Australia Australia - Corryn Rayney, 44, Como, WA, 7 August 2007

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Nads said:
Might still work on juries, but yeah judges would tire of certain things I reckon too.
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Hi Nads, it was fairly busy, people coming and going, still some seats to spare though.

Yes, I think the judge thought the defence was over-stating their points. At one point they were questioning a forensics cop who was in charge of photographing evidence at the Rayney House. They went on and on about what types of material in the driveway, walls etc that he photographed. In fact, the word "overkill" was used by the judge.
 
Flossy_ said:
Hi Nads, it was fairly busy, people coming and going, still some seats to spare though.

Yes, I think the judge thought the defence was over-stating their points. At one point they were questioning a forensics cop who was in charge of photographing evidence at the Rayney House. They went on and on about what types of material in the driveway, walls etc that he photographed. In fact, the word "overkill" was used by the judge.
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Know exactly what you mean Flossy!!
I was there last week when they were examining the bollard photographs. IMG.... it was like WATCHING PAINT DRY.....
It sure isn't like watching Television, is it?
:banghead:
 
Nothing like on TV (not that I watch much courtroom dramas).
Sometimes you find yourself just drifting in and out.. Then something interesting will happen - and your back!

I wonder how the judge keeps focus?
 
mouse detective said:
I think it's fair to say that LR lied to the police about which car he drove in to that dinner.

This is a question for everyone - do you think that LR will take the witness stand and provide a testimony?

Personally I don't believe he will. JMO
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I don't think he will take the stand, but I would looooove to see it if he did! :)

I have wondered how actively involved he has been in formulating the defense strategy.
 
One thing I forgot from today, I noticed that Corryn's nametag (apparently "possibly similar" to that of Lloyd's found at the scene), was found in the centre console of her car? Has there been any reporting on this that I've missed?
 
What are your thoughts regarding the missing teeth on the zipper of Corryn's jeans?

I read in one MSM report that the police had used a metal detector to search for the teeth at the Como property. In some ways that doesn't really fit in with the Prosecution's assumption that the zipper was undone to allow her legs to be folded into the grave.

Surely, you wouldn't consider undoing the zipper to fit her into the grave until you'd tried to fit the body in and realised that the legs wouldn't bend properly with the zipper done up. This would mean that the missing teeth would most likely be in the soil in the grave or somewhere around the edge of the grave. If this was the case, then why weren't they found?

I wonder whether the zip may have been undone to allow her legs to be bent to fit her into the back of the car. This could mean that the missing teeth were in the driveway of the family home. I don't think that the police conducted their detailed analysis of the family home for some time after the murder. The missing teeth could have easily been removed prior to their search with the metal detector.
 
Solaris said:
I don't think he will take the stand, but I would looooove to see it if he did! :)

I have wondered how actively involved he has been in formulating the defense strategy.
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I suggest he would be likely to be extremely active in this arena, afterall that is/was his JOB.
Initially alot of his legal support were of quite a young age. And to some degree, they still are. IMO he would pretty much be running the show from the coaches box.
 
I still can't get my head around the place card. Okay, lets say that the place card found in Kings Park, found it's way there via LR. If so, why on earth would he take it home in the first place?????? I wonder why the police think he took the card from the restaurant?

If he wanted to take the card home, he had to have kept track of what Elizabeth Needham did with the card after the game of Celebrity Head and then retrieve the card from the table and either put it one of his pockets or carry it in his hand out to the car (which it seems was his car and not Corryn's).

It just doesn't make much sense to me that LR would bother to go to the trouble of retrieving his own card. The guy and his wife went to Bali in Gina Rinehart's private jet for goodness sake. It's hard to imagine him getting excited about a place card from one of probably numerous Chambers events he had attended.

Unless he has a sense of humour and thought it might be funny to show the girls the card with his name on one side and the Queen's on the other. But he didn't pretend to be the Queen, Elizabeth Needham did. Wouldn't it have made more sense to keep the card with the name of the character that he had pretended to be?

