GUILTY Australia - Terence Darrell Kelly, charged w/ abduction of 4 y.o., WA, 16 Oct 2021 #2

[Estelle]

RSBM

She did have fair hair when she was younger. However, there are many photos on the internet, including ones with her mother, her sibling, and the entire family showing her much closer in age to the abduction. She now has auburn hair and I definitely don't believe it was dyed.


If you Google "images + her full name" you can see for yourself.

I agree with you that for me it's a stretch too far for TK to dye her hair. If anything, I would have thought he would dye it blonde.

 

[Estelle]

Some browsers let you log into multiple FB profiles at once with a drop down menu .. it might not have been that hard for him to interact between them that way. Instagram also allows this on your phone. I think he did all of it on his own, I think this was his own private little world.

I also think he did all this on his own. After all, he initially set some of these FB profiles up in 2011 and just added to them when he wanted.

IMO he would have been too embarrassed to tell anyone else about it and, as you said, it was his own little fantasy world.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Dr Michelle Noone, criminologist and psychologist, explains the techniques used when interviewing very young children in this excellent interview.

Interview Link Here

 

[Estelle]

Wonder who's 4wd it was and could he hav possibly used a car other than the one in his driveway the night he allegedly abducted

I have assumed that TK had sold the 4WD which had been seen there in the past and used the car he recently bought. If, as LE have told us, that it was an opportunistic crime, there was no need for him use a different car.

 

[Estelle]

I'll try to paraphrase it for you........

TK was taken in as a toddler, by one of the most respected Aboriginal women in the Gascoyne region, Penny Walker.

TK was raised by PW a warm and humorous woman who collected small statues of unicorns and cherished her pets.

PW was 44yrs old when in 1987 she agreed to raise TK. She called him Terry.

PW , in an oral history in an interview in 5/2019 for the state library of WA, she volunteered that in her youth she had been a heavy drinker, a domestic violence victim & that her own six biological children had been taken from her,

She considered TK a gift from god.

She raised TK in the same house as two of her biological grandchildren who were of similar age.

She gave evidence at a parliamentary inquiry about the patient travel scheme for regional Western Australians in 2014, where she explained she had multiple health problems but she was also a full-time carer for one of her two biological grandsons who suffered mental distress.

She told the inquiry she took in TK because his biological mother was a drug addict. PW said in the oral history recording: “His mum didn’t want him and she threw him away”.

Ms Walker and Mr Kelly were said to be close and locals have told The Australian he grew more withdrawn after her death in early 2020.

In the oral history interview she recounts a childhood of mission homes, abuse by priests and working on a cattle station.

With obvious pride, Ms Walker says in the recording that later in life God gave her the chance to raise three boys – her two biological grandsons ( after their mother died ) and Mr Kelly.

“This little boy, God was giving me something back into my life, what the welfare took off me, my children,” she said.

“So I had this little boy. Beautiful boy, Terry, two-year-old jet black curly hair.”

She raised the three boys together in Carnarvon.


NoCookies | The Australian

From the above link:

TK was raised by PW a warm and humorous woman who collected small statues of unicorns and cherished her pets.

So PW collected small statues of unicorns. But did she also collect dolls? Have any of you noticed unicorns on the shelves?

https://www.amazon.com.au/Schleich-...ocphy=9112615&hvtargid=pla-1236600538747&th=1

 

[mickey2942]

Yes, it's very sad what the indigenous elders had to go through many years ago...just totally incomprehensible and so inhumane

As I was listening to her speak, she could have easily have been any of our Indigenous people, in the United States, Navajo, Blackfoot, they all have similar lives.

 

[Estelle]

NoCookies | The Australian

Another article.....

Paraphrased......

