GUILTY Australia - Jill Meagher, 29, Melbourne, 22 Sep 2012 #3

[GutFeeling!]

Why do people think it will be a legal aid lawyer representing the alleged perp? My guess is that with a high profile case like this, lawyers would be clammering to get their names in lights. I could be wrong of course!

Also, do people agree with my theory that everything took place in the alleged perp's car? I'm just going with my gut here and reports that even seasoned journalists were physically ill when they were briefed off the record by Vic police on the crime. If it was that awful, I'm guessing he couldn't do that on the street when there was a possibility of people walking by. He would need to be hidden from view. Also, there have been no reports of an obvious crime scene. The car seems the obvious place. If so, it would be literally littered with DNA evidence.

Having said all this, I'm wondering what happened to make this escalate into murder. I can't believe I'm saying this but my understanding is that one of the reason many rapes are not reported is that women don't believe that they will be believed and/or they themselves are treated like the criminal. Knowing this, wouldn't a perp just assume he'd get away with the rape & leave it there? I know the alleged perp is a sexual predator and has been caught for rape before - but I am assuming there were many more rapes he committed where he wasn't caught? What snapped in him to progress this to murder?

I do believe everything took place in the car.

What the reporters heard may not involve a crime scene as such.

Serial "anythings" often start out with less awful crimes and build up to a horrendous act. Serial killers often have a history of harming cats or dogs early in their lives. we may never know why this time, we may, at a later date find that others that he raped did feel like they were going to die though.
His DNA would be recorded from previous crimes wouldn't it? (sorry not trying to be smart but I am an aussie living in America and have covered courts in both countries and the laws mesh at times lol)
The smallest and oddest thing can make a person snap. I remember a mother over here that killed her kids for talking back. The woman had a history of mental illness and she snapped at a bit of lip from teenagers.

 

[fruity]

Help me out here. Is the pizza shop north or south of where Jill was seen talking to BH on the CCTV?

I don't know Melbourne at all, but from what I've read and piecing bits together, it's about 130 metres north. I've read that Duchess Bridal is 30 metres south of the Hope St intersection and that the pizza place is 100m north of it. Looking at google maps, it might be less than 130 metres.

If I'm wrong, can a local please correct me?

 

[Curiousasacat]

When I did my post degree legal training, I did a morning with the magistrate's duty lawyer ( in Brisbane) and they dealt with all the legal aid matters on that session. We just saw each person for 5 to 10 minutes prior to representing them in court.
So to answer your question, I guess it would be whoever was on duty would have been assigned as the legal aid lawyer for the morning's court appearance. It would be rare for a legal aid lawyer to refuse to act unless they knew anyone involved. Legal aid is means tested.

Excellent. Thanks Ali. I was hoping you'd answer but didn't want to ask :blushing:
So that is interesting. I can just see the aid sitting there squirming. Not me,not me lease:

Thanks again Alioop for all of your posts,very informative :rocker:

 

[GutFeeling!]

http://m.heraldsun.com.au/news/vict...s-body-was-found/story-e6frf7kx-1226483793882

This article says the pizza shop camera was filming along Sydney Rd. So the footage must be of Jill on Sydney Rd, not behind the shop. For some reason she had walked past her turn. If she was walking at this point.

MOO

Maybe she was trying to put him off by not taking her usual route? Staying on Sydney Road would be better lit than Hope Street.

 

[aust amateur slueth]

I think the pizza shop was south of hope st (Jill was heading south). The owner was really surprised to see jill on the footage as she wasn't supposed to have gone up that far. I read that, see if I can find a link.

http://m.theaustralian.com.au/news/...ill-meagher-case/story-e6frg6n6-1226482923777


"The other camera was shooting along Sydney Rd from a pizza shop farther south along the strip."
http://mobile.news.com.au/national/...s-body-was-found/story-fncynjr2-1226483793882

This is My opinion only



I think Jill knew something was up by then and stayed on Sydney Rd because she thought it would be safer, plus the Brunswick Police Station is at 630 Sydney rd, she could have been trying to get there.

