Australia Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, Jun 1997 #2

[Itsapuzzle]

Has anyone been able to find a photo of FR from his soccer days , just curious, would be interested to see how he looked back then. I haven’t been able to locate one thus far ..... can find all his team mates, but not him or a team photo..

 

[Itsapuzzle]

Forgive my greed for information today, but any sleuths out there with access to ancestry.com, etc .... so are there any Remekel's listed? The ones from the islands near the Phillipines, are there any records of their parents, or further back parents/parents? I get so darn curious .... that spelling "error" of Remekel has piqued my interest, but there may be something to it .... dark skinned, tall, sounds more like a match to man in the car than Fernand - perhaps someone from the military over here .... just my Thursday evening thoughts ..... thinking the man in the car is the key to solving this mystery ..... there is the Luxembourg housewife clue, but anyway .....

 

[Sophie-Renee]

Forgive my greed for information today, but any sleuths out there with access to ancestry.com, etc .... so are there any Remekel's listed? The ones from the islands near the Phillipines, are there any records of their parents, or further back parents/parents? I get so darn curious .... that spelling "error" of Remekel has piqued my interest, but there may be something to it .... dark skinned, tall, sounds more like a match to man in the car than Fernand - perhaps someone from the military over here .... just my Thursday evening thoughts ..... thinking the man in the car is the key to solving this mystery ..... there is the Luxembourg housewife clue, but anyway .....

I have an ancestry membership and will spend somw time searching with this different spelling. The Luxembourg connection and name remakel does make it sound like it was based on someone Marion actually knew herself or someone who would have been aware of the connection. It could have simply been not f remakel himself but someone who was a footballing fan, someone he was accquatined with or remakel was a family name rather than his own surname. I. e a mother's maiden name or a name the occurred a few generations back. I have also discussed the name florabella a name that could crop up as a rarity but in different countries. However, the florabella Marion may have known.. her mothers maiden name was botterill and she married a despoges.

Might look into the origins of those names too. Someone linked to Marion with a Luxembourg connection could just happen to be a link to the name remakel or some sort of association to it. I think we now know anyone she could have been with physically in Australia, that remakel was not their real name and therefore could very well be the man in la courrier, or that still could have been a coincidence. He may have posted the ad in 94.. had no luck and met Marion through someone or in some other way, while still preferring to refer to himself as remakel for whatever reason.

 

[Sophie-Renee]

I also did check an Australian directory and while florabella stocks last known address on wattle Street was sold in 1995..I did come across an F. W. H Stocks on rainbow parade in peakhurst. We know the florabella in question had the middle name Hazel. So who knows if she is still alive. Or had another middle name she didn't always use. I searched all stocks in new south Wales and it was the only initial F that came up and specifically in peakhurst only about 5 mins drive from the original wattle street. Totally coincidence maybe, but would be interesting if anyone knew of anyone in peakhurst new south Wales. I am guessing if it is same lady she will be very elderly and I would definitely never wish on her anyone prying or asking loads of questions. It would be nice to know though if there is a Florabella that did know Marion, how she knew her and how the connection ended. Idk how someone would find that out without asking someone themselves, but like I say someone in Australia might know someone, who knows someone in peakhurst , who knows someone else.....

 

[Itsapuzzle]

I have an ancestry membership and will spend somw time searching with this different spelling. The Luxembourg connection and name remakel does make it sound like it was based on someone Marion actually knew herself or someone who would have been aware of the connection. It could have simply been not f remakel himself but someone who was a footballing fan, someone he was accquatined with or remakel was a family name rather than his own surname. I. e a mother's maiden name or a name the occurred a few generations back. I have also discussed the name florabella a name that could crop up as a rarity but in different countries. However, the florabella Marion may have known.. her mothers maiden name was botterill and she married a despoges.

Might look into the origins of those names too. Someone linked to Marion with a Luxembourg connection could just happen to be a link to the name remakel or some sort of association to it. I think we now know anyone she could have been with physically in Australia, that remakel was not their real name and therefore could very well be the man in la courrier, or that still could have been a coincidence. He may have posted the ad in 94.. had no luck and met Marion through someone or in some other way, while still preferring to refer to himself as remakel for whatever reason.

Thanks so much Sophie-Renee, that'd be great when you've got some free time .... pretty hectic and busy round this time of year .... look forward to hearing from when you're able, completely wonderful.

