AZ AZ - Adrienne Salinas, 19, Tempe, 15 Jun 2013 - #8

[kodi]

<snipped>

One aspect of sharing ideas in posts that bugs me sometimes is when people assume because someone is asking questions along a certain line of thinking that they're making an accusation. That's what I think sleuthing is especially when we have nothing to go on. We're writing factitious scripts that may contain an element of truth.

RSBM

This is where cautious wording comes into play. It can be difficult to get an idea/question across accurately without be too directional and against TOS. I choose my words very carefully in some posts; sometimes it goes well and sometimes it crashes.

It all goes back to means motive and opportunity.


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Which is the core for unraveling any mystery and makes me want to pull my hair out. I'm sure we can all conjure up all kinds of possibilities as to why some close to AS might fit, but a random fits just as well, if not better, IMO. :fence:

<snipped>

It sure would help if we had all of the electronic data for this case, and had them sync'd correctly. Including video. A verified communications timeline would suffice.

RSBM

I think we all would be doing happy dances for days if we had access to everything LE has. Personally, I'm confident in LE as far as them being able to work out any discrepancies with time stamps on varying videos/phones or any other technology. JMO.

 

[illdigya]

Some how I missed the screaming from the trunk...can someone point me to where that came from?

 

[prospektor]

Coming out of lurk mode. I am just at the beginning of this thread, but before I forget, from the last thread, this was posted

"GGE's catching those two young men (and that van scary) in the wash getting air lifted on july 21st only feet away from where A's body was found - it's still giving me the creeps (speaking of forced servitude)"

Can someone remember what this is about, or whereabouts I can read about it. Its nothing something I remember reading.

Thanks in advance..hopefully by the time I catch up, more will be known.
RIP Adrienne.

Hi there.
This was about a video that was captured during the flash flood on the 21st of July, there were two men stranded in a vehicle in the wash and had to be airlifted, a news helicopter filmed it. Coincidentally, that was pretty much the area where later Adrienne's body would be discovered.
It should be in the later part of the last thread, after approx. August 10.

Some how I missed the screaming from the trunk...can someone point me to where that came from?

I can be mistaken, but I believe that was something about an unrelated case.

 

[Mony Mony]

I have been following this case, as I moved to Phoenix the day after this occurred. :scared:

This is IMO, MOO, etc: I strongly believe Adrienne was killed by one of the partygoers. I think she was walking to the AMPM when an acquaintance from the party rolled up and offered her a ride, perhaps saying he will take her to AMPM. Once she got in the car, I think he said to her something along the lines of "I will treat you so much better than your boyfriend, I am the one for you". He was rebuffed, and he likely forced himself upon her, and then killed her because he was afraid of facing rape charges. I think they should reexamine everyone else at the party.

Any thoughts from fellow sluethers? I think Culiacano had the same thoughts.

 

[illdigya]

Coming out of lurk mode. I am just at the beginning of this thread, but before I forget, from the last thread, this was posted

"GGE's catching those two young men (and that van scary) in the wash getting air lifted on july 21st only feet away from where A's body was found - it's still giving me the creeps (speaking of forced servitude)"

Can someone remember what this is about, or whereabouts I can read about it. Its nothing something I remember reading.

Thanks in advance..hopefully by the time I catch up, more will be known.
RIP Adrienne.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased AZ - Adrienne Salinas, 19, Tempe , 15 June 2013 - #7

 

[fringles]

Also coming out of lurkdom - I've been following along though. I should note that I haven't done any SM sleuthing on this case, so I might be a little clueless about the finer details of the relationships Adrienne had.

To me, the calls to the boyf make perfect sense, for the age, the time, the situation. You have a fight, the boyf doesn't want to continue, you're still angry. I had boyfriends at that age that I fought with like crazy, and they would *always* seem to have the gall to just fall asleep in what I thought was the middle of the argument.

Not to say I'm 100% sure he's nothing to do with it, but I don't see anything in the way his evening's been presented that seems too weird. And I do think it was Adrienne calling him. Whether it was her on the last call to the taxi I'm not quite as positive.

I can't rule out a random - but as others have said I think it's far more likely to be someone she knew, somehow. It just seems like such an incredibly strange coincidence that after that evening, and with the timing as it is, that she'd have run into a random predator at precisely that moment. But it is possible, I guess.

What I do wonder about is the event where Adrienne was unable to get into her bedroom. And I wonder about the girl seen on camera. I wonder if perhaps when Adrienne left the house to get the cab, someone, or several someones, went after her. I know it was said that nobody saw her go, but I wonder if maybe that's not the case, if perhaps the reason she didn't get the cab is that someone talked her out of it. That's what I'd do, if it was a friend of mine who'd had the evening she did. But I struggle to see how that fits in with her coming to harm, TBH.

