Australia Australia - William Tyrrell Disappeared While Playing in Yard - Kendall (NSW) #78

Welcome to Websleuths!
Click to learn how to make a missing person's thread

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves

New Posts

SouthAussie said:
I think that may be the house that was built (later) on the empty lot across the street.

Back when we had earlier relevant shots of the area on google streetview, there was a clear line of site from the road near the Miller's place into FGM's back yard and patio area. Bushes and trees have now grown to obscure that view (in current streetview).

The old screenshots were posted on-thread way back in the threads somewhere.

imo
Click to expand...
I think it might be the Crabb's place. This is a photo I took of the new place opposite the FGM's house

1728453491398.jpeg
 
sleepinoz said:
Yes it is the Millers house Doc, from this angle we are looking next door (uphill) to FGM. The high balcony is on the downhill side and the Millers is right next to the small patio where they were sitting.
Click to expand...

You are right. It is not the house across the street. I just looked at the (newish) house across the street, it looks NOTHING like the house in the photo.

I think the photo angle threw me off.

Sorry @drsleuth
 
SouthAussie said:
You are right. It is not the house across the street. I just looked at the (newish) house across the street, it looks NOTHING like the house in the photo.

I think the photo angle threw me off.

Sorry @drsleuth
Click to expand...

Just to add, in case someone doesn't remember - The Millers were not home on the day, they were away on holidays.
Which makes it more perfect for watching or hiding. IMO
 
drsleuth said:

A key witness in the William Tyrrell case has revealed the stunning question police asked her as never-before-seen photos emerge of the home where the boy disappeared.

Heath Parkes-Hupton and Dan Box

October 8, 2024 - 1:59PM

Detectives investigating William Tyrrell’s disappearance wrongly suspected the parents of missing four-year-old Cleo Smith were involved in her disappearance, causing one witness to question their judgement in his case.

snip

News.com.au can also reveal previously-unseen photographs of the house where three-year-old William was reported missing on September 12, 2014, taken by Ms White in the days that followed.

Over the next week, she took photographs, as well as lengthy notes of her interactions with his foster parents, but was not questioned by police about what she saw.

Police only took possession of the photographs years later, after Ms White volunteered them.

Five days after seizing the photographs – showing heavy furniture in place on the veranda – William’s foster mother was questioned over whether he had fallen from there.

Police contacted Ms White again two years later, December 2023, Ms White said a detective asked her if William’s foster mother had access to any other cars around the time he was reported missing.

View attachment 536294

View attachment 536297

View attachment 536298
Click to expand...
Just looking at those new images taken by MW again…..

Back in 2014 there was not very much shrubbery under the high balcony …. (Unlike the years later when the Police dug up the garden …)
I think a dead or injured child would have been very obvious, if that occurred …
Did legal counsel for the NSWCC even look at images of the garden from 2014??? before asking the questions???

JMO

IMG_1880.png
 
Finally found the streetview photos again. These were streetview photos I screenshot in 2019. From out the front of the Miller's place you could see right into FGM's patio area and adjoining back garden.

Anyone walking along the road there could likely hear children playing and see who they were.

Just for orientation purposes, that is Paul Savage's house at the end of that upper portion of the road. The driveway you see is the Miller's driveway.


a.jpg b.jpg

Thread 47, post 13
 
Last edited:
SouthAussie said:
Finally found the streetview photos again. These were streetview photos I screenshot in 2019. From out the front of the Miller's place you could see right into FGM's patio area and adjoining back garden.

Anyone walking along the road there could likely hear children playing and see who they were.

Just for orientation purposes, that is Paul Savage's house at the end of that upper portion of the road. The driveway you see is the Miller's driveway.


View attachment 536508 View attachment 536509

Thread 47, post 13
Click to expand...
Here is the google maps link dated 2010

www.google.com

Street View · Google Maps

Explore a place in a more immersive way in Google Maps.
www.google.com www.google.com
 
SouthAussie said:
I don't think anyone had to be aware. We have already been told that (for example) Frank Abbott was known for petty crimes - would break and enter when people were away - like the people next door to the FGM's house who were away at the time.