 

[Intriguedbyintrigue]

I just saw a post on Facebook (copy of the text below) which accompanied a nice pic of Marion. Episode out tomorrow!! The wording "final chapter" and "we're sure......will be solved" seems to suggest the podcast investigation is going to wrap without a definative outcome. I hope not - what about Sally???

Conversations 17 out tomorrow - As the final chapter nears, we discuss the latest breakthrough and why we're sure the mystery of what happened to Marion will be solved.

 

[Itsapuzzle]

I just saw a post on Facebook (copy of the text below) which accompanied a nice pic of Marion. Episode out tomorrow!! The wording "final chapter" and "we're sure......will be solved" seems to suggest the podcast investigation is going to wrap without a definative outcome. I hope not - what about Sally???

Conversations 17 out tomorrow - As the final chapter nears, we discuss the latest breakthrough and why we're sure the mystery of what happened to Marion will be solved.

Thanks for the breaking news Intrigued ... how very interesting ... final chapter .... latest breakthrough ... sounds like they've cracked the case or are close to it ....

 

[Intriguedbyintrigue]

Thanks for the breaking news Intrigued ... how very interesting ... final chapter .... latest breakthrough ... sounds like they've cracked the case or are close to it ....

Could it be that an inquest has been scheduled?? Although it does seem like an awfully quick turnaround seeing as they thought it would be 3-6 months before a decision would be made.

 

[KiwiNZ]

Maybe the police or someone has suggested the podcast may not be helpful if someone where to be convicted of a crime ? It may hinder the case.

 

[sunnynz]

Conversations 17 out now. Haven’t listened yet but here’s the synopsis. It’s only the last episode for the year, not last episode ever.
“As the final chapter for the year approaches, we discuss the latest breakthrough and why we're sure the mystery of what happened to Marion will be solved.”

 

[KiwiNZ]

It was just a discussion the actual episode is out Monday.

My guess is the document the sleuth got access to was maybe the re entry card.

 

[sunnynz]

It was just a discussion the actual episode is out Monday.

My guess is the document the sleuth got access to was maybe the re entry card.

Yes just listening now. They say in the full episode on Monday they will discuss a key document that they’ve got their hands on which provides a lot of answers about whet was happening at the time of marions disappearance. But also raises more questions.

they say it’s something they’ve been trying to get hold of for a long time. Wonder if it’s the flight manifest.

 

[Intriguedbyintrigue]

51 minute infomercial for Mondays episode. Could have been 2 minutes. There are now ads in the podcast.

The document released from national archives could be the doc found by the web sleuth??

From todays episode it appears there have been 3 applications for info from the police file. The NCAT decision due this week relates to everything in the police file up until Dec 2018. There is a second request for Dec 2018 to June 2019 and another for the most recent.
The 1st before NCAT is still pending, aparently a decision was made on the second and given to Sally which Sally says she doesnt have (although they then go on to discuss how Sally has to be careful what she shares).

I'm super annoyed that when they gave the overview of 'Sallys journey' they again say that when Marion was reported missing initially the police assumed she was a 3 times divorced woman who'd run off and didnt do anything - and this is completely and utterly wrong. Marion was contacted and said she wanted no contact. Attempting to rewrite the timeline to suit their narrative undermines their credibility.

 

[JLZ]

I'm super annoyed that when they gave the overview of 'Sallys journey' they again say that when Marion was reported missing initially the police assumed she was a 3 times divorced woman who'd run off and didnt do anything - and this is completely and utterly wrong. Marion was contacted and said she wanted no contact. Attempting to rewrite the timeline to suit their narrative undermines their credibility.

(snipped for focus)

And Karlie Pearce-Stevenson was contacted and said she wanted no contact. Except it wasn't Karlie, it was somebody helping cover up the murder of Karlie and her daughter. Afterwards police acknowledged that they hadn't followed due procedure because they didn't actually sight her before removing her from the missing persons list.