Also, I might be being naive, but IMO it would have to be a very dumb (and probably mentally ill) taxi driver to do something to a girl whose pickup was recorded. Again I'm not saying I'm 100% certain, but with what we know about the driver (family man, no record) it doesn't seem likely to me - particularly with LE being so quick to investigate him. I guess I just feel like if a man like that were to do something like this, he'd have to be in a pretty bad way, mentally, and thus, I suspect, would've left some evidence of it.

It's so confusing, and I'm hoping LE have more of a handle on it than I do!

 

[Mony Mony]

Hi Fringles, I think you are spot on with Adrienne's actions. I remember being that age, and behaving the same way. I even had my BF at the time pull over to let me out of the car so I can walk the rest of the way home. Mind you, it was well after midnight, and demanded to get out on a dark and deserted road. What was I thinking!

I have also accepted rides from acquaintances to go on a beer run, to another party, etc. It is not out of the realm of possibility she got into the car with someone she may have only met that night.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

She was gone in a minute
BUT then 1/2 the stuff she allegedly was wearing or would have taken with her are not
WALLET IN APARTMENT
EBT CARD IN APARTMENT
CLOTHES IN APARTMENT
DOG IN APARTMENT
CELL PHONE NOT IN APARTMENT
OVERNIGHT BAG NOT IN APARTMENT
makes ya hmm?
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Makeup on bathroom counter in apartment.
Phone charger on bed in apartment.
(second charger, pink one, gone per roommate)

Where was the overnight bag was found?
Did she leave it in her car even though she still planned to go to bf via taxi?
(Who claims she returned to the apartment if no one saw her there? Also this was the same approximate time given for the party ending - 5:00 a.m. - some party! The overlaps don't compute.)
She returned to her apartment after leaving car on the side of road, leaving bag behind and carried on to bf's without bag or makeup?
I guess the story is that she changed clothes and now the time is closing in the the morning but still the whole thing seems strange imo.

Do we have specific answers to any of these questions?

 

[Mony Mony]

Just some random thoughts:
There are was talk regarding Adrienne's lack of cash, and how she was going to pay for the cab. Do you know if she had a credit card? Could she use that to pay for the cab?

Also, I am not too concerned about Adrienne not taking her make-up bag. Some girls have a TON of makeup, and can take some "essentials" without making a dent in the makeup collection. My teen girls have about 7 tubes of mascara, multiple bottles of foundation....I wouldn't have the foggiest idea if they left the house with or without a make up kit. They just have so much, and don't throw out old/empty containers.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

BBM
Cabbie was going to Scottsdale anyway, it was the end of his shift......

There's no issue as to why that service was contacted by her. It advertises Scottsdale and surrounding areas, including Tempe. Key words are used for anyone searching for your company site. When I was selling specific poultry on my old web site, I used: Arizona, Silkies, Chinese Silkies, ASBC, Paulden, Zubaz Ranch, Poultry, Hatcheries, Chicks, Chickens, Adult Chickens....etc.etc. You pick the key words you want that will take your perspective customers to your web page.

I'm going to have to take notes! Okay I did.

All times a.m.
4:23 - AS calls cab
4:43 - Texts bf "I'm coming overt." (typo on actual text)
4:53 - Cabbie calls AS to ask where she is. AS says she's on her way.
5:06 - AS doesn't show up so cabbie calls her a second time/gets no answer.

So, AS wasn't in the cab when she texted bf. She's texting as she's walking? She makes decision to call a cab, he arrives in 15 minutes but she's not arrived to make the connection with him. He claims someone answered her phone assuring him she's on her way (I think I read 'one minute'). After another 13 minutes she still hasn't arrived so he calls again but doesn't get an answer. Did the call go to vm?

My initial thought is that usually one calls a cab from the location they want to be picked up at - they wait until the cab arrives and get in (picture yourself waiting and constantly looking around with anticipation for YOUR cab to arrive). I've never really heard of someone calling a cab to meet them at another location that they would still have to travel to. Unless, ironically, she was thinking she didn't want a cab driver to know her address. Was this the nearest public place to her apartment?

It's possible somebody (known or unknown to her) nabbed her on her walk over to meet the cab. If the times are correct, it would have been in the 13 minute window between telling him she's on her way (4:53) and not showing up (5:06).
Could she have crossed the street because she sensed that four door car was following her? How would that have helped her? What time was the woman caught on video (and then two minutes later the car)? Two minutes is long with such a narrow window. At that point, how far was the woman on video away from the gas station?