 

[TheStupidTree]

Yes I think from the pizza shop it's between 50-100 meters across the rd to the police station.

 

[Onlyone]

I still don't get why she didn't call her husband. I can only think that she didn't think she was in any danger.

Also suspect there is more CCTV stuff that is more incriminating that we have not seen! But I suspect the clincher in this case will be the DNA evidence. Finding the handbag & the body so quickly will be of enormous help in this regard.

But it does get me thinking of all the people who go missing everyday and never get found. And their families and loved ones. Like that boy Daniel Morcombe. And countless others. While Jill Meagher captured our hearts, the people who have never been found should capture our minds.

I've been wondering the same.... Maybe with the time difference it wasn't so late there & she thought he might still be up. Which means at that point she was worried & wanted the comfort of a voice, not in fear to call her husband who was close but asleep or even the police. Like Daniel when our subconscious is uneasy we should not care about a fuss. If someone threatens you with a weapon to get into a car or up a lane, away from people - it's not going to get any better. We need to teach ourselves & our children to make a huge fuss when there is a chance of help or being too much trouble for the abductor. God bless Jill's family with strength and love to live without her and may she rest in peace now this poor excuse for a man will never satisfy his disgusting needs again.
May justice now prevail.

 

[knowledgethirsty]

there is also Godfathers pizza shop which is on the corner of victoria and sydney road number 347. Down near Bar etiquette.

 

[Curiousasacat]

From stupidtree's MMS link.

A worker at a Sydney Rd shop, which provided the police with key CCTV footage, said everyone including the staff was scared, "so everyone would be relieved that police had (arrested) someone".

"All the owners around here were very scared, but last night there were still girls walking around here," said the worker, who did not want to be identified.

"It's a great relief and everyone will feel safe."

She said she checked the footage on Sunday morning.

"I wasn't even supposed to be around here, but I thought I would check, randomly," she said.

The worker was unnerved to know she was watching the last moments before Ms Meagher disappeared.

"I watched it and it was sickening to have seen that. If I had not checked my video I might never have realised," she said.

Martin McMenamin, 28, works around the corner from where Ms Meagher was last seen and commended the police for an arrest.

"It will make everyone feel safer now that they have (arrested) someone. It will make the community feel at ease," he said

http://m.theaustralian.com.au/news/...ill-meagher-case/story-e6frg6n6-1226482923777


BBM-Are there clues there?

 

[TheStupidTree]

I think it's celine pizzeria. Almost opposite is police station just near IGA. I'm on a phone so I can't load a map. It's bloody frustrating this whole thing. Poor Tom

 

[TheStupidTree]

Maybe she was trying to put him off by not taking her usual route? Staying on Sydney Road would be better lit than Hope Street.

And possibly didn't want him following her home. Knowing where she lived.

 

[oz_sleuth]

I think it's celine pizzeria. Almost opposite is police station just near IGA. I'm on a phone so I can't load a map. It's bloody frustrating this whole thing. Poor Tom

wow

i just reviewed the map , and if she walked past Hope st she would have been so damn close to that police statin

we are talking 50 within 50 metres or so. So sad, I wonder if she was trying to get to it.

Makes me even sicker to know that the attack would have happened within 150 meters or so of the police station too


the more facts that emerge the angrier i get, and its only going to get more grizzly unfortunately

 

[GutFeeling!]

From stupidtree's MMS link.

A worker at a Sydney Rd shop, which provided the police with key CCTV footage, said everyone including the staff was scared, "so everyone would be relieved that police had (arrested) someone".

"All the owners around here were very scared, but last night there were still girls walking around here," said the worker, who did not want to be identified.

"It's a great relief and everyone will feel safe."

She said she checked the footage on Sunday morning.

"I wasn't even supposed to be around here, but I thought I would check, randomly," she said.

The worker was unnerved to know she was watching the last moments before Ms Meagher disappeared.

"I watched it and it was sickening to have seen that. If I had not checked my video I might never have realised," she said.

Martin McMenamin, 28, works around the corner from where Ms Meagher was last seen and commended the police for an arrest.