 

[Itsapuzzle]

Just throwing my two cents worth in .... firstly, how brilliant is Joni, hey, finding all this great stuff .... bravo Joni
H'mm, so what is this document .... experts are pouring over it and it's like going back in time .... could it be Marion's bank statements, experts going through each transaction .... or perhaps the phone records, going through all the calls she made ..... then again, maybe the deed poll ..... I absolutely can't wait to find out. Completely fascinated about this magazine that was found in a Los Angeles library .... totally amazing find by this gentleman .... wondering if Marion's Ashmore address was in it, or her name .... can't wait to hear about that too. I enjoyed the Conversations episode, building up great suspense, mystery and intrigue for Monday's Episode 17. Hope it's a good outcome.

 

[Intriguedbyintrigue]

Yes just listening now. They say in the full episode on Monday they will discuss a key document that they’ve got their hands on which provides a lot of answers about whet was happening at the time of marions disappearance. But also raises more questions.

they say it’s something they’ve been trying to get hold of for a long time. Wonder if it’s the flight manifest.

Could be or the flight reentry card. I think this document is likely to be the digital images Itsapuzzle found the record of in the national archives. The name was spelt differently Remekel in this record which could be what they refer to when they say it poses more questions.

Cant wait to hear what it is!! Although I cant help being frustrated by the 'filler' nothingness of todays episode

 

[Intriguedbyintrigue]

(snipped for focus)

And Karlie Pearce-Stevenson was contacted and said she wanted no contact. Except it wasn't Karlie, it was somebody helping cover up the murder of Karlie and her daughter. Afterwards police acknowledged that they hadn't followed due procedure because they didn't actually sight her before removing her from the missing persons list.

I see what you are saying however
Karlie was young, naive, free spirited and had a baby to care for. She was in a low socioecomonic environment and associated with some outwardly nice but dubious people (doing drug runs from memory). She was extremely vulnerable.

Marion was mature, life-experienced, financially independant and educated. She liquidated her major assets, changed her name, created cover stories and in addition to the phone call where she indicated she wanted no contact, she had daily contact in person with bank staff where she was identified and could easily have requested assistance.

 

[JLZ]

I see what you are saying however
Karlie was young, naive, free spirited and had a baby to care for. She was in a low socioecomonic environment and associated with some outwardly nice but dubious people (doing drug runs from memory). She was extremely vulnerable.

Marion was mature, life-experienced, financially independant and educated. She liquidated her major assets, changed her name, created cover stories and in addition to the phone call where she indicated she wanted no contact, she had daily contact in person with bank staff where she was identified and could easily have requested assistance.

Fair enough, that changes the probabilities, but I still think police should themselves have met with Marion face to face before deregistering. I'm curious whether NSW/Qld police have different rules from NT police on that.

 

[Mel 1303]

(snipped for focus)

And Karlie Pearce-Stevenson was contacted and said she wanted no contact. Except it wasn't Karlie, it was somebody helping cover up the murder of Karlie and her daughter. Afterwards police acknowledged that they hadn't followed due procedure because they didn't actually sight her before removing her from the missing persons list.

Very true. No one sighted her. They should have. She was let down. In this case however, she was identified by bank staff (in the suburb where she lived) withdrawing the balance of her account from the Colonial bank in Ashmore (from an account no one knew she had, until the police investigated following Sally's initial missing persons report), and spoke of starting a new life. Bank staff following security procedures are considered persons in authority, as per NSW police protocol, and they did identify her. There was also a phone call made after the withdrawal- so the bank had a way of contacting her. There is also the doctor visits, with doctors being persons in authority. I know the podcast keeps saying it has to be a police officer, but it simply isn't true.

 

[JLZ]

Very true. No one sighted her. They should have. She was let down. In this case however, she was identified by bank staff (in the suburb where she lived) withdrawing the balance of her account from the Colonial bank in Ashmore (from an account no one knew she had, until the police investigated following Sally's initial missing persons report), and spoke of starting a new life. Bank staff following security procedures are considered persons in authority, as per NSW police protocol, and they did identify her. There was also a phone call made after the withdrawal- so the bank had a way of contacting her. There is also the doctor visits, with doctors being persons in authority. I know the podcast keeps saying it has to be a police officer, but it simply isn't true.

Interesting about NSW police protocol, thank you.

The doctor visits, had Marion been to that practice before? A doctor isn't going to investigate the identity of a new patient who presents with the appropriate Medicare card.

I don't particularly trust the bank. They'll say what they think is in their own interest to say, in my opinion, and it's probably too long ago for them to be sure they weren't either a little lax or not lax but deceived.