An opportunistic crime (as opposed to a planned one). Someone saw an opportunity, and took it.


A criminal profiler has revealed details about the person police suspect may have abducted toddler William Tyrrell from his grandmother's home in Kendall 12 months ago.
Dr Sarah Yule is a member of the police taskforce .... "It does seem that this was an opportunistic crime .... "

Forensic profiler reveals details about three-year-old's suspected kidnapper

Congratulations to Dr Sarah Yule — winner of the Employee of the Year Award! Manager of the Criminal Psychology Unit, she has provided expert consultation for hundreds of investigations NSW Police Force
Click to expand...
Thanks SouthAussie and for the link too.
Strange things do happen in this world and this is one of them. A case of 'two worlds collide' so to speak or a sliding door moment.
 
Marg944 said:
In the media a few people have said that they reported information to Crimestoppers, but no one ever got back to them. Which is correct, Crimestoppers pass on the information to the Police, who will investigate it and if they need more information, only then will they get in touch with the person who made the report to Crimestoppers. Perhaps these people were able to give clear and concise information, and the Police were able to complete the investigation without the need to contact the person. Just because the Police didn’t contact them does not in any way mean that their reporting was not investigated.

I know for a fact that you don’t get feedback once you make a report to Crimestoppers. You don’t get told if your information was helpful. You just have to believe that you have helped as much as you can in making the report to Crimestoppers.

I wasn’t able to find NSW Crimestoppers explanation of what happens after you make a report to them, but I did find Western Australia’s:-

“Whether you report online via our website, use the Eyes on the Street app or phone us, the information will be assessed by the Crime Stoppers contact centre staff and added to our database. It will also be sent to the relevant department and/or station for their information and investigation. Remember that
even if no action can be taken at that time, it could still be useful in the future.

Reports are categorised into the appropriate crime type/s, for example stealing, drugs, antisocial behaviour, fraud or assault, to name just a few. Words in an information report can be searched by analysts or investigators, such as name, address, vehicle registration, clothing descriptions or physical appearance.

If you left your contact details, an investigator may follow-up with you if they need to clarify or askanything else which could help them. If you chose to remain anonymous then obviously there will be no further contact once your report has been sent, as we don’t know who you are.
You will also have some peace of mind, knowing that you have helped police by safely sharing whatyou know.

We understand you’d like to know what action is being taken or receive feedback on your
report.Because we receive an average of over 1,000 reports each week, it’s not possible or practical to do this and confidentiality must be maintained.

A common complaint we hear is “I made a report, but nothing happened,” and there may be several reasons for this.

Your information might be of high value, but police may need more details to justify taking action.
Because you remain anonymous, unless you have volunteered to provide your contact details, we’re unable to get in touch to ask for further information.
Police may already be investigating a drug house or aware of a repeat offender but are waiting for
further activity to take place before they raid a property or arrest an individual. Strategically, it’s not always the best policy to jump in straight away, as police may be able to identify drug dealers higherup the chain or seize more stolen or illegal property if they wait.

Naturally, you want to see some positive results sooner rather than later, but we ask that you be patient.

Your information does make a difference and adds valuable pieces of the puzzle, which police and other law enforcement agencies are trying to solve.

Remember, if you are the victim of a crime, please call 131 444 or if it's life-threatening dial 000.”


“Potential witnesses in William Tyrrell case come forward with shocking claims​

A woman who tried to report seeing William Tyrrell near Uluru a year after he disappeared says she was turned away by police and her repeated calls to Crime Stoppers were never followed up.

She is one of five people news.com.au has spoken to who say police failed to respond to potentially credible tips, including alleged sightings of a car and driver about which detectives had previously appealed for information.”

Click to expand...
^ above is true. I’m not sure people are aware of this imo. Thank you for reminding us
 

Top William Tyrrell cop left 19 unsolved cases to ‘gather dust’​

An inquiry laid bare the challenges that have undermined NSW’s unsolved homicide team for years as it tries to solve William Tyrrell’s case.