• Police have been clear they do not believe CS's abduction was planned
• Investigating the theory that TK came across CS by chance when he visited the campground to either sell drugs or look for opportunities to steal from campers or both.
• Sources close to the investigation told The Australian that TK came to the attention of profilers working on the case because police in his hometown of Carnarvon suspected he was a petty thief and a small-time distributor of cannabis who occasionally went to the Blowholes Campground. They suspected he had been to the campsite at least once to deliver cannabis for the personal use of backpackers.
• TK was not an obvious POI for investigators to focus on , he is not a RSO, nor did he frequent the campground
• Being known to police put him in a large group of people identified through profiling
• Investigation began to focus on TK when detectives received information that they will say shows one of three mobile phone towers close to the campground detected a phone registered to Mr Kelly at 3am on the day CS was abducted.
• The Point Quobba phone tower was installed just over a year ago as part of a national phone black spot program.
• Police believe it was Tk's phone that pinged the tower about 90 minutes after CS mother, ES, last saw her – when she gave her eldest daughter a drink of water in the tent at 1.30am – and around the time police say a motorist on North West Coastal Highway saw a car leaving the campground road and turning right towards Carnarvon.
• A source familiar with events in the hours before Mr Kelly’s arrest said the mobile phone data was important but detectives soon found other things they believed implicated Mr Kelly. Police have not said what they are.
• Forensics officers have been at Mr Kelly’s two-bedroom rented duplex in Carnarvon since CS was rescued there at 12.46am on Wednesday. They are expected to continue their work for at least three more days.
• Police on Sunday took items including a large clear plastic tub into the backyard of the property and tested each item for fingerprints. On Saturday, they removed carpet from inside.
• Police have stopped commenting on the case since Mr Kelly was charged with abduction on Thursday. On the day of Mr Kelly’s arrest, Inspector Rod Wilde – who leads the investigation – told reporters that police believed the crime was opportunistic and that Mr Kelly acted had alone.

NoCookies | The Australian

From above post:

Police on Sunday took items including a large clear plastic tub into the backyard of the property and tested each item for fingerprints.

I wonder if TK used the tub to bathe CS? At 4yo, my children could bathe themselves so IMO it does not necessarily mean AK bathed her or was even present. He may have given her privacy. We cannot assume anything devious from this.

 

[Estelle]

NoCookies | The Australian

Another article.....

Paraphrased......

• Police have been clear they do not believe CS's abduction was planned
• Investigating the theory that TK came across CS by chance when he visited the campground to either sell drugs or look for opportunities to steal from campers or both.
• Sources close to the investigation told The Australian that TK came to the attention of profilers working on the case because police in his hometown of Carnarvon suspected he was a petty thief and a small-time distributor of cannabis who occasionally went to the Blowholes Campground. They suspected he had been to the campsite at least once to deliver cannabis for the personal use of backpackers.
• TK was not an obvious POI for investigators to focus on , he is not a RSO, nor did he frequent the campground
• Being known to police put him in a large group of people identified through profiling
• Investigation began to focus on TK when detectives received information that they will say shows one of three mobile phone towers close to the campground detected a phone registered to Mr Kelly at 3am on the day CS was abducted.
• The Point Quobba phone tower was installed just over a year ago as part of a national phone black spot program.
• Police believe it was Tk's phone that pinged the tower about 90 minutes after CS mother, ES, last saw her – when she gave her eldest daughter a drink of water in the tent at 1.30am – and around the time police say a motorist on North West Coastal Highway saw a car leaving the campground road and turning right towards Carnarvon.
• A source familiar with events in the hours before Mr Kelly’s arrest said the mobile phone data was important but detectives soon found other things they believed implicated Mr Kelly. Police have not said what they are.
• Forensics officers have been at Mr Kelly’s two-bedroom rented duplex in Carnarvon since CS was rescued there at 12.46am on Wednesday. They are expected to continue their work for at least three more days.
• Police on Sunday took items including a large clear plastic tub into the backyard of the property and tested each item for fingerprints. On Saturday, they removed carpet from inside.
• Police have stopped commenting on the case since Mr Kelly was charged with abduction on Thursday. On the day of Mr Kelly’s arrest, Inspector Rod Wilde – who leads the investigation – told reporters that police believed the crime was opportunistic and that Mr Kelly acted had alone.

NoCookies | The Australian

From above post:

They suspected he had been to the campsite at least once to deliver cannabis for the personal use of backpackers.