It's doing my head in! :)
 
Zoro said:
I suggest he would be likely to be extremely active in this arena, afterall that is/was his JOB.
Initially alot of his legal support were of quite a young age. And to some degree, they still are. IMO he would pretty much be running the show from the coaches box.
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Totally agree. Maybe that is why he is appearing to be so smug. If he wins this case, in addition to getting away with murder (if he is in fact guilty) it will also prove what a great lawyer he is. :rolleyes:
 
Solaris said:
I still can't get my head around the place card. Okay, lets say that the place card found in Kings Park, found it's way there via LR. If so, why on earth would he take it home in the first place?????? I wonder why the police think he took the card from the restaurant?

If he wanted to take the card home, he had to have kept track of what Elizabeth Needham did with the card after the game of Celebrity Head and then retrieve the card from the table and either put it one of his pockets or carry it in his hand out to the car (which it seems was his car and not Corryn's).

It just doesn't make much sense to me that LR would bother to go to the trouble of retrieving his own card. The guy and his wife went to Bali in Gina Rinehart's private jet for goodness sake. It's hard to imagine him getting excited about a place card from one of probably numerous Chambers events he had attended.

Unless he has a sense of humour and thought it might be funny to show the girls the card with his name on one side and the Queen's on the other. But he didn't pretend to be the Queen, Elizabeth Needham did. Wouldn't it have made more sense to keep the card with the name of the character that he had pretended to be?

It's doing my head in! :)
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I get your point Solaris.........who in the hell would want to purposely take their name tag (without sentimental value and the like). But then again, they found one of Corryn's place cards in her boot.... Maybe that's what they do?
People have all kinds of peculiar habits or traditions. BUT I certainly get what you mean along with your curiosity.
I for one would NEVER bother with such trivia without reason.
(AND having just written that.... maybe there was a REASON????)
Gawwwwwwwwwd the thot plickins!!! :banghead:
 
Solaris said:
I still can't get my head around the place card. Okay, lets say that the place card found in Kings Park, found it's way there via LR. If so, why on earth would he take it home in the first place?????? I wonder why the police think he took the card from the restaurant?

If he wanted to take the card home, he had to have kept track of what Elizabeth Needham did with the card after the game of Celebrity Head and then retrieve the card from the table and either put it one of his pockets or carry it in his hand out to the car (which it seems was his car and not Corryn's).

It just doesn't make much sense to me that LR would bother to go to the trouble of retrieving his own card. The guy and his wife went to Bali in Gina Rinehart's private jet for goodness sake. It's hard to imagine him gettinG
excited about a place card from one of probably numerous Chambers events he had attended.

Unless he has a sense of humour and thought it might be funny to show the girls the card with his name on one side and the Queen's on the other. But he didn't pretend to be the Queen, Elizabeth Needham did. Wouldn't it have
made more sense to keep the card with the name of the character that he had pretended to be?

It's doing my head in! :)
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Remember LR told his PA that he had taken the name card from the restaurant. His PA gave evidence confirming this. Whether he did or not is still unsure but for some reason he made a point of telling her that he did take it. Which surprises me as the 'framed' story would be easier if he hadn't taken it. Unless of course he had corryn's car at the restaurant and therefore the card would have been in her car the night of the murder. Make sense?
 
Dodo said:
Remember LR told his PA that he had taken the name card from the restaurant. His PA gave evidence confirming this. Whether he did or not is still unsure but for some reason he made a point of telling her that he did take it. Which surprises me as the 'framed' story would be easier if he hadn't taken it. Unless of course he had corryn's car at the restaurant and therefore the card would have been in her car the night of the murder. Make sense?
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Hi Dodo

Yes, I know what he told the PA, but I think (and please correct me if I'm wrong) that he only told her that to try to explain how the card could have ended up in Kings Park. He also said that he was driving Corryn's car on the night of the Chamber's dinner.

So yes, that story makes sense. He drove Corryn's car to the dinner, placed the card in the console (for as yet unexplained reasons) and then when some nefarious stranger kidnapped and murdered his wife, the card was somehow deposited in Kings Park on the night she was buried there to implicate him in the murder. We know her car was there because of the trail of transmission fluid and the evidence of the car hitting the bollard. All wrapped up with a neat bow.

An excerpt from the following MSM article.

http://www.smh.com.au/wa-news/evidence-was-planted-rayney-to-pa-20120726-22uwo.html

After Mrs Rayney's murder, Ms Paradise said Mr Rayney asserted he had been framed, stating a dinner place card bearing his name "had been planted" in Kings Park, near his wife's gravesite.

