, set up an RBT and test everyone going through (including BRE) then get the confirmation they needed (for themselves), carry out the stunning TRG arrest and formally test his DNA.

Thanks Justified. I realised after I posted that that would be the most likely scenario.

I'm afraid I'm super skeptical of people saying they 'know' something about this case on the thread as so many posters have been on here just making stuff up :facepalm:

But this may indeed make sense.

Amazing operation they undertook if that's how they got it!

 

[justified]

Thanks Justified. I realised after I posted that that would be the most likely scenario.

I'm afraid I'm super skeptical of people saying they 'know' something about this case on the thread as so many posters have been on here just making stuff up :facepalm:

But this may indeed make sense.

Amazing operation they undertook if that's how they got it!

Agree with the skepticism at times. Indeed stunning. Goodness knows what has really gone on when you compare it to the Daniel Morcombe police operation. Patience is a virtue....

 

[petedavo.au]

I believe there was quite a discussion about whether or not DNA had been taken covertly and in this manner prior to his arrest. If they were aware of a movement pattern, set up an RBT and test everyone going through (including BRE) then get the confirmation they needed (for themselves), carry out the stunning TRG arrest and formally test his DNA.

Could've just been that WAPOL decided to test all old drug sample tests for DNA matching to old unsolved crimes. The booze bus has a license plate recognition camera, reported in the West Australian https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/peak-hour-booze-bus-brings-freeway-to-a-standstill-ng-ya-158997 So it'd be easy to pinpoint the registered owner belonging to the test strip if there was a match.

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[nomadicchop]

Been a long time lurker first time poster, straight up I want to say thanks to you all for such a great topic. Having grown up in Perth the CSK was something close to us all, it was emotional hearing BE was arrested just before Christmas because it felt like something that has been with me (all of us) since childhood was about to end. That got me onto this site and I've been reading through the posts, bloody outstanding work!


This weekend I took a ride up to Pipidinny road to see what kind of area the body was left in.
I've attached some photos if anyones interested.. some context The photo with the motorbike handle/mirror just in view is the same location/hill where the image of the police cars/trailer are. The dirt track photos is the same dirt track you can see from the helicopter photo looking down on the police.
Something I noticed (which may or may not be correct) is the photo looking from the track into the bush has a Y shaped - black bush on the left of centre area. In the helicopter photo looking down on police again (with the white suits) you can see a similar Y shaped Black bush. Same one? I dont know, probably not.. but something i saw.


Now, In the police photo of the cars on the hill, the road clearly looks sealed and in good/new shape.
Things that became apparent to me on the journey
1. Its quite a trek from perth cbd north to this location even with the freeway/marmion avenue. I dont think this was a planned location. I believe he drove and drove until he thought he'd drive enough then took the next turn.


2. He wouldn't have been able to pull his car off the road and hide it during the dumping. Its to dry and loose for a non 4-wheel drive car. So he had to park it on the side of the road. A big risk considering you are dumping a body. Anyone seeing a car out there at that time of night parked on the side of the road would remember it, especially if a body was located there some time later.


3. The area has a number of walking trails around. He obviously didn't see the trails at night or else he'd of chosen a different location. Thus, he didn't scope the area prior and this wasn't a planned drop point. He didn't drag the body very far from the car, it seems as if it was rushed!


Truly sad what happened to this beautiful lady, I hope its him and I hope he fries in hell. I am looking forward to the court case, Perth will finally get answers.


I've heard a number of rumors from previous police, but having just read site rules I realize I am not allowed to post them. That sucks as I'd like to have known if anyone else heard similar.

Edit to add, personally I believe there were 2 people involved. But BE did the killing, perhaps the other person watched. I think they either built a fake Taxi Cab and the 2nd person identified himself as a passenger going to the same location and offered to split the fare, or he hid in the boot and revealed himself with a weapon during the trip. The locations the girls were taken from was too populated, too many camera's, too many cars.. blitz attacking a girl is difficult to hide in those area's.

A long time ago I was working on an island work site in QLD, a girl was walking down the road. We saw a man approach her and grab her around the neck from behind.. at first we thought they were friends and mucking around, until she started screaming for help..

Blitz attacks unless done perfectly always allow the victim to scream! Plus being late at night on alert of their surroundings they'd scare easy

Keep up the good work, Lets hope many other mysteries are finally solved thanks to the police catching this b@stard

 

[RETPI]

Hi everyone, interesting thread here in my absence! So I was speaking to someone in the legal profession this weekend and I heard that they got BE's DNA from a set up roadside drug test, where you swipe the piece of plastic over your tongue. Hope I can say this?

If the "someone" you spoke to, is “in the legal profession”, they should educate themselves or already be aware, of how WAPOL is authorised to obtain DNA and that a procedure, such as you describe, is against the evidence act.