Does the car in the video match a car belonging to anybody who was at the party? Was LE able to id the car?

 

[DocBrew]

I'm going to have to take notes! Okay I did.

All times a.m.
4:23 - AS calls cab
4:43 - Texts bf "I'm coming overt." (typo on actual text)
4:53 - Cabbie calls AS to ask where she is. AS says she's on her way.
5:06 - AS doesn't show up so cabbie calls her a second time/gets no answer.

So, AS wasn't in the cab when she texted bf.

The bolded isn't gospel, so the conclusion about her not being in the cab when she texted him is speculative. The bolded was told to LE and various media outlets by the cab driver and/or his representatives. LE was very careful to say that this is what was reported to them rather than this is what definitely occurred. If you'll note, the cab driver was 20 minutes or less away when she initially called at 4:23. Now note the time she sent the 'I'm coming overt' text. Yep, 20 minutes. She theoretically could have been in a cab at that time.

 

[Mony Mony]

Snip<

My initial thought is that usually one calls a cab from the location they want to be picked up at - they wait until the cab arrives and get in (picture yourself waiting and constantly looking around with anticipation for YOUR cab to arrive). I've never really heard of someone calling a cab to meet them at another location that they would still have to travel to. Unless, ironically, she was thinking she didn't want a cab driver to know her address. Was this the nearest public place to her apartment?

End Snip

I have only seldomly used a cab, but FWIW, I recall requesting a cab to meet at a particular location, then walking to that location to meet the cab. I did not want to get to meeting place first, then call for cab. Seems like a waste of time.

In regards to why she would request the cab to meet her at the store vs her apartment: IMO, she did not want her friends knowing she was going to meet up with the BF. She may have been embarrassed, ashamed, etc. I was once that age, and us girls would sit around and talk "smack" about the BF, and I am sure she just didn't want to hear it from anyone that they were no good for each other.

Also, did her roommates know she wrecked her car? She may have wanted to keep that under wraps as well until things settled with the BF. They may have asked questions if they saw a cab pull up to the apartment. She had only one thing on her mind, and that was to get her BF to see her point of view, no matter what. :banghead: All this if, of course, speculation, MOO IMO etc.

 

[cluciano63]

Snip< End Snip

I have only seldomly used a cab, but FWIW, I recall requesting a cab to meet at a particular location, then walking to that location to meet the cab. I did not want to get to meeting place first, then call for cab. Seems like a waste of time.

In regards to why she would request the cab to meet her at the store vs her apartment: IMO, she did not want her friends knowing she was going to meet up with the BF. She may have been embarrassed, ashamed, etc. I was once that age, and us girls would sit around and talk "smack" about the BF, and I am sure she just didn't want to hear it from anyone that they were no good for each other.

Also, did her roommates know she wrecked her car? She may have wanted to keep that under wraps as well until things settled with the BF. They may have asked questions if they saw a cab pull up to the apartment. She had only one thing on her mind, and that was to get her BF to see her point of view, no matter what. :banghead: All this if, of course, speculation, MOO IMO etc.

I think all of this could be true. I am pretty much thinking that everything happened as LE first said it did...and that the only missing piece is those few minutes when she went off the radar. She either did make it to the cab or was prevented from doing so by accepting another ride or being forced into a vehicle.

If what the driver's father told is true, that video exists of him waiting and smoking, etc. then I am leaning toward her ending up in another vehicle. I have a feeling she was forced, though, since she told cabbie she was still on the way, rather than, never mind, I don't need a cab after all. Unless of course she was embarrassed to say that and lied. JMO

 

[Woe.be.gone]

"In a minute" to me means that she was in Scottsdale.......

Say what? (Haven't read ahead yet so answer may be forthcoming)
Are you suggesting she called a cab while already in Scottsdale?
And then 10 minutes later texted bf "I'm coming overt."?
(of course that wouldn't be her who sent that text)

Has LE examined pings (can they do that without her actual phone? - shoot, you'd think I'd know this stuff by now but can't remember details! Yes, I believe they can once they subpoena the phone records.)

 

[fringles]

In regards to why she would request the cab to meet her at the store vs her apartment: IMO, she did not want her friends knowing she was going to meet up with the BF. She may have been embarrassed, ashamed, etc. I was once that age, and us girls would sit around and talk "smack" about the BF, and I am sure she just didn't want to hear it from anyone that they were no good for each other.

(RSBM)

Yeah good point. I also wondered if she was wanting to pick up some snacks - something the boyf liked, or whatever.

Also someone was asking how it was known that she'd been back to the apartment - wasn't it that the party clothes/clothes she'd been wearing when she drove off were there?