Heath Parkes-Hupton and Dan Box

October 10, 2024 - 5:59AM

The officer responsible for a 2017 project to identify and retrieve this missing evidence, Detective Chief Inspector David Laidlaw, told an inquiry last year that he hadn’t received any written updates on its progress.

Asked if he had requested these updates, Mr Laidlaw said: “No.”

Asked why not, he replied: “I can’t give a reason.”
 
The final report about the review of the Unsolved Homicide Squad is over 3,500 pages long, but the NSW Bar Association published an overview.

Among the findings - of common themes:
- Inadequate investigations
- misplaced records
- insufficient resourcing
- lost opportunities

Among the findings - with more detail:
- investigative and related steps taken (or not taken) by the NSWPF were not in compliance with proper police practice
- processing unsolved homicides too slowly and with insufficient frequency
- 20 per cent of unsolved homicide cases have never been screened, triaged or reviewed
- plagued by difficulties with the availability and quality of exhibits and records
- widespread deficiencies in both systems and training within the NSWPF, at least among unsolved homicides
- In some cases, entire investigative files were not able to be produced
- In others, it could not be ascertained whether particular investigative steps were not taken at all or were taken and simply not recorded
- In many instances it was unclear whether material had been lost, destroyed in an authorised manner or destroyed in an unauthorised manner


They currently have 854 unsolved homicides. William's case presumably being one of them, considering Laidlaw is overseeing the investigation, and the detectives are from that squad. imo.
They have now reopened two other case investigations. And "prioritised" looking at 213 others. Link
 
Last edited:
SouthAussie said:
"In many instances it was unclear whether material had been lost, destroyed in an authorised manner or destroyed in an unauthorised manner"
Click to expand...

Too many times do we read that police lost or destroyed evidence. I guess storage and cataloging of evidence must be a huge logistics problem, and oversight and control of it must be a challenge, especially in outlying areas.

My guess is that when resourcing is tight, such tasks are given low priority.
 
JBowie said:
Too many times do we read that police lost or destroyed evidence. I guess storage and cataloging of evidence must be a huge logistics problem, and oversight and control of it must be a challenge, especially in outlying areas.

My guess is that when resourcing is tight, such tasks are given low priority.
Click to expand...
Or sometimes evidence is conveniently "lost" , statements changed or lost / missing etc

So many long term missing person's cases are not solved due to police incompetence / corruption / cover ups eg Janine Vaughan ( https://media.opengov.nsw.gov.au/pa.../c9/28/98/09/b9/75/10/obj/Rani_Report__1_.pdf )

I'm glad that investigative journalists are tackling these cases & shinning light on police failures & hopefully give some hope to all these poor families etc

Lets hope Dan can do the same

IMO
 
SouthAussie said:
The final report about the review of the Unsolved Homicide Squad is over 3,500 pages long, but the NSW Bar Association published an overview.

Among the findings - of common themes:
- Inadequate investigations
- misplaced records
- insufficient resourcing
- lost opportunities

Among the findings - with more detail:
- investigative and related steps taken (or not taken) by the NSWPF were not in compliance with proper police practice
- processing unsolved homicides too slowly and with insufficient frequency
- 20 per cent of unsolved homicide cases have never been screened, triaged or reviewed
- plagued by difficulties with the availability and quality of exhibits and records
- widespread deficiencies in both systems and training within the NSWPF, at least among unsolved homicides
- In some cases, entire investigative files were not able to be produced
- In others, it could not be ascertained whether particular investigative steps were not taken at all or were taken and simply not recorded
- In many instances it was unclear whether material had been lost, destroyed in an authorised manner or destroyed in an unauthorised manner


They currently have 854 unsolved homicides. William's case presumably being one of them, considering Laidlaw is overseeing the investigation, and the detectives are from that squad. imo.
They have now reopened two other case investigations. And "prioritised" looking at 213 others. Link
Click to expand...
And all these cases have families that are suffering :(
 
drsleuth said:
I'm glad that investigative journalists are tackling these cases & shinning light on police failures & hopefully give some hope to all these poor families etc

Lets hope Dan can do the same

IMO
Click to expand...