 

[Guccigal]

Hi Guccigal :seeya:

Just wanting to get clear here.

So your 'source' is saying they had BRE's DNA before his arrest?

This is contradictory to what has been published in MSM which says only familial DNA was collected pre-arrest and it was after his arrest that BRE's DNA was tested.....

(But obviously, MSM may not be revealing everything to us.)

If the "someone" you spoke to, is “in the legal profession”, they should educate themselves or already be aware, of how WAPOL is authorised to obtain DNA and that a procedure, such as you describe, is against the evidence act.

Only going by what I was told. I never said this was in the Prosecution's brief of evidence,it was how they matched him initially. So let me be very clear about this, you are saying that they had familial DNA (as discussed previously) and then got the TRG to storm in to BE home then get the DNA after when they had probabale cause??

 

[RETPI]

Only going by what I was told. I never said this was in the Prosecution's brief of evidence,it was how they matched him initially. So let me be very clear about this, you are saying that they had familial DNA (as discussed previously) and then got the TRG to storm in to BE home then get the DNA after when they had probabale cause??

I am not saying, that WAPOL used familial DNA as an investigative tool, although I am aware that one of the UK experts they are using, is well versed in its use.

However, some media reports have alluded to that technique being used. They may or may not be correct.

These reports have led people to speculate as to which relative had a docket and was on the DNA database.

It appears that the Huntingdale attempted rape, provided them with further investigative lines of inquiry that were already on file.

WAPOL would have looked closely at BRE to determine if he had motive, the opportunity and the means to carry out the alleged crimes.

You will recall, WAPOL had allegedly already identified, that fabric from a White VS Series 1 Holden Commodore Station Wagon was linked to one of the crimes scenes (JR).

A White VS Station Wagon, allegedly driven by BRE in the 90’s was seized by WAPOL on the same day, so obviously, they had done their homework and believed they had sufficient grounds to act.

WAPOL are not permitted to run around surreptitiously obtaining people’s DNA, they must adhere to strict guidelines.

So I am saying, they didn’t obtain his DNA illegally, as some have suggested.

The use of the TRG is standard procedure, when executing a warrant that may involve a potentially violent and/or armed offender.

 

[MsAnais]

Been a long time lurker first time poster, straight up I want to say thanks to you all for such a great topic. Having grown up in Perth the CSK was something close to us all, it was emotional hearing BE was arrested just before Christmas because it felt like something that has been with me (all of us) since childhood was about to end. That got me onto this site and I've been reading through the posts, bloody outstanding work!


This weekend I took a ride up to Pipidinny road to see what kind of area the body was left in.
I've attached some photos if anyones interested.. some context The photo with the motorbike handle/mirror just in view is the same location/hill where the image of the police cars/trailer are. The dirt track photos is the same dirt track you can see from the helicopter photo looking down on the police.
Something I noticed (which may or may not be correct) is the photo looking from the track into the bush has a Y shaped - black bush on the left of centre area. In the helicopter photo looking down on police again (with the white suits) you can see a similar Y shaped Black bush. Same one? I dont know, probably not.. but something i saw.


Now, In the police photo of the cars on the hill, the road clearly looks sealed and in good/new shape.
Things that became apparent to me on the journey
1. Its quite a trek from perth cbd north to this location even with the freeway/marmion avenue. I dont think this was a planned location. I believe he drove and drove until he thought he'd drive enough then took the next turn.


2. He wouldn't have been able to pull his car off the road and hide it during the dumping. Its to dry and loose for a non 4-wheel drive car. So he had to park it on the side of the road. A big risk considering you are dumping a body. Anyone seeing a car out there at that time of night parked on the side of the road would remember it, especially if a body was located there some time later.


3. The area has a number of walking trails around. He obviously didn't see the trails at night or else he'd of chosen a different location. Thus, he didn't scope the area prior and this wasn't a planned drop point. He didn't drag the body very far from the car, it seems as if it was rushed!


Truly sad what happened to this beautiful lady, I hope its him and I hope he fries in hell. I am looking forward to the court case, Perth will finally get answers.


I've heard a number of rumors from previous police, but having just read site rules I realize I am not allowed to post them. That sucks as I'd like to have known if anyone else heard similar.

Edit to add, personally I believe there were 2 people involved. But BE did the killing, perhaps the other person watched. I think they either built a fake Taxi Cab and the 2nd person identified himself as a passenger going to the same location and offered to split the fare, or he hid in the boot and revealed himself with a weapon during the trip. The locations the girls were taken from was too populated, too many camera's, too many cars.. blitz attacking a girl is difficult to hide in those area's.

A long time ago I was working on an island work site in QLD, a girl was walking down the road. We saw a man approach her and grab her around the neck from behind.. at first we thought they were friends and mucking around, until she started screaming for help..