On that note - was it ever released, what she WAS wearing? Did anyone know what was missing from her wardrobe?

 

[Dee10]

Oh no, this doesn't sound promising:

“This case will be solved because someone comes forward to give us information,” said Sgt. Mike Pooley, a Tempe police spokesman. “If the forensics come back with nothing, we will need someone to come forward.”

Police on Tuesday said they are sifting through what they found for potential evidence and have no immediate plans to conduct further searches of the wash.

Dr. Greg Hess, Pima County’s chief medical examiner, said a team of pathologists and anthropoligists are working to determine a cause and manner of death.

But Hess said they don’t have much to work with and it is possible that the decision on her manner of death may eventually be based on the totality of the suspicious circumstances.

Because of the condition of the remains, it may be difficult to identify a suspect based upon forensics, Hess said.

“I think that would be pretty much a longshot,” he said.

http://www.azcentral.com/community/...earching-more-clues-death-year-old-woman.html

 

[Mony Mony]

I think all of this could be true. I am pretty much thinking that everything happened as LE first said it did...and that the only missing piece is those few minutes when she went off the radar. She either did make it to the cab or was prevented from doing so by accepting another ride or being forced into a vehicle.

If what the driver's father told is true, that video exists of him waiting and smoking, etc. then I am leaning toward her ending up in another vehicle. I have a feeling she was forced, though, since she told cabbie she was still on the way, rather than, never mind, I don't need a cab after all. Unless of course she was embarrassed to say that and lied. JMO

BBM

I am glad we post all these theories!

I am not sure she was forced into a car. In my scenario, she is walking to the store, gets a call from the cabbie and says she will be there in a minute, then the perp/acquaintance rolls up and offers her a ride.

Also regarding her statement of "in a minute". I know many people who have no problem embellishing or overestimating. For example, my mother in law is notorious for saying she will be somewhere at a given time, say for example 4:30. 4:35 rolls around and she will call to say "I am on the road" or "almost there" when in fact she is just then pulling out of the driveway. So I guess I am saying, I don't necessarily take it literally to mean, "in a minute".

 

[Dee10]

The impression I have from the quotes from her father is he seems to feel it was a stranger abduction.

&#8220;We are hoping, praying that someone will come forward,&#8221; Salinas said. &#8220;We know it was foul play and someone caused this, someone is responsible.&#8221;


He said it could be as simple as someone finding Adrienne&#8217;s telephone by the side of a road and turning it into police, or someone reporting the description of a suspicious person they spotted on the way to Canyon Lake on June 14, the day before Father&#8217;s Day.


The remains were found in the area of Highway 88 and Lost Dutchman Boulevard, near Lost Dutchman State Park.


&#8220;I strongly believe it was foul play, that she was in the wrong place at the wrong time,&#8221; Salinas said, adding that it is vitally important to himself and his family that justice is eventually served.


Salinas also said that because the person who harmed his daughter is still at large, other people&#8217;s loved ones are at risk.


&#8220;We don&#8217;t want this to happen to another innocent child,&#8221; he added.

http://www.azcentral.com/community/...earching-more-clues-death-year-old-woman.html

 

[cluciano63]

Yeah, it sounds to me like they don't have much at all to go on, evidence-wise. I hope that isn't really the case.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

The bolded isn't gospel, so the conclusion about her not being in the cab when she texted him is speculative. The bolded was told to LE and various media outlets by the cab driver and/or his representatives. LE was very careful to say that this is what was reported to them rather than this is what definitely occurred. If you'll note, the cab driver was 20 minutes or less away when she initially called at 4:23. Now note the time she sent the 'I'm coming overt' text. Yep, 20 minutes. She theoretically could have been in a cab at that time.

The cab driver was 20 mins away when she called?
First call to cab company, 4:23 = 0 minutes
text message sent to bf, 4:43 = 20 minutes

So you're saying that potentially AS could have sent the text promptly upon hopping into the cab?
Don't the cameras verify that the cab was at the AMPM place later though?

Cab driver says he called AS and she answered, 4:53 = 30 minutes gone by
Cab driver says AS is a no show - called again, 5:06 = 43 minutes total, 13 mins. between calls

Oh, so the jury is still out whether or not AS answered the call made to her at 4:53, correct? Only ten minutes between the text msg. sent to bf and the first call the cab driver claims he made to AS. Is that enough time to get away and incapacitate her in some way?
(ouch, I hate saying or thinking about that)

It actually makes more sense that she'd be in the cab within 20 minutes after calling for it to pick her up. Especially if the cab driver was already in the Tempe area.

To expect a cab to wait for you for over 30 minutes (when you told it to pick you up - or did you?) isn't logical.