Perhaps AK was a small-time distributor of cannabis and that's how he got the money to buy the dolls? I wonder if he used cannabis himself? Distributors don't always use themselves so we can't assume he does. Perhaps his night drives were when he delivered cannabis to his clients???

ALL IMO

 

[Estelle]

<modsnip - quoted post removed / included victim name>

Now you remind us, I do remember a female voice at the beginning of the tape. I also think that some of them were in police uniform. Just the detective wasn't.

Perhaps we assumed that CS would be in the arms of the female police officer.

ALL IMO

 

[centred]

As I was listening to her speak, she could have easily have been any of our Indigenous people, in the United States, Navajo, Blackfoot, they all have similar lives.

Sadly Nothing has changed and many still suffer loss and grief on a regular basis for various reasons . None are not touched by early deaths and incarceration . Fas and having to be educated on living with lead in some areas.

The Lead Alliance | Living Safely With Lead
Fetal alcohol spectrum disorder - Wikipedia

 

[Estelle]

I'll try to paraphrase it for you........

TK was taken in as a toddler, by one of the most respected Aboriginal women in the Gascoyne region, Penny Walker.

TK was raised by PW a warm and humorous woman who collected small statues of unicorns and cherished her pets.

PW was 44yrs old when in 1987 she agreed to raise TK. She called him Terry.

PW , in an oral history in an interview in 5/2019 for the state library of WA, she volunteered that in her youth she had been a heavy drinker, a domestic violence victim & that her own six biological children had been taken from her,

She considered TK a gift from god.

She raised TK in the same house as two of her biological grandchildren who were of similar age.

She gave evidence at a parliamentary inquiry about the patient travel scheme for regional Western Australians in 2014, where she explained she had multiple health problems but she was also a full-time carer for one of her two biological grandsons who suffered mental distress.

She told the inquiry she took in TK because his biological mother was a drug addict. PW said in the oral history recording: “His mum didn’t want him and she threw him away”.

Ms Walker and Mr Kelly were said to be close and locals have told The Australian he grew more withdrawn after her death in early 2020.

In the oral history interview she recounts a childhood of mission homes, abuse by priests and working on a cattle station.

With obvious pride, Ms Walker says in the recording that later in life God gave her the chance to raise three boys – her two biological grandsons ( after their mother died ) and Mr Kelly.

“This little boy, God was giving me something back into my life, what the welfare took off me, my children,” she said.

“So I had this little boy. Beautiful boy, Terry, two-year-old jet black curly hair.”

She raised the three boys together in Carnarvon.


NoCookies | The Australian

So here we learn that TK was brought up with a mother figure (grandmother) and two "brothers" so when he lost his last family member, TK "grew more withdrawn after her death in early 2020".

 

[JudgeJudi]

Dr Michelle Noone, criminologist and psychologist, explains the techniques used when interviewing very young children in this excellent interview.
Interview Link Here

One of our fab mods helped with the link and it's now working.

 

[mickey2942]

So here we learn that TK was brought up with a mother figure (grandmother) and two "brothers" so when he lost his last family member, TK "grew more withdrawn after her death in early 2020".

He sounds like he didn't have a family connection. And maybe he wanted a family, not knowing how to meet a gal, but he wanted a child. Maybe he never had an idea to hurt his victim, simply wanted a family.

Didn't he have a tribe? Or home to go back to?

 

[Estelle]

He sounds like he didn't have a family connection. And maybe he wanted a family, not knowing how to meet a gal, but he wanted a child. Maybe he never had an idea to hurt his victim, simply wanted a family.

Didn't he have a tribe? Or home to go back to?

Yes TK's family connection had ended with the death of his grandmother only a year or so ago.

IMO TK is naive and in grief. Perhaps CS could not go back to sleep after she had the drink of water and somehow got out of the tent and was wandering around when TK found her and asked her if she wanted to see his dolls. I think he simply wanted a daughter.

 

[Trooper]

He sounds like he didn't have a family connection. And maybe he wanted a family, not knowing how to meet a gal, but he wanted a child. Maybe he never had an idea to hurt his victim, simply wanted a family.