She said Mr Rayney had told her after a legal dinner on July 28, 2007, he had put the place card in the console of a car. However, Ms Paradise could not recall which car he said he'd put the car in – his or his wife's.

I agree with you Dodo that the "framed" story would be easier to float if he had not admitted to taking the card (as anyone could have taken it off the table) and did not try to convince people that he had taken Corryn's car to the dinner (when it seems that he did not).

If it is true that he placed the card in the console of his car (and not Corryn's), it is harder to explain how the nefarious stranger who actually killed Corryn got the card out of his car to conveniently drop in Kings Park.

Possible Scenario

I wonder if the place card was dropped by LR in Kings Park on the night of the Chambers Dinner (28 July 2012)?

The dinner finished between 11-11.30pm at the Bluewater Grill in Applecross. The Rayney house in Monash Ave, Como is only about 10 minutes from there. LR offered Paul Bevilacqua and his partner Katasha Gorsdan a lift to Perth city. The distance to the city is further than the distance to the Rayney house. If he drove them to the city via Canning Highway he would have had to drive directly past his house on the way to the city. If he went down Kwinana Freeway or along Labouchere Rd, then the Freeway he would still have had to travel a lot further than his own house to give them a lift. He was really putting himself out to give them a lift to the city.

It would've taken about 15-20 minutes to get to the city, depending on where he dropped them off. This would have given him a good opportunity to swing by Kings Park (which is right next to the city) late at night (between 11.15pm and midnight) to check out possible burial sites. He could have inadvertently dropped the card or it was knocked out of the car when he was doing his reconnaissance.

Just a possibility and very speculative on my part.
 
Hi everyone,

I have been following this case on and off since it started. One thing that I still don't really understand is what LR's defence actually is. Is he simply pleading guilty and suggesting some crazy attacker did it and he was framed, or does he have an alibi at the time?
 
Also could one possibility be the Claremont Serial Killer? Or is that stretching things too far. Seems to be in similar fashion to those in the mid 1990s.
 
mouse detective said:
That's me done for the day - haven't managed to get anything done for days!! I feel like I am addicted to this case. I can imagine there are many others just like me gripped to this case and when GBC trial starts I am sure it will have a similar impact.

I find this case particularly intriguing because all the players are involved in the justice system. The integrity of the Wa legal system is being tested to it's limits. I am sure it has polarised the legal fraternity. Does anyone know if there has ever been a case like it?
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BBM
Not that I am aware of in Australia mouse

JMO MOO
 
Zoro said:
I suggest he would be likely to be extremely active in this arena, afterall that is/was his JOB.
Initially alot of his legal support were of quite a young age. And to some degree, they still are. IMO he would pretty much be running the show from the coaches box.
Click to expand...

Agree totally Zoro, he used to be the Crown Prosecutor for WA I think?

Wouldn't be many fancy legal footsteps with which he is not toally familiar. GRRR

:maddening:

JMO MOO
 
Solaris said:
Hi Dodo


respectuflly snipped

.
Click to expand...

Possible Scenario from Solaris

I wonder if the place card was dropped by LR in Kings Park on the night of the Chambers Dinner (28 July 2012)?

The dinner finished between 11-11.30pm at the Bluewater Grill in Applecross. The Rayney house in Monash Ave, Como is only about 10 minutes from there. LR offered Paul Bevilacqua and his partner Katasha Gorsdan a lift to Perth city. The distance to the city is further than the distance to the Rayney house. If he drove them to the city via Canning Highway he would have had to drive directly past his house on the way to the city. If he went down Kwinana Freeway or along Labouchere Rd, then the Freeway he would still have had to travel a lot further than his own house to give them a lift. He was really putting himself out to give them a lift to the city.

It would've taken about 15-20 minutes to get to the city, depending on where he dropped them off. This would have given him a good opportunity to swing by Kings Park (which is right next to the city) late at night (between 11.15pm and midnight) to check out possible burial sites. He could have inadvertently dropped the card or it was knocked out of the car when he was doing his reconnaissance.Just a possibility and very speculative on my part.

Love your work Solaris, makes a lot of sense to me.

:twocents:

JMO MOO
 
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