Co-incidental that you should mention how beneficial investigative journalists are…… I actually emailed Shayla Bulloch, the journalist who has been covering Frances’ story, with the Courier Mail in Brisbane, to compliment her on finding information on Mr Crawford’s Airbnb. And then following up on it with the information that it had been removed and then keeping on the case, to interview a person who actually stayed at the property as a guest. Hopefully keeping his name in the press will push him…
 

A second police report, stamped “For Official Use Only” in 2017, also said there was a backlog of hundreds of unsolved homicide cases and a number of projects deemed “necessary for the unit to continue functioning … were either partially completed or abandoned”.

This report, signed by the then-Homicide Squad commander, Scott Cook, said there were 763 unsolved homicide matters on the force’s books, dating back to 1972, and the number that had been reviewed was “small”.

“In fact, there have been no reviews conducted in relation to unsolved homicide matters since 2013,” it said.

BBM : This is just appalling , imagine how you would feel if this was your loved one? & we have the allegation from GJ that Scott Cook stopped by his desk and pointed at a picture of William and said 'get him off the books, get him to unsolved homicide'.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Lead cop claims boss told him 'no one cares about' William Tyrell

Former William Tyrrell lead investigator Gary Jubelin claims Detective Superintendent Scott Cook told him to wrap up the case and 'get him off the books... to unsolved homicide'.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk

William's case was just too much work for them & too many errors along the way IMO

I believe Scott did say that too IMO
 
drsleuth said:
Or sometimes evidence is conveniently "lost" , statements changed or lost / missing etc

So many long term missing person's cases are not solved due to police incompetence / corruption / cover ups eg Janine Vaughan ( https://media.opengov.nsw.gov.au/pa.../c9/28/98/09/b9/75/10/obj/Rani_Report__1_.pdf )

I'm glad that investigative journalists are tackling these cases & shinning light on police failures & hopefully give some hope to all these poor families etc

Lets hope Dan can do the same

IMO
Click to expand...

I remember in Spedding's historical charges case that the original police interview had been lost.


Crown Prosecutor Craig Everson conceded that evidence had been lost ...
"Mr Spedding was spoken to by police about these allegations, by the investigating officers, and that interview has been lost. Ongoing inquiries will be made to try and find it," Mr Everson said.

'Person of interest' in William Tyrrell's abduction fights to have historic child sex charges against two girls dismissed - because police LOST crucial evidence
 
drsleuth said:
BBM : This is just appalling , imagine how you would feel if this was your loved one? & we have the allegation from GJ that Scott Cook stopped by his desk and pointed at a picture of William and said 'get him off the books, get him to unsolved homicide'.
Click to expand...

Scott Cook told the FM similar also. Even when he knew Unsolved Homicide were not clearing cases.


The foster mother told the court that in the same conversation, Mr Cook, who is now assistant commissioner, said “William was not our only case” and she was not the only relative of a homicide victim.
Two other detectives also gave evidence that Mr Cook made comments along the lines of police were wasting their time on the case and police would never get anyone for it.

www.macdougallhydes.com.au

The ironic Prosecution of Gary Jubelin — MacDougall & Hydes Lawyers

In 2020 we represented former Detective Chief Inspector Gary Jubelin in a case that generated significant public interest. After a 2 week hearing, a Local Court Magistrate found Gary guilty of breaching the Surveillance Devices Act (2007) . He was convicted and received a fine of $10,000.00. D
www.macdougallhydes.com.au www.macdougallhydes.com.au
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

DNASolves

Who is Fairfield County Jane Doe (1993)?

Members online

... and 59 more.
Total: 1,549 (members: 60, guests: 1,489)

Online statistics

Members online
60
Guests online
1,489
Total visitors
1,549
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
606,106
Messages
18,198,714
Members
233,736
Latest member
Karla Enriquez
Back
Top