Didn't he have a tribe? Or home to go back to?

Apparently, a father in Karratha, about 700 klms northeast.. That would be the connection to his People. As I understand it, Gran is an adopted carer.. ... On his facebook stuff he claims his mother was Italian.. doesn't sound like it from Gran's story. There doesn't appear to be anything that would prevent him from re entering his People in Karratha, except his own choices.

He , so it says, sells cannabis around the town, so that would be a sort of tribe. People must have been having some sort of repeated social contact with him , on that basis.

He obviously knew that what he did was wrong, because he hid the child. He didn't stroll down the main street of Canarvon , introducing his new daughter to the baker, for example.

He didn't appear to have any social skills, of the sort that enables one to be a part of a community, the usual stuff, where you give and take, live and learn, laugh and cry with the folks, lend and borrow, that sort of stuff.

That makes him unusual in the milieu he resides in. People in that environment do all those things, day in, day out. He seems unable to do that.

 

[styzrz]

He sounds like he didn't have a family connection. And maybe he wanted a family, not knowing how to meet a gal, but he wanted a child. Maybe he never had an idea to hurt his victim, simply wanted a family.

Didn't he have a tribe? Or home to go back to?

I agree with this and while being raised with two of your cousins by your grandmother isn’t the worst scenario, I think he would have realised from an early age that he didn’t have a “normal” family. I can empathise with this to an extent.

I still believe that he knew right from wrong though and he would definitely understand that kidnapping a child is very wrong so I don’t have any empathy for him in that regard. He saw the missing persons posters and watched the heartbroken parents plead for their daughter’s return but chose to continue holding her captive.
This is where he could have owned up and slightly redeemed himself but no, he chose to be evil at that point. JMO

 

[Estelle]

I agree with this and while being raised with two of your cousins by your grandmother isn’t the worst scenario, I think he would have realised from an early age that he didn’t have a “normal” family. I can empathise with this to an extent.

I still believe that he knew right from wrong though and he would definitely understand that kidnapping a child is very wrong so I don’t have any empathy for him in that regard. He saw the missing persons posters and watched the heartbroken parents plead for their daughter’s return but chose to continue holding her captive.
This is where he could have owned up and slightly redeemed himself but no, he chose to be evil at that point. JMO

Yes the main point is that TK is not capable of empathy.

 

[Estelle]

Apparently, a father in Karratha, about 700 klms northeast.. That would be the connection to his People. As I understand it, Gran is an adopted carer.. ... On his facebook stuff he claims his mother was Italian.. doesn't sound like it from Gran's story. There doesn't appear to be anything that would prevent him from re entering his People in Karratha, except his own choices.

He , so it says, sells cannabis around the town, so that would be a sort of tribe. People must have been having some sort of repeated social contact with him , on that basis.

He obviously knew that what he did was wrong, because he hid the child. He didn't stroll down the main street of Canarvon , introducing his new daughter to the baker, for example.

He didn't appear to have any social skills, of the sort that enables one to be a part of a community, the usual stuff, where you give and take, live and learn, laugh and cry with the folks, lend and borrow, that sort of stuff.

That makes him unusual in the milieu he resides in. People in that environment do all those things, day in, day out. He seems unable to do that.

IMO TK's fantasy world and dolls are so important to him that if they are taken away from him, he may have no will to live hence his head banging. His Grandmother must have known about and accepted his doll collection but few of his community members would have.

I wonder if LE will ever return his dolls to him?

 

[JLZ]

I agree with this and while being raised with two of your cousins by your grandmother isn’t the worst scenario, I think he would have realised from an early age that he didn’t have a “normal” family. I can empathise with this to an extent.

(snipped)
They weren't his biological family at all according to the article paraphrased by DrSleuth. Not his grandmother, not his cousins.

 

[bearbear]

i hope his house isnt vandalised or robbed while hes in prison, not sure if his grandmother owned it outright or if he was paying rent?
wondering if he has no close family who would pack up and mind his belongings?
this whole case is so sad, for everyone