Blitz attacks unless done perfectly always allow the victim to scream! Plus being late at night on alert of their surroundings they'd scare easy

Keep up the good work, Lets hope many other mysteries are finally solved thanks to the police catching this b@stard

RSBM

Thank you for your post, Nomadicchop.

The info and pics are really interesting.

 

[Guccigal]

Hi Guccigal :seeya:

Just wanting to get clear here.

So your 'source' is saying they had BRE's DNA before his arrest?

This is contradictory to what has been published in MSM which says only familial DNA was collected pre-arrest and it was after his arrest that BRE's DNA was tested.....

(But obviously, MSM may not be revealing everything to us.)

I am not saying, that WAPOL used familial DNA as an investigative tool, although I am aware that one of the UK experts they are using, is well versed in its use.

However, some media reports have alluded to that technique being used. They may or may not be correct.

These reports have led people to speculate as to which relative had a docket and was on the DNA database.

It appears that the Huntingdale attempted rape, provided them with further investigative lines of inquiry that were already on file.

WAPOL would have looked closely at BRE to determine if he had motive, the opportunity and the means to carry out the alleged crimes.

You will recall, WAPOL had allegedly already identified, that fabric from a White VS Series 1 Holden Commodore Station Wagon was linked to one of the crimes scenes (JR).

A White VS Station Wagon, allegedly driven by BRE in the 90’s was seized by WAPOL on the same day, so obviously, they had done their homework and believed they had sufficient grounds to act.

WAPOL are not permitted to run around surreptitiously obtaining people’s DNA, they must adhere to strict guidelines.

So I am saying, they didn’t obtain his DNA illegally, as some have suggested.

The use of the TRG is standard procedure, when executing a warrant that may involve a potentially violent and/or armed offender.

But what you are saying then is that the Police never take covert DNA samples? We will have to agree to disagree on this one because of course they do!

 

[RETPI]

But what you are saying then is that the Police never take covert DNA samples? We will have to agree to disagree on this one because of course they do!

Could you direct me to court cases where it was shown that WAPOL has obtained evidentiary DNA from an alleged offender by covert means?

 

[SN76]

The use of the TRG is standard procedure, when executing a warrant that may involve a potentially violent and/or armed offender.

Thanks RETPI..

 

[Guccigal]

Hi Guccigal :seeya:

Just wanting to get clear here.

So your 'source' is saying they had BRE's DNA before his arrest?

This is contradictory to what has been published in MSM which says only familial DNA was collected pre-arrest and it was after his arrest that BRE's DNA was tested.....

(But obviously, MSM may not be revealing everything to us.)

I am not saying, that WAPOL used familial DNA as an investigative tool, although I am aware that one of the UK experts they are using, is well versed in its use.

However, some media reports have alluded to that technique being used. They may or may not be correct.

These reports have led people to speculate as to which relative had a docket and was on the DNA database.

It appears that the Huntingdale attempted rape, provided them with further investigative lines of inquiry that were already on file.

WAPOL would have looked closely at BRE to determine if he had motive, the opportunity and the means to carry out the alleged crimes.

You will recall, WAPOL had allegedly already identified, that fabric from a White VS Series 1 Holden Commodore Station Wagon was linked to one of the crimes scenes (JR).

A White VS Station Wagon, allegedly driven by BRE in the 90’s was seized by WAPOL on the same day, so obviously, they had done their homework and believed they had sufficient grounds to act.

WAPOL are not permitted to run around surreptitiously obtaining people’s DNA, they must adhere to strict guidelines.

So I am saying, they didn’t obtain his DNA illegally, as some have suggested.

The use of the TRG is standard procedure, when executing a warrant that may involve a potentially violent and/or armed offender.

Could you direct me to court cases where it was shown that WAPOL has obtained evidentiary DNA from an alleged offender by covert means?

Hi RETPI

I never said WAPOL if you refer back, I did say police. I draw your attention to where informal collection of genetic samples have been used in other states. In R v Nicola (NSW) police collected a styrofoam cup from a suspect. In R v Phuc (VIC) police collected cigarettes from a bin. I can probably chase up some WA cases for you from the law library in the next few weeks.

 

[Kambo]

Could you direct me to court cases where it was shown that WAPOL has obtained evidentiary DNA from an alleged offender by covert means?

I suspect that they might on occasion do it, but the evidence is not admissible in court and therefore can't even be used to obtain a search or arrest warrant. If they were found to be doing it Covertly I am of the understanding that any evidence obtained as a result of the unlawful DNA test (which could lead them to a lot of other clues) would also not be able to be presented to a jury at trial. So they must have a lot more to have obtained the initial search warrant.

Makes me think that there was possible a long term link between BRE and huntingdale offence. May have been easier to get a warrant for search relating to that relatively minor crime - then surprise surprise they get a DNA sample and it matches CSK. Knowing full well that it was going too. All speculation/my opinion of course.




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