"It will make everyone feel safer now that they have (arrested) someone. It will make the community feel at ease," he said

http://m.theaustralian.com.au/news/...ill-meagher-case/story-e6frg6n6-1226482923777


BBM-Are there clues there?

Very poorly written I'm afraid, there is a double meaning in everything you have highlighted from that story.
"The worker was unnerved to know she was watching the last moments before Ms Meagher disappeared."
Does this mean she witnessed something horrendous, or was she "unnerved" by realizing it may have been the last minutes Jill was alive. The Bridal shop CCTV footage was unnerving to me and Jill was standing and talking.

"I watched it and it was sickening to have seen that. If I had not checked my video I might never have realised," she said.

Was it sickening to see Jill's last minutes alive or, once again was something horrid happening on the video?

Martin McMenamin, 28, works around the corner from where Ms Meagher was last seen and commended the police for an arrest.

Which Corner? Hope Street (north of the bridal shop) The corner south of the bridal shop? the corner near the pizza place?

The "key" part of the video may well have been something horrendous or a full clear picture of his face.

there are a lot of gaps there.

 

[fruity]

From stupidtree's MMS link.

A worker at a Sydney Rd shop, which provided the police with key CCTV footage, said everyone including the staff was scared, "so everyone would be relieved that police had (arrested) someone".

"All the owners around here were very scared, but last night there were still girls walking around here," said the worker, who did not want to be identified.

"It's a great relief and everyone will feel safe."

She said she checked the footage on Sunday morning.

"I wasn't even supposed to be around here, but I thought I would check, randomly," she said.

The worker was unnerved to know she was watching the last moments before Ms Meagher disappeared.

"I watched it and it was sickening to have seen that. If I had not checked my video I might never have realised," she said.

Martin McMenamin, 28, works around the corner from where Ms Meagher was last seen and commended the police for an arrest.

"It will make everyone feel safer now that they have (arrested) someone. It will make the community feel at ease," he said

http://m.theaustralian.com.au/news/...ill-meagher-case/story-e6frg6n6-1226482923777


BBM-Are there clues there?

I undid your bolding and added my own.

I think the two people are separate. The first person doesn't want to be identified, but the pronoun 'she' is used. The second person readily gave his identity as Martin and is referred to as 'he'.

 

[jgv]

Maybe she was trying to get to it but he struck and she couldn't get away or maybe there was a weapon? She might have thought he was menacing but underestimated the situation.

It's hard because you think why didn't she create a fuss but it went bad quickly I am guessing and who expects that to happen? You just can't know until you are in that fearful moment I guess.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Meagher death prompts Melbourne CCTV audit

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-09-...v-review-in-wake-of-meagher-abduction/4287336

 

[catswhiskers]

"I wasn't even supposed to be around here, but I thought I would check, randomly," she said.

I swear when this was first published it said
"She wasn't even supposed to be around here..."
Then it made sense - the female pizza employee checked the footage, not expecting to see anything as Jill hadn't been reported as being in that area.

sayitaintso posted this back here

She said she checked the footage on Sunday morning on a whim.

''She wasn't even supposed to be around here, but I thought I would check randomly,'' she said."
"
Anyone know where the pizza shop is?

 

[Alessi]

There seems to be a long history. Is there any chance it could place him in Perth at the time of the series of unsolved murders in mid 1990s? There are some remarkable similarities.

I had the same thoughts. Very similar and the Claremont murders were never solved.

Apparently a suspect was caught on CCTV in the Claremont murders but the police didn't release it to the public.

I am very glad that the Victorian police were different in the current case.

 

[catswhiskers]

It's a bit like the chinese whispers game - a word or two changed with every different report published and the tone of the content can be changed a lot. Some reporters misquote and get facts like dates and numbers wrong all the time. When AB was first arrested one tv reporter said he was 31 years old.

 

[TheStupidTree]

I need to correct myself and apologies. Jill was heading north. I have no idea why I thought it was south. I am, however, going to blame apples iO6 maps and say that's why. Goggle earth cleared it up for me.